• OK, it's on.
  • Please note that many, many Email Addresses used for spam, are not accepted at registration. Select a respectable Free email.

Why INTP and ENTJ?

Local time
Today, 10:33
Joined
Jul 9, 2008
Messages
1,594
#51
Well, my mother is ENTJ and I'm INTP, though my P sometimes looks more like a J. There are many positive things about the relationship. However, the problems I see are:


-The mentoring is fine until I get competitive. They simply don't let you get away with that. They love it when you're strong and independent, but they're always boss (ok, it's my mother, but still).

-The discussions are rarely playful. It's always about learning something, improving something. Sometimes I just want to be in peace.

-When I'm not feeling strong and independent I get looked at as if I were some strange specimen. I cover it up with sillyness. Much better than hearing how you're supposed to control your emotions when you're a lil INTP and thusly unused to complete emotional control (dettachment is quite different). Actually, this is the lecture I get whether I'm sad, angry, or just clueless about those nasty things called feelings.


Would I like an ENTJ partner? Maybe. Not many people could keep my interest for the long term. Would it be an easy relationship? Not bloody likely.
 
Last edited:

IntenseBurger

Active Member
Local time
Today, 12:33
Joined
Aug 29, 2008
Messages
100
Location
Lexington, KY
#52
I have two friends that are ENTJ (plus an ISTP), we all get along quite well. But when I look for a girlfriend i always end up with ENFP (never on purpose). I don't see any examples of this anywhere else in the thread, so is it strange for an INTP to end up with ENFP?
 

Jordan~

Prolific Member
Local time
Today, 17:33
Joined
Jun 4, 2008
Messages
1,967
Location
Dundee, Scotland
#53
My best friend is ENFP. I think they can get along with anyone.
 

Decaf

Professional Amateur
Local time
Today, 09:33
Joined
Apr 16, 2008
Messages
2,170
Location
Portland, OR, USA
#54
My best friend is ENFP. I think they can get along with anyone.
On the contrary... I think ENTPs have very little respect for the rules, preferring to change the rules just to see what else would work, while ISTJs have more respect for law and order as they exist than anyone else.. I could see a lot of fireworks coming from that.

Similar to how INTPs crave and need independence and ESTJs like to micromanage and control (a.k.a. lead).
 

Wisp

The Soft Rational
Local time
Today, 12:33
Joined
Jan 4, 2008
Messages
1,291
Location
East Coast of USA
#55
ISTP, not ISTJ.

Different as night and day.

Trust me, I know an ISTP with a VERY strong P.
 

Decaf

Professional Amateur
Local time
Today, 09:33
Joined
Apr 16, 2008
Messages
2,170
Location
Portland, OR, USA
#56
oops, missed that. OK, I see no reason why an ENTP and an ISTP couldn't be great friends. The former would help the latter apply himself to the outside world and the latter would help the former follow through on their ideas.
 

Verity

Redshirt
Local time
Today, 12:33
Joined
Sep 29, 2008
Messages
4
#57
I've been married to an ENTJ for almost 17 years.

In my experience, the shorthand description for his type, "field marshal," definitely fits. My husband and I seem to think alike and agree on many issues, including politics (I don't think I could be married to someone whose politics differed from mine), but I don't like the way he always so sure he is right and tries to steamroll me if I happen to disagree with him. On the other hand, I envy that he can talk to anyone and people genuinely like him. I am typical of INTPs in that I don't like to play the social game.
 

Calamedes

Active Member
Local time
Today, 19:33
Joined
Sep 28, 2008
Messages
139
Location
Ra'anana, Israel
#58
Hahaha my best friend (and ex-girlfriend) is an ENTJ. It's strange how well we work together. Come to think of it, the only reason we broke up was because we were spending so much time together that we never did our homework, and that bothered us greatly XD

And she definitely took the lead, always trying to get me to come to campus hockey/football games (usually while I was on a mental roll, so to speak). Once, she convinced me to volunteer (1 point) for a campus event involving actively running around (2 points) with kids (10 points) ON A WEEKEND! (500 points). I'm still not sure how she did it, but it happened... and I got a free T-shirt out of it :D
 

sarin

Redshirt
Local time
Today, 12:33
Joined
May 15, 2009
Messages
11
#59
I posted on this thread a while back, when I was really starting my relationship with an ENTJ. When I originally posted, I did think that our relationship could be/become close to ideal. Now we are having problems.

Here is my number one piece of advice for a relationship with an ENTJ, as an INTP:

Always give your ENTJ a piece of your mind.

I'm not saying that, especially in the beginning, you should be brutally honest about everything. But always totally honest. That may seem obvious, but with an opinionated J and a quick, and sometimes overwhelming E, I often found it difficult to and/or not worth the effort to help him understand my opinions that he did not agree with or seem to truly comprehend (although he undoubtedly always believed he understood all which was important about anything).

From my experience, ENTJs are or can be:

- opinionated
- commandeering
- unwilling to explore ideas that they are not immediately inclined towards (like when I tried to express things that bothered me in our relationship)
- condescending
- self-absorbed
- oppressive
- unkind, especially towards other people - mine was quick to label entire groups of people as stupid, and unwilling to give those "stupid people" a chance to prove themselves worthy of any sort of recognition, unless they're "usefulness" was shoved in his face. (as a fellow NT, I also tend to be quick to label others stupid, but as a P, I am almost always willing to give people a chance to prove themselves, and am much more inclined to accept what a person is without resentment)
- emotionally abusive: such as incessant teasing, and inability to recognize my efforts to please him - at least, a strong disinclination to express his appreciation; this is obviously very much an NT trait, which I also have, but in a serious relationship I see it as necessary to try to work on/address the emotional/appreciation sort of things between my significant other and i
- slightly distrusting, even towards me; defensive, is more the word
- discreetly, but surprisingly vulnerable - he was always inclined to take any personal remarks and observations of mine to heart, although he tried not to seem like he did
- ignorant
- ferociously guarded
- vultures


At his best, my ENTJ was:

- stimulating
- driven
- entertaining
- very good at being affectionate, when he was
- intelligent
- totally capable
- great for debate, when he was believed the topic to be worth discussing
- surprised me with occasional great gestures of courtesy (although, in retrospect, these gestures were not as great as they seemed; they probably only seemed so wonderful because I was not used to receiving truly considerate gestures from him)
- intensely creative
- very interesting
- shared common interests, principles, and beliefs with me, although his passion for those things was of quite a different strain than my own
- beautiful, in the fiery, vain, and spirited way of... a phoenix, or something like that...


Factors which should be taken into account:

- he was a musician, an artist
- like nearly all artists, he was self-centered
- like nearly all musicians, his number one priority was and will always be his music, and his band
- is coming from a somewhat difficult past where he has had to be intensely ambitious and quick to make judgments in order to survive; he has been a bit "hardened"
- my extreme flexibility, at times extreme insecurity, and generally understanding nature has allowed, if not encouraged, him to, basically, walk on me... half the time
- i have been told i have codependent tendencies (as many of us do), which also have undoubtedly encouraged him to sometimes believe, as i often do, that i may not be of great value - although i am entirely certain he does care for me, in his self-centered way, and does often see value in me, although he probably sometimes doubts it



1) don't date a musician if you don't have time to establish a very solid relationship with them before they go on tour, no matter how independent you are

2) defend yourself, do not let things go which you ultimately know need to be addressed/established

3) do not allow yourself to be overwhelmed by an ENTJ's relentless expression of his opinions. esp when you know you could handle his ass, if you only got a word in which he really listened to...

4) never allow yourself to feel absolutely unable to leave your ENTJ. ENTJs tend to convince themselves and put off that they don't need anybody. in reality, we are the introverts, in addition to being rationals. we typically truly need our partner much less then they need us, and once we have actually left a relationship, are much better able to regain full function as single people. keep in mind, although it may not initially seem to be true, that while you may appreciate your ENTJ partner more, but you actually need him/her/or it less.

5) I hope my next guy is an ENTP. The E did bring me out of my shell, I love the ability to objectively debate complex topics that NTs have, and I think the P would lead to more openmindedness, esp with the combination of N and P. I just hope he's got some more J than I do, and is not a terrible slacker, like I tend to be.
 
Local time
Today, 09:33
Joined
Jan 31, 2009
Messages
30
#60
Pairing with an extrovert who sees the world the same way (NT) and makes decisions (J) is great for an INTP. The INTP suggests, the ENTJ decides and implements. You don't spend time on any F stuff and you're always refining skills.

I think the ENTJ is an even better "business partner" match for an INTP; the INTP turns out constant abstract analysis, the ENTJ sifts it and then implements the relevant part. Both get to rely on their strength: the ENTJ leads and implements, the INTP is off in the ether thinking without having to worry about day-to-day, "small picture" business decisions or sifting through what is practical.
 

A Reasonable Facsimile

Asleep in the poppies.
Local time
Today, 17:33
Joined
Aug 24, 2009
Messages
16
Location
Victoria, BC
#61
I'm an ENTP, and I could see myself in a relationship with an ENTJ or INTP (but probably not an INTJ, for reasons I haven't truly explored).

I could probably only be in a serious relationship with an NT. With a partner, I'd absolutely need to have scientific and philosophical discussions with them. I find that only other NTs make the cut in the art of discussion.

The INTP/ENTP pairing has the potential to be great. Both are intelligent, easy-going and fun. It would probably never get boring.

The ENTJ/ENTP pairing is more problematic. While I could see it working in some cases, ENTJs usually bring out the worst in me for some reason.

The ENTJ/INTP pairing probably wouldn't work for me AT ALL.
 
Local time
Today, 11:33
Joined
Aug 17, 2009
Messages
3
#62
I am an INTP, my father is an ENTJ as is my wife. Observations:


Father - poorly developed individual
  • Abusive (physically and verbally)
  • constant need to be in control
  • hair trigger anger over the silliest things
  • can bluff a well thought out argument to all non-NT types
  • overly sensitive
  • prone to addictions
Wife - when I met her (10 years ago in college)
  • Very forthright and outgoing
  • organized
  • no social filter
  • would say insensitive and hurtful things without understanding peoples reactions
  • during fights would "fight dirty"
  • Very smart
  • Not focused (I think this has more to do with the fact that she was having a bad fight with your parents)
  • Very argumentative
Wife - now
  • Very organized
  • Moderate social filter
  • has learned to fight fair and not hurt people’s feelings
  • Very driven and focused
  • Very creative
  • Very neat
  • Very argumentative
Our relationship has worked very well as she's helped me with things I'm naturally not good with and the other way around. As we share the NT we have strong common ground to start from. I found out quickly that she would not only listen, but respected my ability to argue my point (and usually hand her a logical beating when her head got a little too large) On the other hand she dragged me kicking and screaming to a small amount of organizational ability and helped smooth out some of my natural manic/mania highs and lows.

In general, we've really sped up the growth of our secondary and tertiary functions and become a smooth functioning team. She still thinks I'm a bit messy and absent minded, and I still think she's too structured and over-bearing... but it's more at a mild annoyance level. The personality traits are still there, they've just been sanded off and muted to a very livable level while the strengths have been broadened and magnified.

My Dad's still an ass, and we talk very rarely... but according to my mom he respects me a lot and wishes I liked him.
 
Local time
Today, 09:33
Joined
Aug 23, 2009
Messages
3,674
#63
Hmmm...I suppose I should put my two cents in since I'm an INTP dating an ENTJ

When I first met him I liked him a lot because he was insightful and willing to take a general discussion to a new theoretical level with me. He'd follow me down even the silliest conversational rabbit holes and I really liked that.

He had no "social filter" whatsoever and would say things that really hurt people's feelings. He didn't mean to step on toes intentionally...he just said what popped into his head and end up making people cry or get angry. I'd have to point it out to him before he'd even realize it. That's how bad it was, I'm an INTP and I had to point out that he'd hurt people's feelings. Also, he was practically oblivious to most social undercurrents. Girls would flirt with him and he'd be completely oblivious. A few girls I know got really angry with him because they kept dropping hints like a bulldozer and he'd just ignore them like they didn't exist.

I tried to flirt with him (agonizing as hell) but got fed up pretty quick with the whole thing and finally just asked him out. He was delighted with my proposition and we've been together for 4 years now. Now, he's much better about filtering things before he says them although he mostly just clams up and becomes stoic if he's in company he doesn't know well and thinks will be offended by his humor. Still completely oblivious to the attentions of other girls though.

As for the whole INTP/ENTJ compatability thing: It's been great living with somebody who can take criticism without getting his feelings hurt. It's also nice that I can trust him to be straight forward with me about things that are bothering him. We've got a very uncomplicated relationship. I tell him I need affection and he gives it to me. It's kind of funny really. I'll say, "I need reassurance that this is correct" and he'll look at me and come up with a good logical reason why I'm right.

Does this help at all?
 
Local time
Today, 09:33
Joined
Aug 23, 2009
Messages
3,674
#65
Hell yes, I want one.
:D

When asked if I could sell him to somebody on the INTP Forum he politely declined...okay, okay he actually said "Hell No Woman! I've only just got you properly trained". Buahahaha!!!! Want one now? :icon_pferdehaufen:
 
Local time
Today, 10:33
Joined
Jul 9, 2008
Messages
1,594
#66
I very much doubt you'll take 10 cents in pesos and some lint in exchange :p Plus I'm told their care and feeding is... best left to themselves, and oh how they're exacting. You know what? I'll sit here and wait for a wild one to appear. :D
 
Local time
Today, 09:33
Joined
Aug 23, 2009
Messages
3,674
#67
You know what? I'll sit here and wait for a wild one to appear. :D
Crickey! I see one now! I'm going to sneak up from behind and stick my thumb in it's cloaca!

I couldn't help but think of Steve Irwin and the crocs :D
 

wadlez

Active Member
Local time
Tomorrow, 03:03
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
Messages
387
#68
From a purly mbti prospective (derived only from jung, not my personal view on the subject)

ENTJ's functions are very close to ours.
Our primary function is Introverted Thinking, theres is Extroverted Thinking.
Secondary function Extroverted iNtuition, theres Introverted iNtuition.
Tertiary function Introverted Sensing, theres Extroverted Sensing.
Our final, most repressed shadow function is Extroverted Feeling while theres is Introverted Feeling.

Because we are both primary Thinking types and both repress and dislike Feeling we will both see the world in the same way so agree and share ideas/opinions well.

Our character compliments theres. As they are very dominant and opinionated us being open to ideas and not so assertive works well so we dont clash. All of there ideas have practical applications and is drawn from objective facts and created for some practical reason, ours ideas are created just for sake of the idea and our purely subjective purpose. So when we share ideas they ground us to reality and try to make something practical of our thoughts, while we offer very creative insights and expand on there ideas.

My best friend is an ENTJ
 
Local time
Today, 12:33
Joined
Sep 29, 2009
Messages
93
Location
Somewhere among the ruins...
#69
I have a few good friends who are ENTJ's, sometimes they can get very blah blah blah blah or be total dicks without realizing it but I generally enjoy their company. As for why INTP/ENTJ relationships are supposed to work in theory, I think Black Pat did a good job summing it up earlier ITT:
Pairing with an extrovert who sees the world the same way (NT) and makes decisions (J) is great for an INTP. The INTP suggests, the ENTJ decides and implements. You don't spend time on any F stuff and you're always refining skills.
This makes sense and everything but if ENTJ females are anything like their male counterparts I don't think I would want to live with one.
 
Local time
Today, 10:33
Joined
Jul 9, 2008
Messages
1,594
#70
Um, okay. Time for a "what's good about ENTJs" summary. This is strictly from my perspective with a well developed ENTJ parent. (Assuming, of course, that my intuitive typing is correct)


1. They let you know where you stand. If you screw up, they'll tell you. No emotional scenes and no avoidance.

2. You can talk to them in a rational manner. You can even convince them if your reasons are good enough.

3. They'll give you space. They might not understand the "I" need to withdraw, but they'll respect it.

4. They're strong. This means they can drag your ass out of whatever shit life might throw at you. Efficiently.

5. They're good at making people do what they want. They might not always know why people act as they do (INTPs know this), but they nearly always know what people will do.

6. They have a soft spot: In spite of their extroversion, or perhaps due to it, they might end up lonelier than INTPs. They're intuitive rationals, they're weird in their own ways and they're also the kind of people who make enemies, simply because they're "out there" being themselves. But they need public recognition more than we do.
 
Local time
Today, 09:33
Joined
Aug 23, 2009
Messages
3,674
#71
Um, okay. Time for a "what's good about ENTJs" summary. This is strictly from my perspective with a well developed ENTJ parent. (Assuming, of course, that my intuitive typing is correct)


1. They let you know where you stand. If you screw up, they'll tell you. No emotional scenes and no avoidance.

2. You can talk to them in a rational manner. You can even convince them if your reasons are good enough.

3. They'll give you space. They might not understand the "I" need to withdraw, but they'll respect it.

4. They're strong. This means they can drag your ass out of whatever shit life might throw at you. Efficiently.

5. They're good at making people do what they want. They might not always know why people act as they do (INTPs know this), but they nearly always know what people will do.

6. They have a soft spot: In spite of their extroversion, or perhaps due to it, they might end up lonelier than INTPs. They're intuitive rationals, they're weird in their own ways and they're also the kind of people who make enemies, simply because they're "out there" being themselves. But they need public recognition more than we do.
Well said. That's pretty much the best description of my ENTJ. Kudos.
 

Tunesimah

Man-Child becoming a Dude.... Man
Local time
Today, 11:33
Joined
Sep 20, 2009
Messages
167
Location
Wisconsin, USA
#72
Reading this I think my Aunt is an ENTJ. I've always enjoyed her company, and she is always pushing me to do things. Her personality is really appealing to me, she can be demanding, bossy, slightly short tempered but I know she is thinking and has well thought out arguments for what she's doing... so I don't have a problem.

I'm more inclined to think deeply on subjects, but she's just as just as interested in intellectual thought and exploring topics.

I've always been curious of what her MBTI is... the ENTJ you guys have been talking about fits her perfectly.

I've alway enjoyed the company of NT women. The feminine qualities tweak the NT approach every so slightly to make them different from me in a good way. Overall it's very easy to talk with them.
 

Carnap

Active Member
Local time
Today, 18:33
Joined
Apr 1, 2009
Messages
490
#73
So can anyone say what an INTP brings into the equation? I mean, other than brainstorming, what does the INTP bring other than unorganization and possibly not being able to get his shit together?
 
Local time
Today, 10:33
Joined
Jul 9, 2008
Messages
1,594
#74
I'll try. Some of it is speculation, okay?

1. We're rationals. This means they can understand our thoughts, and bounce off ideas with us, which is something they appreciate.

2. We understand people's motives better. This helps them being more effective leaders, even if they might get occasionally annoyed at our brand of cynicism.

3. We can make them feel and notice their feelings. They'll rarely show this, and they might decide they don't want it, but they need it. I'd say we do this because we look harmless enough as rationals, but it turns out we're interesting people... and then it's too late :p

4. We can be "a project". They like changing the world. INTP-improvement can become a hobby for them. (One area of improvement can be emotion management. This makes them realise they don't excel at it all the time -not thay they'll show it-, so they turn to self improvement, and .... with some luck, the process doesn't end)

5. We provide a challenge, respect and companionship. The latter gets more and more important with time. Also, when we're walking the Fe, we're cuddly people. Let them wrap their minds around that. :D
 
Local time
Today, 18:33
Joined
Sep 18, 2009
Messages
224
#75
So can anyone say what an INTP brings into the equation? I mean, other than brainstorming, what does the INTP bring other than unorganization and possibly not being able to get his shit together?
Since when is disorganization a bad thing? :D

But, to be honest, answering this question is likely to lead to enumeration of ENTJ weaknesses, and I'm not sure how it's going to be received. Let's just say traits such as tolerance, tendency to question others' opinions and some spontaneity play a part.
 
Local time
Today, 09:33
Joined
Aug 23, 2009
Messages
3,674
#76
So can anyone say what an INTP brings into the equation? I mean, other than brainstorming, what does the INTP bring other than unorganization and possibly not being able to get his shit together?
More often then not the INTP brings the ideas to the table and the ENTJ implements them. Or, when the ENTJ develops ideas they don't necessarily develop them enough and the INTP is able to critically look at the idea and make intelligent and relevant alterations. The ENTJ in turn is able to take the criticism then implement an even better plan.

For example: When my ENTJ decides he wants to get something done he often dives into a project then gets frustrated when it doesn't immediately work the way he wants. I then step in and give a few suggestions. At first he might resent this but since my criticism was given with a complete lack of a desire to control he almost always later implements my criticism and things work better for him.

In my experience INTPs make a wonderful second hand man to ENTJs once the ENTJs recognize the fact that INTPs don't want to wrest power from them. The ENTJ is the General and the INTP is his trusted adviser. The ENTJ can make intelligent informed decisions with the INTP at his side. I sometimes wonder if all the generals in the world that failed only failed because their INTP was out to lunch at the time.
 

Carnap

Active Member
Local time
Today, 18:33
Joined
Apr 1, 2009
Messages
490
#77
Good comments.

The whole feeling thing is tough though. The one I know tolerated all sorts of things from me but the moment I told him I had feelings for him, he cut me off brutally in the weirdest way.

His loss.
 

Enne

Consistently Inconsistent
Local time
Today, 17:33
Joined
May 18, 2009
Messages
499
Location
;)
#78
Personally I think that the point of attraction comes from systemization, or more specifically, a love or fundamental 'calling' towards the creating of systems. Sure, all rationals (NTs) are systemizers, but ENTPs tend to be the 'loophole wizards' (Ne), and INTJs tend to be the strategic 'hedge trimmers' (Ni). INTPs and ENTJs, rushing into the fray with their thinking antennae out, will probably feel some natural affinity towards each other in that sense of wanting to either establish new theories (guides) to uncover the layers of the 'ultimate system' (Ti), or else pressing forward with an organically grown working rheubric for the 'ultimate system' (Te), jamming things into the self created framework as necessary. (E vs. I diatomy).

I think where the two will run into the real problem is with the execution. While the Te is concerned with polishing its version of optimal system, Ti is concerned with drawing on as many feasible threads as possible to reach it. Sure, on the surface both architects are working on the blueprints to the building, but one architect will truly, invariably believe that his masterpiece needs only the minor adjustments necessary to finish up, while the other will be out, wandering the streets, looking for a way to incorporate the best of all that he sees into one cohesive, flowing masterpiece. I think the problem with these two is that they're searching for the same thing, but while the first one's journey is to bring others to his preselected destination (ENTJ), the other's journey is just and adventure to discover what that destination is (INTP).
 

Carnap

Active Member
Local time
Today, 18:33
Joined
Apr 1, 2009
Messages
490
#79
So is it true ENTJs have a romantic streak they try to hide? Is that why the one I'm interested acted all weird the moment I said I had feelings for him? Or is my love really some monstrous thing to run from?
 
Local time
Today, 10:33
Joined
Jul 9, 2008
Messages
1,594
#80
Can't give details, but I'll attest to the ENTJ romantic streak. I'll also attest they can take control of it and squash it unrepentantly in a way we never could. Like, we'd be wondering about the 'what ifs', and they'd be :"okay, that's done with, what's next?" In mature ones, it's not that they're running from love, it's that they're terribly practical and realistic. They may even love the other person. If it's a 'no go', that's it.

That's one of the reasons why, if I met an ENTJ I liked, chances are I'd run the other way
 

Carnap

Active Member
Local time
Today, 18:33
Joined
Apr 1, 2009
Messages
490
#82
Can't give details, but I'll attest to the ENTJ romantic streak. I'll also attest they can take control of it and squash it unrepentantly in a way we never could. Like, we'd be wondering about the 'what ifs', and they'd be :"okay, that's done with, what's next?" In mature ones, it's not that they're running from love, it's that they're terribly practical and realistic. They may even love the other person. If it's a 'no go', that's it.

That's one of the reasons why, if I met an ENTJ I liked, chances are I'd run the other way

That really sucks. Is there any way to manipulate them out of that (yes...I want to found a relationship on manipulation)?

Also, I find they are relentlessly blunt, make decisions very quickly, perhaps sometimes regret their decisions, but have too much damn pride to go back on them !!!! It's really frustrating.

But - they seem to glow with some kind of strange charismatic power and it is super sexy.
 
Local time
Today, 10:33
Joined
Jul 9, 2008
Messages
1,594
#83
There's an ENTJ forum. I propose a field research :D

http://entjforum.com/


@Carnap: The one I know is quite possibly the only person I can't manipulate. (I don't manipulate people but did some tests way back when). The only way I can suggest is a)assess what could have made him say no, b)remove the obstacles you can remove, c)tell him this -like when one presents a report-, d)wait for an answer and hope it's positive. If the obstacles are too big, or intrinsecal to the situation/people involved... well...
 

Reverse Transcriptase

"you're a poet whether you like it or not"
Local time
Today, 09:33
Joined
Sep 22, 2008
Messages
1,375
Location
The Maze in the Heart of the Castle
#84
Local time
Today, 09:33
Joined
Aug 23, 2009
Messages
3,674
#85
I call dibs on the codename: Git R Done. It just seems so right for an ENTJ...

For the ENTJ I know it's true that they ARE romantic but if the romance is something they see as pointless or as standing in the way of some other preset goal then they will definitely squash it. I think an ENTJ needs somebody in their life to have taught them the importance of intimate relationships either romantic or platonic. (ideally a parent could teach them this because as an INTP it would be hard to explain and it would involve a lot of...feeling...and I can't hardly explain it to myself much less somebody else) I will always be deeply grateful to my ENTJ's mother, who is very very very much an ENFP, for teaching him that relationship goals are just as important as career and education goals. This means that he works just as hard on achieving his romantic goals (such as stability and harmony in the relationship) as he does on getting through school and getting a good job. I just had to convince him that I should be a part of his five part plan first. :)

I'm sorry Carnap. I suspect that your ENTJ has decided that for some reason you don't fit into their plan. I think that you'll have to put together a three part argument as to why you belong in this ENTJ's world romantically before they will even think about changing their mind...I wonder...is it worth it?
 

Enne

Consistently Inconsistent
Local time
Today, 17:33
Joined
May 18, 2009
Messages
499
Location
;)
#86
There's an ENTJ forum. I propose a field research :D

http://entjforum.com/


@Carnap: The one I know is quite possibly the only person I can't manipulate. (I don't manipulate people but did some tests way back when). The only way I can suggest is a)assess what could have made him say no, b)remove the obstacles you can remove, c)tell him this -like when one presents a report-, d)wait for an answer and hope it's positive. If the obstacles are too big, or intrinsecal to the situation/people involved... well...
Already done.

They're not nearly as cool as they are on TV!

Also, some of the posts are so rigidly narrowminded that they are downright hilarious.


Finally, you guys are late to the punch; I saw some entp.org accts there driving them crazy ...

In conclusion an ENTJ man might grow to hate me; there's just something so boldly preposterous about some of the things they say and the (perceived) tone of delivery that I'd spend most of our lives together just guffawing at him.
 
Local time
Today, 10:33
Joined
Jul 9, 2008
Messages
1,594
#87
there's just something so boldly preposterous about some of the things they say and the (perceived) tone of delivery that I'd spend most of our lives together just guffawing at him.


Okay, I'm going in. I'm tempted to use the smart-assed approach, but if I know ENTJ ethics it might get me banned. So I'll have to combine it with the serious approach, because after what Enne said there's no way I could be totally serious. Wish me luck.

Edit:

I'm in. I didn't mention this forum, if you visit, could you abstain from 'outing' me as forum member? <---- paranoia.

Edit 2:

My humour sense abandoned me as soon as I was there. I even had rehearsed posts of the 'crikey!' kind, but all those frig... er, cool people made me shudder.

Also, I feel as a chameleon going undercover. I freaking love this :cool:

I think I'll make a couple of posts a day, if they reply. I'll abstain from posting about what ENTJs are according to me, in order to gather decent data. At least at the beginning. If several days pass and there's no reply to the dry posts, I'll get more personal and see what happens.
 
Local time
Today, 12:33
Joined
Oct 27, 2009
Messages
25
#88
I am an ENTJ woman (please don't hold that against me!) who recently started dating an INTP man. I didn't think too much of it when we first went out, but gradually as I get to know him more, I realized how special he is...and I am attracted to him too! :)

But since men usually chase me hard so my default way of dealing with men is to resist. I did that with him too on our forth date. Since then he has STOPPED asking me out. I initiated contact a couple of times and explained why, but he uses his new job as an excuse ( I think) and keeps saying "next week"--it has been TWO MONTHS since that forth date. He apologized for not calling/texting saying he is bad at it. Then we ran into each other last Friday. He seemed very into me--body language, eye language, eager to introduce me to his friends etc.--but I feel that he is not confident with me. Example: always asked for permission to kiss, saying things like " does this dance move turn you on?" --I am an amateur latin dancer and he cannot dance.

Frankly, I don't care whether he can dance or not. I just like who he is. But he still hasn't called me. After initiating the last two contacts--which I almost never do when I first start dating a man BTW, I made an exception for him--I feel I need to see him initiating something so I know that he is still interested, although there have been multi occasions where I wanted to tell him something, sadly he was there... :(

Sooo...INTP men out there, could you help with some insights?!!! I only discovered afterwards that INTP is my ideal match--may explain why I like him so much. But this business of no contact nor dates at all is really killing me--I am a very secure woman with lots of options (only mention it because this may be why he is not confident with me? He is successful and well loved in general, has a quiet confidence about him), but I feel I am out of my comfort zone with this man since he doesn't tell me how he feels at all.

Should I give it up and move on? He is so special but maybe he is just not that into me?

Many thanks!!
 
Local time
Today, 09:33
Joined
Aug 23, 2009
Messages
3,674
#89


Okay, I'm going in. I'm tempted to use the smart-assed approach, but if I know ENTJ ethics it might get me banned. So I'll have to combine it with the serious approach, because after what Enne said there's no way I could be totally serious. Wish me luck.

Edit:

I'm in. I didn't mention this forum, if you visit, could you abstain from 'outing' me as forum member? <---- paranoia.

Edit 2:

My humour sense abandoned me as soon as I was there. I even had rehearsed posts of the 'crikey!' kind, but all those frig... er, cool people made me shudder.

Also, I feel as a chameleon going undercover. I freaking love this :cool:

I think I'll make a couple of posts a day, if they reply. I'll abstain from posting about what ENTJs are according to me, in order to gather decent data. At least at the beginning. If several days pass and there's no reply to the dry posts, I'll get more personal and see what happens.
I think the avatar you have right now is appropriate for this kind of thing! :D
 
Local time
Today, 17:33
Joined
Jul 10, 2011
Messages
1
#92
Man, I know I'm crazy late to the party on this one, but my INTP-boy and I have been in a relationship for over a year, and I felt the need, as an ENTJ, to share some points that maybe weren't covered.

- ENTJs are in love with language. We think that words have a great deal of power. So when we talk so much, it's not because we like the sound of our own voice (ok it is that...) but because we believe that words matter. To that end, an ENTJ is going to be expressive with you, particularly about feelings. INTPs, take note. We want to hear it back from you. INTPs have a tendency to think things in their mind, and assume the outside reality reflects and understands what's going on inside. And as a result, the rest of the world doesn't get to hear it.
Think about it this way. INTPs are almost immediately confronted with doubt about a theory or idea they have. (Notably, ENTJs rarely are, and if you have an ENTJ asking you to confirm his/her new theory, congrats, you've got him/her wrapped around your finger). Instead, ENTJs are confronted with that doubt about their external world, and that includes who they are in a relationship with. So a confirmation - daily, hourly if possible - that you feel the same way they feel goes a long, long way.

- The INTP's need to recharge away from people is going to have to be retooled. One miracle that has happened in my relationship is that my boyfriend is able to recoup from being around a lot of people while still being with me. Us doing something together can count as his down time, and that has to happen for the relationship to have any chance.

- The exchange of criticism is still one we're trying to figure out. I'm bold, brash, and do not mince words. If he fucked up, I tell him so, and it doesn't come even slightly from a place of anger. It comes from the ENTJ's desire to fix every problem, particularly when the ENTJ sees the solution "so clearly." At the same time, the INTP's avoidance of confrontation is maddening to the ENTJ, because we don't treat criticisms lobbed at us personal attacks. In fact, since the INTP is right 90% of the time, we welcome the clearly logical help.
Establish the meaning of confrontation in the relationship, and each side is going to have to budge on this a little bit. ENTJs have to work to phrase their suggestions as suggestions, and not get upset when the INTP eschews them. INTPs must be more vocal about their concerns. A frequent (ie. daily) communication about something that's bothering you has to happen, or you're doomed.
 

ked

Member
Local time
Today, 17:33
Joined
Jul 14, 2011
Messages
53
Location
Finland
#93
They both have Si and Te and Ni and Fe as their dominant functions and make a good match if one is a gay. It's a homogeneous and chemically (against the laws of chemistry) boring relationship and has about no attraction, chemically speaking, where the T likes the F the most, and the Ni/Si likes the Ne/Se the most, though the N doesn't like the S. If one values other than chemistry, attraction, more then one makes a pick using other criteria and makes the homogeneous aspects the dominant, also seeing that it's harder to have enough common mentally when picking the heterogeneous things. Pick your mind and go against the laws of nature and go gay, or pick the laws of nature and go against your own mind.
 
Local time
Today, 17:33
Joined
Sep 14, 2011
Messages
3
#94
Yeah, Yeah, this is an old thread -


As for the "What does INTP bring to the relationship?"

I think it's important that INTP is independent enough to keep their own thoughts and ideas independent of the General's, and flexible enough not to be overwhelmed or offended by the ENTJ's attempts to force the INTP into their plans/ideas/ etc.

Basically, the INTP can avoid conflicting with the ENTJ and still maintain her own identity/not get steamrolled.

Important!


And yeah, the one ENTJ I've known well had a super sentimental streak.
 

Dr. Freeman

In a place outside of time
Local time
Today, 12:33
Joined
Feb 7, 2011
Messages
726
#95
I have yet to meet an ENTJ.
 

scorpiomover

The little professor
Local time
Today, 17:33
Joined
May 3, 2011
Messages
1,645
#96
It's not like the ENTJ is saying "OKAY! This is the schedule I have arranged for you today. Failure to comply will result in divorce." it's more like "This is the stuff we have to do today and here's my suggestion on the order we do it in, are we in accord?".
Sounds suspiciously like an old boss of mine. He is very social, clearly an NT, and would plan out what I would do for the day. Then I'd tell him what I thought was wrong with his instructions. He'd then explain to me if any practical considerations existed. Then if the practicals required doing things his way, I'd do it his way, because he'd given good reasons. However, if my reasoning still applied, so his instructions would still not work, then he'd accept what I pointed out, and then we'd thrash out a solution together. This happened about 50% of the time. So 50% of the time, we would do things my way, because he was open-minded enough to realise that what was most important was getting the job done, and not just following his plan.

Another way we worked together, was that I would refer the more practical parts of the job, like installing devices, to him. He would ask me the very technical stuff, that I was much stronger on.

As a result, we were much, much stronger and more capable together, than each of us alone.

I don't know what an ENTJ would be like to go out with, though.

I don't see how you equate planning with commanding.
I noticed that quite a few INTJs report that they have great trouble with INTPs, and regard their complaints as simply not understanding that the best thing they can do, is just do what the INTJ tells them to do. So it just might be that some INTPs are mistaking ENTJs with INTJs.
 

GYX_Kid

randomly floating abyss built of bricks
Local time
Today, 17:33
Joined
Dec 19, 2010
Messages
946
#97
I kind of mentioned this in the skype group we have here, today

the masculine/feminine duality of INTP and ENTJ.

Going by generalities and assuming that ST/TS = masculine and NF/FN = feminine

INTP has masculine introverted functions, Ti and Si; and feminine extroverted ones, Ne and Fe.
ENTJ is the inverse/shadow/what have you, being masculine extroverted (Te and Se) and feminine introverted (Ni and Fi).

Now especially for individuals who mainly use their habitual main functions and haven't developed their others/don't communicate both sides well... in this case both the INTP and ENTJ would be using their masculine functions that they're used to focusing on and using every day without a second thought about it.

In other words, in metaphorical psychological terms they both have a penis and vagina, but they're used to using the penis. Once you develop more you will develop your vagina too, though it's awkward and difficult because NF-ish analysis is much different in nature than TS. (This is in introverted/extroverted terms, talking about our introverted analysis as opposed to our extroverted- I know NT are technically the "main" functions of both.)

Certain judgemental people might see an INTP's undeveloped vagina on the outside, and try to fuck it. What they won't realize is that on the inside the INTP's true self is really a dick, even though the INTP might not even know how to present that using extroverted actions. The ENTJ on the other hand, especially a very undeveloped one, will be the inverse- a dick on the outside, and a little vagina on the inside.

So if an INTP and ENTJ are immature/narcissistic, we have a wolf in sheep's clothing/body/decision-making (INTP) and an insecure bully whose feelings are easily hurt (ENTJ).

In practical basic terms, INTP-ENTJ combination is essentially like an ouroboros, the snake that circles around and eats or fucks itself in a loop. This could be positive in theory, but both individuals would have to be very healthy and probably mature. Otherwise it's an endless loop of hell.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

That being said, I think that a female ENTJ and male INTP would be more inherently compatible. The introverted side is complimented by the actual gender. Female gets to be romantic and action-oriented, and male gets to be a rock statue up in his clouds.

I could envision a male ENTJ/female INTP partnership ending in dead bodies.
 

EyeSeeCold

lust for life
Local time
Today, 09:33
Joined
Aug 12, 2010
Messages
7,841
Location
California, USA
#98
haha

It makes sense to me.
 

Artsu Tharaz

Resident Resident
Local time
Tomorrow, 03:33
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
2,811
#99
Does that mean there are four genders?

=o

Detailed look at similarities and differences of INTP and ENTJ
- two opposing first tier (I, P vs E, J), two shared first tier (NT)
- totally opposing function sets, both Judgment dominant NTs
- similar and complementing social styles, incongruent cognitive styles
- differ by an even number of dichotomies

I would say the heart of the match is in that similar-complementary interaction style
Tip | Tej, Nej | Nip


(They also complement with respect to Ji[Pe] and Je[Pi], and both have the same primary information sets.)

However, in this respect the relationship is equivalent to both INTP-ESFP and INTP-ISFJ, as they both also complement in social style, and further more, a combination of more than two of these is better still.

idk why an ideal relationship would be implied by this.

Strict Te is incompatible with Ti, and so too of Ne and Ni (note: unfiltered Je and unfiltered Ji are not incompatible). It is the quadra that complements.

Or maybe third tier is all that really counts on the level of interaction?
 

xbox

Prolific Member
Local time
Today, 05:33
Joined
Mar 20, 2011
Messages
1,103
"...likely to expect sex on a relatively scheduled basis."

bwhahahahahahahah. *wipes eyes*

I can't think of anything more antithetical to the spontaneity of sex than having a schedule. But then I'm exceptionally adverse to schedules. Haha. This is creating the funniest scenarios I've thought of in a long time... if only I had a talent for comic prose.

What happens if the INTP jumps the ENTJ when it's not scheduled sex time?

What if the INTP sleeps in and misses the 6am wakeup sex?

ENTJ: atten-shun! Prepare for 6am entry! Present ass!
INTP: Zzzzzz......

It's just too funny. :D
Hahahahaahaa you made my day.

That is indeed scary.

LOL
 
Top Bottom