Lazy INTP bum

[Helvete]

Evening all,

I'm from the UK.
I'm 19, been in and out of work after coming out of school and college with absolutely nothing worth noting (I ended up dropping out from a music course)
I've been working in a kitchen training to be a chef most recently. Which I'v thoroughly enjoyed so far. It's new, I'm learning how to cook a lot of different foods (It was all fresh food so everything was made and prepared on the premises).

Unfortunately my boss didn't pay me... So I left and am taking him to court(obviously)

So now I'm at a bit of a whim as to what to do. I'm still considering whether to try it again, but my only concern is once I learn enough in wherever I am will I just get bored and leave (like I'v done with everything else so far).
Bearing in mind I don't really have much to back me up education wise.
My uncle (a physicist) has suggested I get into science, if I did this then I would want to try and work with physics if possible. He thinks I could easily become a technician or something pretty easily and from there I could learn enough to get into the field without going back into education.
I am quite interested in free energy and other sustainable energy sources.

So any thoughts or suggestions would be much appreciated.

 

[Etheri]

I don't think you can 'truly' get into science without going back to education. I do think you could certainly get into technical jobs, technician, mechanic, electrician, ... without (too much) education. As far as i'm aware, these jobs are suprisingly well-paid in most of western europe.

I don't think any of us can tell you what to do, how would we deduce such a thing from half a page of text? You should honestly just aim for what you find interesting, within your capabilities.

You state you're quite interested in physics and sustainable energy; perhaps read up on energy efficiency and power generation methods (and their benefits / disadvantages) and see if you can get a job in that sector? I don't know how easy it'll be getting a job without any credentials, and I don't know howmuch you know on the subject.

Ps. What's free energy? (I only know the term as helmholtz / gibbs free energy, but that doesn't have too much to do with sustainable energy)

 

[Vrecknidj]

Thoughts/suggestions...

1) You enjoyed cooking. By itself, that's very important, frankly. It's easy enough for me to go for months without experiencing anything like enjoyment; I don't know about other INTPs, but, finding something that's actually enjoyable is itself a good thing.

2) You already have some training in the skills necessary for being a chef.

3) It's quite common for INTPs to find all sorts of trouble with employment -- for many, it's because they don't know what to do, or they don't have any practical skills. Being able to cook well is a very employable skill.

If I were in a similar situation, I'd probably find another employer and continue my training.

Also, have you seen this? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiro_Dreams_of_Sushi

 

[Helvete]

I don't think you can 'truly' get into science without going back to education. I do think you could certainly get into technical jobs, technician, mechanic, electrician, ... without (too much) education. As far as i'm aware, these jobs are suprisingly well-paid in most of western europe.


I don't think any of us can tell you what to do, how would we deduce such a thing from half a page of text? You should honestly just aim for what you find interesting, within your capabilities.

You state you're quite interested in physics and sustainable energy; perhaps read up on energy efficiency and power generation methods (and their benefits / disadvantages) and see if you can get a job in that sector? I don't know how easy it'll be getting a job without any credentials, and I don't know howmuch you know on the subject.

Ps. What's free energy? (I only know the term as helmholtz / gibbs free energy, but that doesn't have too much to do with sustainable energy)

I think I agree with this I'v been finding this more interesting than anything else lately. I mean it's something that I think is achievable, interesting enough to keep me stimulated and if it winds up that it doesn't work out, what have I really lost?
There's a science park not too far from where I am that houses a few different science businesses that I can try. One works with hydrogen energy which would be a good place to start I think.

Also here's a clip from the film Thrive that just gives a bit of an overview of free energy. The whole films definitely worth a watch if you have the time. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2Abuj53Y6E

Thoughts/suggestions...

1) You enjoyed cooking. By itself, that's very important, frankly. It's easy enough for me to go for months without experiencing anything like enjoyment; I don't know about other INTPs, but, finding something that's actually enjoyable is itself a good thing.

2) You already have some training in the skills necessary for being a chef.

3) It's quite common for INTPs to find all sorts of trouble with employment -- for many, it's because they don't know what to do, or they don't have any practical skills. Being able to cook well is a very employable skill.

If I were in a similar situation, I'd probably find another employer and continue my training.

Also, have you seen this? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiro_Dreams_of_Sushi

1) Are you saying you can bear not finding the enjoyment in work and that for you generally it's good to be able to find the enjoyment?

2) Yes, and I definitely don't intend to close this door!

3) I started cheffing on a complete whim after leaving college and enjoyed it. Before then I literally had no clue what I wanted to do.

I think I'll try the science route - maybe employment surf as much as possible right now and see if I can catch something that I'll really find enjoyable that I'll stick at!

And no I haven't seen it. It looks interesting though so I'll give it a watch.

 

[Etheri]

There's a science park not too far from where I am that houses a few different science businesses that I can try. One works with hydrogen energy which would be a good place to start I think.

Also here's a clip from the film Thrive that just gives a bit of an overview of free energy. The whole films definitely worth a watch if you have the time. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2Abuj53Y6E

I'm sorry, but as far as I'm aware the majority of this video is complete garbage, bullshit, fiction. Zero point energy exists, it is the quantummechanic lowest energy level, which isn't always zero. This is unique to quantummechanics. However, as far as I'm aware nobody has ever been able to use this energy for anything. Also, it's usually very, very small amounts of energy. In fact, the video keeps talking about 'free, unlimited energy', yet one of the fundamental laws of science is that energy is always conserved, and can change forms but never is created nor destroyed. Free energy is an illusion.

Hydrogen is rather interesting and real, but it's a form of fuel and mostly interesting as an energy carrier, rather than in terms of energy production. (We'd need a source of hydrogen for energy production from hydrogen.) Nuclear fusion would be a great possibility for energy production, but as far as i'm aware there are no reactors capable of making the fusion energy efficient at this point.

I'll be honest, but I do think you atleast need to know the basic concepts before you can truly apply, whether it's mechanical work or scientific research, you'll need to know what you're doing. There's a vast amount of resources on the internet, whatever you're interested in, read up on it. In the meanwhile, just find whatever job suits you best? (Truth be told, for a job in science you're likely to have to go to school, if only for a while.)

 

[Helvete]

I'm sorry, but as far as I'm aware the majority of this video is complete garbage, bullshit, fiction. Zero point energy exists, it is the quantummechanic lowest energy level, which isn't always zero. This is unique to quantummechanics. However, as far as I'm aware nobody has ever been able to use this energy for anything. Also, it's usually very, very small amounts of energy. In fact, the video keeps talking about 'free, unlimited energy', yet one of the fundamental laws of science is that energy is always conserved, and can change forms but never is created nor destroyed. Free energy is an illusion.

Hydrogen is rather interesting and real, but it's a form of fuel and mostly interesting as an energy carrier, rather than in terms of energy production. (We'd need a source of hydrogen for energy production from hydrogen.) Nuclear fusion would be a great possibility for energy production, but as far as i'm aware there are no reactors capable of making the fusion energy efficient at this point.

I'll be honest, but I do think you atleast need to know the basic concepts before you can truly apply, whether it's mechanical work or scientific research, you'll need to know what you're doing. There's a vast amount of resources on the internet, whatever you're interested in, read up on it. In the meanwhile, just find whatever job suits you best? (Truth be told, for a job in science you're likely to have to go to school, if only for a while.)

With the link I'm aware that the ideas are pretty over simplified and probably not completely accurate, but I think they do hold some value. Like there's a hell of a lot of other information and theories on this subject but this is one of broadest examples I could think of. Obviously my knowledge is pretty limited in this area at the moment and I'll have to read a lot. Hutchison demonstrates using it here and shows some pretty interesting stuff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vO-1l0lXR_U

I think the free energy thing is real, it obviously needs a hell of a lot more research done especially with how to harness the energy but I think it's pretty interesting that all the scientists who've tried to research it over time have been suppressed in some way.
I don't expect to just be able to just jump in here or even with all the basic understanding I'll need to be able to find work in this field. But it's something I want to find out as much as possible regardless.

I'm not really trying to argue or persuade you that exists. I just think there's enough to validate further research into this area.

In the meantime once I look into all the basic concepts with the hydrogen energy and other forms of sustainable energy I'd like to give a good stab in that direction.
I think for me it would be a very good place to start, if after I do all the necessary research it is a plausible option.
Obviously I'm going to have to educate myself some way or another, whether that means going back into education or not right now I'm unsure of. But I'v got till September to find out and do as much in that time as possible.

 

[Ex-User (5841)]

Let's play a game.

How can one make kitchen energetics more efficient?

 

[Hawkeye]

Let's play a game.

How can one make kitchen energetics more efficient?

By referring the box of MB's 1967 Battleship board game to the wife and daughter? ^^

Spoiler

 

[Helvete]

Let's play a game.

How can one make kitchen energetics more efficient?

Define Kitchen energetics?
This wouldn't go amiss though!
Sound energy is something else that needs addressing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JrpdVZyt_s

 

[Kuu]

There is no such thing as free energy. Unless you're very good at scamming people, I'd suggest you stick to the chef path.

 

[The Void]

Become a monk and train your mind to combat boredom and attain mental perfection.

 

[Valentas]

Here is an idea: build a solar panels network on the Moon and beam energy back to Earth using microwaves. Idk about side effects though. The amount of energy transmitted would be enormous. That would be fun.

Edit: Wow, Japanese are already doing that: http://gizmodo.com/japan-wants-to-ring-the-moon-with-solar-panels-to-power-1474946201

Okay...

 

[Goku]

poker is the best job in the world if you can win consistently. I'm still trying to figure that part out.

 

[Hawkeye]

poker is the best job in the world if you can win consistently. I'm still trying to figure that part out.

Roulette worked for me for a while until I lost it all due to greed...

However, I noticed I had £10.50 in my account this morning and so I placed it all on number 8.

I walked away from the table with £378.

 

[Helvete]

There is no such thing as free energy. Unless you're very good at scamming people, I'd suggest you stick to the chef path.

I'll need to see this disproved I think before I'm properly convinced.

Become a monk and train your mind to combat boredom and attain mental perfection.

Aha definitely something to think about

poker is the best job in the world if you can win consistently. I'm still trying to figure that part out.

I'd love to do this also. Unfortunately I don't have the funds to risk practising the time it would take me to profit consistently. If that makes sense?

 

[Pikachu]

It's not that easy to go for science, it's not as simple as all of the videos that you've watched. You need to attend boring classes, do homework, pass exams, etc. If you have no passion for that, I'm afraid you won't finish your study.

You should take hospitality as your major, you probably can be a famous chef in the future.

 

[Helvete]

It's not that easy to go for science, it's not as simple as all of the videos that you've watched. You need to attend boring classes, do homework, pass exams, etc. If you have no passion for that, I'm afraid you won't finish your study.

You should take hospitality as your major, you probably can be a famous chef in the future.

Thanks. Clearly it's the theory isn't really explained, but I find the concepts plausible. Which is why it interests me so much, and why these things aren't being used widespread.
I still want to try the science route despite that you and a few others have suggested otherwise. This isn't because I'm ignorant, I understand the views and points being made. It's just I do think I have a chance to get a job and potentially get into the field that way rather than going through more education. As my uncle seems to think I can, and I'v seen my brother and cousin do the same thing (although they didn't stay in science due to other interests).
So my line of thinking is that I can give this a go, then if it does fail or it's not what I'm looking for I can go back to cheffing.

 

[Goku]

I'll need to see this disproved I think before I'm properly convinced.



Aha definitely something to think about



I'd love to do this also. Unfortunately I don't have the funds to risk practising the time it would take me to profit consistently. If that makes sense?

Makes sense. I'm still hemmorhaging money learning the game.

 

[Pikachu]

As my uncle seems to think I can, and I'v seen my brother and cousin do the same thing (although they didn't stay in science due to other interests).
So my line of thinking is that I can give this a go, then if it does fail or it's not what I'm looking for I can go back to cheffing.

I'm the youngest in my family, I've 2 older brothers.
The oldest is actually bright, but he was never into school.
He went to the best college in my country and studied Mathematics, but he had never finished it. However, he got a job in a multinational oil company as programmer and makes lots of money ever since.

Being smart in science doesn't mean you'll be bright in school. There are 2 options: finish school and get a good job easily or never attend school but you need to be real bright in order to get a good job.

You should know your own capability, you need to spend at least 3-4 years in college. It would only wasting your time if you don't finish it.

And, never compare yourself to others even it's your own cousins.
It would be kinda frustrating if you can't be like them.

 

[Helvete]

Makes sense. I'm still hemmorhaging money learning the game.

If you don't mind me asking, what would you say your win/loss ratio is?

I'm the youngest in my family, I've 2 older brothers.
The oldest is actually bright, but he was never into school.
He went to the best college in my country and studied Mathematics, but he had never finished it. However, he got a job in a multinational oil company as programmer and makes lots of money ever since.

Being smart in science doesn't mean you'll be bright in school. There are 2 options: finish school and get a good job easily or never attend school but you need to be real bright in order to get a good job.

You should know your own capability, you need to spend at least 3-4 years in college. It would only wasting your time if you don't finish it.

And, never compare yourself to others even it's your own cousins.
It would be kinda frustrating if you can't be like them.

This makes sense, but I'm frustrated with the situation I'm in now. At a guess I would say my brother is ENTJ and my cousin INTX so we all share similar traits.
All I'm saying is; there's good reason I should be able to accomplish this. I don't really get worked up or nervous in new situations or in interviews and the thought of failure doesn't really bother me right now. It's almost like a good opportunity to test my limits to see what I can really achieve.

 

[Goku]

If you don't mind me asking, what would you say your win/loss ratio is?

[...]

For me, it's more honest to look at how many big blinds I'm winning per hour at a certain limit, over hundreds of hours played.

I think that once you can beat a game for 10 big blinds per hour, on average, you could be ready to move up another level.

I felt like I was dominating the $200 n/l game, with $3/$5 blinds; I was playing about 20-25 hours per week, for 4 weeks straight. It seemed that the most I could beat that game for is 10 big blinds per hour; I think this is especially true for the lower limit cash games, where the dealer rake represents something like 30bb per hour, lol, it is difficult to beat the game with such a high rake regardless of your skill level.

I only recently moved up to the $500 game with $5/$5 blinds, and I lost both sessions. It's been a tough game of patience for me, because when I lose, it takes me about a month to save up another $500 that I can afford to blow.

In the past, I might have just played the $200 game and parlayed it into the $500 game... but, I feel like that's taking a step back. I'm just going to man up and play in the game I feel like I should be playing in.

 

[Etheri]

I'll need to see this disproved I think before I'm properly convinced.

How could we disprove it when you don't have the slightest clue what it is? How can you be convinced of something you absolutely do not understand?

Thanks. Clearly it's the theory isn't really explained, but I find the concepts plausible. Which is why it interests me so much, and why these things aren't being used widespread.

These things aren't used widespread because they're not possible.

For the sake of it :

In quantum mechanics, bound systems usually have discrete energy levels. This means these systems always have a specific amount of energy that coincides with it's level, and it cannot have the energy between two levels.

There's also heisenberg's uncertainty principle, which states that the possition and the momentum (velocity) cannot both be known to perfect precision. There's always an error.

In classic mechanics, systems could have any amount of energy. A system in rest will have perfectly located non-moving particles, and the total system will have no energy. Notice how both location and momentum are perfectly pinpointed!

As stated earlier, in QM this is no longer the case. One of the weird things, is that the lowest energy state that is possible is no longer 0. QM states that the 'ground state' (lowest energy state) even for a system at absolute zero temperature (T=0K), but that there is always a certain amount of rest energy. This rest energy is required to forfill heisenberg's principle : there's still an uncertainty.

Now you're saying that there's this 'limitless energy source', because even when systems are in their absolutely lowest energy state, they still have a small amount of energy left in them (which you cannot extract!). First of, we can't even get any system to the ground state / zero point energy. We cannot reach 0K, we cannot reach absolute vacuum. Secondly, we can't extract the energy. Thirdly, there's more energy in ... you know, normal systems that we find on this planet.

If it were possible to reduce the energy from a system in it's ground state, either energy can be created (which goes in against one of the oldest thermodynamic laws) or the system can have an energy which isn't a quantum state (which goes in against the fundamentals of QM). I'd say it's rather unlikely. Also, assuming it were possible, unless it's #1 (energy can be freely created), there's not much energy to collect. There's more energy in a system at room temperature.

>Which is why it interests me so much, and why these things aren't being used widespread.

They're not being used, because it's not possible, and even if it was it still wouldn't be a good source of energy. What you're saying is essentially : 'I wonder why we're not extracting energy from captured alien space ship fuels. It interests me that this isn't widespread'

 

[Helvete]

For me, it's more honest to look at how many big blinds I'm winning per hour at a certain limit, over hundreds of hours played.

I think I should of asked this on my other thread I'll reply later

 

[Helvete]

How could we disprove it when you don't have the slightest clue what it is? How can you be convinced of something you absolutely do not understand?


These things aren't used widespread because they're not possible.

For the sake of it :

In quantum mechanics, bound systems usually have discrete energy levels. This means these systems always have a specific amount of energy that coincides with it's level, and it cannot have the energy between two levels.

There's also heisenberg's uncertainty principle, which states that the possition and the momentum (velocity) cannot both be known to perfect precision. There's always an error.

In classic mechanics, systems could have any amount of energy. A system in rest will have perfectly located non-moving particles, and the total system will have no energy. Notice how both location and momentum are perfectly pinpointed!

As stated earlier, in QM this is no longer the case. One of the weird things, is that the lowest energy state that is possible is no longer 0. QM states that the 'ground state' (lowest energy state) even for a system at absolute zero temperature (T=0K), but that there is always a certain amount of rest energy. This rest energy is required to forfill heisenberg's principle : there's still an uncertainty.

Now you're saying that there's this 'limitless energy source', because even when systems are in their absolutely lowest energy state, they still have a small amount of energy left in them (which you cannot extract!). First of, we can't even get any system to the ground state / zero point energy. We cannot reach 0K, we cannot reach absolute vacuum. Secondly, we can't extract the energy. Thirdly, there's more energy in ... you know, normal systems that we find on this planet.

If it were possible to reduce the energy from a system in it's ground state, either energy can be created (which goes in against one of the oldest thermodynamic laws) or the system can have an energy which isn't a quantum state (which goes in against the fundamentals of QM). I'd say it's rather unlikely. Also, assuming it were possible, unless it's #1 (energy can be freely created), there's not much energy to collect. There's more energy in a system at room temperature.

>Which is why it interests me so much, and why these things aren't being used widespread.

They're not being used, because it's not possible, and even if it was it still wouldn't be a good source of energy. What you're saying is essentially : 'I wonder why we're not extracting energy from captured alien space ship fuels. It interests me that this isn't widespread'

Ok, thanks for explaining this. can you recommend some good places to research these theories?

But please don't twist my words. I said that based on the limited knowledge I have on the subject. I'm just saying that I think it's something that should be researched.
On a side note: Hypothetically if we had captured alien space craft, then the engines could be reverse engineered to find out how they work.

 

[pjoa09]

Evening all,

I'm from the UK.
I'm 19, been in and out of work after coming out of school and college with absolutely nothing worth noting (I ended up dropping out from a music course)
I've been working in a kitchen training to be a chef most recently. Which I'v thoroughly enjoyed so far. It's new, I'm learning how to cook a lot of different foods (It was all fresh food so everything was made and prepared on the premises).

Unfortunately my boss didn't pay me... So I left and am taking him to court(obviously)

So now I'm at a bit of a whim as to what to do. I'm still considering whether to try it again, but my only concern is once I learn enough in wherever I am will I just get bored and leave (like I'v done with everything else so far).
Bearing in mind I don't really have much to back me up education wise.
My uncle (a physicist) has suggested I get into science, if I did this then I would want to try and work with physics if possible. He thinks I could easily become a technician or something pretty easily and from there I could learn enough to get into the field without going back into education.
I am quite interested in free energy and other sustainable energy sources.

So any thoughts or suggestions would be much appreciated.

I think stick with cooking for now. I think anything that isn't a marketable skill puts you into marketing. INTPs generally find it really fucking hard to find something to stick with. If it didn't cause you immense stress then its probably worth it. My previous job used to make me have panic attacks.

 

[NSINTP]

@Helvete
If you are interested in "free energy" as I am, mind you this is merely a side note which is not meant to put you on a job path (or perhaps it will), might I suggest looking into Josepewman's energy machine. According to Newman, the magnetic field is composed of "gyroscopic" particles comprising all matter (aether vortex model consistent), and that a small coil of wire with x resistance generates a less intense B field than a coil with the same resistance requiring a larger diameter and greater mass (length), while demanding the same power input. Accordingly the collapse of the greater B field generates a more intense electric field claims Newman. I have noticed a few parallels in claims for Newman's device and those effects in my own experimentations with John Bedini's SSG motor, however I have yet to build a Newman motor to test these claims as I do not have the funds.

 

[Helvete]

Hi NSINTP, thanks for the info.
I'll look into it tomorrow when I get time

 

[Halcyform]

Are you interested in science/technology?

True to form I never developed a true calling. I stumbled into a path based on my broad knowledge base.

Try cooking first and if that doesn't work then you can always try power generation. Power generation is an incredibly broad field that will expose you to many disciplines. If you work in a power plant (doesn't matter what the fuel is), in order to be an effective operator you would need knowledge in chemistry, thermodynamics, physics, electrical and mechanical theory, personnel management (if you want to be supervisor), computer skills (both administrative and programming logic) and many others.

I've always leaned towards computer sciences, but I was a nuclear operator in the military before I made the transition to civilian life. I couldn't ultimately decide what I wanted to do so I continued with power generation so I wouldn't get bored due to wide range of things I could occupy my mind with. If I got bored studying mechanical theory, I could study electrical. If I got bored with electrical, I'd study chemistry, etc.

Apologies for the possible necro post, but I ran across this forums while doing further study on INTP profile. It seems that we can end up being immature about what we want out of life in terms accomplishment/achievement/status.

Long ago, I came to the realization that (in practical and logical terms) that if you have no clue what you want to do, it's best to pick something you "can" do. Once you pick that something, specialize and become good at it. With that footing you can achieve some measure of comfort and wealth then explore your options while still having your current "something" to fall back on. It's not the ideal scenario but, sadly, it's not an ideal world.

If you were curious, I chose electrical engineering. I chose to specialize in power generation and power quality. They are broad specializations, but I've been doing this for awhile now.

 

[HAL9000]

Long ago, I came to the realization that (in practical and logical terms) that if you have no clue what you want to do, it's best to pick something you "can" do.

Totally agree with this. I chose to study maths, quite literally because I read a bit deeper into the INTP profile and learned I was meant to be good at it. It turns out I am good at it and am now doing a degree in theoretical physics and love it!

I think INTPs just take longer to find their path in life. OP is 19 years old. When I was 19 a large portion of my friends were at university, while I was out skateboarding, getting drunk and even spent a year of my life taking copious amounts of drugs on weekends away from work. Whereas now my old friends are all bored and aimless, while my life is going in a great direction and everything is working out fantastically.

 

[walfin]

I'm not sure whether you're versed in the laws of thermodynamics and the history of failure of perpetual motion machines.

It may be good to go to school and get a degree in a science discipline before starting a career in research. That said, to my understanding a PhD is required to get an interesting research job, and it may not even guarantee that.

If you enjoyed cooking, maybe you can consider finding another employer. They may not be all bad. If you're interested in both food and science, you could also consider a job in food science.