• OK, it's on.
  • Please note that many, many Email Addresses used for spam, are not accepted at registration. Select a respectable Free email.
  • Done now. Domine miserere nobis.

Older INTPs and function development

echoplex

Happen.
Local time
Today 6:14 PM
Joined
Jan 28, 2009
Messages
1,609
---
Location
From a dangerously safe distance
This forum consists mostly of young members, many of them under 20. We are also very fortunate to have the perspective of many older and more experienced members. I often wonder how our handle of certain functions will evolve as we age, so I thought I'd ask those who've been around longer. Obviously we are all different despite type, but some perspective would be interesting.

So, for the older members (let's say, 30 and older), how have your inferior functions developed over time? How is this compared to when you were younger? How have events (marriage, kids, career, etc.) affected the development of weaker functions? Have you become more functionally versatile or do you still rely mostly on more familiar functions? Do you consider developing weaker functions important? If so, how has this been important in your life?

And I apologize in advance for calling you people old. :p
 

loveofreason

echoes through time
Local time
Today 12:14 PM
Joined
Sep 8, 2007
Messages
5,492
---
If I had the strength I would slap you round with my walking stick.

All I can say is that my whole life I had been so adverse to groups... to socially participating in any way with other people... but something finally struck me.

If I hated groups of people so much... and hated culture so much... and didn't feel I belonged anywhere... and I was lonely because of that... then wasn't it my responsibility to do some active creating of the social environment I wanted to exist?

This seems to be an awakening of Fe, in MBTI terms.
 

Artifice Orisit

Guest
How old does somebody need to be to get away with stuff because they're old?
 

EloquentBohemian

MysticDragon
Local time
Today 6:14 PM
Joined
Oct 4, 2008
Messages
1,386
---
Location
Ottawa, Canada
If I had the strength I would slap you round with my walking stick.

I LOLed so hard at this that tears came to my eyes. :D

All I can say is that my whole life I had been so adverse to groups... to socially participating in any way with other people... but something finally struck me.

If I hated groups of people so much... and hated culture so much... and didn't feel I belonged anywhere... and I was lonely because of that... then wasn't it my responsibility to do some active creating of the social environment I wanted to exist?

This seems to be an awakening of Fe, in MBTI terms.
I'll initially second this, and later I will add more of my own thoughts (...once I regain my composure) :D
This happened for me around my late 30's. I began to actively seek out more people on the 'fringe' of society than merely hanging around with groups which were slightly off the norm. This was also a time of reflection on the meandering directionless course I had taken since leaving my childhood home at sixteen. I seriously began to ask myself what I wanted for my life and what I believed in. Much of what I had experienced from the ages of 16 to around 22/23 came to the forefront of my thoughts, especially concerning the experiences I encountered and the knowledge I had gained from them but had filed away in favour of just living a middle-class lifestyle. I was married, had a good government job and a few occasional friends, but the 'aloneness' began to resurface.
 
Local time
Tomorrow 7:14 AM
Joined
May 28, 2009
Messages
88
---
Location
The land where a merlion is the country's official
A lot of under 20s? Ah, little wonder now.
 

brain enclosed in flesh

Well-Known Member
Local time
Today 4:14 PM
Joined
Apr 16, 2009
Messages
559
---
Location
need to get out
I'm old and I've been giving this some thought so I'll give it a shot-

First off, I'm not convinced that I'm an INTP. In high school I tested as an INFP and I look back at my childhood and that's pretty much what it screams, so...

I'd say Fi was my first big thing. Then Ne in high school. Then Si in my twenties. Then Fe now. I'm hoping Te will come in two to three business days.

I know this isn't a detailed answer but I'm tired.

Oh. Ti! I don't know. Always? I still am completely confused about Ti vs. Fi. For me they feel like one and the same.
 

Toad

True King of Mushroomland!!!
Local time
Today 3:14 PM
Joined
Apr 7, 2009
Messages
1,778
---
Did knowing your MBTI type help you guys "awaken" or overcome some of the INTP "weaknesses"? Also, I think it is important to know when you started becoming interested in your type because that will probably be the point when you started understanding yourself better and started changing.

I feel that I still have a ways to go to becoming a better person. I think knowing that I am an INTP and reading about it has really helped me though. Understanding yourself is the first step in becoming what you want, imo.
 

snowqueen

mysteriously benevolent
Local time
Today 11:14 PM
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
1,359
---
Location
mostly in the vast space inside
Did knowing your MBTI type help you guys "awaken" or overcome some of the INTP "weaknesses"?

Rather the opposite actually. Most of my life I tried to be anything but INTP because, although I didn't know my type, it represented everything my mother found unacceptable in me. So I spent years trying to be different - to be 'warm' and 'thoughtful' (remembering birthdays etc) and not argue or spend time alone - be sociable etc. I was exhausted. When I found out about INTP I realised that all those things I was trying to change were actually my strengths and all the things I was trying to do instead of the INTP traits were exhausting me. But I have learned a lot of good social skills along the way and I can deal with lots of different types of people. It's just that I feel a lot more relaxed nowadays. Anything can be a strenth or a weakness depending on the context. It's more a question of being wise enough to know what to do in each unique situation rather than being fixed into behaving in a certain way.

But knowing your temperament is helpful to know what to do to regenerate yourself. Spending time on my own, thinking about connections in my work, birdwatching (great for Ne) and allowing myself to daydream, having deep conversations with select friends.

I think knowing that I am an INTP and reading about it has really helped me though. Understanding yourself is the first step in becoming what you want, imo.

Better not let your guru hear you saying that!! You might get kicked out of the club.
 

Toad

True King of Mushroomland!!!
Local time
Today 3:14 PM
Joined
Apr 7, 2009
Messages
1,778
---
Rather the opposite actually. Most of my life I tried to be anything but INTP because, although I didn't know my type, it represented everything my mother found unacceptable in me. So I spent years trying to be different - to be 'warm' and 'thoughtful' (remembering birthdays etc) and not argue or spend time alone - be sociable etc. I was exhausted. When I found out about INTP I realised that all those things I was trying to change were actually my strengths and all the things I was trying to do instead of the INTP traits were exhausting me. But I have learned a lot of good social skills along the way and I can deal with lots of different types of people. It's just that I feel a lot more relaxed nowadays. Anything can be a strenth or a weakness depending on the context. It's more a question of being wise enough to know what to do in each unique situation rather than being fixed into behaving in a certain way.

But knowing your temperament is helpful to know what to do to regenerate yourself. Spending time on my own, thinking about connections in my work, birdwatching (great for Ne) and allowing myself to daydream, having deep conversations with select friends.



Better not let your guru hear you saying that!! You might get kicked out of the club.

Yes! I was always trying to be outgoing and sociable too! I always wanted to be "that guy". The life of the party. The one that everyone likes to be around and hang out with. After I found out I was an INTP it made so much sense to me why I wasn't ever happy.

Who is my guru? lol
 

snowqueen

mysteriously benevolent
Local time
Today 11:14 PM
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
1,359
---
Location
mostly in the vast space inside
you are Face's acolyte aren't you?

Face doesn't believe in the MBTI (which begs the question what is s.he doing here in the first place?)
 

echoplex

Happen.
Local time
Today 6:14 PM
Joined
Jan 28, 2009
Messages
1,609
---
Location
From a dangerously safe distance
If I hated groups of people so much... and hated culture so much... and didn't feel I belonged anywhere... and I was lonely because of that... then wasn't it my responsibility to do some active creating of the social environment I wanted to exist?

This seems to be an awakening of Fe, in MBTI terms.
Good point. I sometimes feel this peeking out of the surface, but I'm afraid it's something I'm still too immature to really apply. I suppose one must first get rid of all of their angst before they can really accept this. I think I'm getting there...

How old does somebody need to be to get away with stuff because they're old?
hmmm, I wish I knew. They do tend to get away with alot. Just recently Lor almost smacked me with a stick, and then EB just laughed about it. If a young person did that I doubt it would be very funny, unless it was a baby who did it. Then it would be hilarious.

I'd say Fi was my first big thing. Then Ne in high school. Then Si in my twenties. Then Fe now. I'm hoping Te will come in two to three business days.
Yeah, I think a common theme for INxPs is Ne in the late teen years. I've become alot more adept with Si lately too, as well as Fi, despite my T-ness. I can do Te if I want to, I just never want to. Anytime I use it I end up feeling like I let too much of my thought process become public. It makes me feel a bit naked. It also seems a bit too pedantic and unnecessary.

I'm still waiting on Fe. It's probably the function I'm most curious about on this topic.
 

Toad

True King of Mushroomland!!!
Local time
Today 3:14 PM
Joined
Apr 7, 2009
Messages
1,778
---
I was Face's acolyte...I don't know what to believe anymore. . . I'm so confused! Can I be your acolyte snow?
 
Local time
Today 11:14 PM
Joined
Jan 24, 2009
Messages
1,787
---
Location
where i have been put
i don't think any MBTI type develops of their own accord, i think society wears them down into it. many P types are forced into J-ness by what society wants. N into S, dreams die. I-E - I types forced to Extravert....

but i think the T-F is developed personally, not by society's needs.

'tis all
 

snowqueen

mysteriously benevolent
Local time
Today 11:14 PM
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
1,359
---
Location
mostly in the vast space inside
but i think the T-F is developed personally, not by society's needs.

'tis all

That is really interesting Sed. How can you possibly be only 15?

So there are places in society for Ts and for Fs? Like engineering and nursing for example? So there isn't the need to try to change that aspect so much - is that what you mean?
 

Anthile

Steel marks flesh
Local time
Tomorrow 12:14 AM
Joined
Jan 10, 2009
Messages
3,987
---
Well, being emotional is often considered as weak and sissyish, especially if you happen to be male.


Personally, my functions seem to be a complete mess. I have no idea what type I am.
 

Jennywocky

Creepy Clown Chick
Local time
Today 6:14 PM
Joined
Sep 25, 2008
Messages
10,739
---
Location
Charn
So, for the older members (let's say, 30 and older), how have your inferior functions developed over time? How is this compared to when you were younger? How have events (marriage, kids, career, etc.) affected the development of weaker functions? Have you become more functionally versatile or do you still rely mostly on more familiar functions? Do you consider developing weaker functions important? If so, how has this been important in your life?

Personally I believe the goal of life (in terms of function development) is to become better-rounded... to be able to draw on various facets of yourself regardless of one's preference. I do not advocate working to make all your functions equal -- it's important to accept that you have strengths and weaknesses, and that your strengths are assets to be used, so trying to shore up all potential weaknesses is usually just pissing away energy for limited result than the bang you would get for your buck investing energy in your strengths -- but at the same time I believe that ignoring/shunning unpreferred functions actually undermines the preferred functions, while developing them to some degree makes your strengths stronger.

This is actually a pretty complicated topic, it's all about personal development and how it works.
Early in life we all have preferences. We focus on our preferences because they make us comfortable and stronger, and so those functions get stronger and other functions atrophy. If childhood is screwy, it can do a number of things... it can undermine preferences, or it can increase the strength of distorted non-preferences, for example. Increased anxiety results in a lack of confidence in the True Self, leading to various coping mechanisms ... whatever best enables survival... and thus the development of a False Self (see Karen Horney's body of work for deeper exploration of this, for one).

The complication here is that functions not only sometimes get shunned or over-relied upon, but the function becomes distorted -- it is still used, but only in certain contexts or only certain aspects of it are used. This makes it hard to come up with generalized rules for everyone.

For example, because of my undermined confidence in myself and my perceptions (due to feeling emotionally assaulted by parents), my introversion stopped being just a natural affinity and grew a lot stronger as it became a suit of armor for me; it was far easier to be alone, and introversion/aloofness protected me. My Ti function still existed but only internally, I stopped sharing it with other people -- so inside it grew stronger and more rigid, but on the outside, I focused on my Ne as my method of connection because it was a "safe" function in terms of not attracting ire. Everyone loves a quick, imaginative, funny mind; Ti meanwhile as a judging function only usually resulted in my butting heads with the establishments.
Si function also becomes another mechanism of becoming entrenched -- you weave a protective wall around yourself and in the way things are supposed to be based on what once was.

Fe is the most interesting for me. I grew up under the influence of ISFJ women and ISFJ-style religions, and I was also the eldest, so I not only became sensitized to social expectation but felt horrendous guilt when my Ti+Ne would lead me away from social convention -- I was torn between being true to myself but "being an awful/inconsiderate human being" vs being someone who was socially approved of and positively considered but feeling like she had betrayed her True Self. There is a lot of alienation involved there, whether from the self or from social contacts who were supposed to be investing in me and helping me thrive... and instead they were just killing me. Also, Fe was never being used to prop ME up -- it's supposed to be a two-way system that supports the individual as well as the larger social consciousness -- but I was just using it to make myself feeling horrendously guilty for what I was not able to give, rather than realizing that society was supposed to be reciprocating and I had a right to rely on that same system for my betterment, not just constantly giving to it.

As an adult, then, I was someone who looked more flightly and creative (the Ne), socially astute (the Fe) and otherwise guilt-stricken, but reclusive (the I) and internally bitter (the Ti), etc.

Getting older and realizing things weren't right did bring lots of changes. I also realized that I was stronger than I thought and that I didn't need to fear others -- they could hurt me but not kill me, not in the most real senses. I could endure pain, survive, and thrive, and come out the other side. It also taught me there were some losses worth suffering because compromising myself would only kill me in the end. But it took hard experience to teach me that.

The Fe thing is probably the most notable "weaker function" that I've developed very strongly, partly because of my past. I'm not only sensitive to all the little cues that people are constantly putting off by what they say or do (and yes, it can be enough to drive you neurotic if you don't think the social rules are fair), but I'm finally capable of putting them in balance and determining which ones I want to fulfill and which ones I won't and not being bothered if someone doesn't like it. The Ne "I love options" part of me also never wanted to burn any bridges or allow a door to close, but if you ignore some social cues/obligations, some relationships will automatically have limits placed on them... but I accept that that's okay now, and so I choose now what I want, without bitterness or anger. I also have the space I now need to share my thoughts (Ti) without shame, while appreciating other points of view even if I don't necessarily view the world the same way.

Basically getting older is like a forge or a sander -- if you let it, it'll smooth/burn off all the rough edges and get things in balance for you. If you fight that natural balancing, you might break instead, or at least ruin your full potential because you're not letting your psyche get in sync. A strong runner on a relay team might be the best runner in the world, but the success of the race depends on the whole team no matter how strong he is; basically once everyone's in sync, the lesser members can help slingshot the strong guy into the lead so to speak; and function use is sort of similar, putting everything in balance and not neglecting certain functions can help the whole be bigger than the mere sum of the psyche.
 

snowqueen

mysteriously benevolent
Local time
Today 11:14 PM
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
1,359
---
Location
mostly in the vast space inside
wow Jenny I am in awe of you - that is such an amazing analysis. It really helps me understand what I have gone through in my life. I also had an ISFJ mum so all of that process rang really true for me - I just wish I'd found this all out 20 or 25 years ago. I feel that I have ruined my full potential and don't have enough lifetime left to make it right. But I'm going to have a damn good try!

Thank you.
 

EditorOne

Prolific Member
Local time
Today 6:14 PM
Joined
Mar 24, 2008
Messages
2,695
---
Location
Northeastern Pennsylvania
It would be difficult to improve on what Jenny said. Very nice.
 

NoID10ts

aka Noddy
Local time
Today 5:14 PM
Joined
Jul 14, 2008
Messages
4,541
---
Location
Houston, TX
Very well said Jennywocky.

Over the past few years, I've felt like I am waking from an SJ induced nightmare and am now trying to figure out where to go from here.

My biological father is an INTP, but my step father is an ESFJ (:eek::eek::eek:) and he raised me since I was four. My Mom is an ISTJ and my wife is an ISFJ. I've spent my entire life trying to mold myself into being an SJ type of person, but the older I get, the more cracks seem to appear on the facade. I'm tired of pretending to be someone I'm not.
 

Jennywocky

Creepy Clown Chick
Local time
Today 6:14 PM
Joined
Sep 25, 2008
Messages
10,739
---
Location
Charn
Wow, thank you for the kudos, although I was hoping to read more about what everyone else had to say. :)

... I feel that I have ruined my full potential and don't have enough lifetime left to make it right. But I'm going to have a damn good try!

...that's all we get. There is always time to start on a new course, too; our lives are our lives, every second of it.

* * * *

I was just reading some Jung overview over lunch -- this time, regarding the Persona, which is the face we use to negotiate with external society. It is a compromise between the self we think we are / want to be and what the surrounding world wants us to be, the pragmatic functional facet of self. We can each have a few personas (although too many and we get confused, there is no obvious "singular self" and people start to realize we just wear masks).

In any case, I was thinking that if there is no persona that accurately reflects the Self (and to some degree the ego, which is the conscious parts of the self), then we erode as people and feel we do not really exist... the self is not being allowed permission to manifest and we are living a lie. The more divorced the Self is, the worse the pressure becomes... and either we die inside or the persona itself must die and be replaced.

MBTI type can play into this, since Ego generally can be expressed via primary + secondary, while shadow often gets projected on the Inferior. Forced function use that doesn't somehow accommodate the natural inclinations can result in unsuitable personas that cannot perpetually house the Self... and note how we are discussing the personas we are being forced to wear in the language of functions here, and other functions as being the oppressors of natural Self....
 

Da Blob

Banned
Local time
Today 5:14 PM
Joined
Dec 19, 2008
Messages
5,926
---
Location
Oklahoma
How old does somebody need to be to get away with stuff because they're old?

Just older than his or her peers...
a 16 year old can abuse anyone 14 and younger based on their vast experiences in the "adult" world

As far as the OP, I used to be INTJ before I graduated to the more mature INTP that you know and love....
 

Gorgrim

Active Member
Local time
Tomorrow 12:14 AM
Joined
Oct 8, 2008
Messages
256
---
Location
Denmark
I think intuition is great for science and worse for philosophy. I think that the functions are how people generally work. But much of science is practical in it's pursuits.

My feeling side I do not use much. And that's not neccesarily bad. Except for dealing with living in a society that holds value to feeling, femininity, and social values. Because, it's how society glues it's herd together into common values norms and goals.

Society needs to work practically on different areas to work, it needs practical scientists, it needs a large work force, etc. For that reason, even thinkers must be doing practical neccesities, to be part of the working society.

I wouldn't call actual functions but the individual or herd mentality works in accordance with many of the MBTI functions. It's a model for the aspects of the human mind ofcourse. The functions however, are rather arbitrary, the tendencies though, match well. Because human's that use their mind in one way will be very similar to another human using his mind the very same way. That's because the human enviroments are quite alike, and the brains, too. so on examination on two humans, with the same methods, we can see how similar they behave.

The problem is that inferior functions don't neccesarily develop like you think they do. The brain does not have a system in which each function has a turn to develop:

It's about maturing you and your emotions in general. it's about becoming more aware of reality, about thinking things through, becoming wiser, etc. All those can and inevitably will develop your functions as is known in MBTI - but they aren't actually concrete functions, theyre models that explain behavior. and as such, that behavior will also be explained by certain brain activity, but not that there is an actual thinking department, etc. as you could be led to believe by the MBTI model. It explains the effects of largely unknown causes, and when the effects are similar, we have a certain 'type of person'.


Jenny. Things you say are true, most people are forced to create other personas, or masks, especially for society. obviously. I dislike trying to be turned into a pragmatic person by 'pragmatic people', as one of those.

The singular self is basically the true self, without the ego conflicting on your identity, there is nothing trying to tell you how to act, or that you should define yourself a certain way etc. Since all these cause emotions; pride, shame etc and are part of the ego, the ego is those false masks. The thing is, the ego is quite strong, and lie to it's own mind.


thats why I don't think losing that precious ego, and sense of identity, or self is living a lie, merely that the ego wants to tell you that you should get back to your sense of identity because that's whats real. But it's imaginary.


Also, ones ego or sense of existence, identity, is not about being conscious. Most people aren't conscious about all the things that ego cause - emotions, like fear, for losing identity and dying, for example. Is about a sense of identity that really isn't anymore real than identifying yourself as a speck of dust.
 

Felan

Prolific Member
Local time
Today 5:14 PM
Joined
Apr 20, 2009
Messages
1,064
---
Location
Unauthorized personnel only
I came to know my type through Kiersey more than MBTI. Supposedly Kiersey INTPs are MBTI INTJs but I test strongly INTP in both. All of the function stuff doesn't show up in Kiersey's approach. I haven't devoted enough time to exploring the functions to really understand them. It does seem an unnecessary encumberance to me though.

I think the arena I've most developed in is empathy. I feel I'm pretty good up to a point. I'm not very comfortable holding someone, even their hand. I realize the power that simple touch can convey but still a part of me squirms at it. That bothers me about myself.

An example of how I know the power of touch, is I had a dentist once who seemingly had a rule. Either he or the nurse had to be touching the patient, in a non-sexual way, at all times. I first inferred this and asked about it and he confirmed it. The process of getting my teeth worked on, which I have had a lot of work done to them, was far more comfortable with that simple little thing. It can be so frustrating knowing how effective something is but just be unable to effectively use it for some inexplicable reason.
 

EditorOne

Prolific Member
Local time
Today 6:14 PM
Joined
Mar 24, 2008
Messages
2,695
---
Location
Northeastern Pennsylvania
"I I'm not very comfortable holding someone, even their hand."

Oddly this can go in another direction. I tended to overtrust anyone willing to touch me, because it's such a big deal for me to touch anyone else.

It's apparently one of those things you finally figure out when you can "get over yourself" in various ways and start working on the idea that other people put a different meaning and value on things like casual touching, etc.
 

Felan

Prolific Member
Local time
Today 5:14 PM
Joined
Apr 20, 2009
Messages
1,064
---
Location
Unauthorized personnel only
"I I'm not very comfortable holding someone, even their hand."

Oddly this can go in another direction. I tended to overtrust anyone willing to touch me, because it's such a big deal for me to touch anyone else.

It's apparently one of those things you finally figure out when you can "get over yourself" in various ways and start working on the idea that other people put a different meaning and value on things like casual touching, etc.

I would say that is an accurate description. I think I understand it conceptually but still at 37 myself gets in the way. If I may, how old were you when you got over on yourself.

I must confess what you said is rather unsettling for me. I've never actually had someone make an accurate insight of my nature that I didn't really understand already.
 

Jennywocky

Creepy Clown Chick
Local time
Today 6:14 PM
Joined
Sep 25, 2008
Messages
10,739
---
Location
Charn
I came to know my type through Kiersey more than MBTI. Supposedly Kiersey INTPs are MBTI INTJs ...

Wait a moment, this is not correct.
Kiersey INTPs = MBTI INTPs
Socionics INTjs = MBTI INTPs

Socionics is the weird one -- all the introverts have the opposite letter because they are gearing off the category of the Primary function, not the function that is extroverted (which for introverts is the Secondary).

... weird, of course, is relative.
(and sometimes relatives are weird.)

If it helps, although your question wasn't directed at me, I think I started figuring out in my mid-20's that people didn't mean what I thought they meant when they did things, or that their touching me or their commitments to me (or other things they said or did) were viewed by them differently than I was viewing them. It took a number of years to really recalibrate after that point.
 

Felan

Prolific Member
Local time
Today 5:14 PM
Joined
Apr 20, 2009
Messages
1,064
---
Location
Unauthorized personnel only
Wait a moment, this is not correct.
Kiersey INTPs = MBTI INTPs
Socionics INTjs = MBTI INTPs

Socionics is the weird one -- all the introverts have the opposite letter because they are gearing off the category of the Primary function, not the function that is extroverted (which for introverts is the Secondary).

... weird, of course, is relative.
(and sometimes relatives are weird.)

If it helps, although your question wasn't directed at me, I think I started figuring out in my mid-20's that people didn't mean what I thought they meant when they did things, or that their touching me or their commitments to me (or other things they said or did) were viewed by them differently than I was viewing them. It took a number of years to really recalibrate after that point.

The clarification on the kiersey -> mbti -> socionics is very much appreciated!

It does help. I'm 37. I guess I just hadn't really processed that my willingness to trust would influenced so greatly by my subconscious attributing greater importance to touch than in fact the person doing it intends. On reflection it fits. Maybe I'll get over myself soon. I have moments of epic density.
 

echoplex

Happen.
Local time
Today 6:14 PM
Joined
Jan 28, 2009
Messages
1,609
---
Location
From a dangerously safe distance
Personally I believe the goal of life (in terms of function development) is to become better-rounded... to be able to draw on various facets of yourself regardless of one's preference. I do not advocate working to make all your functions equal -- it's important to accept that you have strengths and weaknesses, and that your strengths are assets to be used, so trying to shore up all potential weaknesses is usually just pissing away energy for limited result than the bang you would get for your buck investing energy in your strengths -- but at the same time I believe that ignoring/shunning unpreferred functions actually undermines the preferred functions, while developing them to some degree makes your strengths stronger.
I agree. I think developing Fe can definitely help Ti and Ne work better. I often get alot of interesting (to me at least, heh) Ne-driven ideas but don't know how to express them to others in a way they can appreciate. I also find it hard to smooth over potentially offensive thoughts. I often get the sense that I'm surrounded by overly sensitive people whom I can't simply just speak my mind around freely. I imagine that more confidence with Fe would help me to feel that I can deal with negative (over)reactions of others. So far I've usually just held back.

And thanks for the lenghty response, it was very illuminating. Especially the part about social convention vs. true self. I think we can all relate to that.

As far as the OP, I used to be INTJ before I graduated to the more mature INTP that you know and love....
Nice to see you posting again, Blob. :)

I sometimes feel that my type has changed over the years, although that may reflect simply not knowing myself well enough. I was very ISTJ as a young child, then more of an INTJ as a teen, and now I'm pretty confident I'm INTP. I sometimes feel that I will become an INFP next. :eek:

thats why I don't think losing that precious ego, and sense of identity, or self is living a lie, merely that the ego wants to tell you that you should get back to your sense of identity because that's whats real. But it's imaginary.
Totally. I wonder too if losing that ego can help us develop weaker functions. I think MBTI can often, if intepreted in a limited way, cause us to identify ourselves by the (supposed) strict confines of type. We may indentify ourselves as "unemotional" or "procrastinating" and attach our sense of self to those concepts, thus preventing any attempt at growth. If we let go, we may find that we can be quite emotional or reponsible (or whatever else) if we really want to be.

Of course, we shouldn't force it as Jenny said. But we also shouldn't suppress the natural evolution of our personality.

I think the arena I've most developed in is empathy. I feel I'm pretty good up to a point. I'm not very comfortable holding someone, even their hand. I realize the power that simple touch can convey but still a part of me squirms at it. That bothers me about myself.
I'm this way too. I especially don't like being touched when I don't expect it. Even if it's just someone accidentally brushing up on me, it tends to feel almost like an affront. Touch can also feel good though, I just like it better when I know it's coming. I'd rather hug someone than they hug me, basically.
 

Beat Mango

Prolific Member
Local time
Tomorrow 10:14 AM
Joined
Mar 25, 2009
Messages
1,499
---
This happened for me around my late 30's. I began to actively seek out more people on the 'fringe' of society than merely hanging around with groups which were slightly off the norm. This was also a time of reflection on the meandering directionless course I had taken since leaving my childhood home at sixteen. I seriously began to ask myself what I wanted for my life and what I believed in. Much of what I had experienced from the ages of 16 to around 22/23 came to the forefront of my thoughts, especially concerning the experiences I encountered and the knowledge I had gained from them but had filed away in favour of just living a middle-class lifestyle. I was married, had a good government job and a few occasional friends, but the 'aloneness' began to resurface.

How did you go about this? Where did you find such people?
 

EloquentBohemian

MysticDragon
Local time
Today 6:14 PM
Joined
Oct 4, 2008
Messages
1,386
---
Location
Ottawa, Canada
How did you go about this? Where did you find such people?
It depends on what kind of fringe people you're looking for. Artists, writers and musicians. I hit smaller clubs which would feature eccentric muscians where I would play some music myself (I used to play guitar and write alot). I went to poetry readings where I read my own writing, usually at some cafe or small club close to a university. You get to meet other writers. Small art galleries and artist co-ops. Small independent bookstores, also, where you can find locally published chapbooks and usually the store-owner or someone who works there writes or knows local writers, as well. Those people who think way outside the boxes exist, you just have to look hard to find them. They're usually not obvious.
 
Top Bottom