Shadow functions: avoid them!

[Architect]

Good Video

DaveSuperPowers has some good MBTI vids, I've got links to the INTP relevant ones here. I think he is a self proclaimed INTP, who knows how to extravert only for doing these videos. He has some other site where they do reviews of RC planes and such, and now they're starting a new site called Intuitive Time, which isn't available yet.

At any rate he has some good points about MBTI, namely

• Avoid the tests, they're horrible
• Avoid the profiles, which are mostly copy and paste of each other
• To understand MBTI and yourself you have to master the functions
• Don't be well rounded! Concentrate on your first two functions, become the master of them, because that is the source of your strength (your other two functions will come along with that)
• There are physiological clues to type

Note: it's not clear to me what he means exactly by shadow functions, but I think he's referring to the theory that there are four complementary shadow functions to your main functions (Dominant, Aux, Tertiary, Shadow). The shadow function (singular) is the last of your primary functions.

 

[intpz]

1:15 is great stuff, he expressed my thoughts exactly.

In general, I do agree with what he said. An occasional stimulation to some functions is good practice. For example, for me taking a walk, preferably in nature, and taking pictures is enjoyable, but only sometimes, mostly when I am bored. If I wouldn't be bored, I probably do it very rarely, or not at all. Once a year, maybe twice. That's for Fi and Si.

 

[Words]

I've watched his other videos in the past (where he mentions that he is INTJ), and i thought he was very sensible, but this video really resonates with my own ideas: the part about focus and obsession, having unlimited energy, and the mentor part. Although function-use, i think, is highly dependent on perception. School and details for example, one could try to reconcile it with your top two functions. So, what usually drains you, energizes you, as a result of perspective.

 

[Architect]

In general, I do agree with what he said. An occasional stimulation to some functions is good practice.

Agreed, which is why I play the piano and do photography.

I've watched his other videos in the past (where he mentions that he is INTJ)

Ah, I couldn't remember. He doesn't seem INTP, and one would be unlikely to do videos like this. Good for him, because he mercilessly makes fun of INTJ's too.

the part about focus and obsession, having unlimited energy, and the mentor part. Although function-use, i think, is highly dependent on perception. School and details for example, one could try to reconcile it with your top two functions. So, what usually drains you, energizes you, as a result of perspective.

Agreed

 

[skip]

Agreed, which is why I play the piano and do photography.

Do you post the photos? I'd like to see some.

 

[Ink]

After spending an hour reading the INTJ forums I feel completely drained... Scary stuff

 

[Architect]

Do you post the photos? I'd like to see some.

Thanks for the interest, but no. I've taken 15,000 pictures this year, so I prefer the process of taking pictures more than actually having pictures. In all the shots I have (many tens of thousands) there's maybe few that I think are worth sharing, but I don't feel that strongly about it.

I've got top drawer gear but I'm continually amazed at how hard it is to take a good photograph.

After spending an hour reading the INTJ forums I feel completely drained... Scary stuff

So true. At one point, not understanding the functions, I thought I was an INTJ. About ten minutes on their forums convinced me otherwise.

 

[Proletar]

I'm not convinced.


You see, there are times in life when you have to, I mean seriously have to, develop your F. Learning to handle your feelings by exposing yourself to them and let them rip. No one can simply stroll through life with JUST iT/eP. That would be a life cut in half.

There is both wants and needs, and sometimes you have to do things that you need to do, not just what you want, or "have an unlimited energy" in doing.

 

[Hadoblado]

get out you stanky feeler.

 

[Proletar]

Seriously?

I feel hurt by your statement. I'm going to eat a bucket of ice-cream and watch a season of grays anatomy to calm myself.

 

[Architect]

I'm not convinced.


You see, there are times in life when you have to, I mean seriously have to, develop your F. Learning to handle your feelings by exposing yourself to them and let them rip. No one can simply stroll through life with JUST iT/eP. That would be a life cut in half.

There is both wants and needs, and sometimes you have to do things that you need to do, not just what you want, or "have an unlimited energy" in doing.

Again, the shadow functions are different from your inferior (or sometimes called SHADOW (singular) function).

However his point is that as you age you will necessarily develop your shadow functions, so you two are in agreement.

 

[Hadoblado]

mmmmm shadow functions =/= inferior functions... tis all very confusing

Are the shadow functions just the opposite of our normal ones on the introversion/extroversion scale? So... Te, Ni, Se, and Fi?

 

[Proletar]

Again, the shadow functions are different from your inferior (or sometimes called SHADOW (singular) function).

However his point is that as you age you will necessarily develop your shadow functions, so you two are in agreement.

I was talking about the shadow functions, not the inferior ones.


Se and Fi for example. Absolutely crucial certain times in life. I don't wholly agree with him, because he is talking about being obsessive about your two leading ones. I say that we have to learn to handle (not master) all of them. To focus on the one that is currently important.

 

[Dapper Dan]

mmmmm shadow functions =/= inferior functions... tis all very confusing

Are the shadow functions just the opposite of our normal ones on the introversion/extroversion scale? So... Te, Ni, Se, and Fi?

Yep, exactly.

I was talking about the shadow functions, not the inferior ones.


Se and Fi for example. Absolutely crucial certain times in life. I don't wholly agree with him, because he is talking about being obsessive about your two leading ones. I say that we have to learn to handle (not master) all of them. To focus on the one that is currently important.

Why? I mean, there may be times when you don't have a choice in the matter, but if you do, then why do things in a way that's contrary to your nature?

 

[intpz]

You see, there are times in life when you have to, I mean seriously have to, develop your F. Learning to handle your feelings by exposing yourself to them and let them rip. No one can simply stroll through life with JUST iT/eP. That would be a life cut in half.

There is both wants and needs, and sometimes you have to do things that you need to do, not just what you want, or "have an unlimited energy" in doing.

Se and Fi for example. Absolutely crucial certain times in life. I don't wholly agree with him, because he is talking about being obsessive about your two leading ones. I say that we have to learn to handle (not master) all of them. To focus on the one that is currently important.

Why? If you need someone to think you're a feeling cunt, pretend, make some fake tears or whatever is your goal there. Be a hypocrite if you think it's so necessary in some situation. Why would you need develop your F? You'd just be another annoying guy out there, who'd get on T's nerves every time he opens his mouth.

Why? I mean, there may be times when you don't have a choice in the matter, but if you do, then why do things in a way that's contrary to your nature?

You always have a choice.

 

[snafupants]

Good Video

DaveSuperPowers has some good MBTI vids, I've got links to the INTP relevant ones here. I think he is a self proclaimed INTP, who knows how to extravert only for doing these videos. He has some other site where they do reviews of RC planes and such, and now they're starting a new site called Intuitive Time, which isn't available yet.

At any rate he has some good points about MBTI, namely

• Avoid the tests, they're horrible
• Avoid the profiles, which are mostly copy and paste of each other
• To understand MBTI and yourself you have to master the functions
• Don't be well rounded! Concentrate on your first two functions, become the master of them, because that is the source of your strength (your other two functions will come along with that)
• There are physiological clues to type

Note: it's not clear to me what he means exactly by shadow functions, but I think he's referring to the theory that there are four complementary shadow functions to your main functions (Dominant, Aux, Tertiary, Shadow). The shadow function (singular) is the last of your primary functions.

@Architect

I concur that comprehending the cognitive functions is paramount but I would extend one's functional repertoire to one's top three functions; I consider the inferior function (e.g., Fe for INTP and Se for INTJ) to be part of the Jungian shadow; anyway the inferior function appears to steer or countervail the dominant function, and I'd leave it at that. Yeah I believe Dave is using the phrase shadow functions in the same way that Beebe uses the term, which happens to conform to your end-of-post conjecture relating to four complementary/destructive functions; for an INTP these shadow functions would be Te-Ni-Se-Fi in that order; there are roles assigned to each shadow function (e.g., trickster) but I don't find that entirely edifying to think about. Anyway, for my money the tests lag behind the profiles and the profiles lag behind the cognitive functions in terms of grist for determining one's type; physiognomy can be helpful. Dave's videos are pretty enlightening.

 

[Proletar]

Why? If you need someone to think you're a feeling cunt, pretend, make some fake tears or whatever is your goal there. Be a hypocrite if you think it's so necessary in some situation. Why would you need develop your F? You'd just be another annoying guy out there, who'd get on T's nerves every time he opens his mouth.

-.-


Nothing wrong with my T. In fact, my T is so amazing that it has lead me to the extraordinary conclusion that other traits need to be developed. More than yours have ever done!

^^

 

[intpz]

More than yours have ever done!

^^

Looks emotional.

 

[Turniphead]

Just because you know how to use a function does not mean you have to use it all the time.
Avoiding understanding of your inferior function is a bad idea. blbhabh blah I'll just leave this here because It basically explains what I mean.

INTPs’ Fourth/Inferior Function: Extraverted Feeling (Fe)
For those unfamiliar with the powerful influence of the inferior function on personality, as well as common strategies for dealing with it, I strongly encourage you to explore my post, Understanding the Inferior Function.

Despite being largely unconscious, the inferior function it has its own set of needs and refuses to let its voice go unheard. One way the inferior asserts itself is by serving as a sort of goal or idealized endpoint for personal growth. As the complement to the dominant function, it carries the promise of psychological balance and wholeness. This is why people sometimes describe experiences with their inferior as ecstatic or magical, experiences that allow them to glimpse the long-lost “other half” of themselves.

As is true of other types, INTPs can be easily blinded to the degree to which their inferior function impacts their decisions and behavior. Without sufficient awareness and integration of their inferior, INTPs will continue to feel incomplete and be prone to unwise decision-making in their careers, lifestyle, and relationships. As discussed in my INTP careers post, INTPs may be enticed by their inferior function, Extraverted Feeling (Fe), to pursue careers for which they are ill-suited, such as counseling or psychotherapy. Or, in INTPs’ relationships, they might pair with EFJ types in attempt to readily obtain, even if unwittingly, what they are lacking and striving to find in themselves (i.e., Fe). In order to be subconsciously controlled by their inferior function, INTPs seeking self-knowledge and personal growth must work to understand the ways in which their inferior Fe manifests in their personality.

from: http://personalityjunkie.com/the-intp/3/


P.S. yay I love feelings feelings feelings yay.
P.P.s I know I'm not talking about shadow functions.

 

[RadicalDreamer31]

I understand the logic in that statement. But his argument is weak, and his advice is inconsistent form video to video. Also life is not homogenous; Achilles heel.

I choose not to be monochrome.