Star Trek Picard

[sushi]

is it good

i dont have netflix here so i cant watch it here, only cutaway from youtube

 

[Niclmaki]

I enjoy it enough to keep watching it. A few non-spoilery complaints though.

There’s one episode so far that was 75% a “wtf is this”. Other 25% was solid.

It’s also a little bit difficult to care about anyone not in Picard’s immediate circle.

There’s a character that would have been better if it didn’t exist, and they just went with a mcguffin.

It is NOT similar to the Star Trek we knew from TNG/Voyager. Closer to the DS9 interpretation, definitely a postwar Star Trek universe. Your mileage may vary with this.

 

[Daddy]

I haven't seen all the episodes, but so far I find it interesting. Picard is basically striped of his rank and authority, so that's kind of fun to watch, since he's not ostentatiously in charge. It seems a little slow though to get the story going and I'm kind of hoping they end up with some new interesting characters like Data.

 

[Elen]

I like that they manage to highlight Picard's massive ego being punctured and his elderly frailness while still making him be unfailingly interesting and engaging. I find myself feeling he absolutely deserves his situation because it is due to his hubris yet I'm still rooting for him to fix it and still come out in top.

 

[sushi]

what is data's role in series, has data surpass the borg

 

[Elen]

Data isn't in it.

 

[sushi]

it seems the borg cube have ties with the romulans or are created by them.

 

[Jennywocky]

The romulans have their own goals but essentially contribute to the borg reclamation project occurring on the cube where the XB's (ex-Borg) are having all their prostheses removed and undergo psyche work and are restored at least as much as possible to what they were before being assimilated.

Data isn't in it.

Well, kinda, kinda not. more like the 'ghost of Data' looming over everything.

I finally watched ST: Nemesis (the last TNG film before the reboot) and much of Season One, by the time you reach the end, feels like a "proper ending" to the story from that film. Which does involve Data.

So Data is kind of a "theme" in Season One driving a lot of Picard's decisions and the season helps resolve long-standing feelings of guilt he had over what happened in ST: N. It was actually pretty touching.



But dang. Lots of cameos. I think only a handful were helpful. (I thought Episode 7 was pretty on-mark, at least; and I think it makes sense for Jeri Ryan to be around. Plus she's playing the edgy disruptive influence, which the show needs.)

 

[sushi]

Jurati gets assimilated, Q comes back to troll Picard. I only have watched partial scenes but not the whole story.

 

[Rook]

 

[Daddy]

I'm liking season two, but I also love the Borg and Q more than anything else in the Star Trek universe.

 

[sushi]

they resurrected data and that is already a fail

 

[fractalwalrus]

I'm liking season two, but I also love the Borg and Q more than anything else in the Star Trek universe.

Season 2 was pretty good up until near the end.

 

[Jennywocky]

I'm liking season two, but I also love the Borg and Q more than anything else in the Star Trek universe.

Season 2 was pretty good up until near the end.

Yeah, it's been awhile, but I remember enjoying parts of Season 2 but then it kind of spiraled back into conventionality and I was kinda like... eh. They did make better use of Alison Pill at least, in terms of leaning into her strengths.

I really enjoyed Season 3 and it was an example of how to revisit old characters done correctly. It weakened a bit in the final two episodes but still stuck the landing.

 

[fractalwalrus]

I'm liking season two, but I also love the Borg and Q more than anything else in the Star Trek universe.

Season 2 was pretty good up until near the end.

Yeah, it's been awhile, but I remember enjoying parts of Season 2 but then it kind of spiraled back into conventionality and I was kinda like... eh. They did make better use of Alison Pill at least, in terms of leaning into her strengths.

I really enjoyed Season 3 and it was an example of how to revisit old characters done correctly. It weakened a bit in the final two episodes but still stuck the landing.

They did get to explore "darker" themes for Trek as well, such as intercrew conflicts and a more dystopian perspective on Starfleet, which is something Roddenberry explicitly intended to avoid.

 

[LOGICZOMBIE]

 

[fractalwalrus]

She has some valid points, some of which are based upon personal preferences (the Trek must stay utopian, for example), and some of which are based on poor writing quality (the Picard's mother storyline, for example). I would not call myself a massive fan of the Picard series, quite the contrary, so I would suppose that my account of Season 2 was in reference to the rest of the series, which was rather lackluster. I'd imagine that whether or not one felt slighted by the change in tone from TNG to Picard would be partially dependent upon either whether they would be insistent upon a thing needing to retain certain essential characteristics (utopianism, for example) in order to be said to even be the same thing, and whether someone was personally a "Doomer" or not and preferred themes that matched this outlook. I could write a more detailed analysis, but I will refrain from doing so until someone else shows interest.

 

[LOGICZOMBIE]

they would be insistent upon a thing needing to retain certain essential characteristics (utopianism, for example)

picard wasn't nearly as "dark" as ds9, and i loved ds9, so i don't think that's it

the moment that really made me throw my hands up was when they revealed that the federation had outlawed artificial intelligence research, ok, sure, and everyone (romulans, klingons, vulcans) just stopped at the same time ??

this seems extremely unlikely

season one is mostly interesting, i liked the new character they introduced, and the fact that people were trying to kill her and nobody knew why was a good start

but then she gets killed

and then they reveal a twin sister

i was like,


"i'm out"

 

[fractalwalrus]

they would be insistent upon a thing needing to retain certain essential characteristics (utopianism, for example)

picard wasn't nearly as "dark" as ds9, and i loved ds9, so i don't think that's it

the moment that really made me throw my hands up was when they revealed that the federation had outlawed artificial intelligence research, ok, sure, and everyone (romulans, klingons, vulcans) just stopped at the same time ??

this seems extremely unlikely

season one is mostly interesting, i liked the new character they introduced, and the fact that people were trying to kill her and nobody knew why was a good start

but then she gets killed

and then they reveal a twin sister

i was like,


"i'm out"

So, I lasted a bit longer watching the series than you, but part of that persistence came from encouragement from someone else who insisted it would improve in the second season. DS9 was arguably "darker" than Picard, as it dealt directly with wartime decision making and certain ethical dilemnas (Sisko's Romulan deception).

I thought the same thing you did about the foolishness and illogical decision to ban AI research. The federation in the past tended to respond to outside threats via development of their own countermeasures, and an outright ban on the research would simply allow anyone who was developing it to have the upper hand. Now sure leadership was different (Tal Shiar), but I would doubt that, given the government form of the Federation, one individual would be able to engage in this degree of sabotage without MASSIVE pushback.

As for Soji, The whole kill something and then bring it back but slightly different trope was needlessly done there, and has been over-used in many a series.

Season 2 started off mixed. Why would the Borg Queen not know about the self-destruct option on the ship and have been able to predict Picard's behavior? The possible explanation [Agnes intending to let the ship explode, which still makes no sense] could not have come about without the self-destruct sequence (before Agnes became the queen). Q has always been a bit of a problem to the universe due to the fact that his powers can account for any plot holes. Oh, Borg Queen does something that doesn't make sense? She's just Agnes because Q stepped in to set events into motion that made it so. This is the biggest problem I had with the season, and the season basically ended with the beginning, so....

 

[ZenRaiden]

I am fan of Voyager, DS9 and TNG, absolutely did not watch Picard series. I did try to watch it, but I think I dodged a bullet.

I consider my self mid tier viewer of these shows because I already have low expectations.
I think so far there were only few movies and series that I loved from start to finish, but its sci fi so suspending judgment and disbelief is important.

The tricky part is that star trek is immersive experience, and its mostly soap opera.
Its high tech elements are not meant to be back bone of the story.
They are the arch of story in some way, but its the characters and their attitudes and their resilience and intellect that makes the shows interesting.
Its open mindedness, fantasy and unreal world with options and solutions. Problem solving skills, the mans fight against the odds, etc. that make the show interesting, as well as mans command of technology to ensure survival in space.
Voyager had many interesting character arcs and interesting concepts of sci fi many of which were inspired from other sci fi.

For example voyager would fight a fleet of drones, tiny space ships swarms.

Which kind of reminds me of todays warfare of drones.

Also esoteric topics like other dimensions, telepathy, and afterlife or picards meeting with his grandmother in a dimension at the end of space where ideas can become real.

There is also themes of morality, virtue and comradery, as well as themes of psychology and so on.

I feel like that is what draws me and makes me immersed. I actually hated a lot of episodes in star trek and many were pretty flat, but I watched them regardless as they have various themes which are interesting to contemplate and think about.

 

[fractalwalrus]

but its sci fi so suspending judgment and disbelief is important.

Yes, it is about suspending disbelief when it comes to technological capability or some specific aspect of a species's abilities or something, but not when it comes to continuity errors. So, the specific error here was with the Borg Queen. I had seen First Contact, and the Borg would have gained knowledge of the self-destruct capabilities of the Federation and the ability to predict Picard's behavior since he was once a Borg. I can't see why the new Queen would not have known this. Now, there could have been an explanation written in to account for this issue, but there wasn't.

Its high tech elements are not meant to be back bone of the story.

Yeah, they are not meant to do this. A physicist might find some issues with it.

There is also themes of morality, virtue and comradery, as well as themes of psychology and so on.

Definitely. Season 2 tries to explain away Picard's inability to form intimate relationships (psychology), and I did find the alternate universe scenario to be interesting to play with (though I have seen it before, but not in this specific iteration). An alternate scenario where humans decide to handle environmental disaster with essentially a bandaid was interesting. They tried to explore the immigration issue a bit more with Rios' arrest). It didn't seem like old Trek, but maybe it didn't have to be. Definitely more action and less contemplation. Then again, I'm sure one could contemplate just about anything with the right input.

 

[ZenRaiden]

Still cannot decided whether picard is INTJ or ENTJ.
I feel like hes too deep for ENTJ, but also to bold and action oriented for INTJ.

 

[LOGICZOMBIE]

Still cannot decided whether picard is INTJ or ENTJ.
I feel like hes too deep for ENTJ, but also to bold and action oriented for INTJ.

ultimately his "sense of self-worth" comes from his social status, which makes him an "E"

but of course, we're all a little of both, sometimes more and sometimes less

 

[fractalwalrus]

Still cannot decided whether picard is INTJ or ENTJ.
I feel like hes too deep for ENTJ, but also to bold and action oriented for INTJ.

What if I told you, I could paint Picard as any type if I cherry-picked data, or lacked a depth of understanding of the theoretical framework of MBTI? What if I typed Picard using the 4 categories and not the 8 function stack? What if I told you, I needed a lens with which to analyze the whole series from? What if I told you, I could decide to analyze the stylistic effects of the show or focus on plot holes? What if I commented on the quality and referenced it to something I considered "low quality?" What if there is something of value in that which is considered "low quality?" Would that make me an INTP or not INTP? What if, knowing about the classification system itself plays a role in preserving or destroying its utility?

 

[LOGICZOMBIE]

What if I told you, I could paint Picard as any type if I cherry-picked data, or lacked a depth of understanding of the theoretical framework of MBTI? What if I typed Picard using the 4 categories and not the 8 function stack? What if I told you, I needed a lens with which to analyze the whole series from? What if I told you, I could decide to analyze the stylistic effects of the show or focus on plot holes? What if I commented on the quality and referenced it to something I considered "low quality?" What if there is something of value in that which is considered "low quality?" Would that make me an INTP or not INTP? What if, knowing about the classification system itself plays a role in preserving or destroying its utility?

100% INTP

 

[sushi]

picard in stark trek picard seems like a mix of INTJ and INFJ

 

[ZenRaiden]

ultimately his "sense of self-worth" comes from his social status,

I feel like this is true, but I cannot think of an episode where this would be outwardly or glaringly obvious. He seems to commit to a goal and get it done, but I never felt he flexes status or feels like its alpha and omega of his character. He seems well grounded, and honestly far from alpha males that want their dicks sucked at every turn. Not sure if I missed it.

 

[fractalwalrus]

picard in stark trek picard seems like a mix of INTJ and INFJ

Really? I kind of got the type of OLDDUDE from him, but I am definitely not an expert here.

 

[fractalwalrus]

honestly far from alpha males that want their dicks sucked at every turn

He does like his tea "hot." And Earl Grey. Earls are known to value social status.

 

[LOGICZOMBIE]

I feel like this is true, but I cannot think of an episode where this would be outwardly or glaringly obvious.

a true INTP prefers to operate "behind the scenes"

they will take a (high-profile) leadership position if the current (high-profile) leadership is incompetent or missing

but they generally do not persist in (high-profile) leadership over the longer term