The world as we know it...

[FacetiousPersona]

It's sweet when the lies are accepted as evil. Why care for evil when it's tolerated as natural? Who is to disown evil when it's within us all? Who would surrender their individuality for a taste of freedom which is death?

Will we ever be in the zone for accomplishment when our minds are confined to the narrow realm of humanity? Which standards should we compare ourselves to when aiming for success? Shall the limits of humanity corrupt our view of success when there is potential for much beyond the imagination? Do these possibilities of qualms our very thoughts?

Is it you who cries or the reality which has endured your embrace of it? Can you tell this reality that it's a lie when it has only created the circumstances for one? What is needed for deceit when all is essentially already led as a singular belief?

Where's my time when there is no organization of this reality through the void which is my empty mind? Who is to gauge time when it has ceased, completley abandoning humanity as a construct to support our petty lives? Will our lives continue without fabrication notions to ensure we are maintained?

I am a Lion, and this Lion has no requirement for a watch or firearm to rule. Practiality is nothing when all is that is reality will be destined for destruction through the irony of its contradicting effects. Can you smile to me, dear girl, and tell me you love me?

There is a puzzle for love and the Universe. My love is for the Universe and the entity which we dare categorize as love. Dear Universe, I love you.

 

[Hawkeye]

A person bound by soceity and traditions is doomed from the moment they question it.

 

[flow]

I was under the impression that Face had left our community, I guess not!

 

[FacetiousPersona]

A person bound by soceity and traditions is doomed from the moment they question it.

The moment an individual questions the society is when an alternate society unveils itself to their mind. This is where the revolution is born and one advances our generation into the new society.

 

[flow]

rejection of one society does not necessarily open the door to another. If I was living in a small village and realized I didn't like their customs, that doesn't mean I'm now free of their tradition by simply realizing I'm against it.

 

[Hawkeye]

The moment an individual questions the society is when an alternate society unveils itself to their mind. This is where the revolution is born and one advances our generation into the new society.

That is true to a certain extent. If however, they are bound to it and are trying to break the mold based on the restrictions they believe they have; they usually commit suicide.

a perfect example to this is the song 2112. (Mentioned it once already! and I promised myself not to blabber on about it...)

 

[FacetiousPersona]

That is true to a certain extent. if however, they are bound to it and are trying to break the mold based on the restrictions they believe they have; they usually commit suicide.

One who succumbs to these trivials feelings is no profound visionary. Only the individuals with incredible insight truly see the society to sincerely contempt it and oppose it. These individuals pierce the ignorance to eliminate it, not fall to the lies of it.

 

[Hawkeye]

One who succumbs to these trivials feelings is no profound visionary. Only the individuals with incredible insight truly see the society to sincerely contempt it and oppose it. These individuals pierce the ignorance to eliminate it, not fall to the lies of it.

Interesting.

I see myself as a spectator. I do not like the world as it is as a whole yet I see no point in attacking these traditions to the point of their elimination. I simply choose not to abide by them.

Tom Bombadil fits my explanation perfectly.

 

[FacetiousPersona]

Tom Bombadil was a fool that allowed his neutrality to be ignorance. A person should approach a situation with the purpose of deciding correctly on the basis of logic or rationality, not a stubborn tendency to remain neutral. This limits their potential and may potentially damage all possibility of peace with factions.

Do you truly believe that Tom Bombadil would have been allowed to continue his life peacefully with Sauron dominating Middle-Earth? Did he foresee the defeat of Sauron? I do not think that he could have successfully protected the environment he valued and guranteed the survival of those he loves. Would he have ran away as a coward would? Is being neutral allowing your loved ones die and the land you value to be destroyed? What does it take for one to truly react and decide upon a side?

Perhaps he would have finally fought. Surely it would've been wiser of him to have acted in this manner previously? His delay might have caused severe disadvantages and consequences. The neutral approach is not correct each time. It's indecisiveness, and I do not think it's working against unfolding possibilities much. You're allowing them to develop, and neglecting them will not necessarily lead to them ignoring you as a variable.

If it is possible to prepare against these unfolding possibilities or defeat them, why should you hesitate when it's feasible to succeed? You cannot be certain with any of these, but I believe that possibilities will often inevitably affect you. You should use your foresight to ascertain how much they will and subsequently determine the need for action.

 

[Hawkeye]

Tom Bombadil was a fool that allowed his neutrality to be ignorance. A person should approach a situation with the purpose of deciding correctly on the basis of logic or rationality, not a stubborn tendency to remain neutral. This limits their potential and may potentially damage all possibility of peace with factions.

Do you truly believe that Tom Bombadil would have been allowed to continue his life peacefully with Sauron dominating Middle-Earth? Did he foresee the defeat of Sauron? I do not think that he could have successfully protected the environment he valued and guranteed the survival of those he loves. Would he have ran away as a coward would? Is being neutral allowing your loved ones die and the land you value to be destroyed? What does it take for one to truly react and decide upon a side?

Perhaps he would have finally fought. Surely it would've been wiser of him to have acted in this manner previously? His delay might have caused severe disadvantages and consequences. The neutral approach is not correct each time.

yay, I'm opening the shell


Neutrality only goes so far. I consider myself as a neutral until my own beliefs are threatened.

Tom Bombadil would have lived a peaceful life if Sauron began dominating. He does not care about who controls what. However, if his personal space was invaded then yes, Tom would have reacted.

Tom Bombadil isn't bound like everyone else though. He has the ability to destroy Sauron if he so wishes yet, he has no need to. You are trying to believe that Tom feels for others and this isn't true. He has no loved ones. He is completely neutral. A Spectator.

Maybe this is what perplexes you?


He has no goals. He is completely free.


To me he is simply a wonderful character.

 

[FacetiousPersona]

His own existence could be the one he loves. The freedom could be a concept which he loves. I was basically indicating that he may have foresaw the threat and acted based upon this instead of tangible events which occur before him.

 

[Hawkeye]

Maybe he did but procrastinated his action plan. haha


I'm guessing he would be an ENTP if you can class such fictional characters.

 

[merzbau]

we all surrender to society to some extent, whether it agrees with our principles or not, because there is no possible way a society that values individual ideals equally can exist.

all political theories, all world religions, all forms of collectivism that attempt to deal with individuals will break down to one equation - the choices of the many supercede the choices of the individual. there can be no equality in such a state, as an individual's rights are insignificant to society as a whole.

say the current structure of society dissolves, and you are asked to construct a totally egalitarian society based on the principle that individuals have unhindered control over their lives if they so choose, and are not beholden in any way to a state authority. let's even assume that every person wants to abide by the law and has no desire to harm others, even though they would not be prosecuted.
well i ask you, what would you do with those that disagree? eventually you'll come across someone who desires more control, or less. someone wants to eat animals, another person wants to stop eating meat. one person wants to fight wars, another wants to be peaceful. one person cuts down trees, another wants to save them.
what then? even if you decide via referendum, you will have to ignore, incarcerate or silence everyone to disagrees with the majority, or your "egalitarian society" will collapse.

the condescending socialist viewpoint is that all humans can be trained to desire the same thing if they are "educated" and "knowledgable." but what humans want out of life will always differ, no matter how "stupid" or "clever" you deem them to be. the moment three humans band together - at the very crystallisation of primitive society - disagreements will occur, the greater will inevitably outforce the lesser, and the losing party will be disenfranchised and oppressed. if differences are irreconcilable even at that stage, what hope does modern society have of attaining actual equality, let alone entertaining individual ideals?

answer: none.

 

[cheese]

i am a mousetrap

 

[Melkor]

Hmm..

I think Face is suffering from that semi-detachment I was blabbing about one time.

You depises societies ways, and not their means, you wish to leave them yet you cannot live without them.


I think it's the plight of a great many intelligent people.

You may say humans are flawed, but they're twice as much so when living under flawed systems.

But really, what can you do?

You have to accept that, though you may see the way as clear and true, others will not.

-and you must remember also, that the view of a good society is dependant entirely on the viewer.

If one such moron see's the system as good, for he lives a good life, then who are you to say the system is flawed?

Opinions are opinons, no matter how well constructed, or ill placed.

By which I mean, no matter how right you are about your view of a perfected society, humanity will always remain wrong.


Hmm..

I've mused over a utopian society many times.

Obviously such intelligence needs to be at the heart of such a place.

But really, if dreams and reality ever intertwine, it's usually to chaotic effect.

Thus, I am unhappy, yet forced, to live in a world which does things so badly.

 

[Weliddryn]

Walk the fields of void and grey
Seek to hide what is as plain as day
Fight the war you cannot see
All is in not outside of thee

You know from whence this fog has come
The answers sought after will be found
If focus shifts and truth is sound
Within your heart and your mind