INTP AND A.D.D. ?

[g0dc0mplex]

I hope my title is correct in putting the question mark a space after the period in the end. I am so grateful to have found this site, although I am worried it might have potential for addiction (though I am usually perfectly fine with that risk). It feels amazing to laugh out loud as many times as I have WITH others for once, as opposed to usually laughing AT others (secretly) in wonder and amusement. I know how that sounds but I feel safe to admit that here...Maybe...I have spent several hours reading threads and posts and I apologize if this topic has already been covered in another thread.
Is there a correlation between INTP results and A.D.D. ? (There's that damn question mark issue again!) Many posts sound exactly like how textbooks describe the symptoms of A.D.D. I am sure many (myself included) have been misdiagnosed with A.D.D. when really the psychiatrist just doesn't see/relate to the INTP type as well as he/she should. I only took one psychology class in college and most of the time I found myself staring at the pictures (not because they were interesting, but instead, wondering how they could get printer toner to bond so well to the surface of slick paper without smearing). Yes I majored in Computer Science (and yes I've been told I use too many long sentences and WAY too many parentheses). If science were to discover a cure for A.D.D., (I hope not, I love my medication too much), would INTPs test differently while on the medication, and then flip back to INTP while off of it? That is assuming we all remember to take it....

 

[g0dc0mplex]

I'm sorry for the double post, especially on my first thread!

 

[EyeSeeCold]

Yea I guess we could be diagnosed with ADHD-PI. Always starting new projects, but never completing or publishing them. However we are able to concentrate on an issue for an incredible amount of time until the problem is uncovered. So you really have to take more into consideration. ESFPs and ESTPs are more likely to have classic ADHD though.

 

[Claverhouse]

I hope my title is correct in putting the question mark a space after the period in the end.

You are entirely correct. Good spacing, as in spaces around punctuation marks & double-spacing after full stops, is vital for all educated people who understand style and excellence.

[ French Spacing maintains the first, but not the second; whereas English Spacing maintains the second but not the first. Only both are acceptable: then again bloody php eliminates double-spacing anyway, but I still do it out of principle. ]

I'm sorry for the double post, especially on my first thread!

No problem. ( Except that you used the hideous closed space before the exclamation mark in your apology. )




Claverhouse

 

[g0dc0mplex]

Thank you Ragnar. I usually prefer closed spaces and adding comments that are totally out of context. I'm glad to have found a home here. Nice use of parentheses by the way!

 

[SpaceYeti]

I'm been diagnosed with ADD. Is there a correlation?

 

[snafupants]

What sort of medication are you taking g0dc0mplex? Where do you think your ADD stems from? By calling it ADD and not ADHD, I assume you just have the inattentive ilk of the disorder...

 

[g0dc0mplex]

I currently take Adderall, 30mg, three times a day. I have researched typical dosages for adults and discovered the amount I take is relatively high. Ever since my initial diagnosis over five years ago, I have had a few different doctors since then who did not hesitate to continue that dose. None of them have ever questioned my condition either, which is odd since Adderall is typically not something doctors feel comfortable prescribing, even with a prior history, without at least a few questions. It is as if I have a blinking light above my head that says A.D.D. Is my quiet evaluation of all the details I see, mixed with the random absent mindedness of what I consider just boring present stimuli A.D.D. or just a part of being an INTP? I am very much an INTP and relate so well to so many posts I have read here. I joined only yesterday, yet I've been glued to my computer for hours since...

 

[bloozie]

I think that they officially call it ADHD instead of ADD now.
As for mbti and diagnosis, I would expect any type is especially susceptible to have ADHD... I would guess it would be seen more in perceiving types though.
As with medication, I would disagree with taking medication because I think having ADHD would be a positive thing... it's just that the person with it would have to apply it toward something that would help them excel in their environment.

 

[g0dc0mplex]

Interesting point about the lack of distinction between ADD and ADHD. I most certainly do not have the ADHD hyperactivity disorder as I never fidget and can sit for many hours without hardly moving a muscle. I know a girl that I can hardly communicate with at all (which is too bad because she is very interesting) because she cannot sit still or stop fiddling with something in hands the entire time she is talking. Talking to her and watching that gives ME nervous energy to the point that I can only handle her in small amounts. She has been diagnosed with ADHD and also takes Adderall. I absolutely agree with you about the ADD being a positive thing, although the medication can SERIOUSLY EXAGGERATE the problems we also face already as an INTP type. Sometimes it thickens the great detail fog I fight with to be in the "here and now" as they say, and I find myself shifting from task to task faster but less productively and getting basically nothing finished in the end. Other times, it makes me so goal driven and focused that I will work for hours into the night (even later than usual) to accomplish one particular thing that is not all that important that I would usually just procrastinate on for a long time. I have noticed that not taking it for consecutive days usually leads to oatmeal mixed with orange juice with a glass of milk on the side, and missing sunglasses that "magically" reappear on my face. Much like what I read on the top "You know you're an INTP when..." thread. Just a curiousity.

 

[SpaceYeti]

I think that they officially call it ADHD instead of ADD now.
As for mbti and diagnosis, I would expect any type is especially susceptible to have ADHD... I would guess it would be seen more in perceiving types though.
As with medication, I would disagree with taking medication because I think having ADHD would be a positive thing... it's just that the person with it would have to apply it toward something that would help them excel in their environment.

No, ADD is basically just like ADD, but without the H (hyperactivity). They're the same basic thing, but in one you're hyperactive, and in the other you're not.

 

[Ska]

I think it's more of a P vs. J thing.

the “P” right brain is the subconscious hemisphere; it is has greater difficulty paying attention. This explains why the vast majority of persons diagnosed with ADD are right-brained dominant Ps. The right-brained “P” is process-oriented rather than time/clock driven.

http://personalitycafe.com/myers-briggs-forum/9648-types-brain-pseudo-science-behind-mbti.html?

 

[SpaceYeti]

Geeze, that sounds gay. I'm glad I realized I didn't have to fit into those norms when I was, like, 8.

 

[LabyrinthMind]

Geeze, that sounds gay. I'm glad I realized I didn't have to fit into those norms when I was, like, 8.

I'm glad for you.

Too bad your early acquired knowledge of self and social norms wasn't more helpful regarding your mental health.

 

[420MuNkEy]

I got myself diagnosed with ADHD 4 or 5 years ago in an effort to find an elusive substance that would negate my natural reaction to being legally compelled to spend the majority of my childhood in an institution claiming to have a monopoly on all the information necessary for life (ie, school). The substance that seemed to achieve this, was Adderall.

Here's the official definition of ADD/ADHD from the DSM-IV-TR (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders) published by the American Psychiatric Association. This is the one that's currently being used.

[FONT=Arial][SIZE=2][B]Attention-Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder[/B]
A. Either (1) or (2):
    (1) six (or more) of the following symptoms of [B]inattention[/B] have persisted for at least 6 months to a degree that is maladaptive and inconsistent with developmental level:
        [B]Inattention[/B]
        (a) often fails to give close attention to details or makes careless mistakes in schoolwork, work, or other activities
        (b) often has difficulty sustaining attention in tasks or play activities
        (c) often does not seem to listen when spoken to directly
        (d) often does not follow through on instructions and fails to finish schoolwork, chores, or duties in the workplace (not due to oppositional behavior or failure to understand instructions)
        (e) often has difficulty organizing tasks and activities
        (f) often avoids, dislikes, or is reluctant to engage in tasks that require sustained mental effort (such as schoolwork or homework)
        (g) often loses things necessary for tasks or activities (e.g., toys, school assignments, pencils, books, or tools)
        (h) is often easily distracted by extraneous stimuli
        (i) is often forgetful in daily activities
    (2) six (or more) of the following symptoms of [B]hyperactivity/impulsivity[/B] have persisted for at least 6 months to a degree that is maladaptive and inconsistent with developmental level:
        [B]Hyperactivity[/B]
        (a) often fidgets with hands or feet or squirms in seat
        (b) often leaves seat in classroom or in other situations in which remaining seated is expected
        (c) often runs about or climbs excessively in situations in which it is inappropriate (in adolescents or adults, may be limited to subjective feelings of restlessness)
        (d) often has difficulty playing or engaging in leisure activities quietly
        (e) is often “on the go” or often acts as if “driven by a motor”
        (f) often talks excessively
        [B]Impulsivity[/B]
        (g) often blurts out answers before questions have been completed
        (h) often has difficulty awaiting turn
        (i) often interrupts or intrudes on others (e.g., butts into conversations or games)
B. Some hyperactive-impulsive or inattentive symptoms that caused impairment were present before age 7 years.
C. Some impairment from the symptoms is present in two or more settings (e.g., at school [or work] and at home).
D. There must be clear evidence of clinically significant impairment in social, academic, or occupational functioning.
E. The symptoms do not occur exclusively during the course of a Pervasive Developmental Disorder, Schizophrenia, or other Psychotic Disorder and are not better accounted for by another mental disorder (e.g., Mood Disorder, Anxiety Disorder, Dissociative Disorder, or a Personality Disorder).

[I]Code[/I] based on type:

[B]314.01 Attention-Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder, Combined Type:[/B] if both Criteria A1 and A2 are met for the past 6 months

[B]314.00 Attention-Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder, Predominantly Inattentive Type:[/B] if Criterion A1 is met but Criterion A2 is not met for the past 6 months

[B]314.01 Attention-Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder, Predominantly Hyperactive-Impulsive Type:[/B] if Criterion A2 is met but Criterion A1 is not met for the past 6 months

[B]Coding note:[/B] For individuals (especially adolescents and adults) who currently have symptoms that no longer meet full criteria, “In Partial Remission” should be specified.
[/SIZE][/FONT]

It's quite apparent after reading it, that this it is essentially nothing but a list of behaviors that an instructor in a classroom would be irritated by. There is nothing inherently wrong with most of these behaviors, they just aren't ideal in most classroom settings. If slight deviation (and lets face it, it is only slight) from social normality is suppressed like this, how can we expect to grow as a society?

I'm not trying to say it's bad to take substances that produce desired effects, just so long as those effects are desired by you.

 

[pjoa09]

lol, id finish the work, forget my name and the date and put it in my folder, then when its being handed back go ...

OH SHIT!

 

[Ermine]

Hmm. I don't have ADD/ADHD in the slightest, though I do tend to relate well to those who supposedly have that condition. I have a way of channeling their energy in a positive way, or at least I did with a couple good ADD friends I had.

 

[Riiscup]

Although never diagnosed with ADD, I do believe I have ADD. Even after discovering I am INTP, I still think I have ADD. I have thought about trying to get diagnosed just to get the meds to see if they would help, but have decided against it so far.

 

[typus]

Although never diagnosed with ADD, I do believe I have ADD. Even after discovering I am INTP, I still think I have ADD. I have thought about trying to get diagnosed just to get the meds to see if they would help, but have decided against it so far.

Well, being a hypochondriac is another INTP trait.

 

[Riiscup]

I don't know if it counts as hypochondia because I have no anxiety or feelings about possibly being ADD, I just think I am.

 

[Riiscup]

But if it is hypochondria and its an INTP trait, all the more reason to feel like I belong here!

 

[DesertSmeagle]

Hmm good topic. Ive always thought i had ADHD, because i have so many other problems with depression and anxiety. It seemed to me that ADHD just came in the whole depression package. This is why im scared to go to college in a few days. Im scared ill get distracted by something i see as more important. But the only reason i know i dont have ADHD is because i can focus on something im interested in for an incredibly long time. Like school papers, which brung me incredoble amounts of stress. If i put my mind to them, i just go for hours to get them done. Probably because im scared of getting behind, its been a problem before.
But maybe i do have ADD. I got involved in world of warcraft a few years ago, but i only have one high level character. I honestly hate the game but i play it just to pass the time when im bored. I have like 10 different characters because i cant play 1 character for to long before losing interest. I dont have that H though because im incredibly lazy unless i see things as instant gratification. I was supposed to read this book for summer college and a paper is due in 4 days, before classes even start.. havent read any of it, to busy makin this haha YouTube- Badass Tough Guy
but ive found that im really good at making shit up in essays, without reading the book at the last minute. I once did a paper on dark matter for my earth science class the day before it was due. had to be 5 pages single spaced. so i go on the computer, look stuff up, 4 hours later i have an A+ paper..is this an INTP trait? being able to do things at the last minute? probably..but ya i think i might have some ADD..just remember its the most overdiagnosed mental disorder in the country..I wish i was still on crazy pills.. Used to be on cymalta..now im depressed and ive been seein life as a waste of time.. stupid doctor said i shouldnt be on anti depressents if im not suicidal..bullshit.

 

[UptownHarmlessPantyHose]

The ENTP type is more closely related with classic cases of ADHD hyperactive/impulsive type.

The INTP has traits that are closely aligned with ADHD-inattentive type and Asperger's syndrome/autism.

I have ADHD combined type and show some traits of Asperger's syndrome. It's difficult to tell where my INTP qualities end and my Asperger traits begin but I am little bit more "out there" than most INTPs, althotgh I appear *normal* for the most part.

Since Myers Briggs really only indicates qualities that are present and not the root cause it's almost impossible to to decide what behaviors to assign to the INTP profile and what to assign to Asperger's, but it is a spectrum disorder and in some cases, a very mild Aspie and an average NT INTP can appear to be identical for all intents and purposes.

 

[Tautology]

I wonder if:

1) people with an INTP personality are similar to or like people with Asperger's syndrome but do not have Asperger's syndrome. The two only happen to overlap at certain points. However they are not one and the same.

2) people with an INTP personality have Asperger's syndrome (or in a broader sense an autism spectrum disorder), albeit in varying degree (they may meet all or just some of the criteria for the syndrome or autism spectrum disorder according to DSM-V).

I am fully aware that some diagnostic criteria for Asperger's syndrome involve things like hypo- or hypersensitivity to sensory input, unusual motoric movement (and other symptoms) that one of course need not have in order to have an INTP personality. How ever having such symptoms does not exclude that one may have an INTP personality and in effect also Asperger's syndrome.

Or:

is INTP in fact a description of a person with Asperger's syndrome, or a person with, in varying degrees, traits of Asperger's syndrome? Are the two in fact describing the same phenomena?

Any input welcome!

 

[Hermetic Alchemist]

As with medication, I would disagree with taking medication because I think having ADHD would be a positive thing... it's just that the person with it would have to apply it toward something that would help them excel in their environment.

This shows a complete lack of understanding about AD(H)D.

People with ADHD CANNOT apply it/themselves. That is the whole problem. Yeah we can get superfocused about a single thing (INTP!) but I would say that for the most part that is going to be an information gathering thing. I could read Wikipaedia for 10 hours a day, and think about the things I have learnt, but if you then asked be to synthesize it or to write about what I've read I become extremely distractable and fidgety. It actually upsets and depresses me because I can't get everything out that I want to. So while there ARE certain aspects of ADD that are beneficial, as a research scientist I like to think I am good at making (random-seeming) links between data points, and thus am though of as a 'creative' researcher, for the most part it is unhelpful. If I can never totally finish an experiment, or start something new too often (ADD AND INTP behaviour!) then I am not being a very effective (or good) scientist, since I cannot informa anyone elese of my insights or discoveries.

 

[Hermetic Alchemist]

I wonder if:

1) people with an INTP personality are similar to or like people with Asperger's syndrome but do not have Asperger's syndrome. The two only happen to overlap at certain points. However they are not one and the same.

2) people with an INTP personality have Asperger's syndrome (or in a broader sense an autism spectrum disorder), albeit in varying degree (they may meet all or just some of the criteria for the syndrome or autism spectrum disorder according to DSM-V).

I am fully aware that some diagnostic criteria for Asperger's syndrome involve things like hypo- or hypersensitivity to sensory input, unusual motoric movement (and other symptoms) that one of course need not have in order to have an INTP personality. How ever having such symptoms does not exclude that one may have an INTP personality and in effect also Asperger's syndrome.

Or:

is INTP in fact a description of a person with Asperger's syndrome, or a person with, in varying degrees, traits of Asperger's syndrome? Are the two in fact describing the same phenomena?

Any input welcome!

Funny you should say this, because I'm both very INTP and pretty ADD (high-functioning) and my ex was convinced I was on the Autistic Spectrum. I once asked the shrink working with me on ADD about it, and she said that the most obvious evidence that I wasn't ASD is that I've got a pretty good sense of humour (completely absent in ASD), and for the most part I comprehend social intereactions even if I don't necessarily behave that way myself.

So, lots of common traits, but not actually ASD.

Although it might be like one of those logic problems: ASD people are INTPs but not all INTPs are ASD ... If Hermetic Alchemist is INTP is he ....

 

[Jean Paul]

I met a INTJ with ADHD once

 

[SkyWalker]

The ENTP type is more closely related with classic cases of ADHD hyperactive/impulsive type.

The INTP has traits that are closely aligned with ADHD-inattentive type and Asperger's syndrome/autism.

I have ADD, I have all the symptoms. But I do well financially, so don't need medical help for it.
Also I never did homework, but was lucky enough to get good grades anyway, so school was never a problem either.

But yeah I have self-diagnosed ADD and have tried ritalin as an experiment:
I was actually like superman on it. I felt like that guy in the new movie Limitless on "NZT" (the drug that makes you super intelligent), I did the most amazing things. I think I can really conquer the world on that stuff. * OH NO, I WANT TO POP THE PILL IF I THINK ABOUT THAT *
It basically activates my practical HOW-TO-intelligence, while it turns off my WHY-intelligence
Its basically the same as cocain, so even though it was all great I got scared of it (too good to be true, it will probably ruin my brain in the end) and stopped.
I still keep 2 boxes of it though, to pop the pill for special occasion.

---

INTP = Ti Ne
ENTP = Ne Ti

Basically they are the same, but with a different judgement/perception balance.

I used to think I am INTP, but I found out I am ENTP. ENTPs are known to be the most introverted of the extraverted types and I think that is why I thought I was INTP and I guess mosts simple tests could lead to that same mistake.

The P of INTP is also confusing, since you think its perception over judgement, while the INTP actually has Ti as first function. (Thats why Socionics tried to fix this J/P confusion)


This makes sense to me:
- Ti as a first function (INTP) would make you more Asperger-like
- Ne as a first function (ENTP) would make you more ADD-like

If you go on ENTP forums you will see lots of absurd jokes and clowning around. They take things much lighter.
On INTP forums things are more serious. If you clown around (like I do sometimes) the INTPs will start commenting on it in serious style: "it's not scientific"

 

[WanderMind]

I suppose the difference is that personality is not commonly thought to be inherited as the a.d.d and other 'neurological disorders' gives a great chance to be inherited from parents to childs.
Thought personality is somewhat defined by the persons neural system, which is strongly defined by the genes you get from your parents. Anyway the fenotypes can be inherited by very complicated ways and could be that there is no simple way to inherit the same 'neural system' or personality as your parents.

Im not sure if its a good thing to medicalize certain personality types, but it seems that western medical science wants to give borderlines to what is called 'normal' behavior. At some point the situation could be turned out that the 'symptoms' cause more difficulties and pain than happiness and joy. At that point it could be wise to get some help.

Ive always wondered that if most of people feel their lives easy as they must feel similar to the other peoples around them.... I've never felt normal for a long times.

 

[humblecheesecake]

This is a great thread! I can't count all the times I've tried to analyze whether I had ADD and/or Asperger's. Asperger's--no, ADD--maybe.

But yeah I have self-diagnosed ADD and have tried ritalin as an experiment:
I was actually like superman on it. I felt like that guy in the new movie Limitless on "NZT" (the drug that makes you super intelligent), I did the most amazing things. I think I can really conquer the world on that stuff. * OH NO, I WANT TO POP THE PILL IF I THINK ABOUT THAT *
It basically activates my practical HOW-TO-intelligence, while it turns off my WHY-intelligence
Its basically the same as cocain, so even though it was all great I got scared of it (too good to be true, it will probably ruin my brain in the end) and stopped.
I still keep 2 boxes of it though, to pop the pill for special occasion.

Haha, I think you're right about the switch from "why" to "how-to." I once took adderall thinking that I would study for a test, but spent the whole night constructing a laminated box that would lock my hookah in place to keep it from falling, hold the necessary items, and allow for easy clean.

I still debate with myself on whether or not I have ADD, but it could just be addiction to uppers. I wish I could have two boxes lying around like you.

 

[Jordan~]

There's a correlation between xNxP and ADHD, I think. I've got ADHD, according to a psychiatrist - the inattentive symptoms are worse, but the hyperactive ones are definitely there, too. Like others here, I did very little at school, put in minimal effort, and still got the best possible grades; it only started to be a problem at university, where the support network was gone and I could actually be disciplined for all that. At school I could not do an essay all year and still get an A in the exam, at university if I didn't produce my three weekly essays like clockwork I'd be kicked off the course.

I still definitely don't test differently - I know I'm disorganised, forgetful, struggle to complete tasks, get bored very easily, need mental stimulation, etc. without the pills. I'd rather medication than a permanent 'cure', because I don't see it as something that needs to be cured. It's just a set of inconvenient personality traits, imo; a neurological basis wouldn't prove anything, everything in your personality has a neurological basis. Far better to be able to medicate away the inconvenience and remain the same person than fundamentally change yourself for the sake of convenience.

I wouldn't call it 'misdiagnosis' to diagnose ADHD in someone with an xNxP personality. They're not the same category of phenomena; one is a classification of psychological problems and the other is a categorisation of personalities. Aspects of those personalities can be psychologically problematic or otherwise. You can be an xNxP and have ADHD or you can be an xNxP and not have ADHD, it just depends on the severity of the traits in question and whether or not they cause problems for you.

 

[CLOfriendOSE]

I have ADHD and OCD, according to my shrink. I choose not to be on medication though. I found it just slowed me down/made me zombie-esque. It basically made it easier to make decisions at the cost of most of my creativity and critical thought. Needless to say, as an artist, I need those things.

 

[Jordan~]

What medication were you on, might I ask? I'm on Concerta (methylphenidate) and I don't feel that at all - slowed down a little, maybe, but everything was way too fast before, I couldn't stop to relax or get anything done and I'd spend hours getting to sleep because my mind was racing. I'd listen to really fast songs and wish they were faster. It could be distressing, everything else felt too slow and I had this frantic energy that I couldn't get rid of. If I'd had an outlet for it, it might have been a good thing, but as things are it was just uncomfortable. Maybe you were on too high a dose?