How do you manage getting a job?

[Inferno]

Nearly every job I apply for requires me to do a personality test, and once the hiring manager finds out I'm an introvert, they completely throw out my application and don't bother replying back to me.


How am I supposed to get a job if so many employers want job candidates to have people skills?

Why are people skills so valued anyway?

At my old job, I worked hard and applied myself and some of the other employees who have 'people' skills basically talked or texted most of the day and did little work.

To have people like that who get hired over me, someone who will actually work hard and not waste time, is annoying to no end. I and a few other friends who are introverts are still without jobs after graduating college but we know people who partied most of their time in college, cheated in class etc., got jobs soon after graduating because they have 'people' skills...Whatever

 

[Nocturne]

Oi. How irritating. I am in the process of trying to find a job but laziness is preventing me.

Perhaps introverts are stereotyped as people who are completely unsocial, very mildly enthusiastic, and have difficulty adjusting to new environments due to their shyness, etc? >.<

Most of the time, this may not be so.
Good luck!

 

[Meer]

Consider lying the next time a potential employer makes you take a personality test.

 

[Beholder]

Consider lying the next time a potential employer makes you take a personality test.

Second. ^

Seriously, lying is the only way. I lied so much on my application form for this job... I'll tell you if they accept me (I'm pretty much already in)

 

[Architect]

All you need is one job. Keep trying, you'll find it.

 

[Pyropyro]

Uh... using personality tests for hiring people is like using zodiac signs to hire people. I think you're better off not working with them.

How am I supposed to get a job if so many employers want job candidates to have people skills?

You train by yourself or under a coach to get people skills. I'm training under an Extrovert at the moment to acquire this.

Why are people skills so valued anyway?

Because any job requires contact with people. Yeah it's hard for us Introverts to but not impossible.

 

[Dapper Dan]

Getting a job is all about who you know. Try to make use of what connections you have. Ask people if they know anyone who works in ____. Even a second-degree relationship can get you to the top of the resume stack.

Also, people skills are incredibly valuable. That doesn't mean you have to be a super socialite, but you do need to be able to communicate clearly and get along with your coworkers. INTPs are actually fairly well equipped for this.

 

[xbox]

Yes, lie on those tests. Take a bunch of coffee shots before the interview. Let your insides cringe with fear as you fake an extrovert's enthusiasm.. Once you get the job, keep it up, but let it taper off. They'll keep you for your hard work, and see right through the others.\

 

[walfin]

Start your own company and fire extroverts on a whim. Reverse discrimination FTW!

 

[Vrecknidj]

All you need is one job. Keep trying, you'll find it.

True.

Getting a job is all about who you know. Try to make use of what connections you have. Ask people if they know anyone who works in ____. Even a second-degree relationship can get you to the top of the resume stack.

Also, people skills are incredibly valuable. That doesn't mean you have to be a super socialite, but you do need to be able to communicate clearly and get along with your coworkers. INTPs are actually fairly well equipped for this.

True.

I currently have 7 employers:

1) A large university in the midwest (I teach philosophy)
2) A union at that university (I am a unionized employee)
3) An alternative-ed. high school in the midwest (I know the boss)
4) A large, multinational company for which I serve as a consultant (a friend from the aforementioned university got me the position)
5) Rite Publishing (check them out if you're into Pathfinder, D&D or other RPGs)
6) A private military school's summer camp (I'm the director; the guy who runs the alternative-ed. school above used to be the headmaster at this school)
7) A private university in Indiana (I teach in their school of professional studies and I got the job because the liaison was connected to me through the private school in #6)

I have all of these employers concurrently. It's quite a juggling act. The hours I put in to any one of them varies by season, but, in the month of April 2012, for instance, I will have logged hours for each of them.

They're all part-time, I have no insurance (America sucks), and it's a helluva lot of hours. But, I get to do a lot of different things (which is good, because INTPs can otherwise get bored).

Anyway, I got most of them (indeed, probably, all of them), because of someone I knew. More than anything else, I've gotten jobs based on who I knew, not based on what I knew.

Dave

 

[Sigma Octantis]

I say fake it.


look, if the job demands you to be out of your personality... is this really a job you want?


if its just some part time job, fake it to get in... sounds wrong...

 

[snafupants]

I was looking for a job and then I found a job, and heaven knows I'm miserable now.

 

[MissQuote]

My blood boils at those personality quizzes. I can barely make it through half of one without the overwhelming urge to either throw my computer on the ground or being tempted to start cynically rewriting the whole thing from the bottom up with language that supports and encourages the subtle nuances of intelligence and employable merit along with a full dissertation as to how it is nothing but folly and poorly attempted psychological manipulation with the obvious aim of forcing the applicant to feel unworthy while they grovel for a slave wage job and submitting that as my resume instead.

Obviously, I am having trouble finding employment.

 

[Affinity]

As someone who has held about 20 jobs over the past 7 years... Fake it til you make it!

 

[EditorOne]

For crying out loud.

If you want to answer "I'd rather read a book' on the quiz, don't. Pick the choice that involves other people, like "I'd rather go to a party." How hard is it to figure out the opposite of introverted and answer the quiz that way?

I'm not trying to give you a hard time, but the answer is "do what you have to do".

Nobody but the bureaucrats in human resources even look at the test results. Your job is to simply get by them and into the workplace where you can do the work and be judged more on that. Human resources = resident evil, devil's spawn, fifth column. I'd call them snakes but it would offend the snakes. People think the comic strip "Dilbert" is a joke, but it is so soberingly accurate it's almost not funny. Jump the hurdle and get into play.

 

[Inferno]

It wouldn't really matter if I lied on personality tests, because the employer who will interview me (most jobs I apply for, the employer does the interviews) will see that I'm not outgoing or personable.

What jobs do you guys have?

 

[Dapper Dan]

Software/Web Developer.

My department has the most INTPs I've ever seen in one place.

 

[Affinity]

It wouldn't really matter if I lied on personality tests, because the employer who will interview me (most jobs I apply for, the employer does the interviews) will see that I'm not outgoing or personable.

What jobs do you guys have?

The trick with interviews is to practice. The more prepared you are, the more smoothly things will flow. Even if you are not outgoing, you can help convey that you are by being prepared and sounding confident. Things to work on would be solid resume, firm handshake before and after, upright seating posture, as well as eye contact. Understanding body language is a plus. Be prepared for questions such as tell me about yourself or why did you leave your prior jobs. Use google and practice. Don't be too hard on yourself because jobs are a bit harder to come by these days. Practice, practice, practice.

I currently work graves moving mass transit trains around and prepping them for the morning. Currently going to school for computer science.

 

[Co60]

The trick with interviews is to practice.

I agree with this, in spades. If you're introverted, you need to regard an interview as acting, and learn and rehearse your (probable) lines until you're word-perfect and can deliver them in a convincing and confident style. Eye-contact and smiling is crucial - practice this with friends.

In respect of the testing bit - I agree with EditorOne - it's dead easy to see which are the 'correct' responses on almost every personality test - all you need to do up-front is think yourself into the alien persona that you're trying to project.

I agree getting a job isn't easy - certainly not in the UK just now, either. If I was in this position (I'm not) I'd regard it as a military campaign. First I'd review my resources and qualifications, and identify my own USP - what can I bring to an employer that will attract him, and make me stand out from the crowd? If I needed to develop that (more qualifications / experience) I'd work on that. Then I'd review where the vacancies are, what kinds of jobs in which fields, and where upcoming vacancies might occur -research into companies moving into the area / expanding operations, and get to them ahead of the rest of the field.

Posts up the thread are very true - exploit friends and family as much as you can.

Regard the time you're unemployed as opportunity to work on your abilities - upskill yourself for free by using online resources and local education opportunities, or do volunteer work to improve your experience section on your CV / resume.

Take up an unusual hobby so you'll stand out from the others and have something to talk passionately about at interview. Don't lose hope - there is a job out there for you, and you'll get it in the end.

I'd look at it this way (and I have a 19-y.o. son in exactly this position) - everyone's living longer and working longer, so even if it takes a couple of years longer to get into a career when you're young, you'll still have forty or more years to develop it before you need to stop working. Extra time when you're old means extra time when you're young too.

Re-reading it, all of this sounds very structured and not very INTP - but if you want a job, you have to make yourself do stuff that doesn't come easily.

For the record, I'm a project and strategy manager in nuclear decommissioning. Ideal for an INTP, but I couldn't do it without a team of very non-INTPs helping me out big-time.

 

[EditorOne]

I agree with co60. An addendum: Your first goal is to get interviews, then you worry about the job. If the test stands between you and an interview, do what you have to do to get by it. Reconfigure yourself as suggested for the interview, change your mindset, attitude, etc. What the person interviewing you wants is probably less structured than the crap HR goes through with its screening. Dependability is in short supply these days, and anything you can do to convey your dependability is plus points.

And yes, jobs are tough to come by right now no matter who you are, so don't take any of it personally.

For the record, I stopped looking for jobs some time ago and am now in the early stages of starting up a business of sorts.

My entire life has been spent in journalism, and the initial attraction was this: I got to be where interesting things and interesting people were happening, always a changing scene, and all I had to do to pay for the privilege was write about it. The big drawback was not introversion - being a reporter automatically conveys enough gravitas to make talking to people a lot easier. It was learning not to inadvertently step on people's toes, especially fellow workers, with accurate observations that to me had no value judgment implicit in them, but which others found cruel, callous, insensitive, etc. Or perhaps it was learning to pretend I cared that they found the remarks cruel, callous, insensitive, etc., hard to say. :-) The second half of my career was managing journalists in some fashion or other, and it worked out pretty well so long as I could hire people whose fulfillment was centered on aspects of the job, like mine was. I'd identify the effective people on staff, make sure they had all obstacles cleared out of their way, and then leave them alone. The less effective people got training and perhaps a shift to a better match between job and temperament. The second half of the career also involved shifting organizations over to innovative stuff, and to figuring out how to redefine and cover news in the middle of a changing paradigm. That part was fun. Working for total asshats occasionally and dealing with the victimhood champions in human resources was not.

 

[Vrecknidj]

The trick with interviews is to practice.

I'll chime in and add another "Yes. This is the truth." comment here.

The more prepared you are, the more smoothly things will flow. Even if you are not outgoing, you can help convey that you are by being prepared and sounding confident.

Getting a job is like getting a date, in this respect. People admire and desire confidence in other people.

Things to work on would be solid resume, firm handshake before and after, upright seating posture, as well as eye contact. Understanding body language is a plus. Be prepared for questions such as tell me about yourself or why did you leave your prior jobs. Use google and practice. Don't be too hard on yourself because jobs are a bit harder to come by these days. Practice, practice, practice.

All good advice.

Dave

 

[Meer]

I had an interview today, for a summer student painting thing. Actually, it was the second interview. The lady told me that she wasn't impressed with me after the first interview because I seemed kind of shy.

Yeah, I'm too shy to paint houses.

I've got another interview tomorrow for a job that I (think I) actually want. But, the dude seemed reasonable enough and I'm pretty knowledgeable in the area and they probably super want me soo it'll probably go okay.

 

[oneinfiniteloop]

My girlfriend is going through the same thing right now. Has a great resume, MsC in Marketing from Uni of Manchester, and is damn good at what she does and she knows it. Problem she keeps running into are inter-personal relations, either she'll call out fallacies and show people why their ideas do not work in certain scenarios during the "group interaction" part of interviews, and be called stuck up and know-it-all, or she'll be pretty quiet and reserved and sometimes its hard for her to get a word in edgewise with the more extraverted interviewees. She gets discouraged, but like others have said, you just have to fake it to make it. Be nice, polite, and courteous to others, even if they are idiots.

 

[Crazythinker1]

Yeah. Those personality tests make my blood boil. Fortunately, I did not need to take a test to get my currant job, I just had to impress the boss lady. Apparently, she likes us quiet introverted types

 

[EyeSeeCold]

[bIMGx=500]http://i.imgur.com/H9QQ7.jpg[/bIMGx]

 

[Dr. Freeman]

Spoiler

I agree with this, in spades. If you're introverted, you need to regard an interview as acting, and learn and rehearse your (probable) lines until you're word-perfect and can deliver them in a convincing and confident style. Eye-contact and smiling is crucial - practice this with friends.

In respect of the testing bit - I agree with EditorOne - it's dead easy to see which are the 'correct' responses on almost every personality test - all you need to do up-front is think yourself into the alien persona that you're trying to project.

I agree getting a job isn't easy - certainly not in the UK just now, either. If I was in this position (I'm not) I'd regard it as a military campaign. First I'd review my resources and qualifications, and identify my own USP - what can I bring to an employer that will attract him, and make me stand out from the crowd? If I needed to develop that (more qualifications / experience) I'd work on that. Then I'd review where the vacancies are, what kinds of jobs in which fields, and where upcoming vacancies might occur -research into companies moving into the area / expanding operations, and get to them ahead of the rest of the field.

Posts up the thread are very true - exploit friends and family as much as you can.

Regard the time you're unemployed as opportunity to work on your abilities - upskill yourself for free by using online resources and local education opportunities, or do volunteer work to improve your experience section on your CV / resume.

Take up an unusual hobby so you'll stand out from the others and have something to talk passionately about at interview. Don't lose hope - there is a job out there for you, and you'll get it in the end.

I'd look at it this way (and I have a 19-y.o. son in exactly this position) - everyone's living longer and working longer, so even if it takes a couple of years longer to get into a career when you're young, you'll still have forty or more years to develop it before you need to stop working. Extra time when you're old means extra time when you're young too.

Re-reading it, all of this sounds very structured and not very INTP - but if you want a job, you have to make yourself do stuff that doesn't come easily.

For the record, I'm a project and strategy manager in nuclear decommissioning. Ideal for an INTP, but I couldn't do it without a team of very non-INTPs helping me out big-time.

Though much of this has clearly been said, acting is key. If you were to ask almost anyone who interacts with me regularly, (who knows what the term means) they would say that I am heavily introverted. If you were to ask anyone who has only seen me in Model UN or on the debate team, they would say I am an extravert. Stress your ability and make the effort, no matter how difficult, to act as if you care about the interviewer. Believe it or not, it actually helps.

 

[Felan]

I find it also helps to do some research on the place before you go and see if there is any hooks that you can be passionate enough about. Even if it pure cheese like, "Every time my soccer team won a game, a bunch of us would come here and get soft serve ice cream. So I was thinking how neat it would be to work in this place so full of good memories." I've never met anyone that though happy memories were the basis of employment but everyone loves a good story, and you'll stick in their memory more, which means they will give more than a passing thought to you. Another approach is to say you noted how much the company donates to charity and it suggests a corporate ethic that you want to be part of.

Ask them questions and challenge them. "Why should I work here?" "What's the best thing I can learn from this opportunity?" "In what ways does the company elicit input from the employees and what you have suggested of late?" "I'm ambitious and curious how often opportunities come up for greater responsibility?" Obviously don't be snotty about it but personally I've found asking interesting and engaging questions to good way to seem like you are serious about your future amid a market where few are. This gets easier as you get experience.

Just my two cents.