For as long as I could remember I have always had this feeling of paranoia. I feel as if every move I make, any thought I conceive...I feel that someone is monitoring it and recording it for research. I feel like i'm never safe with my thoughts, like if I think something absurd or even diabolical...It'll be released publicly, as if everyone around me is reading my mind, and studying me, like I am an animal in a cage and I can't escape. This feeling restricts me, it eats at my core. Any conversation I have, anything I say under my breath I just know someone is listening, they see what I see, dream what I dream, and I feel like i'm helpless to stop it, I always tell myself it's impossible but I can't help it. Is this normal, am I alone?
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OK, it's on.
Thoughts being monitored
- Thread starter Raquelio
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Scarlett Hayden
Member
I don't know if it's normal but i do know that i get that too. It's not as bad as it used to be but i don't deny that i feel like somewhere and somehow someone is watching me, listening into my thoughts. It is absurd, it could be true, like supernatural, or it could be a disorder, but it can make it incredibly frustrating to do anything. In the end i just think "f*ck it" because whatever i'm doing someone out there has probably done a hundred times worse, and if there are people/things watching me then they are probably watching them too. But yeah i know what you mean, it's creepy.
nanook
a scream in a vortex
im trying to understand my own mind. as i write the following
[edit: didn't think i would have anything to say on the topic at all. the more fresh my thoughts are, the more typos i make, sorry for the fucking mess haha]
i sometimes dip into a paranoid psychosis myself, only at night in my dreams, at most once per month, so far. it's like a solipsistic echo. part of it is alienation from one's own cognition. like transcendence gone wrong. incomplete witness mode. i am being made by the fabric of reality. this fabric isn't me. i am nothing. it isn't anyone. but something of me is still unconsciously having the I-thought, the "there is a me, this me is what i am, and what is, is happening to this me" and then it's like: "this is done to me". reality is done to me. by "someone". an unconscious projection of the concept of agency, of will. i know it sounds slightly different then what you describe, but it's related on a level, i can't tell how.
you are thinking. that's what is. yet, the thought aren't your's. you are not making them, you wouldn't know how, you are not god. thoughts occur to you. the experience of thought is claimed by two parties. the ego says: i am the thinker. consciousness sees: the ego itself is just another thought. consciousness sees the i-thought and all other thoughts. that's true for everyone. it doesn't explain why some are blissfully unaware of consciousness, some have a clean awakening (being one with consciousness) and some are unconsciously torn between both views.
now, there is a neurotic version of paranoia, where you project the concept of some god, who is judging you. this is on first sight something else. you have this judging voice, it's a regular part of the mind. the mind is not one. the mind is commenting on itself. the ego can't handle this. it want's to claim thoughts as his property, but when thoughts are too contradictory, well then the ego prefers to deny ownership. let me try it again. you are thinking: "what i did there was so wrong" and then you are wondering about the creative spirit that put this thought into your mind. how do you know, that what you did was wrong? who is this subject, that is holding all of these opinions? how was it created? how did it grew in you? you have this semi-concsious remembrance. once there was a time, when you didn't know about the difference between you and other people. life was like a dream. people were like dream characters. people said: "you are a bad boy". this sentence existed and happened inside your mind. your mind repeated the sentence over and over. this is how the inner critique grew into a complex recollection of possible accusations. you never owned this part of your mind. you can't own it. it's too obvious, that this part of the mind was there, before your ego existed. your ego was born afterwards. you ego grew, as something in you got informed about who you are supposed to be. the information came from "the outside". so you have the feeling that your inner critique is a real entity, observing you, because that's how it started. but who is this entity really? has this entity ever been your parents? no. it's you consciousness, perceiving your parent's voices, holding them, accepting them, comprehending them, forming a vision of their meaning, an image of you. and you think you are that image. this image has informed your egoic identity. so, you, ego, have been created out of the observations of your consciousness. your consciousness' observations of the thoughts about you and the comprehension of their meaning. and now your ego claims those thoughts to be his own thoughts, because your ego want's to be essentially "the thinker" of any current thought. it doesn't know how to be the observer (consciousness, witness, mirrormind). it's just a subtle thought. it can't observe anything at all. so there is the connection between the more psychotic version on the one hand, which is actually a more subtle and conscious version - where you have some witnessing capacity and you doubt thoughts, because all meaning is transparent to the witness, and on the other hand the neurotic version of paranoia - the one where you believe in your thoughts entirely and you only experience a hunch of what's going on, an old echo of transcedent knowledge, plus your believe in the meaning of what the critical voices say.
well i don't know that's the best i can do right now ....
[edit: didn't think i would have anything to say on the topic at all. the more fresh my thoughts are, the more typos i make, sorry for the fucking mess haha]
i sometimes dip into a paranoid psychosis myself, only at night in my dreams, at most once per month, so far. it's like a solipsistic echo. part of it is alienation from one's own cognition. like transcendence gone wrong. incomplete witness mode. i am being made by the fabric of reality. this fabric isn't me. i am nothing. it isn't anyone. but something of me is still unconsciously having the I-thought, the "there is a me, this me is what i am, and what is, is happening to this me" and then it's like: "this is done to me". reality is done to me. by "someone". an unconscious projection of the concept of agency, of will. i know it sounds slightly different then what you describe, but it's related on a level, i can't tell how.
you are thinking. that's what is. yet, the thought aren't your's. you are not making them, you wouldn't know how, you are not god. thoughts occur to you. the experience of thought is claimed by two parties. the ego says: i am the thinker. consciousness sees: the ego itself is just another thought. consciousness sees the i-thought and all other thoughts. that's true for everyone. it doesn't explain why some are blissfully unaware of consciousness, some have a clean awakening (being one with consciousness) and some are unconsciously torn between both views.
now, there is a neurotic version of paranoia, where you project the concept of some god, who is judging you. this is on first sight something else. you have this judging voice, it's a regular part of the mind. the mind is not one. the mind is commenting on itself. the ego can't handle this. it want's to claim thoughts as his property, but when thoughts are too contradictory, well then the ego prefers to deny ownership. let me try it again. you are thinking: "what i did there was so wrong" and then you are wondering about the creative spirit that put this thought into your mind. how do you know, that what you did was wrong? who is this subject, that is holding all of these opinions? how was it created? how did it grew in you? you have this semi-concsious remembrance. once there was a time, when you didn't know about the difference between you and other people. life was like a dream. people were like dream characters. people said: "you are a bad boy". this sentence existed and happened inside your mind. your mind repeated the sentence over and over. this is how the inner critique grew into a complex recollection of possible accusations. you never owned this part of your mind. you can't own it. it's too obvious, that this part of the mind was there, before your ego existed. your ego was born afterwards. you ego grew, as something in you got informed about who you are supposed to be. the information came from "the outside". so you have the feeling that your inner critique is a real entity, observing you, because that's how it started. but who is this entity really? has this entity ever been your parents? no. it's you consciousness, perceiving your parent's voices, holding them, accepting them, comprehending them, forming a vision of their meaning, an image of you. and you think you are that image. this image has informed your egoic identity. so, you, ego, have been created out of the observations of your consciousness. your consciousness' observations of the thoughts about you and the comprehension of their meaning. and now your ego claims those thoughts to be his own thoughts, because your ego want's to be essentially "the thinker" of any current thought. it doesn't know how to be the observer (consciousness, witness, mirrormind). it's just a subtle thought. it can't observe anything at all. so there is the connection between the more psychotic version on the one hand, which is actually a more subtle and conscious version - where you have some witnessing capacity and you doubt thoughts, because all meaning is transparent to the witness, and on the other hand the neurotic version of paranoia - the one where you believe in your thoughts entirely and you only experience a hunch of what's going on, an old echo of transcedent knowledge, plus your believe in the meaning of what the critical voices say.
well i don't know that's the best i can do right now ....
IdeasNotTheProblem
Active Member
OP: You're definitely not alone. I think it's about 15-20% of people have paranoid thoughts to a varying degree. This will probably not ease your suspicions, but you may find comfort knowing you're not alone.
Personally, my paranoia stems from the feeling that I'm someway somehow being controlled or manipulated by other people. For instance, If a series of events took place that would cause me to be late for work, less productive at work or unable to perform at my best. EXAMPLE: You're late one day cause there's a nail in your tire(who put it there?). next day you come down with the flu(who got me sick?). You recover and then your dog gets sick and you miss work to bring it to the vet(who got my dog sick?). Each event on their own is easily dismissed as a common inconvenience. However, the more persistent the "bad luck" the more I worry that for some reason someone is out to get me.
Trouble is when you express these feelings to someone. I find they are very quick to tell you how unfounded they are. And they're probably right...But what they don't realize is that in your skeptic mind you're thinking "well of course you'd want me to think that. wouldn't you?"
One suggestion I'd have is to open your mind as much as you can. A narrow mind can always find patterns and evidence that support their suspicions. No matter how unfounded they are. A good Lawyer can argue any idea/possibility and make a decent case for it. If left unchallenged, that point of view becomes paramount. The longer it is left unchallenged the more evidence supporting the idea can be gathered. Contradicting evidence is easily dismissed or not seen at all.
Try to see and explore every possibility and understand others' point of view and how it relates/contrasts with your own. You may never PROVE your suspicions wrong, but you may realize that they are far LESS PROBABLE than other explanations and course of events.
p.s. You're thoughts may or may not be monitored but your posts here definitely are! haha
Personally, my paranoia stems from the feeling that I'm someway somehow being controlled or manipulated by other people. For instance, If a series of events took place that would cause me to be late for work, less productive at work or unable to perform at my best. EXAMPLE: You're late one day cause there's a nail in your tire(who put it there?). next day you come down with the flu(who got me sick?). You recover and then your dog gets sick and you miss work to bring it to the vet(who got my dog sick?). Each event on their own is easily dismissed as a common inconvenience. However, the more persistent the "bad luck" the more I worry that for some reason someone is out to get me.
Trouble is when you express these feelings to someone. I find they are very quick to tell you how unfounded they are. And they're probably right...But what they don't realize is that in your skeptic mind you're thinking "well of course you'd want me to think that. wouldn't you?"
One suggestion I'd have is to open your mind as much as you can. A narrow mind can always find patterns and evidence that support their suspicions. No matter how unfounded they are. A good Lawyer can argue any idea/possibility and make a decent case for it. If left unchallenged, that point of view becomes paramount. The longer it is left unchallenged the more evidence supporting the idea can be gathered. Contradicting evidence is easily dismissed or not seen at all.
Try to see and explore every possibility and understand others' point of view and how it relates/contrasts with your own. You may never PROVE your suspicions wrong, but you may realize that they are far LESS PROBABLE than other explanations and course of events.
p.s. You're thoughts may or may not be monitored but your posts here definitely are! haha
IdeasNotTheProblem
Active Member
A guy goes to a psychiatrist...
He says "Doc! You got to help me. I'm going crazy!"
Doc says, "Oh, tell me why you think that?"
Patient says "I keep thinking my cat is an alien and forces mice to sneak in my room while I'm sleeping and steal money out of my wallet! Please help me! I don't know what to do?"
The Doc, after a long pause, says "O.k. here's what we do... Take this hidden camera. Set it up in your bedroom, then place these mouse traps all around your wallet. Make sure there's plenty of money in it, but not too much, and then I want you to..."
"Woe woe woe!" The patient interrupts, "Thats not helping! You're job is to tell me it's all in my head and I shouldn't think this way!"
The Doc replies, "That would be jumping to a conclusion. Would it not?"
"If I discounted or embraced an idea with no evidence to support it, then tell me who here is the bigger skeptic? you or me?"
"Challenge how you think, rather than what you think."
He says "Doc! You got to help me. I'm going crazy!"
Doc says, "Oh, tell me why you think that?"
Patient says "I keep thinking my cat is an alien and forces mice to sneak in my room while I'm sleeping and steal money out of my wallet! Please help me! I don't know what to do?"
The Doc, after a long pause, says "O.k. here's what we do... Take this hidden camera. Set it up in your bedroom, then place these mouse traps all around your wallet. Make sure there's plenty of money in it, but not too much, and then I want you to..."
"Woe woe woe!" The patient interrupts, "Thats not helping! You're job is to tell me it's all in my head and I shouldn't think this way!"
The Doc replies, "That would be jumping to a conclusion. Would it not?"
"If I discounted or embraced an idea with no evidence to support it, then tell me who here is the bigger skeptic? you or me?"
"Challenge how you think, rather than what you think."
KMaki
Red***r*
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Back in elementary school I did have an idea that everyone could read my mind. Or maybe at least someone, and felt that because of that I have to constantly control my thoughts. It felt really true, but I took it as an unproven question. I'd purposely start to think of things, starting with the cliche "i know you can read my mind", and kept on prodding for responses in behaviour or maybe even telepathic answers. I also tried to shock any "listener" by thinking really horrible things. I'm concluding nobody I've met can read minds, and I'm therefore free to think whatever I please, as it won't offend anyone and will be private.
I say rebel.
--Actually it dawned to me that you might think I could be one of the monitorers trying to get you to do what I want. But without testing it, there's no way to know. I'm really not, though. I simply have no way to prove it. You on the other hand do.
I was also going to write that I promise not to think about your thoughts anymore. But I will, only in the "hope they sort out" fashion.
I say rebel.
--Actually it dawned to me that you might think I could be one of the monitorers trying to get you to do what I want. But without testing it, there's no way to know. I'm really not, though. I simply have no way to prove it. You on the other hand do.
I was also going to write that I promise not to think about your thoughts anymore. But I will, only in the "hope they sort out" fashion.
Peripheral Visionary
Eye In Tee-Pee
Feelings of paranoia are rising to epidemic proportions. It is probably high time the government took action to more closely monitor the paranoid with the latest surveillance techniques and electronic equipment. To keep them safe, of course.
IdeasNotTheProblem
Active Member
haha!
You ever get stuck at a stoplight, and feel like that little camera is taking your picture? I used to give it the finger until someone crossed the street one day and gave me the "stink eye". What do you say then? "sorry, i'm just flipping off the traffic light"
You ever get stuck at a stoplight, and feel like that little camera is taking your picture? I used to give it the finger until someone crossed the street one day and gave me the "stink eye". What do you say then? "sorry, i'm just flipping off the traffic light"
Vrecknidj
Prolific Member
A good friend of mine, the one who introduced me to typology back in the early 1990s, pointed out that one of the more common neuroses (which can turn into a psychosis) for INTPs is full blown paranoia.
If you're truly experiencing paranoid thoughts, of a significant kind, it would be worth finding a skilled counselor. There are counselors who are themselves INTPs. I had one for a few years around 2002 or so. Totally worth it.
If you're truly experiencing paranoid thoughts, of a significant kind, it would be worth finding a skilled counselor. There are counselors who are themselves INTPs. I had one for a few years around 2002 or so. Totally worth it.
nanook
a scream in a vortex
needless to say that counselors are out there to get you. they feed on other peoples thoughts and all that. yeah it's true, paranoid types who are locked into the thinking function, can have good use for advice - also the most difficult time accepting any.
IdeasNotTheProblem
Active Member
That's a good point. I would add that if anyone were capable of reading your thoughts, it would probably be a therapist...
These are really interesting thoughts. I thought I was alone when it came to these things but I guess not, I don't like talking about these types of things because usually they will either think i'm completely insane, that i'm asking for attention, or they won't understand because I'm not that good at putting my thoughts into words...