Question for long-term INTPs

[yoopernation]

I've been reading and posting for a couple of days now, and it's dawned on me that I've changed quite a bit since I had my first introduction to M-B and similar material in a college class that taught skills needed to troubleshoot organizational cultures. I've learned to deal with most of my weaknesses as an INTP (very strong I and N, moderately strong T and P), but there are some things that I will probably never handle well. I can handle anger pretty well (I look on people who can't control their anger as children), and sad people I handle pretty well ... I really do empathize. The only strong emotion I never can deal well with is anguish, grieving over loss of loved ones, etc. In the loss of loved ones category, the combination of my general personality traits and the fact that I'm so comfortable with life and death result in me coming across 'badly' with grieving people.

What 'weakness' do you find most troublesome to 'fix'?

 

[MatthewSawyer]

Personally, I think it is incorrect to state you are strong in I and N and only moderately strong in T and P. As far as I understand this is just not how MBTI works.

For me, I am very strong in Ne and Ti. I mean my intuition and thinking are strong. My Si is also somewhat developed and my Fe is a no-show. If you don't understand what I am talking about, search "cognitive functions 100." It is an excellent thread on this forum.

As for which weakness I find most troublesome to fix.... My wife sums it up best when I hurt her feelings and says: "you are an insensitive asshole sometimes."

I am pretty bad at understanding other people's feelings a lot of the time. It makes relationships very difficult. I cannot empathize with people. To steal a lime I like: "emotions.exe failed to execute"

 

[walfin]

Inappropriate emotions I guess - finding funny what others do not find funny, finding sad what others do not find sad, etc, some of the time. Doesn't go away but just have to fake appearing to feel what other people feel.

 

[Jennywocky]

What 'weakness' do you find most troublesome to 'fix'?

I can't fake concern/sympathy, especially if my intellect has analyzed things and found something to be critical about. It feels like a lie. Some people just know how to make someone else feel better, regardless of what they have to say; i envy them, but I can't be them, even if I know it would be prudent.

I also don't like social routine that feels fake, especially with family stuff. Social contrivance does not intimacy and connection make. I can play the game for awhile, but eventually I'll dump an earful and want something more substantial.

I've got decent extroverting/feeling skills, but eventually I crash and have to hibernate. I worry that people think I've been lying to them the whole time about liking them, or that I'll come off as a flake. The truth is I just can't handle a lot of proximity for prolonged periods, even with people I like. I need space. I also wish I could emote better.

I also tend to do everything on my own and not make space for people to involve themselves in my life, so they grow detached from me. Sometimes I feel like I have a wall of dead space around me that nothing really gets through, and it's lonely. I'm pretty much stuck with myself for all time, and wonder if anyone would ever really, permanently, bridge that gap... if that is even possible.

Finally, I have trouble just working methodically through a task, linearly. It seems boring, shallow, and tedious to me. Unfortunately, it's a good and necessary skill to have.

So much of my complaints revolves around the relational/emotive and the sensing areas. I have little qualm about my thinking and intuition, those skills have always served me well... it's just that because they're my natural priority/comfort, I do less well with the others.

 

[yoopernation]

I wish I knew a woman who was INTP or very similar ... just for the sake of curiosity if nothing else. I personally love what comes with all my characteristics, and don't have much trouble dealing with my weaknesses. I think it may be more difficult for a woman though. Women are 'supposed' to be more feeling, etc. I know there are some people who have negative views of me (waitresses, etc.), and I feel 'bad' about it for about 20 seconds, then I move on. If I don't need somebody to like me for practical purposes, I don't care a whole lot about what they think of me.

Uh-oh ... reminds me of a story. I remember going to a talk by the guy who wrote the 'what color is your parachute?' books ... he had a story he related about himself. One day he found out how he was viewed (i.e. stuck up) by the waitresses at the restaurant he frequented. This took him by surprise, as he knew he wasn't (sound familiar?). He told this story as a way to show that it is useful to hear how other people view you, and how you should ask a good friend to tell you how you come across to others. It's also interesting to see yourself on camera in conversation, etc.

 

[yoopernation]

I kind of had a problem with the 'insensitive asshole' aspect in one of my jobs. I had a woman boss who was pretty much as different in personality as could be. I lasted for 9 years because she pretty much let me run things the way I wanted, but I finally had to leave. She just drove me crazy! Typical left-wing ('please call me Doctor') socialist.

Regarding Myers-Briggs classifications ... it's how I learned it in college, and I've never had a problem discussing typology with others. I'd guess what you're referring to is a fine-tuning or some other revision of what I learned 25 years ago. All of the Myers-Briggs tests I've ever taken tell you how strong you are in each category.

 

[ScorpioINTP]

I can't fake concern/sympathy, especially if my intellect has analyzed things and found something to be critical about. It feels like a lie. Some people just know how to make someone else feel better, regardless of what they have to say; i envy them, but I can't be them, even if I know it would be prudent.

I also don't like social routine that feels fake, especially with family stuff. Social contrivance does not intimacy and connection make. I can play the game for awhile, but eventually I'll dump an earful and want something more substantial.


I also tend to do everything on my own and not make space for people to involve themselves in my life, so they grow detached from me. Sometimes I feel like I have a wall of dead space around me that nothing really gets through, and it's lonely. I'm pretty much stuck with myself for all time, and wonder if anyone would ever really, permanently, bridge that gap... if that is even possible.

Finally, I have trouble just working methodically through a task, linearly. It seems boring, shallow, and tedious to me. Unfortunately, it's a good and necessary skill to have.

.

Wow, that all sounds so much like me. I hate mundane meticulous linear tasks....ugh. I despise social conventions and small talk at social events. I hate being asked about things that I feel the person really doesn't care about, just like I don't really care about so and so's kids, church life, etc.

I have a habit of dismissing peoples feelings after concluding they are illogical or the result of a misunderstanding (and therefore should no longer be felt). I find it frustrating to be the cause of said emotions.

 

[Jennywocky]

I wish I knew a woman who was INTP or very similar ... just for the sake of curiosity if nothing else. I personally love what comes with all my characteristics, and don't have much trouble dealing with my weaknesses. I think it may be more difficult for a woman though. Women are 'supposed' to be more feeling, etc.

Yes, that's kind of a tough spot and why INTP women sometimes feel different from other females / like they don't fit in. Plus, a lot of guys go for women of more typical expressions of femininity. We're unique in a lot of ways. Even if a male INTP is considered geeky for his personalities and interests, it's still generally accepted in western culture as a male pathway... but I think the geek girl thing is only lately finding acceptance and there is still a lot of pressure to conform to a more conventionally feminine role.

 

[GYX_Kid]

in an argument, when an INTP makes a theoretical argument and the other person reacts with 'emotion'/'outburst'/'obstacle'

practicality and applicability disagreements tend to happen

i also occasionally may hold a deep, lasting grudge against someone who successfully frightens me in the right context

 

[myexplodingcat]

I can't fake concern/sympathy, especially if my intellect has analyzed things and found something to be critical about. It feels like a lie. Some people just know how to make someone else feel better, regardless of what they have to say; i envy them, but I can't be them, even if I know it would be prudent.

I also don't like social routine that feels fake, especially with family stuff. Social contrivance does not intimacy and connection make. I can play the game for awhile, but eventually I'll dump an earful and want something more substantial.

I've got decent extroverting/feeling skills, but eventually I crash and have to hibernate. I worry that people think I've been lying to them the whole time about liking them, or that I'll come off as a flake. The truth is I just can't handle a lot of proximity for prolonged periods, even with people I like. I need space. I also wish I could emote better.

I also tend to do everything on my own and not make space for people to involve themselves in my life, so they grow detached from me. Sometimes I feel like I have a wall of dead space around me that nothing really gets through, and it's lonely. I'm pretty much stuck with myself for all time, and wonder if anyone would ever really, permanently, bridge that gap... if that is even possible.

Finally, I have trouble just working methodically through a task, linearly. It seems boring, shallow, and tedious to me. Unfortunately, it's a good and necessary skill to have.

So much of my complaints revolves around the relational/emotive and the sensing areas. I have little qualm about my thinking and intuition, those skills have always served me well... it's just that because they're my natural priority/comfort, I do less well with the others.

^That. Exactly that.

For sympathy, I'm at a loss. Mostly I suck in my breath, clench my teeth, and say, "Gee, that stinks," and "Aww" and stuff, but it doesn't sound right to me. I'm always hoping that the people are caught up enough in their introverted Feeling that they don't notice how fake I sound, just that I'm making vaguely reassuring noises. I can tell, though, that some people don't buy it.

Also, I find that--and you'll hear this from me a lot--I can't just straight memorize things. This is one of the reasons I hate history classes. I don't mind the general story, but I have a horrible memory for names.

Names. I can never, ever, ever remember names. I forget to ask them, avoid using them, and can't see the purpose of them except for talking about them to other people, which isn't much of a purpose. But they're probably useful to other people when they shake me to get me to pay attention to their sob stories.

I was listening to my Math teacher get emotional and her eyes get all watery and stuff once, because her brother's boss's mother died, and I'm thinking, "Is this a reason to get that emotional?" I know, that sounds highly insensitive, but still. Irrational. She's an ESFJ, by the way, which explains a lot.

Jennywocky just explained my life, right there.

 

[descendant]

^ owh I think I'm exactly like you
and people around me think I'm a heartless person just because I don't seem to have any sympathy
sometimes I just have to act as if I was sympathizing them but then it really drains my energy
so nowadays I would try my best to avoid conversations other than work related

 

[ElvenVeil]

yeah let's face it.. Jennywocky pretty much nailed it.

The worst of my weaknesses usually becomes visual when I participate in larger groups/ social meetings; I tend to grow all silent and disappear into myself.. And that's actually a pity as I have learned most people read this reaction in a wrong way.. I have experienced many people take it as a critique of themselves and that you wish to stay aloof of the conversations. As that is not always the case, I would say it's a major weakness

but yeah perhaps it's just easier to second Jennywocky , rather than typing the whole thing again :P

 

[stig]

The only strong emotion I never can deal well with is anguish, grieving over loss of loved ones, etc. In the loss of loved ones category, the combination of my general personality traits and the fact that I'm so comfortable with life and death result in me coming across 'badly' with grieving people.

What 'weakness' do you find most troublesome to 'fix'?

I think in order to recognize and empathize with anguish, whether it be over a death or otherwise, you have to have experienced it for yourself recently. The mind forgets the core of intense pain over time, whether it be mental or physical. Anguish isn't created by death itself, but by the loss of something you value greatly. Losing a hard drive can be pretty traumatic if it entails the loss of a years hard work, for instance. Over time, most people cope with loss in all it's forms, and the emotions behind it become vague memories. For some, it's a person or people that they most value, and the loss of those people will most certainly give rise to anguish, at least for a little while. As a father, I place such value on my kids that even imagining such a scenario as the loss of ones child is enough to elicit empathy. My pre-father self would have never understood or properly empathized with such a loss. Even from a purely logical standpoint, my children represent the better part of my efforts in life for the last 15 years. That's one hell of a hard drive.

But, in this same regard, and to answer your question as well, my biggest weakness is empathy as well, but less directly aimed or specific. The line I draw in my head for what I see as trivial, and what others see as important, is far off from the norm. As a result, I spend a good bit of my time in incredulity; most people seem rapped up in non-matters, and to empathize with their plight seems ridiculous. In this way, perhaps I can empathize with your state, as awkward it do make.

That said, as one who's recently experienced a fair amount of anguish, while I understand the awkward in never knowing what to say to someone in such situations, at least in my case, that awkwardness is really not warranted. I'm perfectly capable of handling any and all viewpoints without offense.

 

[kinetickyle]

I never have any problems with emotions. I tend to stay pretty detached, though not as bad as Meursault from The Stranger. I don't care if my responses are considered inappropriate like walfin does, and I completely know what Jennwocky's talking about by not being able to fake sympathy. I don't even try. If people have a problem with my emotional reactions, or lack thereof, that's their problems - not mine. Sorry if that makes me sound like a prick, but that's just the way it is. Some people may see these as weaknesses, but I don't. I'm not saying that they're strengths, either. They're just traits.

I my mind, my biggest weakness is my tendency to second guess myself. I will form a strong argument, and then shoot it in the leg with "what if" hypotheticals. I'm not sure why I do that, but it sometimes makes it hard to persuade someone of an opposing viewpoint to agree with me.

 

[theory_of_everything]

People grow. I feel that its limiting to stay so polarized.

Yes, my natural tendency is to be an introvert, but its nice to take a vacation from that world, or at least try to understand extrovert. My jobs have made me act a little more like a J than a P. And with much of my artwork and writing, I'm trying to understand how I feel and how others feel and how to understand and express these emotions.


I've just recently started to study personality types. I think if I found out I was INTP earlier in my life, I would have used it as an excuse to not venture out and do new things. Instead I would have clung to my personality type as if it were my identity.

Your personality type is the blank canvas. Now some canvases are better for acrylic, or oil, or whatever. But in the end, you will decide what the painting is.

My personality has been a blessing and a curse. It has brought me further at some parts of my life and behind in others. And I struggle to find balance and to become the man I wish to be.