When a female INTP reveals herself.

[Tc76]

Reading though the posts here I’m always amused with the comments that follow when a female INTP shares her gender. The ‘Holy Crap you’re a girl!?’ reaction. I wonder if it’s our sexism, ego or our social upbringing that makes males assume we have the monopoly on the mind and intelligence.
With that thought.
Ladies, do you consciously not advertise this for the above reasons or something else.
As a side note, a female INTP is dangerous…think about it lol.

 

[EyeSeeCold]

I wonder if it’s our sexism, ego or our social upbringing that makes males assume we have the monopoly on the mind and intelligence.

Huh, who's making that assumption?

INTP gender poll

And why is your text so dark..

 

[Cheeseumpuffs]

Rules 29 and 30:

29. In the Internet all girls are men and all kids are undercover FBI agents.
30. There are no girls on the internet.

Mildly humorous 4chan crap aside, there is a general misconception that the fields of computers and technology and such are primarily male dominated. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KyF-FmNCsw
This video seems relevant. The video mainly discusses jobs in technology but I don't think it would be unreasonable to assume that this effect is similar in simple Internet Society.

 

[NinjaSurfer]

I could go for some female revealing in this thread

 

[Tc76]

Well what other reason do you think the shocked/suprised reaction comes from. What's your idea.

As for the dark text, I copied and pasted from a word doc and it came out that way. Figured that it got my idea across so the color didn't realy matter.

 

[Vladimir]

Yeah we should have the male/female symbol near our names, under the join date or something.

 

[The Gopher]

Yeah we should have the male/female symbol near our names, under the join date or something.

*dies slowly* I always just assume it's a person. (although I have been wrong)

A female INTP is dangerous? Either this is a joke I missed or an obvious statment. Everyone is dangerous for different reasons.

 

[Tc76]

As for being dangerous..ment as a joke. The whole male/female interaction..ie guys get stupid when..well for lack of a better term..boobs. Add that to a mind that we would find as much or more intriguging..well guys being guys, no matter their type..shinanigans will comence.

(my grammer is horrid I know)

 

[Hadoblado]

The OP font is difficult to read, I am glad you discontinued with it.

I tend to assume that people on the internet are male, but I think that in the case of the sites that I frequent, they mostly are.

 

[snafupants]

I could go for some female revealing in this thread

@NinjaSurfer

This is the only pussy you'll be receiving tonight.

 

[MissQuote]

Who's says INTP's have any monopoly on mind or intelligence?

 

[ProxyAmenRa]

What on earth are you talking about? Everyone knows there're no women on the internet.

 

[Tc76]

lol I love the over analyzing. Not saying an INTP are more intellegent than any other type. Just that those here are INTP or INTP leaning. Was focusing the question to the audience. The audience that likes to show how intellent they are but still fall into the assumption that gender is signifact to the idieas someone expresses. (The omg your a gile/wishing the girls would be more obvious) I am sure the big brains here will say that is not the case, at least with them. But look to Vladimir's responce. (Not saying anyting neg about you V, just using yout post as an example ) We all have our preconceived bias when it comes to gender and ones mental capabilty. Otherwise why ask for the women to identify themselves. Was pointing that out as being ironic..this being the land of minds as it was. Or I could be totaly wrong..

 

[EyeSeeCold]

Well what other reason do you think the shocked/suprised reaction comes from. What's your idea.

As for the dark text, I copied and pasted from a word doc and it came out that way. Figured that it got my idea across so the color didn't realy matter.

Yeah, it doesn't matter that much it's just..black text on dark grey lol, and I think DarkCastle is the default forum skin, I really don't remember anymore though.

I would say most males are shocked, when they are, because of the general abundance of males on the internet. That's more likely than people here assuming that women are, on average, less intelligent; I'm not really sure why you suggested that.

I could go for some female revealing in this thread

Spoiler

Who's says INTP's have any monopoly on mind or intelligence?

Spoiler

 

[The Gopher]

(my grammer is horrid I know)

*twitch* (not that my grammar is any good either but I happen to be a grammar hippy[Doesn't care about his own grammar but cares a little about others]{note: hippy can stand for hippycrit<and yes that isn't how it is spelt>}])

 

[NinjaSurfer]

it's like when you find out someone playing tribalwars is a female
you're more likely to support that player and less likely to attack
that's why it's good MMORPG strategy to pretend you're a girl with a screen name like Amanda217

 

[MissQuote]

I find the "Reveals" part odd. In this whole question dealy topic thing.

It's not like coming out of the closet or something. For that matter I read some stuff that made me think recently about how everyone is assumed straight until informed of otherwise, and I thought that was interesting, with the idea of bias and prejudice concerned, even the most open accepting mind has the tendency to make general assumptions about peoples most basic states as humans until more information is provided that proves the assumptions incorrect.

The questions/ideas you are throwing up fall into a sort of similar category of assumption. that is that everyone on the internet, or perhaps that everyone on INTPf is a male until further information is provided and/or confirmed.

With you word usage "reveals" perhaps and then the idea of shock or that one will be treated/responded to differently after "revealing" themselves as female there is a definite clear picture of a portion of the troubles the female sex faces purely by default and of no fault of her own, still this day, in the world.

 

[NinjaSurfer]

I find the "Reveals" part odd. In this whole question dealy topic thing.[...]

yea I was really hoping for some upskirt, disappointed

 

[MissQuote]

Hush you. Stop it. There are ladies in the room.

 

[Vladimir]

*dies slowly* I always just assume it's a person. (although I have been wrong)

A female INTP is dangerous? Either this is a joke I missed or an obvious statment. Everyone is dangerous for different reasons.

I see what you mean. A gender symbol will undoubtedly create an immediately different approach to the person. Please excuse my ignorance, and I thank you for enlightening me.

I no longer hold that we should have gender symbols under our names or next to the join date.

 

[snafupants]

Hush you. Stop it. There are ladies in the room.

@MissQuote

Now that Victorian probity regarding sexual conduct/discussion is what grates me more than foul language. So many women whip that out and then have a gang-bang that weekend or something. I'm nobody's daddy (hello nobody) but I frequently note the hypocrisy. I'm assuming your comment, however, was meant to be ironic.

 

[Etheri]

I'll admit to often assuming people are male. That being said, does it truly matter? It shouldn't, however it often does. We do change our behaviour depending on someones gender, whether we like it or not. Perhaps not knowing is best to more objective?

it's like when you find out someone playing tribalwars is a female
you're more likely to support that player and less likely to attack
that's why it's good MMORPG strategy to pretend you're a girl with a screen name like Amanda217

Far too obvious name, my friend. In all honesty, within a day of playing a MMORPG with someone you'll usually figure out quite alot about them. Very few guys manage to keep up and succesfully 'be a girl' for long enough, especially once you get in rather social clans / guides / groups. The behaviour is usually just plain easy to read.
That being said, I quit all mmorpg's over a year ago. I miss them at times .

 

[NinjaSurfer]

Ok how bout Sparklypoo4U
I think I could pull it off

 

[Etheri]

Ok how bout Sparklypoo4U
I think I could pull it off

Scamming 14 year olds doesn't count. Then again, might teach them an important lesson in life : There's no girls on the internet. Oh wait. Try something like Jynx, Lynnesse or CrazySnowflake.

 

[Architect]

I assume a poster is male unless there is an indication to the contrary. Why not? Most people on this board are male, most INTP's are male, its a reasonable assumption that I make no apologies for. There's certainly nothing sexist about it. I was surprised recently to find out that 'skip' is female. I had known her as a poster for some years, and I actually detected in her writing that she didn't seem so much like a he, but it was still a surprise when she mentioned being female. Not that it really matters one way or another, but we do form mental images of other posters and it was disconcerting to find out otherwise.

Which brings up a topic, I wish people would use an avatar, or we had an indicator for gender. Not a big issue, but it would be nice. My avatar is obviously, definitely male, it would be nice if we all did something like this.

This discussion reminds me of The Matrix when Neo was in the bar talking to Trinity - "Whats the matter?" she asks "I thought you were a guy" says Neo, "Most guys do" says Trinity. Hacker culture is not typically female, nor is INTP, but we cherish our female compatriots none the less.

Interestingly, I have an INTP male friend I really like being with. My wife has an old INTP female friend, who I really like, but have a hard time being around because I can hear her think. It jams my circuits, if that makes sense. Not sure if that means anything, but I doubt I could have married an INTP.

there is a general misconception that the fields of computers and technology and such are primarily male dominated.

I've worked in engineering for nearly 20 years and I can tell you it is definitely male dominated. Women I worked with complained about it; I once heard them say that it wasn't fair because the guys would continue to discuss technical issues as they went into the bathroom. Which was bullshit as men rarely talk in a bathroom. But the culture is ST male oriented, I agree.

Unfortunately due to this there is a gender imbalance for female engineers in the workplace; they have a much easier time getting promoted. Generally if you are a woman you can do a stint for a year or two as a line engineer, then step into a management position. Happened time and time again. Is that fair?

Back in physics the same thing, and there were all sorts of scholarship opportunities for women in science I wish I had access to.

Ultimately, while people love to blame society for telling women not to go into engineering, technical stuff or science, I don't think that's true anymore; I think it's the women themselves. Most women are 'F', and technical fields attract 'T''s. And in their teenage years women get flooded with hormones (as to the boys), and that certainly plays a big part as evolution has programmed women to be baby machines.

 

[AureliaSeverina]

I could go for some female revealing in this thread

An INTP female (or male) for that matter would be far too bashful to 'reveal' themselves.... Except if they somehow did it by accident because they didn't know what it was.

 

[Jennywocky]

I would say most males are shocked, when they are, because of the general abundance of males on the internet. That's more likely than people here assuming that women are, on average, less intelligent; I'm not really sure why you suggested that.

I don't think it's rocket science either.

1. Higher percentage of male INTPs than females, in the INTP population. (Heck, there's a higher percentage of males in the T population in general in the USA, I think.)

2. Female INTPs often possess behaviors that are attributed as masculine ones in Western culture, compared to other females.

3. We often pick names that are androgynous or masculine sounding, from my own observation. (I specifically chose otherwise with my userid.)

Not sure why we have to assume there's some level of foul play going on when the most obvious factors easily explain the phenomenon at least on the very general level we are bothering to approach it....

 

[MissQuote]

@MissQuote

Now that Victorian probity regarding sexual conduct/discussion is what grates me more than foul language. So many women whip that out and then have a gang-bang that weekend or something. I'm nobody's daddy (hello nobody) but I frequently note the hypocrisy. I'm assuming your comment, however, was meant to be ironic.

@snafupants

It was the only response I could come up to in reply to the reply I received after my well thought out wine induced ramblings.

Yes. an attempt at irony. Not completely sure, but I think I was the first female to post in the thread.

 

[Dapper Dan]

If you frequent a forum enough, you start to recognize certain posters. At the same time, you unconsciously form an identity for that person in your head (what they 'sound' like, general attitude, etc). If this identity turns out to be drastically wrong, it's going to throw you off for a bit.

This isn't exclusive to gender differences. If you meet someone online and get to know them fairly well, you are almost certainly going to be in for a shock if you ever meet them in person. It's just how our minds work.

 

[EyeSeeCold]

Perhaps not knowing is best to more objective?

That's not objective. Males really do tend to assume that others are also male. Because of that assumption, there are some male-centric themes & values that emerge, whether overt or subconscious, but they're still there.

I do think it's unavoidable that awareness of female presence might come with shock and fixation by males(see hormones). If you want to try to be impartial, I think you have to not only refrain from making a big deal out of it, but also realize and accept that females also use the internet.

This discussion reminds me of The Matrix when Neo was in the bar talking to Trinity - "Whats the matter?" she asks "I thought you were a guy" says Neo, "Most guys do" says Trinity.

Nice quote.

I don't think it's rocket science either.

1. Higher percentage of male INTPs than females, in the INTP population. (Heck, there's a higher percentage of males in the T population in general in the USA, I think.)

2. Female INTPs often possess behaviors that are attributed as masculine ones in Western culture, compared to other females.

3. We often pick names that are androgynous or masculine sounding, from my own observation. (I specifically chose otherwise with my userid.)

Not sure why we have to assume there's some level of foul play going on when the most obvious factors easily explain the phenomenon at least on the very general level we are bothering to approach it....

Yeah, the original post was kind of ignoring the fact that this is not just something related to INTPforum, it's even a popular internet meme.

 

[Vladimir]

Yeah, it doesn't matter that much it's just..black text on dark grey lol, and I think DarkCastle is the default forum skin, I really don't remember anymore though.

I would say most males are shocked, when they are, because of the general abundance of males on the internet. That's more likely than people here assuming that women are, on average, less intelligent; I'm not really sure why you suggested that.


]

Males are , on average, taller, and therefore have bigger brains. Because of that, they are generally more intelligent, by like 4 or 5 IQ points. Or so I read. It makes sense to me, but it could still go both ways.

 

[Hawkeye]

Currently, it's still a man's world. Forums are not considered girly.

 

[Moocow]

I for one have no idea what the OP is talking about because I haven't seen any such surprised reactions. Can you justify your accusation?

 

[Brontosaurie]

I thought INTP's were smart enough to recognize the pragmatic legitimacy of a valid prejudice/induction.

as shown in the poll, about 60 % of this forum are male. probably more considering members of a minority will be more inclined to fend for themselves by answering.

it's not stupid or sexist to assume people here to be males. it's sound. if you have to assume something. you could argue that sex is an unimportant trait, of course.

 

[NinjaSurfer]

I just pretend everyone's a female so it's like I'm surrounded by girls all day, just like real life.

 

[EditorOne]

There may be a simpler yet more interesting explanation. I wonder if it's just that in here, with everything reduced to words, we are all more INTP than male or female? Or more specifically, if I can slice my way down to what I'm intuiting without being able to explain it: If I'm a guy and I'm INTP, and I'm getting answers and statements online that fit my mindset, why wouldn't I be open to the assumption it's someone just like me, ie, male and INTP? It is admittedly an unexamined assumption, but that was yesterday. Personally I just assume it's a person and don't concern myself with worrying about gender, because if somebody isn't giving off obvious (to me) gender signals online, it's a signal in itself that the person's gender is secondary to the reason why they're here.
In the real world most females seem to be non-INTP and they'd certainly have different posts from what we see in here.
I dunno did any of that make sense? I'm feeling very fuzzy today.

 

[scorpiomover]

Reading though the posts here I’m always amused with the comments that follow when a female INTP shares her gender. The ‘Holy Crap you’re a girl!?’ reaction. I wonder if it’s our sexism, ego or our social upbringing that makes males assume we have the monopoly on the mind and intelligence.

Seeing as I didn't really make that assumption since I'd discovered my first female INTP, and I am from the UK, and most here are not, I am betting it's social upbringing that is the majority factor involved in both the assumption that most INTPs are males, and that it's reasonable to assume the majority.

 

[Architect]

There may be a simpler yet more interesting explanation. I wonder if it's just that in here, with everything reduced to words, we are all more INTP than male or female? Or more specifically, if I can slice my way down to what I'm intuiting without being able to explain it: If I'm a guy and I'm INTP, and I'm getting answers and statements online that fit my mindset, why wouldn't I be open to the assumption it's someone just like me, ie, male and INTP?

@EO

Well there are other type boards with plenty of females, on those it's usually more obvious due to the avatars and language used.

I think you're on to something though, which is that we all are INTP's here, and when we're all together we're writing pretty similarly; namely clear, succinctly and logically, often about a theory or other. That kind of speech is naturally more male like. Additionally the INTP females I know (a small group - well one) is not very femme.

I think this point has been made elsewhere on this thread.

 

[PhoenixRising]

I don't know about people having a shocked reaction to an INTP being female. I have talked about being female on here and no one has treated me any differently. Maybe it's because, like my boss says, I'm just "one of the guys" lol. I actually did the math recently, being INTP and female makes you 1% of the 2.5% of the population that make up all INTPs. So that means I'm one of approximately 17,434 women in the world with this same personality type. It makes me wonder if I'll ever meet another INTP female, and if I did, how much like me she would be.

It is strange how males seem to think they are more logical and technically minded than females. I may have a biased point of view, but in my experience women handle stressful situations more methodically and rationally than men. I also know a lot of women that are very interested in technology and engineering topics. I myself, have a job that focuses on medical science and engineering.

I read about a study a little while ago that talked about the differences between the male and female brain, and sought to discover if one gender was smarter than the other on average. The study focused on CT scans of the brain. Here's an article highlighting the general discoveries they made in this study. http://www.webmd.com/balance/features/how-male-female-brains-differ?page=2

 

[PhoenixRising]

Males are , on average, taller, and therefore have bigger brains. Because of that, they are generally more intelligent, by like 4 or 5 IQ points. Or so I read. It makes sense to me, but it could still go both ways.

Read the article linked in my previous post. The theory you have stated here is true in that male brains are a bit bigger, but false in that the size of their brains makes them more intelligent.

 

[BigApplePi]

Reading though the posts here I’m always amused with the comments that follow when a female INTP shares her gender. The ‘Holy Crap you’re a girl!?’ reaction. I wonder if it’s our sexism, ego or our social upbringing that makes males assume we have the monopoly on the mind and intelligence.

Yes it is sexism. Sex is one of the most important interests we have. Breathing is important too, but sex can't be taken for granted.

Males and females would post alike (prove me wrong) if we didn't have to reveal our sex. I revealed my sex some time ago because it came out in some context. After that, if there actually are more males posting, they are more sensitive to the opposite sex because they are subconsciously horny. Hence the shock and surprise (I said THAT ... I'd better be more careful in front of a female). What will she think of me. Maybe females make the revelation also because its important to know if they will be accepted by males for what they are (or display).

 

[Deleted member 1424]

As an intp female I tend to assume most people on the internet/forum are male.
Although imo a 60% male population is not high enough percentage to the justify the male assumption.

I actually think it's the media that perpetuates these unconscious assumptions.

and yet....
I don't really care. My gender has never really mattered to me (at least until I realized how much it mattered to everyone else, and now I'm just annoyed). It continues to baffle me how it utterly dominates the perspectives of most people. I've always been open about my gender on the forum, because I believe the main reason for doing so in a community like this is fear (and less so experimentation).


My apathy has probably made me a bit prejudiced against straight gentlemen and gay ladies, as my being female is just so damn important to them, in otherwise platonic interaction. I've always found that trait extremely off-putting.

 

[Polaris]

^ Yup.

I was always more comfortable around guys as they seemed to be less interested in boring personal stuff and talked about things I was curious about. My mother is a complete tomboy and dad has strong feminine qualities, so we never really grew up with that gender-biased influence. As I grew older, people pointed out my "genderless tendencies" and way of thinking as if it were something unnatural and amusing, and I was sometimes mocked for having non-female interests and mostly male friends.

Luckily my two closest female friends were both NT's, so I didn't have to endure the more girly interests, such as playing with dolls, etc. We used to muck around with bicycles, climb trees, secretly smoke cigarettes made from wild herbs and conduct various "science experiments"..... One is now a science teacher/school principal and the other works in the offshore oil industry. I have drifted from one thing to the other, never really managing to conform to the female role, as much as people attempted to hammer it into me.

I really had no clue how much gender/age/sexuality/skin colour/even fucking hair colour meant to the prejudiced, closed-minded I'm-too-cowardly-to-think-differently-idiots, both female and male. I have always had zero patience for people who make up their own generalised irrational assumptions based on personal bias/hatred/fear/jealousy towards people they don't understand.

 

[NinjaSurfer]

Consider in every other instance of human interaction, you generally know the gender of the other person-- live, phone, even over email the name gives you a clue

The fact single men are always on the prowl, consciously or subconsciously, probably makes a guy do a double-take when he realizes a forum goer is a potential mate. One will be more aware of his behavior, that is just the way things are in nature. If an attractive girl asks a guy on the street corner for directions, his body language would reflect differently than if a dude asked him for directions. I don't think anyone should be offended; it seems more like an endearing trait that's getting represented the wrong way. I'm sure that pulling out chairs for girls and holding doors open on dates hasn't been categorized as sexist. I don't think this should impact our abilities to communicate logically-- but the effect that females have on males also cannot just be ignored. It's not a respect issue; it's a "I don't wanna piss you off bc we might be compatible issue." whereas, one guy doesn't really care about pissing off another guy because (unless he's guy) there's no sexual attraction nor possibility.

There's a similar effect for ageism where one might shift his/her perspective on a forum goer's image after finding out someone else is really young or really old.

I'm more inclined to be nicer to girls than guys. I'm also more inclined to hit on a girl wearing a pretty red dress than the grizzly biker dude sitting at the end of the bar.

 

[PhoenixRising]

Consider in every other instance of human interaction, you generally know the gender of the other person-- live, phone, even over email the name gives you a clue

The fact single men are always on the prowl, consciously or subconsciously, probably makes a guy do a double-take when he realizes a forum goer is a potential mate. One will be more aware of his behavior, that is just the way things are in nature. If an attractive girl asks a guy on the street corner for directions, his body language would reflect differently than if a dude asked him for directions. I don't think anyone should be offended; it seems more like an endearing trait that's getting represented the wrong way. I'm sure that pulling out chairs for girls and holding doors open on dates hasn't been categorized as sexist. I don't think this should impact our abilities to communicate logically-- but the effect that females have on males also cannot just be ignored. It's not a respect issue; it's a "I don't wanna piss you off bc we might be compatible issue." whereas, one guy doesn't really care about pissing off another guy because (unless he's guy) there's no sexual attraction nor possibility.

There's a similar effect for ageism where one might shift his/her perspective on a forum goer's image after finding out someone else is really young or really old.

I'm more inclined to be nicer to girls than guys. I'm also more inclined to hit on a girl wearing a pretty red dress than the grizzly biker dude sitting at the end of the bar.

I find it curious, you say that single men see any forum goer that happens to be female as a potential mate. However, on forums there isn't usually a way to tell how old another person is, what they look like, if they're married or not, etc. As you mentioned, as soon as you find out they're too young or too old, your opinion of them changes. So with so little information about a female you meet on a forum, why do you go as far as to change your behavior in order to appear less offensive to her? It seems a bit illogical.

I don't know about most women, but I find it very offensive when a man opens a door or pulls out a chair for me just because he thinks I'm attractive.

 

[BigApplePi]

Perhaps I misspoke earlier when I referred to learning a poster is female implying romantic associations. There are OTHER kinds of females, ya know. Mothers, sisters, teachers, girls who prefer unaggressive males ... whatever is in the male imagination. If a poster is expected to be a male, one can forget oneself. A male is sexually transparent to a male ... just like them. If a poster suddenly becomes female outside of expectations, one has to reorient themselves.

Of course that doesn't cover all the possibilities ... I've left some important ones out.

 

[crippli]

If a poster is expected to be a male, one can forget oneself. .

A preference? I find it difficult to understand why you shouldn't be able to to do this with anyone receptive.

 

[BigApplePi]

Do which?

 

[crippli]

all possibilities

?

 

[BigApplePi]

May have been said already:

1. Female reaction to female
2. Gay reaction
3. Reaction to lesbo