Why do women have lower IQs than men?: The case for plebeian intellect in females [SPLIT]

[Mello]

Many.

And you find all of them to be more emotional than men?

 

[Code_Name_Ozz]

More of them than not, but like everything in life there are exceptions. I've seen some men that are complete crybabies. They whine everytime they're told to do something, or when they don't get their way over a certain issue.

 

[Mello]

More of them than not, but like everything in life there are exceptions. I've seen some men that are complete crybabies. They whine everytime they're told to do something, or when they don't get their way over a certain issue.

Cool.

 

[snafupants]

It isn't that women aren't as smart as men, but rather that women are more inclined to make decisions based on their emotion state at any given moment regardless of present logic and reason.

That's a blanket statement that I regrettably cannot condone. Do you have data and sources correlating this phenomenon with intelligence over thousands of individuals and many years?

Even if your unfounded supposition was correct, that hardly means that women are incapable of employing intellect. The issue hinges on aptitude rather than achievement/manifestation.

In other words, women could be wholesale capable of processing information at an extremely high level, but refrain from doing so for whatever reason. What would that prove?

 

[EyeSeeCold]

(As a brief aside, while in conversation with an ITJ woman last about the difference between men and women's conversations, she noted that it is far more likely for a man to tell another man that what he has said is stupid/wrong, whereas a woman is far more inclined to think, "That is the stupidest ****ing thing I've ever heard in my life!" but actually say, "That's an interesting perspective; what led you to a conclusion like that, which I'm having trouble seeing the reasoning behind?" I thought that was somewhat amusing. But it also leads me to think: Which one of those responses demands more self-control and command of the higher faculties?)

The willingness to be diplomatic despite one's true attitude instead of being blunt and insensitive yet honest is what contributes to the introverted subjugation of women.

It might feel empowering at first, but in the long run it establishes the role of women to be pleasers or suck ups. With that said I fully support the movement of women towards straightforwardness, at the risk of them becoming blunt and insensitive.

 

[GYX_Kid]

Whether or not this would even be true, why would this have any impact whatsoever on an IQ test, which is entirely impersonal and not involving a need to include anything other than pure rationality?

(As a brief aside, while in conversation with an ITJ woman last about the difference between men and women's conversations, she noted that it is far more likely for a man to tell another man that what he has said is stupid/wrong, whereas a woman is far more inclined to think, "That is the stupidest ****ing thing I've ever heard in my life!" but actually say, "That's an interesting perspective; what led you to a conclusion like that, which I'm having trouble seeing the reasoning behind?" I thought that was somewhat amusing. But it also leads me to think: Which one of those responses demands more self-control and command of the higher faculties?)

I wonder if the aggressive dismissiveness is more of a male thing to do, or an ITJ thing to do

 

[Jennywocky]

I wonder if the aggressive dismissiveness is more of a male thing to do, or an ITJ thing to do

I don't know. Obviously some males are pretty laid back and amicable, so I wouldn't say it was "male behavior" across the board. But her husband is a lawyer, and I'm sure in the circles she moves in there are some pretty assertive guys, so it probably happens regularly in her experience.

At the gathering in which I met her, I ran across a number of males who were very Type A and domineering in the conversations I had with them... I felt like they expected my contribution just to be there and smile, laugh at the appropriate times, and support the viewpoints. But I have other guy friends not in those circles who are not that way. I do find women in general to be more indirect and/or to take the approach she described for them, though. Women who are too aggressive around other women tend to start to get a lot of passive-aggressive pushback or find the circle shutting them out if they have no way to assert power.

 

[GYX_Kid]

Well yeah in areas of society, it's much more acceptable and almost expected for men to be type A domineering like that than women. In a way, it's kind of like "to succeed socially, be antisocial." But acting really pushy may be a priority over being accepting of another opinion, depending on how it's perceived that success can be attained. Though it can appear that blind steamrollers get their way so often, the most successful know how to combine a mix of forwardness and empathy or understanding.

Although it depends a lot on the department. Actually I would definitely separate the concepts of empathy and understanding, the latter meaning the logical kind

 

[walfin]

Women are allowed by nature to do various things which men cannot do. Thus it is fair if they had a lower IQ.

 

[Jennywocky]

Women are allowed by nature to do various things which men cannot do. Thus it is fair if they had a lower IQ.

I'm not sure "fair" has anything to do with anything.
And of course there are many things that men can do by nature that women cannot.

None of it really has anything to say about why there might be an IQ difference or what it means if one exists.

 

[Jennywocky]

Though it can appear that blind steamrollers get their way so often, the most successful know how to combine a mix of forwardness and empathy or understanding. Although it depends a lot on the department.

Kind of funny how it works. But it does depend on environment. I've been fortunate to have worked in settings my entire career where men and women are treated equally in the day to day operations of the company, who gets promoted and trained, etc. It's kind of a cruel shock when I enter environments where that mutual respect is not the case.

In some environs, you have to be pretty ruthless, self-promoting, and domineering in order to ensure your own survival; in others, a more cooperative effort is rewarded.

Actually I would definitely separate the concepts of empathy and understanding, the latter meaning the logical kind.

Yes, they're kind of different, even if some of the end results can look the same. They can both coexist as well in the same individual (i.e., someone can emotionally resonate with you AND understand you).

 

[walfin]

And of course there are many things that men can do by nature that women cannot.

Many of those things are either of little consequence or can be overcome by effort (by some women at least) or technology.

Facilitating reproduction? With reproductive cloning, a woman wouldn't need a man to reproduce but a man would still need a woman.

Strength? Some women are more athletic than the majority of men.

So even if women had a lower IQ, it wouldn't matter. They'll dominate the planet in time to come.

 

[Mello]

Many of those things are either of little consequence or can be overcome by effort (by some women at least) or technology.

Facilitating reproduction? With reproductive cloning, a woman wouldn't need a man to reproduce but a man would still need a woman.

Strength? Some women are more athletic than the majority of men.

So even if women had a lower IQ, it wouldn't matter. They'll dominate the planet in time to come.

That sounds hot.

 

[Reluctantly]

Facilitating reproduction? With reproductive cloning, a woman wouldn't need a man to reproduce but a man would still need a woman.

I wasn't aware that there is no other redeeming value that a man can bring a woman other than a baby.

So even if women had a lower IQ, it wouldn't matter. They'll dominate the planet in time to come.

DEAR GOD, noooooooo

 

[Jennywocky]

Many of those things are either of little consequence or can be overcome by effort (by some women at least) or technology.

Facilitating reproduction? With reproductive cloning, a woman wouldn't need a man to reproduce but a man would still need a woman.

Strength? Some women are more athletic than the majority of men.

So even if women had a lower IQ, it wouldn't matter. They'll dominate the planet in time to come.

Oh, why didn't I see this before?
You're all expendable.

Thanks for pointing that out.

But life wouldn't nearly be as fun without guys in it.

 

[Mello]

Oh, why didn't I see this before?
You're all expendable.

Thanks for pointing that out.

But life wouldn't nearly be as fun without guys in it.

I shall never leave you.

 

[walfin]

I wasn't aware that there is no other redeeming value that a man can bring a woman other than a baby.

I didn't say men would be exterminated when women become the dominant gender, if they aren't already (depending on how you see it).

But life wouldn't nearly be as fun without guys in it.

 

[Jennywocky]

I didn't say men would be exterminated when women become the dominant gender, if they aren't already (depending on how you see it).

Yes, we plan to put twenty-four of you in an arena on a monthly basis, to fight to the death for our amusement.

And then there will be the brothels.

And the yard work.

And the barbecues.

I shall never leave you.

Hooray! Would you like to go blow something up together? I don't get a lot of that in the womens reader circles.

 

[Reluctantly]

I didn't say men would be exterminated when women become the dominant gender, if they aren't already (depending on how you see it).

I know, I'm just messing with you.

I don't think it would be so easy to define which gender is dominant though because human intelligence is much more complicated than that. A man can enjoy having someone dominate them if it is in their benefit/interest, but that doesn't mean they are necessarily being dominated because they have agreed to it and can change it should they choose to.

Domination, in my mind, is when someone forces someone to do something they don't like or want to do for another person's benefit, while making it really hard for them to resist. If you think women have this kind of primary intelligence, then I guess I agree, but I kind of feel like men and women are pretty equal in intelligence and tend to compliment and balance each other, more than anything else, especially as science advances and we gain the ability to modify ourselves any way we want; I mean if a woman can clone a baby, why can't a man? She's not using her vagina...

 

[GYX_Kid]

Women are allowed by nature to do various things which men cannot do. Thus it is fair if they had a lower IQ.

If one married couple wishes, they can request to God (who is male) for their daughter to trade her orgasmic erogenous nerve potential for intellectual potential.

Then at the time at which the men of the world have scientifically implanted the same sexual power into themselves, these daughters' children will end up as evolutionarily dominant species.

 

[Mello]

I'm going to have ten wives.

 

[walfin]

I mean if a woman can clone a baby, why can't a man? She's not using her vagina...

Yes she is, a man can't give birth. Thomas Beatie was a woman.

If one married couple wishes, they can request to God (who is male) for their daughter to trade her orgasmic erogenous nerve potential for intellectual potential.

A waste.

Yes, we plan to put twenty-four of you in an arena on a monthly basis, to fight to the death for our amusement.

And then there will be the brothels.

And the yard work.

And the barbecues.

Nooooooo......

 

[Jennywocky]

Yes she is, a man can't give birth. Thomas Beatie was a woman.
.

In terms of sexual functionality, tho probably not in terms of anything else...

 

[Code_Name_Ozz]

That's a blanket statement that I regrettably cannot condone. Do you have data and sources correlating this phenomenon with intelligence over thousands of individuals and many years?

Even if your unfounded supposition was correct, that hardly means that women are incapable of employing intellect. The issue hinges on aptitude rather than achievement/manifestation.

Blanket statement or not, I never said women were incapable of employing intellect. I said that more often than not, a woman's reason gives way to her emotional state. I never said that it was a constant occurrance.

Please quit trying to put words in my mouth.

 

[snafupants]

Blanket statement or not, I never said women were incapable of employing intellect. I said that more often than not, a woman's reason gives way to her emotional state. I never said that it was a constant occurrance.

Please quit trying to put words in my mouth.

Here are your words: It isn't that women aren't as smart as men, but rather that women are more inclined to make decisions based on their emotion state at any given moment regardless of present logic and reason. At any given moment seems to imply that women are incapable of employing intellect. This is a wholesale statement that I believe is untenable given the data, more often than not.

 

[Fukyo]

This thread has now run its course. Nobody got the hint that a split thread in crime and punishment should be left alone because it was removed with reason, and not create redundancy with discussion that fits in the original thread.


If you want to discuss the subject of matter of the original thread, go there.


If you want to joke about sexism, go to Boys vs Girls, but keep actual sexism off board.