Worrying symptoms

[0lm8]

I don’t know if this is the right place to be asking this but really I can’t think of anyone that may understand where I’m coming from. I’m and INTP user who’s been in unending apathy for the past 10 years, which has led me down some dark roads with my mental health. After experimenting with LSD I can’t help but notice the rampant activity of my subconscious to the point where it is difficult to distinguish people’s words from my inner most thoughts (I’m aware this could be seen as psychosis). But my quest for meaning has brought me to the observer as it’s the lense we experience reality from. I’m just wondering how much credence do you guys give to subjective reality?

Also depending on your answer to the last question how do you guys feel about music and it’s almost conversationalist quality when viewed like this.

 

[Black Rose]

I filter some music through my subjectivity when I become emotionally involved but not that I confuse others words with mine. I rarely get emotional so the meaning is not there to hold onto like a channeling. Usually, it needs to be built up in my core which is the center of my head and up my spine. It's a connecting process, not so much apathy. So it is a lot more trouble seeing it as "The Other" not myself. As another being or creature, not just sounds. But they seem to be others, not myself.

 

[Cognisant]

I’m just wondering how much credence do you guys give to subjective reality?

Practically none at all

From this and the rest of your post I get the impression you're depressed and trying to escape into your own subjective fantasies, it never works, you need to identify and deal with your problems in the real world.

 

[0lm8]

Had to put reply in a jpg cause it was marked as spam. Just tell me if I should delete it for some reason.

 

[0lm8]

I filter some music through my subjectivity when I become emotionally involved but not that I confuse others words with mine. I rarely get emotional so the meaning is not there to hold onto like a channeling. Usually, it needs to be built up in my core which is the center of my head and up my spine. It's a connecting process, not so much apathy. So it is a lot more trouble seeing it as "The Other" not myself. As another being or creature, not just sounds. But they seem to be others, not myself.

Interesting this is the first time I’ve heard anyone directly address this problem for me with this kind of terminology. Not that I want to get to woo with it but this is very similar to how I feel about music but I get entirely emotionally involved (to my detriment) without any real choice. Again as an incredibly lonely person this is really the only life line I have to even connect with to the world.

And by other I definitely have that feeling of an abstract second feeling of “being” but it’s always either extreme anguish or love. As far as I can tell that’s what people describe as god right? When I explore it I almost always have a break down.

Also I would like to say that me speaking to others about this is evidence of my denial of my nihilistic leanings. I’ve always found it hard especially cause as soon as I mention this shit to anyone it’s either “we’re taking you to a ward” or completely disregarding me.

 

[Black Rose]

The voice(s)/(in the music) are as I encountered them speak personal messages as if they read my mind. But they are not me, simply telepathic. The song is exactly what is happening with me at the moment and the "Other" knows what it means to me. I have to preference It is not all the time the music becomes telepathic. I am not feeling the music but the music came at the exact time my emotions gave the same personification as my feeling I was going through. Just recently I had to give up a puppy and I was listening to music at the time and the music was unnecessarily cruel with betrayal in their words on the playlist.

So the words match exactly my situation.
The people singing the song feel telepathic. (real people not simply sounds)
I do not feel this on every song, it just happens for a situation I personally am going through.

I have tried to induce this connection to this higher order second other but haven't been successful. I do not have contact with God/imaginary friends though have encountered a presence involuntarily.

I have wanted to contact will my spirit animal/angel. But it needs to be controlled. It sounds like you lack control over the situation. You need to separate the self from others. I try to pray every day but it is hard because I feel like no one is listening. I try to make contact with my guardian angel to keep stable.

 

[0lm8]

The voice(s)/(in the music) are as I encountered them speak personal messages as if they read my mind. But they are not me, simply telepathic. The song is exactly what is happening with me at the moment and the "Other" knows what it means to me. I have to preference It is not all the time the music becomes telepathic. I am not feeling the music but the music came at the exact time my emotions gave the same personification as my feeling I was going through. Just recently I had to give up a puppy and I was listening to music at the time and the music was unnecessarily cruel with betrayal in their words on the playlist.

So the words match exactly my situation.
The people singing the song feel telepathic. (real people not simply sounds)
I do not feel this on every song, it just happens for a situation I personally am going through.

I have tried to induce this connection to this higher order second other but haven't been successful. I do not have contact with God/imaginary friends though have encountered a presence involuntarily.

I have wanted to contact will my spirit animal/angel. But it needs to be controlled. It sounds like you lack control over the situation. You need to separate the self from others. I try to pray every day but it is hard because I feel like no one is listening. I try to make contact with my guardian angel to keep stable.

Wow again thank you for being open about this I literally felt as if I was going completely insane. This a beautiful description of how I would describe these events exempt from my framework of casualty. Which is why I initially ask how much credence you guys give to these experiences. Because regardless of there subjectivity these events they do happen and within the confines of my finite experience of the universe couldn’t you say these things are more real then the physical inputs. As far as I can tell the closer you get to objectivity of experience the more warped reality actually seems to get (for example time perception in flow states go extremely fast). Is it a give an take of cognitive awareness? or potentially even as far as a “conversation” with archetypal representations of your own subconscious (or even further down the path of the unknown).
I would like to point out that when in these states, others seem to be aware of my distress which makes it feel even more distressing. I can’t tell if this is just an element of reality that other deal with and FE cannot comprehend it in a healthy way or I’m interpreting everyone’s action incorrectly and focusing to much of my own attention on myself.

I’m sorry If I trigger anyone with my use of terminology btw (not sarcasm).

 

[Black Rose]

Because of your apathy, you are looking at the causality different than me. I get very close to hallucinations I believe are real. Right at the edge of coming into reality. The past 2 months I was in the hospital, March 25 - May 25. I had a bad hallucination. But took everything seriously. I had to reevaluate how reality really worked. I did go through a psychosis. For you, you considered what you experience as Not Real. I every day for 42 days I thought "What is Real?". I still had a base (an ontology for how the universe worked) but was strangled when it was broken over and over again. My magical thinking was on overload. Always on the verge of giving into the thoughts.

The one thing that kept me sain was when an "incorporeal" voice yelled "keep your faith" in the cafeteria. (the cafeteria where the monster was)

 

[0lm8]

Because of your apathy, you are looking at the causality different than me. I get very close to hallucinations I believe are real. Right at the edge of coming into reality. The past 2 months I was in the hospital, March 25 - May 25. I had a bad hallucination. But took everything seriously. I had to reevaluate how reality really worked. I did go through a psychosis. For you, you considered what you experience as Not Real. I every day for 42 days I thought "What is Real?". I still had a base (an ontology for how the universe worked) but was strangled when it was broken over and over again. My magical thinking was on overload. Always on the verge of giving into the thoughts.

The one thing that kept me sain was when an "incorporeal" voice yelled "keep your faith" in the cafeteria. (the cafeteria where the monster was)

I feel your pain (I hope this does not come across as minimising your suffering) this is why I descended into a state of nihilism, I cannot live in a world without some degree of meaning in my life as meaning can only live exempt of material. This is why I have made the truth of my life to bring these objects of thought into reality through art (what I see as the greatest art form the interactive medium of VR) even if it’s just as far as creating the ability to throw a fire ball out of my hand.

The sad thing is it does not take the pain away. But if I can ask how are you dealing with this? Cause I’m stuck in a loop of distrusting everything. Even my relationships just end in vapid loops of unending impedance as if Im scratching the surface of something that can only ever been unseen and then the words slip out of my grasp and the world falls silent again.

Thank you so much for humouring me like this it helps me to know at least I’m not alone in the struggle. And neither are you now!

Also please don’t extend yourself into a painful memory for a stranger on the internet.

 

[Black Rose]

I am bipolar depressive.
I lack the energy to feel happiness.
But I do feel it sometimes.
What really matters is a sense of control.
I know that relationships need to be equal and mutual.

Seriously I mean that control over one's life is a cure for depression.
And relationships are control dynamics. I've studied this in A.I.

I want to be in a relationship myself.
I know what kind of person I wish to be with.
But we will need to be more than ourselves dynamically.
We would need to find our equilibrium in what we both do together and apart.

What you do together and apart is important.

not giving advice but a pattern to recognize.
humans should be cured of depression from analysis of the dynamic of the human system. A.I. is a control system analog to humans as control networks. Theoretically, relationships can be dynamically analyzed to find healthy stable control systems.

 

[0lm8]

I am bipolar depressive.
I lack the energy to feel happiness.
But I do feel it sometimes.
What really matters is a sense of control.
I know that relationships need to be equal and mutual.

Seriously I mean that control over one's life is a cure for depression.
And relationships are control dynamics. I've studied this in A.I.

I want to be in a relationship myself.
I know what kind of person I wish to be with.
But we will need to be more than ourselves dynamically.
We would need to find our equilibrium in what we both do together and apart.

What you do together and apart is important.

not giving advice but a pattern to recognize.
humans should be cured of depression from analysis of the dynamic of the human system. A.I. is a control system analog to humans as control networks. Theoretically, relationships can be dynamically analyzed to find healthy stable control systems.

You sound like an idealist. Which is rare and a painfully necessary position to live in such a bleak world. Just remember don’t lose hope and remember you will always have to expend energy you can either choose to expend it on indifference as for negative emotion or happiness which is a an objectively better state to operate in terms of finite existence.

I will say though that I think that love the intangible category of things that by definition give you joy and the search for them is the only real answer to the apathy.

If that subjective reality does mean anything understand that I am extending as much love as I can in your direction if we can both pretend for a moment.❤️

 

[sushi]

exercise and gtfoutside, don't ruminate and introspect.

 

[0lm8]

exercise and gtfoutside, don't ruminate and introspect.

I understand the sentiment, but not gonna lie it is a bit humorous saying not to be introspective on and INTP forum.

 

[Ex-User (14663)]

Introspection should serve a purpose and result in concrete solutions and actions in the real world. Otherwise it becomes your own private little insane asylum.

 

[washti]

It's ok to have private asylum like that. Up to you what you want from outside world and how often engage with it. Beyond necessities. Whatever you think they are.

Anyway everyone seems to believe that they have the best lifestyle, solutions, ideas what good life supposed to be.

 

[Pizzabeak]

It sounds cool, but you’d have to be careful. Everyone wants a unique talent or skill, although some can’t be too far from mental, under our current beliefs, they want to define it as a mental illness. You can’t share your private ideas with other people because they’ll use your history against you, and say you’re crazy. It’s best to lay low with it for a while, it could be okay if you mind your manners.

 

[Black Rose]

Introspection should serve a purpose and result in concrete solutions and actions in the real world. Otherwise it becomes your own private little insane asylum.

Sounds like a very Te potition to take.

 

[Pizzabeak]

It’s the whole “Sherlock Holmes vs James Moriarty” thing

 

[Ex-User (14663)]

Introspection should serve a purpose and result in concrete solutions and actions in the real world. Otherwise it becomes your own private little insane asylum.

Sounds like a very Te potition to take.

That may be true, but it’s a conclusion I arrived at by doing a lot of introspection. I know what sort of nightmarish existence it is to be stuck in one’s own head, traversing labyrinths of one’s own making.

 

[Happy]

I don’t know if this is the right place to be asking this but really I can’t think of anyone that may understand where I’m coming from. I’m and INTP user who’s been in unending apathy for the past 10 years, which has led me down some dark roads with my mental health. After experimenting with LSD I can’t help but notice the rampant activity of my subconscious to the point where it is difficult to distinguish people’s words from my inner most thoughts (I’m aware this could be seen as psychosis). But my quest for meaning has brought me to the observer as it’s the lense we experience reality from. I’m just wondering how much credence do you guys give to subjective reality?

Also depending on your answer to the last question how do you guys feel about music and it’s almost conversationalist quality when viewed like this.

When in the 10 year timeline did the LSD come into it? Just curious if that’s something you tried after your ‘unending apathy’ or if it kinda led you there. No agenda in the question, just curious.

More curiosity questions:
How are you coping now?; and
Are you here for help, or to find people with similar experiences? Other?

To answer your question, not sure I give much credence to ‘subjective reality’; but for the better part of a year, I have been exploring my own ‘experience of consciousness’ through daily meditation practice, and it’s led me to some interesting (positive) places. I’ve done some ‘metta’ practice, and that’s always left me in a place of empathy and compassion, which I’d say is pretty far from apathy. Maybe worth a try if you haven’t already?

 

[sushi]

there should be a balance between introspection and being active/engage in sports/physical activity. Just pick any one. I am not saying dont introspect,

I used to be an extreme introspect but only sports/physical activity can teach you how the external world works.

even digging a hole somewhere with a shovel and exerting energy is better than sit and think too long.

 

[0lm8]

I don’t know if this is the right place to be asking this but really I can’t think of anyone that may understand where I’m coming from. I’m and INTP user who’s been in unending apathy for the past 10 years, which has led me down some dark roads with my mental health. After experimenting with LSD I can’t help but notice the rampant activity of my subconscious to the point where it is difficult to distinguish people’s words from my inner most thoughts (I’m aware this could be seen as psychosis). But my quest for meaning has brought me to the observer as it’s the lense we experience reality from. I’m just wondering how much credence do you guys give to subjective reality?

Also depending on your answer to the last question how do you guys feel about music and it’s almost conversationalist quality when viewed like this.

When in the 10 year timeline did the LSD come into it? Just curious if that’s something you tried after your ‘unending apathy’ or if it kinda led you there. No agenda in the question, just curious.

More curiosity questions:
How are you coping now?; and
Are you here for help, or to find people with similar experiences? Other?

To answer your question, not sure I give much credence to ‘subjective reality’; but for the better part of a year, I have been exploring my own ‘experience of consciousness’ through daily meditation practice, and it’s led me to some interesting (positive) places. I’ve done some ‘metta’ practice, and that’s always left me in a place of empathy and compassion, which I’d say is pretty far from apathy. Maybe worth a try if you haven’t already?

Definitely my experemtation with psychodelics has been in latter years as I thought I was getting closer to the date where I would end it. So I would say my apathy really flourished before that point and if anything lsd has helped carry me to a place of more perspective.

In terms of coping, my already tentative grasp of reality has been shaken a number of times recently, but this is testiment to my active journey through that.

And I have come here for help as the only reaction I get from standard interactions is disregard, and I thought people with my mind set may have a better insight.

To the meditation I have only really been exploring it recently, and for the reasons you mentioned, but I am still motivated by my anguish for existence (As niave as that sounds). I'm still incredibly annoyed at being tore from my nothing to be put into a "shit hole without purpose".

That being said I am fully aware that regardless of my feelings im stuck. In this game I'm gonna attempt too make it at least a bit better for those that are suffering the same misfortune.

 

[0lm8]

there should be a balance between introspection and being active/engage in sports/physical activity. Just pick any one. I am not saying dont introspect,

I used to be an extreme introspect but only sports/physical activity can teach you how the external world works.

even digging a hole somewhere with a shovel and exerting energy is better than sit and think too long.

I hear that the perspective, but I can't help the question the power of my own hubiris. If my existence is a case of accident then I'm totally indifferent (exempt of free will due to physics(probably reality)) but if I'm able to (even in delusion) break the confines of a standard Life then I will. Which I believe is ultimately what your saying which I think is the only way to justify living. Still pretty shit.

 

[0lm8]

there should be a balance between introspection and being active/engage in sports/physical activity. Just pick any one. I am not saying dont introspect,

I used to be an extreme introspect but only sports/physical activity can teach you how the external world works.

even digging a hole somewhere with a shovel and exerting energy is better than sit and think too long.

I hear that the perspective, but I can't help the question the power of my own hubiris. If my existence is a case of accident then I'm totally indifferent (exempt of free will due to physics(probably reality)) but if I'm able to (even in delusion) break the confines of a standard Life then I will. Which I believe is ultimately what your saying which I think is the only way to justify living. Still pretty shit.

Also sorry for incoherence I'm pretty drunk

 

[Black Rose]

Extraversion and Introversion as in energy depletion/absorption may or may not be linked to Jung's E/I - but I find it helpful as descriptors of a real phenomenon. Energy is a good thing to have mostly, but not with anxiety. Sometimes I have fever dreams and night sweats. The feeling of being stuck is just horrible. All do and caused by not being properly regulated in the brain.

I just spent 5 hours with my family (mom sister niece) doing the shopping and I feel regulated enough to have the energy to do things tonight. There is a point where too much bedtime drains me and the restlessness is too much.

I think we all have set points for how our brains and bodies regulate themselves. Like I was saying that control is necessary to cure depression (a regulatory dynamic). As long as I can regulate myself I feel I can continue on in life. Perhaps each type has its own way of keeping regulated.

 

[sushi]

50% of your worries wont happen or are gross exaggerations constructed by your mind, the other 50% might if that comforts you

write down your top ten worries, or top 6, your mind is constantly looping and repeating these same worries.

 

[ZenRaiden]

Sometimes when your psychological health is too much a of a big puzzle you have to start at some simple point. Fix what you know you can fix and as you go through the process of fixing things you will eventually find ways to fix other parts of the puzzle.

In math we were taught the per partes system. It simply means you start from the beginning and go step by step. Finish first step and get some results and then go to step two and so on.