Temporary Closure - discussion

[Inappropriate Behavior]

Folks - we either have to trust our Mods or not.

I've been here long enough to trust them. I know those who joined around the same time the troubles started may not have had the time to develop that trust as I have. I also know that some may have a more anarchial point of view and prefer letting things go. It obviously wasn't easy to make these decisions but they've been made.

It isn't freedom of speech that's been taken away, merely freedom to be nothing more than a prick.

 

[EloquentBohemian]

Folks - we either have to trust our Mods or not.

I trust them completely. No one is infallible, so they will make mistakes occasionally, but as a whole, I trust the Mods, the Admins, and especially LoR. I think they do whatever they can in the best interests of the Forum.

 

[Agent Intellect]

i think the mods should be constantly questioned on their decisions. its the only thing we have to hold them accountable, since this isn't a democracy.

 

[Cobra]

It isn't freedom of speech that's been taken away, merely freedom to be nothing more than a prick.

weer all in ur threads, sharin eachuthrs ideaz

 

[Jennywocky]

The themes that are emerging from everyone's comments are that

1. we are a community
2. people who come here should either be interested in learning from the community (primarily about INTP) and/or interested in joining it.
3. being part of the this community is a privilege not a right

Nice assess, snowqueen. And yes, the people that seem to not fit are the people who do not seem to sense the community spirit (or just disregard it) and thus disrespect it.

There is another category though - people who are in a group but adopt an individual role. That is - their activity in a group is purely for individual motives and they have no emotional or practical investment in the group. I think if you look at XIII and ChristopherL they definitely fit this category. Face - it's less obvious but Face liked to use the forum as a playground and wasn't worried about the chaos caused as a result so on balance wasn't focused primarily on being a group member.

Very perceptive. Yes, they were here for themselves, ChrisL was very clear on that point, and considered others to be fodder for his own showboating and experiments.

But actually it is the fact that this forum may well be one of the few groups we would choose to belong to as a member that makes it so important that we protect it for ourselves and future members like us.

Thank you for your post, that was a nice assess.

 

[tom]

I trust the mods.

I think ChrisL had the wrong end of the stick when it came to the forum. Its not a resource, its a meeting place, and its one of my favourite places to come and eavesdrop

 

[Wisp]

I trust the mods, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't discuss their decisions. I don't doubt that they come through and read these threads, so any ideas we have here, will trickle back to the higher levels, without anything being done. We should state views and opinions on administerial actions, but at the same time, those actions should still have the full support of the forum, agreed to or not.

 

[Kuu]

[I had posted this on the trolls thread but then realized this thread was more appropriate]

I have been thinking about this a bit, and had an idea the other day. Considering the relative calmness that has resulted from the closure of new memberships... perhaps this could be a periodical thing? Some communities, like torrent trackers, have closed memberships, and only once in a while can new members join. Maybe, say, 2 days of open registration, between 2 week periods of being closed?

That way, people that just stumble into the forum are forced to lurk a little and get to know the general feel of the place before joining. Also, there won't be a nearly daily barrage of new members, which can be quite overwhelming... instead, we get 2 weeks to start getting to know the new ones before others arrive. Slow the pace of growth for better quality.

The screening of trolls and duplicate accounts can be also handled easier that way... maybe

I don't know how well it could work, but the idea is out there now, do with it as you desire.

 

[snowqueen]

I like that idea Tekton - and it might make the mods job a lot easier - only 2 days per fortnight to have to check newcomers.

 

[fullerene]

I dunno about those proportions (two days is not much, and two weeks is a long time--the forum hasn't even been closed for one yet!), but this thought had struck me, too. I had thought of it as more of an easy fix when things got too hectic, though. Leave registration open for a while, but then whenever post-quality seemed to be degenerating, or whenever fights started breaking out, close it off for a few weeks to let people settle down. I bet if it were closed too often, we'd run out of things to say and eventually get bored of each other... so I don't really know what to think about the idea.

 

[Cobra]

I like that idea Tekton - and it might make the mods job a lot easier - only 2 days per fortnight to have to check newcomers.

You said fortnight. I love you.

I agree with cryp. It's a maybe, but it's far from a "bad" idea.

Perhaps screening? Is that possible? How about membership approval? It could obviously employ the same kind of "trust" and "honor system" that we equip our Mods with currently, just aimed at a more focused situation. Think if every person who is screened or given a probationary period is subject to some character scrutiny by the Mods? A judgment call... Hmm... Is that creepy? Or is that a good idea? Too early. Need coffee.

 

[loveofreason]

I'm grateful for everyone's comments in here, and for the ideas being put forward.

The forum will remained closed to new members for a while longer... we're still sorting stuff out as it seems the most opportune time to make long awaited changes... such as updating soft-ware.

The issue with perhaps being more harsh now on banning in compensation for our long-running tolerance is an interesting one, and I would emphasise the point that the Forum is under unusual conditions.

Just like a convalescent... what may be of no consequence when healthy could be extremely damaging while one is recovering.

So the focus now over any consideration for banning is whether or not any account in question is harmful for the forum as a whole. We do not need more rules or more rigid ways of applying them. I argue we need the opposite... we need to look at the interconnected dynamics between user accounts and weigh (yes, subjectively weigh) whether a suspect account is enough of a detriment to others to warrant it's removal.

The narrow prescription of broken rules hardly helps us decide, as one can stay within the rules yet still cause damage, while it is also possible to technically transgress yet cause no real harm...

so discretion and flexibility become more important to recovery than minute attention to rigid boundaries.


And yes... posting here is a privilege. This is a place kept open by the efforts of a few and the goodwill of a benefactor. It 'belongs' to the community of posters and just like any human group... that community creates a culture of shared values. Some people will not belong here. It is not a crime to discriminate. Discrimination is the power by which all things attain individual identities. It is the power to recognise differences and preferences. Fortunately for most, two of our strongest values have been tolerance and openness to ideas.

This place is for the sake of ideas and sharing them... tolerance does not fail because of the ideas that any one poster brings... it fails because of a failure of the poster in question to offer his or her ideas in a way that does justice to the idea and those receiving it.

So, if you wish to take part, please continue to bear with us while we explore the mysteries of Fe.

 

[Cobra]

So, if you wish to take part, please continue to bear with us while we explore the mysteries of Fe.

That should be our slogan here.

 

[snowqueen]

You said fortnight. I love you.

Blimey I wish all men were that easy to please!

 

[Ulysses]

I have another idea.

Guests and newly registered members should not be given full access to the entire forum until they have accumulated a specific number of posts. This won't completely solve the trolling situation, but it might help.

Make it so!

 

[Ogion]

As said above, post count is really not a good measurement. Some people post like 30 or mroe posts per day. That is nothing you can use to check wether it's a spammer/troll or not.

Ogion

 

[Ermine]

And most of the time, the spammers/trolls are the ones that post more in a day than most.

 

[fullerene]

^^Face started with 40 posts on his first day, if anyone remembers, and passed 1000 in 25 days.

That should be our slogan here.

I still like "Ti knights who say Ne"...... but maybe that's just me . I wish I had any art/computer design skills... i would've totally made a banner for it.

 

[loveofreason]

Yep... "Ti knights who say Ne" will be our catchcry...

we just have to upgrade and get that banner happening...

 

[Ulysses]

I can get you guys a banner if you provide me with two shrubberies.

 

[Cobra]

I can get you guys a banner if you provide me with two shrubberies.

Is that a bible reference? I'm so out of touch.

 

[Red Mage]

Didn't Judas betray Jesus for two shrubberies?

 

[Fedayeen]

Is that a bible reference? I'm so out of touch.

I think it is monty python, but that might be originally from somewhere else

 

[Cobra]

Okay, quick topic change, and then I'm done messing things up:

Went to a Catholic wedding yesterday. Thursday, at the rehearsal (my wife was taking pictures for them so they could save money on the photography bill and still get pics for the rehearsal, too), I notice in the large mass room to my right back corner as I walk in one of these "stages" in Jesus' life. There were all these painting style hand carved wood depictions that were numbered (I've been told what the name for these stages are, but it escapes me).

The one to my back right was captioned "Jesus with the women" standing in almost a "mingling" fashion talking to 2 women. Hilolious.

Then two doors down, there was another that said "Jesus is stripped" and there are two figures in the carving I presume were probably Roman males, but since it was all hand carved, they looked very similar to the two women from the one before.

I wanted so badly to see one that said "Jesus is hung." Also one that says "Jesus hanging with the studs" would have really made everything better on wedding day when we had to go through all that up down up down up down shit. And boy are my jokes tired.

Okay, carry on.

 

[Ermine]

Didn't Judas betray Jesus for two shrubberies?

No, 30 pieces of silver.

 

[EloquentBohemian]

...of which he bought to shrubberies with.


...and some petunias.



...and a small picket fence to go 'round them to keep the bunnies out.

 

[echoplex]

Here's an idea, if it hasn't been mentioned already...

I've seen some forums that make you wait 7 days upon registering before you can post. I think that might be a good idea for this forum. It would force new members to lurk a little and get a feel of the forum before posting, and it may discourage banned people from making accounts since they'd have to wait a week to start bugging us.

It's a bit similar to the idea someone posted that posts per day could be restricted until a certain amount of posts. Perhaps these two ideas could be combined to...
- No posting for the first 7 days
- No more than 5 posts a day for the next....maybe 2 weeks?

To be fair, this may also discourage people from joining altogether, so this is not a perfect solution, just an idea I'm throwing out there.

 

[Ermine]

Is there any specific date for when we reopen the forum for new users? IMO that date is coming soon, but you never know.

 

[Ogion]

No reopening date planned atm (that i knew of).

Ogion

 

[Anthile]

Well, nothing will happen about this before the board software update.

 

[Deleted member 1424]

Any new details in regards to opening the forum again?

 

[loveofreason]

...unless Ragnar comes riding into town in a blaze of trumpet fanfare.....?

ummm.... no...

maybe.....

depends...


for fucks sake... as soon as the hallucinations stop... ok?


(ie. well... maybe Jesin is ok, I wouldn't know... but I'm a total basket case and the admin we need to do the job has vanished... so... yeah...)

 

[Deleted member 1424]

It's all good.
I'm not rushing you, just trying to stay up-to-date

 

[Toad]

Does it feel like the forum is dieing without new members? Or is it just that the old members are gone.

 

[Cryss Winters]

I miss new blood.

 

[Sapphire Harp]

Does it feel like the forum is dying without new members? Or is it just that the old members are gone.

I disagree entirely! There are an awful lot of new members who weren't receiving any notice amidst the waves of drama rolling through the place. With things calm and quiet, it's definitely a chance for them to come into their own - and for the rest of us really notice and engage them.

In fact, the first two weeks after the closure, it still seemed so much like new people were joining, I felt like double checking to make sure the closure happened.

If things keep on for a few more months this way, then... yea. I'd definitely start growing concerned... but I think dealing with the software upgrades and hosting issues is a worthwhile thing, too... That forum crash was a particularly bad event, in my opinion.

P.S. Quotation spelling corrected.
​

 

[Ragnar]

Forum opened again, if anyone reading this gets confused.