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I get the impression that @EndogenousRebel and @Black Rose are arguing that logic is a flawed system. Other people may be arguing that logic is not flawed, but is incomplete, and so does not account for all solutions. The argument is: Can anyone make an argument like "I've never been to Kenya...

No. There are 2 possibilities: 1) Logic is flawed. If #1 is true, then we have no means of determining the veracity of an argument. Then all our thinking and science has no basis. 2) Lots of people abuse logic. They say things that are logically invalid, and claim they are logically valid...

I understand. But it was people like you and @EndogenousRebel who supported and encouraged the development of logic into a system that people like you and @EndogenousRebel considered to be "perfect". Now, you and @EndogenousRebel are now claiming that logic is imperfect, when your counterparts...

I know that you being an American, would as a conclusion oppose Marxism. But your argument is equally applicable to billions of Marxists concluding that they should do everything in their power to make your country become Marxist. I do not ascribe to the view that logic is perfect. Godel...

True, because even if he never goes to Kenya, the world might explode anyway, for a different reason. The wars with Marxist communists, was about that very point. Marx claimed that capitalism was the cause of evil, and that unless every country in the world became communist, then communism was...

This is a standard use of a truth table. However, this is just pointing out the well-known rule of "If X then Y" equals "(NOT X) OR Y", as if you do the same truth table for "(NOT X) OR Y", you also get "true, false, true, true". It's a rather trivial result, as it's very well-known. So you...

1) "Every time I go to Kenya, the world explodes." Is that true? On what basis? Deductively? Inductively? "Every time I go to..., X happens" which seems to be a statement of correlation, an inference, not a deduction. Inductively: How many times have you been to Kenya? How many times has the...

I can provide notes. But not written down. This forum doesn't allow for pen and paper. Also, your working out was on different pages. I don't know how to join multiple quotes from multiple posts on different pages, into the same point. So I'll have to break this up into multiple posts.

@EndogenousRebel showed me this video This guy here says that if the premise is invalid, the conclusion is definitely not sound. So that can't happen, at least, not according to @EndogenousRebel.

Why? You refused to accept that your agument was not logical. Yet you claim that it's wrong. You didn't even use truth tables correctly.

Why not all free speech is good. Really? Then where were all the trials of all the Nazi scientists who went to the USA? Where were all the trials of all the Nazis who went to South America?

I can't believe that we're arguing over what logic means. Actually, I can. I've had this same argument multiple times. It seems that what most people used to call "logic" isn't what people call "logic" anymore, just as what most people used to call "an atheist" isn't what people call "an...

I found her boring before she even started talking about the topic. If I wanted to make a video that people would NOT pay attention to, and wouldn't understand, then I would make a video like this. 1) Sabine, how can a high climate sensitivity tell you if your country's economy will collapse in...

The lottery numbers. How to get a girlfriend. How to get a decent-paying job. How to get people to stop acting like a-holes and get on with each other.

Not much point in posting this if it won't last even 3 days. What about all the illegal immigrants? Where will they go?

Is that what INTPs actually do in real life? Is that what ISTPs actually do in real life?

Why? Are you good at formal logic? If so, then why are you trying to claim that all of the people who didn't finish high school are so much better at everything than you? Are you bad at formal logic? Then how would you know if formal logic has flaws in it? This is pure theatrics...

Sure. But then we are often asking "WHEN does a cloud move and WHEN does a cloud NOT move", which often answers the question of immediate causation, but not what ultimately made the cloud move in the first place. It's like if you won the lottery, and lots of pretty girls start flirting with...

Science cannot answer "why". You can only know "why" something exists, by asking the creator of the thing why he/she created it, and listening to his/her answer. Science can answer "how". You can do some experiments and see how gravity works.

Read post #131.

In English, if something is true, it is common to say that something is "logically true", or "logical" for short. If something is false, it is common to say that something is "logically false", or "illogical" for short. Logic is just the subject matter. It's like "things written on paper". Are...

You are referring to the topic that people like Euclid and Newton would have meant by "logic", things that get real answers to real problems, problems where if you get the wrong answer, people die. @EndogenousRebel is talking about a topic Euclid and Newton were not talking about, a topic where...

That's very different. Your relative is an American like you, yes? He is studying modern American philosophy, yes? 1) In Euclid's time, in Greece, Euclid was called a "philosopher", as arithmetic and geometry were considered part of philosophy. Philosophy was about getting accurate answers to...

Go to 23:47 So, is the argument "You didn't go to Kenya, and if you went to Kenya, the world would have exploded. So I can thank you for the world not exploding", VALID? Your premises are "you didn't go to Kenya" and "if you went to Kenya, the world would have exploded". Your conclusion is "I...

The point about public education is to educate so many people that you can reasonably get x % of the population who are educated in physics enough to be phyisicists, y% of the population who are educated in chemists enough to be engineers, etc, because the Law of Large Numbers shows that with...

Maths, physics and chemistry are the hardest of the sciences, in that order, and the IQs of people in those fields are the highest of any subjects, in that order (the top mathematicians have an IQ of 170. The top physicists have IQs of 160. I don't know about the average chemist). So if they...

Yup. It's one of the reasons why the rich usually stay rich, and the most of the poor stay poor. Me too. When I tried to do what others did, it would come out wrong. I had to learn everything consciously, my way. It has pros and cons. The con are that it takes me a lot longer to learn things...

@Old Things made the argument about atheism on the other thread: https://www.intpforum.com/threads/dear-worms-support-freedom-of-speech.29635/post-637730 Rhetoric is about persuasion. It's the same skills that salesmen use. Logic is about what is true and false. It's the same skills that...

Success in the modern world is mostly about things like soft skills, attitude and confidence, most of which don't seem to have much to do with IQ, and seem to be highly correlated with how your parents raised you, and which schools you went to (the schools where the wealthy send their children...

In the 1500s, there was no central heating. If you wanted to keep warm, you had to make a fire yourself. There were no microwaves, If you wanted to eat hot food, you had to cook the food yourself. Captains of ships had to know trigonometry, in order to navigate the stars. Architects had to know...

Either your argument is reasonable or it's not. If it's reasonable, then you have not shown a flaw in logic, i.e. reasoning. If it's not reasonable, then it's not part of reasoning, i.e. it's not part of logic. In logic, it's valid to state "if you went to Kenya, the world would have exploded"...

@Black Rose: Much better. :like: @dr froyd was able to follow it well enough to give you some feedback on it.

A lot of Europeans, particularly on the Continent, tend to think of their culture as superior, even to British culture. But they're mostly snobby about that. I think it's more than that. The Marshall Plan rebuilt Germany and Japan so much, that they became superpowers in the 1980s. At the...

But then people couldn't discriminate against anyone else.

Weren't the same people who said that the 2020 election was not rigged and not stolen from the Republicans, were the same people who were saying that the 2016 election was rigged and stolen from the Democrats, and the same people who were saying that the 2000 election was rigged and stolen from...

I am LIKE speech I don't agree with. That's how I learn best, from when other people disagree with me. I just don't like it when years later, they tell me they agreed with me all along, and were only saying it because they wanted to get people riled up so they'd get more votes so they would win...

I can see what it does.I was doing some C++ on a micro-computer (Arduino, then ESP32), for a home automation project for fun. But it kept crashing. In order to make it stop crashing, I had to figure out the problems. So I had to figure out what the CU was doing in the background, in order to...

Spatial intelligence is all about knowing the short cuts. Those people who are good at it, struggle to explain all the calculations. This is usually because it's their subconscious that does the work. That's great when you happen to be right. But if you can't explain it, then when you're wrong...

I was talking about other things, not meditation. I've also read about meditation, and been taught a lot about mindfulness. That stuff is taught in very practical ways. You can find videos of how to do meditation on Youtube. Meditation is more like exercise. Going to the gym one day, won't make...

His post read to me as if he was talking about alienation and anti-social people, not feminism and male domination of science. He seemed to think that people who were anti-social were people who were misunderstood. I pointed out that I have known lots of people who were misunderstood but were...

FYI, for some perspective, I used to not mind watching foreign films as long as they had subtitles, or I liked the look and could follow the films. So I watched a lot of French films, and a lot of Chinese martial arts films, as well. So I also grew up watching the old 1950s and 1960s Godzilla...

That is how religions are portrayed. I wish. The spiritual stuff I read, is incredibly abstract. It's extremely difficult to get something directly practical from it. That's actually a principle that is taught in some religions. We would hope. Then we wouldn't be missing out by choosing to...

I LOVED Inception. I also thought his Dark Knight trilogy was a very clever and very intelligent version of Batman. Christian Bale did a very good job of portraying Batman's character as being incredibly close to Batman in comic books, right now to his extreme lack of emotion, and his...

I like looking "under the hood", and figuring out how things really work. But most people don't bother, as they're too busy advancing their career, dating, and when they're not doing either, enjoying themselves. If they did, they'd learn a lot. But they probably would get freaked out. I...

I spent the 1st 25 years of my life pre-internet. The computers back then, didn't have the programs you have now. Even to calculate a simple integral on a computer, you had to write a program in Pascal. To calculate anything with a formula, you had to know which formulae to use, and when. If an...

If you re-read my post, I didn't mention anything about misogynism. FYI, I've known several men who have strong Aspie/Autie traits, and who are generally regarded as either having Aspergers or Autism. None of them are considered misogynistic by the women who know them. You entirely misread my...

There isn't any more. Most modern publicised scientific discoveries are low ratio empirical correlations, things like "in a scientific study of 300 obese people, 30% of them had gene variant X". FYI, 30% of lobotomies worked as well. I learned from U-571, that there's zero connection between...

If you are better at regulating epinephrine than norepinephrine, then your body is less responsive to physical exercise. Tht would be psychological stress, which would again suggest you are more responsive to epinephrine, and it's epinephrine which is more responsive to endurance training, such...

The 1st article I mentioned, says that ADRB2 regulates epinephrine, while the ADRB1 gene regulates norepinephrine. This has interesting consequences, because of this article: Plasma Catecholamines in Stress and Exercise So the ADRB2 gene is involved during public speaking, while the ADRB1...

I was curious about what the ADRB2 gene did, as if being overly fearful was a disadvantage, then the ADRB2 gene should have become rarer and rarer over time. So I googled it and found this: Genetics of β2-Adrenergic Receptors and the Cardiopulmonary Response to Exercise ADRB2 causes the lungs...