The Cult OF Personality

[motrhead]

I have never really bought into the "cult of personality". I would never cross the street to watch someone famous go by, or try to get their autograph, or wait to shake their hand. I respect athletes, artists and musicians, but I know many incredibly gifted unknown artists and musicians, and even a few gifted athletes. These are just normal people to me. Of course I wouldn't mind meeting my favourite musicians and writers, but only to actually sit down and talk as an equal (while recognising that I could learn something from them).
I do appreciate someone that is very knowledgeable in their field, but to me people are all equal, and I usually feel that I could probably do what most of these famous people have done, if I had chosen to pursue their field of study. I'm not trying to demean their accomplishments, and I admire intelligence, but I don't think those accomplishments make them special .

One of my biggest pet peeves is the (to me) undeserved respect accorded to "royalty", those with titles, and offices such as prime minister or president.
I can't stand the royal family. The idea of any human being treated as "special" infuriates me. I can hardly wait for the day when the monarchy is abolished and those spoiled brats have to wait in line like the rest of us. Is that wrong?
The whole "Obamamania" thing is just as bad. While I do like him, I can't believe how he is being worshipped ...he's just another lawyer. Can you ever really trust or respect a lawyer? Being a ruler of a country should be a duty (like jury duty), not an instant rock star lifestyle. Many of these leaders turn out to have been somewhat incompetent buffoons! What's so special about that that?

So my reason for posting this, is to ask whether this is a typical INTP attitude?
I don't want to sound arrogant or smug (which I hope am not), but I can usually hold my own when intelligence is required, and I believe I as am worthwhile as anyone else. Why should these people be considered anyone special?
Would you go out of your way to see a member of the royal family, a political figure, or an actor or actress? Would you want their autograph for any reason other than possible monetary gain?

 

[walfin]

Lol, I thought this was gonna be an assault on MBTI (ever read the book "The Cult of Personality"?)

Well, I wouldn't mind someone's autograph if the signature was aesthetically appealing (think Chinese calligraphy), but I don't really care for having an autograph of a "somebody".

Where I live, we do not have any official royal family. There is something close to it though. At least in a constitutional monarchy the royalty don't have that much in the way of political power. It isn't necessarily the best thing in the world to be a royal. I believe monarchs can't even vote.

Believing that you are as worthwhile as anyone else is not arrogant, as long as you believe anyone else could be as worthwhile as you. (I am a bit of a Taylorist, and I believe the only second rate person is somebody that "can sing but won't sing"). That includes not seeing yourself as "better" than "SJ society" (a lot of INTPs do that, I suppose I do too, but I try not to).

It's very easy to judge someone as an incompetent buffoon, until you see all the stuff that guy tried to do behind the scenes, but couldn't. INTPs would probably appear to be incompetent buffoons. Just look at Gordon Brown (most likely INTP). Although leader worship certainly isn't deserved, neither is leader bashing of the sort that takes place nowadays.

I think a lot of problems stem from identifying a person by his/her position, instead of realising that the office is just something that he/she does in life (even if it does take up most of his/her time).

 

[JoeJoe]

Their only authority is logic and coherence, and [INTPs] prize intelligence in themselves and others. Authority derived from office, position or wide acceptance does not carry weight.

Yes, it is typical INTP behavior.

 

[Citizen X]

Motrhead, hadn't it been because of your username and avatar, I could have sworn I had written your text while sleep walking or something. Lifted verbatim from my own head.

Yeah, I agree with you.

I have met various architects whose work I enjoy, and I have even gotten two books signed (why not?) but I have actually sit and talked with them. There are plenty of writers and musicians I would love to meet, but again, as equals.

I am disgusted by people's fascination towards royalties, celebrities and power figures. I hate populism and the way many clueless people just flock towards charismatic politicians who put a pretty face to the crowds and the camera.

I have always believed that gossip magazines and shows exist as a subconscious projection for people to remind themselves that these big figures are just as human as they are.

"Geez, Sandra, look at this. These two Hollywwod pretty faces are going through a divorce! Oh my god, I guess they are human after all!"

I'm specially disgusted by people's fascination with Obama, but I won't say anymore since it actually pisses me off.

 

[Inappropriate Behavior]

I too don't care about meeting famous people nor think any higher of them for being so. If I think they are good at what they do, great. And that's the extent of my interest. If I don't then ignore.exe. The only effect Jackson's death has had on me is to make me turn off my tv which is probably a good thing.

We covered the Obama stuff in the media bias thread. While there is certainly some undue adulation, no one should be surprised by it. Especially in light of the comparison between rock star and rocks in his head. Such a stark contrast is going to lead to over-reactions.

 

[motrhead]

The only effect Jackson's death has had on me is to make me turn off my tv which is probably a good thing.

We covered the Obama stuff in the media bias thread. While there is certainly some undue adulation, no one should be surprised by it. Especially in light of the comparison between rock star and rocks in his head. Such a stark contrast is going to lead to over-reactions.

Funnily enough, that's when I turned off any news myself. I still haven't gone back, other than to check the headlines when I open my email...
I'm not sure what you meant with your rock star/rocks in his head reference. If it was in regard to what I said, I didn't mean to imply that. I believe he is a smart man, and hopefully we won't judge him too harshly after he is out of office. He has been left with a horrible mess to clean up. My "incompetent buffoons" remark was aimed at three of our more recent Canadian Prime Ministers, and certain recent US and UK leaders. Buffoon may not have been an entirely fair description. These leaders were all pursuing their own private agendas (and usually paving the way for their own fiscal security upon leaving office) , and none of them could really be dumb to get to their positions of power, but many of their decisions would lead one to the conclusion that they must be buffoons. Ah, the stupidity of partisan politics.
I don't believe many of these leaders are able to exercise anywhere near the amount of authority that we believe their office represents. Bureaucracy is a slow moving monster, and will resist any attempt at change.
Here in Canada, I have had the (unfortunate?) opportunity to meet a handful of our politicians (but not the PM) because of business demands, and none (okay maybe one) of them has ever struck me as the sort of intelligent person I would hope to have leading or influencing the country. I personally don't think economists or lawyers are the right choice for leaders.
I couldn't treat these politicians with anything more than common decency, and really had no desire to even shake their hands.
I have gone out of my way to meet one musician, and shook his hand, but it was to discuss his music, and encourage him, as he hadn't yet made the big time (he only ever made the "medium time" with limited national airplay, which I think is a complete travesty). If you are curious, his name is Jason Mitchell.

 

[Inappropriate Behavior]

I'm not sure what you meant with your rock star/rocks in his head reference. If it was in regard to what I said, I didn't mean to imply that.

That reference was meant to draw the comparison to how Obama is perceived as opposed to Bush. That's the natural comparison to be made, the new president vs. the last president. This contrast is what leads in part to the cult of personality surrounding Obama. I went into detail with it on the media bias thead about why Obama has the image he does. Personally, I think Obama is okay, it's too soon to say how good/bad he will be. I think the expectations placed on him by his supporters is unfair and foolish (it will only lead to disappointment no matter how well he actually does). I also think that 96% of the criticism he gets from those against him is idiotic bullshit <------ The Bush legacy in a nutshell.

 

[motrhead]

Personally, I think Obama is okay, it's too soon to say how good/bad he will be. I think the expectations placed on him by his supporters is unfair and foolish (it will only lead to disappointment no matter how well he actually does). I also think that 96% of the criticism he gets from those against him is idiotic bullshit <------ The Bush legacy in a nutshell.

I completely agree with you. I don't think he has anywhere near the power or freedom to make changes that the public believes. He is surrounded by many of the same people that his predecessor was, and many of their interests probably don't match his own. I am hopeful that he will be able to make some real positive change, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

[RubberDucky451]

Concerning Obama I believe "Change" is the quintessential phrase for a politician. Believing in that BS is ridiculous.

Personally i find popularity and the craze around that individual disgusting. Michael Jackson went from pervert to saint in a matter of months, try to understand that algorithm.