Creativity - A Noble Thing? A Higher Calling?

[Sapphire Harp]

Do you think creation, creativity, creative pursuits are a noble endeavor? Something that speaks to a calling? A higher purpose? A greater meaning?

If you create a beautiful painting, does it do some greater good or is it just an enjoyable filler of your time?

Or is it really just a matter of the quid-pro-quo layer of existence. Something you do to contribute to your mental health, sense of identity, collection of material possessions, and social reputation?

I've been pondering the importance of creative endeavors lately as a tangent to possibly changing my career and I was wondering how the rest of you perceived the issue…

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Tangentially related to a wonderful, but short lived conversation (thread) about obsession, creation, and recognition… found here.

Also, a pre-emptive notion - this could easily get sidetracked into a religious argument… The topic is inherently linked, so bringing it up makes perfect sense, but I'd appreciate it if we didn't let the discussion get too bogged down in that aspect if it comes up.
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[Keads]

I think the pursuit of creativity to be noble. You will get a small sense of fulfillment from the act of creating. The biggest win that I can think of is when somebody else appreciates your work as much as you do. Imagine if you can shock people out of apathy with something truly beautiful and remarkable.

I chose not to read the link that could cause me to become bias or give me a different perspective of your original thought. I hope I don't miss anything, but I don't want to restart an already finished conversation.

 

[Darby]

I think I go for the latter, but that doesn't mean it doesn't have meaning. I think mental health and sense of identity(I won't list the others, these are the important ones) is one of the most meaningful things you can do. If you are happy with who you are, what you do, and where you are in the world, then what else is there?

To answer the initial question, I do believe it is a noble act, you don't have to, but it makes me happy to create something. As to a higher calling, we all want to be happy, and if art and the creation of something makes me happy, then I suppose that is a calling of some sort.

 

[Cognisant]

I can say (well, assume) it's more noble than brushing your teeth, but by a non-quantifiable amount, since it is merely a subjective concept. So I suppose my point is, if you consider creativity or the act of creation to be of sufficient personal value to warrant being labelled noble, then yes, to you it is noble, and there are many who would agree with you.

But if you're asking if or not it's inherently noble... well no, it isn't.
That's not to say it's the opposite of noble, the same principal applies there too.

 

[bluesquid]

My last GF was "creative". She got pissed at me because I critiqued all the pieces in a show she had gained entry into.

I cant lie. Its just not in me. She said, "basically your calling all the art garbage including mine" she was right, I told her so. Then you get the obligatory, "you didnt go to art school!", "No, because its a waste of money" yada yada yada

There was a picture of a seat at a stadium. It was in the center of the pic. It was green. All the others were orange. It was fucking ridiculous. No, it was art. I said I didnt get it, was told i ahd to know the story of the old guy...

was this huge clay face thingy. It was not aesthetically pleasing at all. It was art. I was told that I didnt realize how much skill it took to make this thing. alot of time and effort for a piece of crap.

art is truth. Art is subjective. If your going to be creative please make sure it doesnt suck. If no one wants to buy it, its probably a fools errand.

Art can be noble, but its as rare as a noble act.

 

[RubberDucky451]

My last GF was "creative". She got pissed at me because I critiqued all the pieces in a show she had gained entry into.

I cant lie. Its just not in me. She said, "basically your calling all the art garbage including mine" she was right, I told her so. Then you get the obligatory, "you didnt go to art school!", "No, because its a waste of money" yada yada yada

There was a picture of a seat at a stadium. It was in the center of the pic. It was green. All the others were orange. It was fucking ridiculous. No, it was art. I said I didnt get it, was told i ahd to know the story of the old guy...

was this huge clay face thingy. It was not aesthetically pleasing at all. It was art. I was told that I didnt realize how much skill it took to make this thing. alot of time and effort for a piece of crap.

art is truth. Art is subjective. If your going to be creative please make sure it doesnt suck. If no one wants to buy it, its probably a fools errand.

Art can be noble, but its as rare as a noble act.

That's the difference between a graphic designer and an artist. They can use the excuse "You don't understand it" or like you said "You didn't go to art school". Graphic designers have to create pieces that work. Something that appeals to the uneducated and the educated is the highest form (although the educated can appreciate it more considering they realize the amount of work put into it and recognize specific graphical concepts). This obviously isn't a rule but i find it generally true.

Considering creativity, I find it gives me a great sense of worth. I also think creativity is severally lacking in our culture, even more so as we age.

 

[Kuu]

That's the difference between a graphic designer and an artist. They can use the excuse "You don't understand it" or like you said "You didn't go to art school". Graphic designers have to create pieces that work. Something that appeals to the uneducated and the educated is the highest form (although the educated can appreciate it more considering they realize the amount of work put into it and recognize specific graphical concepts). This obviously isn't a rule but i find it generally true.

Fix'd for inclusiveness.

I agree fully.


Of course, this does not imply that something made for purely selfish and subjective reasons, something that doesn't 'work', is entirely worthless. I don't know if there is such a thing as noble, I just know that I like doing what I do, and don't care what other people think about it.

 

[Döden]

^ to bluesquid: Well that's not really the point, is it? While some art looks like a total joke, I trust that the artist had some sort of intent behind creating it. Seeing a piece of someone's mind manifested into a medium is always fascinating to me. Whether it is aesthetically pleasing or not actually seems quite removed from this whole idea. Ideally, the artist simply creates. It all comes down to whether some chump will actually pay big dolla to buy it.
That said, I do think art school seems like a huge waste of money.

As far as nobility: I do believe creating is a noble endeavor. Whether or not the creations themselves are noble is debateable and is best left to personal opinion.

 

[Sapphire Harp]

I meant to include the question of why, but didn't seem to remember it earlier… If creating is a noble endeavor, why do you think so? Do you have a notion why you feel that why? As Oresama was saying, some thing makes creativity differ from brushing your teeth…
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I don't know if there is such a thing as noble, I just know that I like doing what I do, and don't care what other people think about it.

I used the word noble as a best fit approximation… An act which is more than indulgence or seeking compensation… An effort which has a higher value?

A lot of us feel this notion, but it's difficult to talk about. It seems like it's either accepted or rejected outright, without too much consideration. There's a pretty deep gap between the two sides, and I'm not sure where my own opinions lie, because I suspect there isn't anything "inherently noble" in attempting, as Oresama suggested.

To sum up, I guess the question is, "If noble… why? Why, why why?"

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P.S. Bluesquid, have you encountered Salvador Dali's Lobsterphone? I bet that's up your alley.

[bimgx=150]http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/images/arts/photos/2009/05/06/dali-phone-cp-2716843.jpg[/bimgx]​

 

[bananaphallus]

What do Tom, Dick and Harry know though? I'm not sure the artistic merit of any work is in any large part defined by the populace's reaction to it, wouldn't to 'make something' with this as a primary consideration be disingenuous? The imagined voices of housewives and six year old bastard children rejecting your creative impulses as they see fit? This [my mind] is a dictatorship! Although, it's impossible not to be influenced by the outside world, prevailing popular opinion, a bastard child's sentiment towards certain types of furniture, trends, etc., so not only are these housewives and bastard children nixing your spontaneous conceptions and editing your flights of fancy, but they're in some ways responsible for the nature/qualities of the thought to be rejected/edited/censored, or possibly even the thought itself. Gah, butt. I don't know where I stand on this.

 

[shoeless]

...i don't like the word "noble". hm.

i guess it depends on the artist's intent whilst creating. whether it's monetary or... something else.

if you paint shit you don't particularly care about because you want to make money, then you're a douche.

if you paint shit you do particularly care about, because you feel something blah blah blah about your soul, or you want to "speak" to other people, etc, then, i guess that is "noble".

everything is a self-portrait. everything is a diary.

is existing as ones self an act of nobility? nowadays, i guess i would say so. if that's your "calling", your creation, then, i suppose so.

by the way, bluesquid, i'm sorry, but your entire post reeked of arrogance and assholery.

 

[Darby]

I don't mind what bluesquid said, I used to feel the same way. I started doing art when I was put in stressful or emotionally charged situations, and all of that changed.

I still have serious issues with photography though, I know a lot of effort goes in, but I just don't see/feel it when I look at a picture. Also, a picture is meant to capture a moment, but I think moments become more special when they are allowed to fade away.

 

[Da Blob]

Perhaps the value of being creative can be determined by examination of the lives of those who never are creative or feel the urge to be so? Those who are utterly passive, feel no need to express them selves or see that their world could be improved

 

[bluesquid]

That's the difference between a graphic designer and an artist. They can use the excuse "You don't understand it" or like you said "You didn't go to art school". Graphic designers have to create pieces that work. Something that appeals to the uneducated and the educated is the highest form (although the educated can appreciate it more considering they realize the amount of work put into it and recognize specific graphical concepts). This obviously isn't a rule but i find it generally true.

Considering creativity, I find it gives me a great sense of worth. I also think creativity is severally lacking in our culture, even more so as we age.

Funny you should say that because she is a graphic designer for (almost Ivy league unnamed school) University Press. This was "her work" aside from the job.

Specious rationalizations abound on art. I just dont believe everything created is art. If it resonates with the person other than the creator, then maybe. Much of what is labeled art is enabled vanity projects. Art has to create something in the viewer. A sense of truth, admiration of beauty, novelty. Otherwise the disdain I feel for the "art" seeps into how i feel about the artist.

I agree that creativity is lacking in this country.

 

[Sapphire Harp]

I guess it depends on the artist's intent whilst creating. whether it's monetary or... something else.

That's a good point for thinking about, Shoeless… If there is a higher meaning or purpose to creative work, it's definitely influenced by the purpose of the maker… Which tends to divide work into hobbyists and commissioned creations. People who develop careers in which they can support themselves with wholly self-directed creation are lucky and rare from what I know…

I'm feeling a spectrum between subsidence and creation for its own sake… Which ties in with Da Blob…
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Perhaps the value of being creative can be determined by examination of the lives of those who never are creative or feel the urge to be so? Those who are utterly passive, feel no need to express them selves or see that their world could be improved

It's a curious notion. I've known a few people who seem to have very little need to express themselves… At a guess, they're mostly the SJ temperaments. I don't imagine I'm seeing all of those individuals, but they don't seem to have needs beyond accumulation of fun, wealth, and status. Hence, a separation between mere existence and something more.

Although, that doesn't help determine whether creativity is something meaningful or a frivolous game...

Also, I'm a little curious what you were thinking when you mentioned improving the world, by the way.

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P.S. I think I've written little but drivel here, but I wanted to try and keep the conversation going… Also, 600 posts - ironically.
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[Da Blob]

There are several members who are engineers. I do not think creativity is limited to the "Arts" but that anyone who builds something, improves something does something new and unique is being creative as well. I think that we each create our own realities and those who 'improve' the reality that is their own environment are being creative.

 

[bluesquid]

There are several members who are engineers. I do not think creativity is limited to the "Arts" but that anyone who builds something, improves something does something new and unique is being creative as well. I think that we each create our own realities and those who 'improve' the reality that is their own environment are being creative.

So, for the most part no?

 

[Zero]

I think creativity is mostly for the sake of one's own enjoyment and MAYBE the enjoyment of other people. But initial it serves a purpose for the creator. If it serves a purpose for a company or the public it is rewarded a sort of different "nobility".

Creativity is about personal meaning and passion. I personally don't believe it means anything else or has any greater purpose. Years later when a painting ends up in a yard sale, it means nothing to other people. It's yet another landscape painting or what have you.

Creating can often be a process that is both wasteful of material (if it has no practical use) and redundant.

That's not to say it's bad. I think it has a personal purpose and that's worth the by-product. From a commercial standpoint the creation will probably be used for something.

By luck of the draw, the creation could gain some kind of cultural significance generations later. The pieces that win such a place are very few compared to the amount that's actually created.

 

[Da Blob]

So, for the most part no?

No? to what? I thought I was responding to S. H. query as to what I meant by "improving the world" I'm sorry if I missed something or wasn't clear enough. I would be glad to elaborate.

EDIT: LOL, although it is questionable if everything artists puts on blank canvas can be seen as an improvement of that blank canvas or any other part of the environment...

 

[Sapphire Harp]

There are several members who are engineers. I do not think creativity is limited to the "Arts" but that anyone who builds something, improves something does something new and unique is being creative as well. I think that we each create our own realities and those who 'improve' the reality that is their own environment are being creative.

Thinking about the 'creation' notion of creativity as opposed to the original expression of difference, I see... I didn't want to bias the discussion to 'arty' things, so I tried to avoid artistic words and overused the sole word of creativity.

I suppose anything that is made is an expression of creativity, on someone's part. Any imposition of organization or order... Although, some gather more or different respects than others. Or contempt, as the case sometimes is.

How about this angle... Does anyone think that attempts to be creative are all just narcissism? (Particularly those which are the artistic attempts at originality.)
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That's the difference between a graphic designer and an artist. They can use the excuse "You don't understand it" or like you said "You didn't go to art school". Graphic designers have to create pieces that work.

You could actually go further than graphic designers, or even just designers if we want to talk about any kind of creation. I was thinking about architects and engineers and the like. Creation with sometimes little to no superfluous features (in something like circuit design, per se.)

Absolute function, no frills...Is it creativity, or just problem solving?
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[Da Blob]

Thinking about the 'creation' notion of creativity as opposed to the original expression of difference, I see... I didn't want to bias the discussion to 'arty' things, so I tried to avoid artistic words and overused the sole word of creativity.

I suppose anything that is made is an expression of creativity, on someone's part. Any imposition of organization or order... Although, some gather more or different respects than others. Or contempt, as the case sometimes is.

How about this angle... Does anyone think that attempts to be creative are all just narcissism? (Particularly those which are the artistic attempts at originality.)
No! I believe that artistic creativity is an effort to express one's self and communicate in a unique manner, it is not necessarily an exercise solely to exalt one's own ego. While it is true than many artists do exhibit Narcissistic tendencies, others are motivated by wanting to share.

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You could actually go further than graphic designers, or even just designers if we want to talk about any kind of creation. I was thinking about architects and engineers and the like. Creation with sometimes little to no superfluous features (in something like circuit design, per se.)

Absolute function, no frills...Is it creativity, or just problem solving?
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"Just" problem solving??? LOL I think that some of the greatest human accomplishments can be categorized as Creative Problem Solving. I mean surely, art solves some kind of problem for the artists? Personally, I have always connected Art with the subjective concept of Beauty. If Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, then if one can see a beauty in circuits and becomes a circuit designer, she or he may well be an artist of some sort.