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The origin of our hesitance

Decaf

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I was reading through one of Cryptonia's posts and I realized something. What he wrote sounded very much like how I think. Weighing all options in the scrupulous insistence that what we do is not careless. I wouldn't post content from the thread it came from except that it was a tangent of the topic at hand.

The post itself didn't appear to create the same train of thoughts in others, so I'll leave it out.

This process (while not always as thorough as this example) is something we are immensely proud of and is directly linked to one of our greatest social obstacles.

So here's my question. When is it safe to "recklessly" forgo the process of careful weighing of implications for the sake of social immersion?
 

EditorOne

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You lost me by assigning value to "social immersion." I thought Cryptonia's post was dealing with posters who might be trolls who enjoy punching our buttons or on the other hand might be desperate souls reaching out for a hand in the storm. I'm on the side of being seen foolish and taken in by a troll rather than not helping someone who is drowning. How you got from there to social immersion involves a few more dots that I'll need to see before I can draw the line connecting them (only one cup of coffee this morning, maybe I'll have a flash of understanding after two :)).

Footnote: (Eventually it's possible to not give a damn if you look foolish, it's just another arena for not giving a damn. :D)
 

walfin

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Cryptonia's post shows rather developed feeling.

Probably not all of us are like that. I have very low Fe and would probably seem reckless.

I should think that recklessness makes social immersion more unlikely. Nothing turns people off more than a tasteless comment.
 

Decaf

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Ok, maybe it was an intuitive leap, but it was the thorough balancing that caught my imagination, not the content per say. The fact that it was a feeling driven argument, I believe, is what helped it come out as naturally as it did (feeling being out extraverted judging function and all).

I'm still interested in the question, so I'll browse around and see if I can find an example to get ya'll on my train of thought.
 

Cavallier

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Ok, maybe it was an intuitive leap
No, I made the leap to. I just didn't respond until I had some time mull it over and form a cohesive response.

What he wrote sounded very much like how I think. Weighing all options in the scrupulous insistence that what we do is not careless
This process (while not always as thorough as this example) is something we are immensely proud of and is directly linked to one of our greatest social obstacles.
When someone is joking sometimes I take them seriously. I don't mean that I get offended by what they've said so much as I apply this system of "weighing all options in the scrupulous insistence that what we do is not careless". I take an offhand remark and start to analyze its implications. Some people value this aspect of my personality. They come to me for advice because they know that I will carefully outline all their options and the pros and cons of these options for them.* They come to me because I'm an outside party that is unaffected by the outcome of their situation so I can objectively give them advice. However, I take this a step further when I apply this same logical and objective weighing process to things that do affect me personally. This is where I stumble and where social immersion comes into play.

So here's my question. When is it safe to "recklessly" forgo this process for the sake of social immersion?
When the process isn't actually that important...this is a catch 22 kind of situation. I have to determine the implications of making a decision without first going through The Process before I can decide if I should just blow it off because it's not important and do whatever *shudder* feels right. When it comes to social immersion I try to take cues from the people around me. If they don't think the situation merits a lot of thought then I will at least outwardly curtail my analysis. That doesn't mean I don't keep mulling it over in my head. I just store it up for later and outwardly go with the flow. However, there are time when I think it's very important to go through this process despite no one else thinking so. I end up doing a high speed Cliffs Notes version in my head when this happens. People say I look distant for a moment and then suddenly announce my decision. Just because our time is limited and the people hanging on our decision are impatient doesn't mean we can't go through this analysis process. We just have to be quick about it and ultimately we are forced to make a choice. I often feel that on the really hard decisions, after all that analysis, in the end its a crap shoot. The only difference I think between my analysis and decision process and that of those who don't analyze much is that I feel personally responsible for my decision. I know I've made the best decision I possibly could because I have carefully considered all the aspects of the decision and have chosen the path/side/thing I think it right. However, it is crushing when it turns out I've made the wrong decision. Yet, I learn from the experience and add it as a component to my future analysis.

*I sometimes wonder if they aren't simply lazy for not doing this for themselves.
 

Agent Intellect

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This sort of thought pattern is a constant problem for me when it comes to social situations. I sort of touched on this in one of my videos in the video thread, too. I end up having to think everything through before I can speak or act on it. It's as if I require a cohesive 'map' of all actions and any possible contingencies before going forward, and I often get bogged down in my mental search for other possibilities that I had not yet though of - this, of course, can also often times lead me into lines of thought that are removed from the original thought by several degrees of separation.

Another problem with this is that I will often get into pedantic quibbles with people over meaningless semantics in order to make sure that everything is accurate (or to make some sort of point that what they said is not entirely accurate). And like Cavelier said, often before I can stop myself, I'll often times analyze and critique peoples statements to them, making me Buzz Killington in social situations.
 

EditorOne

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Thanks to all of you, I now get it. :)

When I'm pretty sure nobody wants to hear an analysis of their offhand, casual comment, I grunt. I have a happy grunt, a diffident grunt and an inquisitive grunt. Seems to get me through those social immersions.

I developed the technique because in addition to being afflicted/blessed with INTP personality traits, I'm also partly deaf, a weird post-explosion outcome that muffles some sounds (including some voices) and amplifies others (like tires on the road while traveling). A diffident grunt when confronted with a person whose comments come to me as mere mumbled murmuring turned out to work pretty well, acknowleding a communication had been made without responding intelligently to what to me was an unknown quantity. But it also works when you don't want to be what you're calling "reckless," ie., offering a comment without mulling it over carefully and, of course, thoughtfully.

The other thing that helps is alcohol. :)
 

Cavallier

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^ I think I've found the key to life here somewhere. I should develop selective hearing and grunt more often instead of making an actual response. You sir are wise indeed. :D

*skips away happily singing, "I've got a golden ticket!"*
 
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