Questions about INFJs

[Escrue]

Hi all I really appreciated the advice this forum gave me about INTPs, so, I thought I would make a mini-topic for anyone curious about INFJ behaviour or a particular INFJ.

Sorry if I sound somewhat presumptuous Haha. I've never done this before, but I'll do my best to answer any questions xD

 

[GarmGarf]

You know the way INFJs tend to think and care about other people much more than they get back? Is that fair? What do you think the world should be like? Is it just tough luck and/or should the INFJ think/care less when it isn't returned; should others return the thought/care to an equal magnitude; or should they meet each other half way?

 

[ProxyAmenRa]

Well, I really screwed up a relationship (casual acquaintance) with an infj girl at university. The best part about it is that I don't know how I created such a situation. Since, she is the high achieving group's fulcrum be default I screwed up my interactions with these people. This makes life difficult in two areas; 1) I am unable to form groups for assignments with people that achieve similar grades to I. And, 2) I have to deal with these people on a day to basis and it is depressing trying to engage with people and not develop relationships further. I like my isolation and solitude but isolation and solitude in a social setting is to my detriment.

From an infj's perspective what actions could I take to remedy the situation?

----- Edit------

Think of this as asking a question about infjs.

 

[Escrue]

You know the way INFJs tend to think and care about other people much more than they get back? Is that fair?

Well, I think for some reason INFJs get a lot of pleasure from giving to other people xD Whether it be their time, their listening skills, gifts, etc. I'm not sure why it feels so much better to give rather than receive. From a rational point of view, it isn't really fair I guess, but from the INFJ view, it's something they love to do, and if their willingness to give is met by enthusiasm and gratefulness, all the better I guess INFJs need to feel needed and validated by the people they love.

What do you think the world should be like?

I guess the INFJ concept of a perfect world would be one of structure and morality, where both the law and moral integrity weren't broken. But, at the same time, creativity and originality would be greatly prized. Basically, INFJs wants everyone to be the best person they can be, but at the same time, 100% true to who they really are without having to put on a mask for the rest of the world. I guess while rational-minded people would be more concerned about technological development, INFJs would be more concerned that the scientists are feeling happy and enjoying what they are doing

Is it just tough luck and/or should the INFJ think/care less when it isn't returned; should others return the thought/care to an equal magnitude; or should they meet each other half way?

INFJs usually don't care if their giving isn't reciprocated, but they do care if it isn't considered valuable by the other party. If they feel that the other person doesn't appreciate it, they might feel very hurt, and attempt to distance themselves under a veneer of rational politeness. (But a lot of the time, like in my case, even if the person isn't very vocal, INFJs convince themselves that deep inside, the person really appreciates and loves them ) Perhaps the need to give to others stems from an INFJ thirst to prove themselves and feel loved by others.

It would probably be difficult for a person to return the thought/care to an equal magnitude. If you are an INFJs best friend, be prepared for multiple gifts on their birthday, constant emails, and phone calls seeing how you are going. If you are an INFJs lover ... heh heh heh. Well, let's just say that you're on your partner's mind all the time, to different degrees. It may seem obsessive, but INFJs put a massive value on those they love, and think about them in relation to everything. E.g. going out shopping, thinking about what small gift/chocolate to buy their partner. E.g. going out for a jog, all the while thinking about the first time they met them.

I'm not saying that the other party doesn't care for them an equal measure, just that INFJs tend to be very, very demonstrative of their feelings. Rationals love their partners equally, but tend to not be as demonstrative. So I guess I'm saying that that while both parties have an equal amount of love, INFJs tend to express it more.

Also, to be honest, I think INFJs would feel very uncomfortable if they met someone else halfway. It makes them feel less ... validated? Valuable? In any case, they would much rather be the giver than the receiver. Perhaps it subconsciously infuses them with a sense of power.

 

[Escrue]

Well, I really screwed up a relationship (casual acquaintance) with an infj girl at university. The best part about it is that I don't know how I created such a situation. Since, she is the high achieving group's fulcrum be default I screwed up my interactions with these people. This makes life difficult in two areas; 1) I am unable to form groups for assignments with people that achieve similar grades to I. And, 2) I have to deal with these people on a day to basis and it is depressing trying to engage with people and not develop relationships further. I like my isolation and solitude but isolation and solitude in a social setting is to my detriment.

From an infj's perspective what actions could I take to remedy the situation?

----- Edit------

Think of this as asking a question about infjs.

Don't blame yourself <3 Sometimes INFJs can be unfair on others. I know that I have, on occasion, felt insulted by a very casual, innocent comment made by someone else. As a result I start to distance myself from them. Then they end up very confused and hurt It's definitely not a good quality to have, and I feel very guilty about doing this to others, but INFJs find it very, very difficult to express their true feelings. It's easy for us to be kind and compassionate to others, but very hard to state their thoughts clearly and bluntly, without any decoration and softening to the words.

You probably said or did something very innocuous to yourself but hurtful to the INFJ. This causes them to go into lockdown mode - basically distancing themselves from you with a veneer of formal politeness but avoiding socialising with you. I have to be clear - THIS IS NOT YOUR FAULT, sometimes INFJs can be very much in the wrong about this when they aren't completely honest. You need to appeal to their feelings and their value as a person to make them finally admit what it was that hurt them in the first place.

I think the the following is the best approach. The INFJ wants to feel needed, validated and valuable. So I recommend emailing them/saying to them: "Look, I know I screwed up [even you didn't necessarily - but don't mention that haha] and I really want to make things right between us. You're one of the nicest people I know and I really value you as a friend. Please tell me what I did to hurt you, and I will do everything I can to make it better. I really miss you."

It might seem excessive, but this is what the INFJ is longing to hear from everybody xD If it doesn't work the first time, try again. Basically, the main thing here is to appeal to how much you value them - especially their uniqueness. E.g., if the person tells a lot of corny jokes, say something like, "I really miss the way you make everyone laugh." If the person has a strange obsession with wine-making, say something like, "I really miss discussing wine-making and everything else with you."

I hope this helps. You can modify the formula accordingly If there are any other problems please feel free to ask!

 

[ProxyAmenRa]

Story in short:

I had a crush on this girl. Told her I liked her and asked her on a date. She rejected me said some sad soppy story about a bad relationship with a guy in the past that left her emotionally scared. She stated she did not want relationships which includes friendships. The last statement was a complete lie because her actions represent the contrary. Plus, people are bad at lying in general. She then continued to use a displacement story which was obvious because I use the exact same one but change the gender of the main protagonist. Anyway, noticing mechanisms used I adhered to her implicit wish to not be friends with me. I did not speak to her for 3 months over the summer break and when the next semester commenced she said hello and the words leaving my mouth in response directed her to her desired people whom she has relations with (adhering to her implicit wish). Thus, latent hostility commenced.

I don't particularly care about being her friend. It is not a goal of mine. However, I would like the latent hostility to subside. It is interesting to note that my gut instinct portrays her as disingenuous in regards to all facets of interaction with people. However, her interactions with people are "real" but the information portrayed is grossly misinterpreted by people.

I believe I am making ground with others in my degree by reverting back to the fundamentals. Which have worked well in the past in the years where I was less conscious. Though, these people are by nature uninteresting from my perspective but working relationships must be maintained. After university I will be working with these people.

 

[Escrue]

Hmmm. That definitely changes things. I'm sorry for what you've been through, it sounds like it was really tough.

In this case, I would recommend simply being warm and polite. Unfortunately, INFJs can sometimes forget that rational people have feelings and emotions as well, and view them as 'robots' in a sense. This is completely untrue, of course, so I think you need to show her that you can be kind and funny. This will help dissipate the tension.

INFJs absolutely loathe any kind of conflict, so if you attempt to patch things up with her, I'm sure that even though she might seem reluctant at first, inside she is very happy that the two of you have settled the past. Consistency is the key. If you always greet her and ask how she is, she will do the same for you. Perhaps you may need to vocalise your wish to join her group at college?

 

[ProxyAmenRa]

That is some good advice.

 

[Escrue]

Thankyou, I hope it helps =D Come back anytime ^__^ I always love reading your posts ;D

 

[shadowdrums4]

So my Mom is an INFJ. I guess I have some questions about recent behaviour. I kinda want to know what she's thinking.

So I notice that every time I go to the store with her, as she's getting groceries, she always says things like "Hang on your dad will whine at that..." so she realizes that he can be very whiny and lazy, but yet if I ever bring it up, "He is NOT. Stop ragging on your dad!" I guess my question is why is this? Is it some kind of "You can't pick on him I can" thing or what?

Mom's always valued imagination and considered herself a dreamer. Is this true of most/all INFJs?

Recently my brother got on my dad's nerves and Dad told him to get out. Mom didn't do anything to stop it, but asked me to call my brother and make sure he was okay after a few days saying she wasn't sure she wanted him gone all the time. Why didn't she say that when he left and why hasn't she told him? When Dad and my brother are fighting, why does she tend to side with Dad regardless of who is actually right?

I realize my mom is an individual and your answers may or may not help but hey, worth a shot.

On a more general scale: What would you say is the most important thing to an INFJ? Like knowledge is everything to an INTP and they want to understand. (In other words fill in the statement ________ is everything to an INFJ and they want ______) What do INFJs think about authority?

 

[Escrue]

I think an important thing to keep in mind is that INFJs are excessively sensitive to any kind of conflict or criticism, even when it's meant for a good purpose. This is one of the type's greatest character failings. They regard any kind of criticism as a personal insult against themselves, rather than what they have done wrong. As a result, they feel deeply hurt and devalued by others.

I think that when your dad criticises anything your mom does (this is not to say he does it out of malice or on purpose) even if it is very, very rare, your mom takes it to heart and does not forget about it like other types would do. That's the other problem about INFJs, even though we appear outwardly polite and calm, it's very hard for us to let go of grudges against other people. Perhaps your dad made an innocent remark to your mom one day about her choice of groceries, and your mom felt personally insulted by that, feeling devalued by her family. INFJs view their household chores as acts of love for their family, and if they feel that it isn't valued by others, they can quickly become resentful.

Yep, all the INFJs I know value imagination and the ability to dream ^_^ Often more so than real life.

When your dad argued with your brother, your mom probably felt a lot of turmoil inside (INFJs hate it when there's any sort of conflict within in the family). But perhaps she decided the best way to keep peace would be to keep quiet, rather than starting a whole new argument. She probably thought your brother needed time to himself (something that all INFJs can relate to). Perhaps she sent you to talk to him because she did not want to seem disloyal to your father, but she can't help caring deeply for other peoples' feelings. Also, she might have thought that being a sibling, you would understand him better.

When faced with an argument, INFJs don't necessarily pick the rational side. They pick the one they feel they should have the most loyalty towards. Thus, it isn't a case of who is right or wrong in the INFJs mind, it's a matter of who they need to defend. Your mom probably feels that siding with her husband is a higher priority than being on the right side of the argument. It's kind of hard to explain. INFJs value loyalty, relationships, and how people feel over 'correctness.'

The imaginative inner life and relationships are everything to an INFJ, and they want to be loved for who they really are.

INFJs (well, at least from my point of view) don't really give a damn about authority ;D They may appear to follow it calmly like a good citizen, but they care much more for their inner values and the feelings of others than rules and laws. They will always side with a person they care about over a law. Also, if a leader does not follow their particular values, they are likely to view them with a measure of scorn.

Hope this helps in a small way ^__^

 

[Wu Flung Dung]

So my Mom is an INFJ. I guess I have some questions about recent behaviour. I kinda want to know what she's thinking.

So I notice that every time I go to the store with her, as she's getting groceries, she always says things like "Hang on your dad will whine at that..." so she realizes that he can be very whiny and lazy, but yet if I ever bring it up, "He is NOT. Stop ragging on your dad!" I guess my question is why is this? Is it some kind of "You can't pick on him I can" thing or what?

Mom's always valued imagination and considered herself a dreamer. Is this true of most/all INFJs?

Recently my brother got on my dad's nerves and Dad told him to get out. Mom didn't do anything to stop it, but asked me to call my brother and make sure he was okay after a few days saying she wasn't sure she wanted him gone all the time. Why didn't she say that when he left and why hasn't she told him? When Dad and my brother are fighting, why does she tend to side with Dad regardless of who is actually right?

I realize my mom is an individual and your answers may or may not help but hey, worth a shot.

On a more general scale: What would you say is the most important thing to an INFJ? Like knowledge is everything to an INTP and they want to understand. (In other words fill in the statement ________ is everything to an INFJ and they want ______) What do INFJs think about authority?

Speaking as an INFJ, I think your mother sounds like an INFP, they are far more likely to be submissive in the way you described. INFJs are diplomatic and can feel victimized but are not submissive. INFPs can have a "my country (husband) right or wrong" atitude like ISFJs which comes from the tertiary Si and the Fi too. Also, INFPs are rigid in a way associated with J types so it is easy to mistype them as Js.

I dream but I am far less dreamy than an INFP and I am also a doer. The most important thing to an INFJ might vary according to who they are but my most important things are giving back to humanity and "self actualization". Also, gaining knowledge is important to me too but the first two things I mentioned are probably more important to me if only slightly.

 

[cheese]

Escrue's answer made more sense imo. The whole thing screams of Fe, which can come across a bit slippery and unreliable, since it's about loyalty/community/relations unlike Fi which is more about rigid personal values. Fe will forego the latter to maintain the former, not the other way round, I think. The rigidity of Ni/Si will come through in a ways not necessarily related to morals or accuracy - I think FJs' actions are less likely to make sense to us than FPs. At least Fi sticks to what it thinks and says, more or less. Fe sticks to people, at the expense of what it says (since often what it says is for the purpose of sticking anyway, and therefore varies from group to group).

 

[Wu Flung Dung]

Escrue's answer made more sense imo. The whole thing screams of Fe, which can come across a bit slippery and unreliable, since it's about loyalty/community/relations unlike Fi which is more about rigid personal values. Fe will forego the latter to maintain the former, not the other way round, I think. The rigidity of Ni/Si will come through in a ways not necessarily related to morals or accuracy - I think FJs' actions are less likely to make sense to us than FPs. At least Fi sticks to what it thinks and says, more or less. Fe sticks to people, at the expense of what it says (since often what it says is for the purpose of sticking anyway, and therefore varies from group to group).

Not really, Fi values are indeed more rigid but provided some deeply held value is not being violated then INFPs will be more go with the flow and subservient and this is probably why INFPs have a bit of reputation for being passive despite having the ability to be so rigid on occasions. Fi is probably more concerned with morals than Fe but it has personal subjective morals which you tend not to know about until you are in violation of one of these values. I do not think IXTPs frequently know how to deal with Fi values because they frequently make sense only to the person with the value. Fi is the equivalent of Ti in terms of independence and even orginality but it is directed in a different way and they can fight against each other in a sense. Fe seeks to balance their values with the values of those around it but if the Fe is backed by Ni then the long term implication of having ones values constantly or severely violated to accomodate others will be noted and reacted against and this is why ENFJs and INFJs though more flexible with values will react if the violation goes too far or is too great.

It is like this I think

INFP (black or white/static)- Will be ok until a value is violated then will become uncompromising.

INFJ (gray/dynamic)-will seek to balanced your values and theirs if possible but it can only do this to a limited extent under certain circumstances regardless of how it seems.

 

[cheese]

I don't think we're in conflict here. I agree with what you've said. The mother just sounds like a Fe user who hasn't had her boundaries crossed yet.

*edit
I disagree with me; the description of the mother now reminds me strongly of a Fi user I know. I think I'm seeing the shade of what you mean more clearly now. Perhaps it's just another wonky perspective though. **edit What I mean is - perhaps my brain is playing tricks on me, again.