INTP´s view on masturbation?

[eagor]

to answer your first optional question: indefinitely...

 

[shortbuss]

I don't care if other people mastrubate, and I probably do it very infrequently. I never use anything to supplement my experience other than my awesome imagination. Although on GREAT occasion I'll make the mistake of curiously browsing through internet porn...which is always a weird experience.

 

[Teohrn]

I do not masturbate.

The foremost reason is that I think that it has negative psychological effects, depression and apathy being among those two effects. The reason for that is that, in my opinion, we are wired towards achieving as far as our potential goes for the simple reason of procreation. Therefore, auto-sex fools our body into thinking that we are being all alpha-male. This leads to complacency and apathy. Orgasms make our brain initiate our reward system, thus we rely on masturbation instead of actually doing something for our dopamine and endorphine fix. This results in a loser.

I also believe that self-moderation is important for the sake of self-moderation itself.

PS. There is a Tedx video (see: The Great Porn Experiment) that is relevant to the thoughts I expressed. It deals with porn, but masturbation and porn go hand in hand.

 

[snafupants]

I do not masturbate.

The foremost reason is that I think that it has negative psychological effects, depression and apathy being among those two effects. The reason for that is that, in my opinion, we are wired towards achieving as far as our potential goes for the simple reason of procreation. Therefore, auto-sex fools our body into thinking that we are being all alpha-male. This leads to complacency and apathy. Orgasms make our brain initiate our reward system, thus we rely on masturbation instead of actually doing something for our dopamine and endorphine fix. This results in a loser.

I also believe that self-moderation is important for the sake of self-moderation itself.

PS. There is a Tedx video (see: The Great Porn Experiment) that is relevant to the thoughts I expressed. It deals with porn, but masturbation and porn go hand in hand.

Very nice post. Both Nietzsche and TCM say, in different ways, that libidinous emission enervates Will. Most folks fail at harnessing and productively channeling that energy because, well, the practice is poorly understood and generally discredited by western science. Also, they shrink away from it because inner energy cultivation doesn't guarantee instant results - in fact, such practice can prove quite painful in the short-term - and sexuality and orgasm represent vicious cycles. It's like heroin - after trying it, you keep at it in order to stave off negative reinforcement brought on by the experimentation. At any rate, I can't speak for women. Some TCM authorities contend that women experience an energetic boost from sex; at the same time, TCM states that men and women are hindered by masturbation, but masturbation ultimately hurts a man's physiology more.

 

[crippli]

Therefore, auto-sex fools our body into thinking that we are being all alpha-male. This leads to complacency and apathy.

Interesting. Haven't thought about it like that. Complacency towards? Thinking one is alpha male when one isn't? Is this dangerous?

 

[Duxwing]

I do not masturbate.

The foremost reason is that I think that it has negative psychological effects, depression and apathy being among those two effects. The reason for that is that, in my opinion, we are wired towards achieving as far as our potential goes for the simple reason of procreation. Therefore, auto-sex fools our body into thinking that we are being all alpha-male. This leads to complacency and apathy. Orgasms make our brain initiate our reward system, thus we rely on masturbation instead of actually doing something for our dopamine and endorphine fix. This results in a loser.

I also believe that self-moderation is important for the sake of self-moderation itself.

PS. There is a Tedx video (see: The Great Porn Experiment) that is relevant to the thoughts I expressed. It deals with porn, but masturbation and porn go hand in hand.

The only difference that I see between my those days during which I masturbate and those during which I don't is a heightened extroversion of my libido; little else comes of it. Moreover, no emotion can be repressed over the long term, each little cathex will find its own way of achieving catharsis, often in much the same way that it was created. In the case of libido, one finds that sexual repression leads to the creation of fetishes, be they for shoes, feet, hands, breasts, buttocks, or bellies. These fetishes do not drive any sort of productive activity beyond their immediate gratification; indeed, their fulfillment becomes an alternate form of masturbation.

And what would the alternative to 'western' medicine be? Unproven folk remedies, the pontification of medically ignorant philosophers, or the whims of the moment? Certainly medicine has its limitations-- the common cold remains uncured-- but that is no reason to suggest that there cannot be progress. For example, the discovery of penicillin in the 1940s saved thousands of lives otherwise lost to bacterial infection: a success brought about only through rigorous, scientific study.

Is the system of researchers, drug corporations, and doctors perfect? No, and, since the disorder of the universe tends to a maximum, it never will be. There will always be a certain portion, no matter how small, of corrupt, sadistic, and even sociopathic individuals in any group, be they doctors, chemists, or executives. The question is how well their numbers can be reduced and their harm mitigated. However, their misdeeds are no reason to abandon the system of modern medicine as a whole, for even if its human element is flawed, its methods of discovery, development, and sale are well-nigh perfect.

-Duxwing

 

[Teohrn]

Very nice post. Both Nietzsche and TCM say, in different ways, that libidinous emission enervates Will. Most folks fail at harnessing and productively channeling that energy because, well, the practice is poorly understood and generally discredited by western science. Also, they shrink away from it because inner energy cultivation doesn't guarantee instant results - in fact, such practice can prove quite painful in the short-term - and sexuality and orgasm represent vicious cycles. It's like heroin - after trying it, you keep at it in order to stave off negative reinforcement brought on by the experimentation. At any rate, I can't speak for women. Some TCM authorities contend that women experience an energetic boost from sex; at the same time, TCM states that men and women are hindered by masturbation, but masturbation ultimately hurts a man's physiology more.

Thank you. I cannot say much else than that I agree with you, that we are on the same track and that I could therefore not add much more. Additionally, I have little to no knowledge on TCM (Traditional Chinese Medicine, I infer? I really have no idea.).

The reason men may be affected more by masturbation is due to sex being (perhaps) the foremost factor of why men conquer and dominate. The will to power is a product of testosterone. (Metaphorically speaking of course.) Testosterone makes a conqueror. Men seek to conquer their goals, the other sex and earthly possessions; and, obviously, they are intertwined. A conqueror grows complacent when there is nothing more to conquer. Women are different: sex does not impede on their Will, if they even truly have the Will to begin with.

Interesting. Haven't thought about it like that. Complacency towards? Thinking one is alpha male when one isn't? Is this dangerous?

Do not fix something that is not broken, right? If your body thinks you are being alpha, it will think you are on the right track in life. Thus you become complacent and you lose the Will, as Snafupants mentions.

It is very dangerous. If you are content in the now you do nothing but preserve the now. That means you will not progress, which you should always seek to do. Bruce Lee said "Be happy, but never satisfied." I took his advice, I suggest anyone else who reads this does as well.

The only difference that I see between my those days during which I masturbate and those during which I don't is a heightened extroversion of my libido; little else comes of it. Moreover, no emotion can be repressed over the long term, each little cathex will find its own way of achieving catharsis, often in much the same way that it was created. In the case of libido, one finds that sexual repression leads to the creation of fetishes, be they for shoes, feet, hands, breasts, buttocks, or bellies. These fetishes do not drive any sort of productive activity beyond their immediate gratification; indeed, their fulfillment becomes an alternate form of masturbation.

And what would the alternative to 'western' medicine be? Unproven folk remedies, the pontification of medically ignorant philosophers, or the whims of the moment? Certainly medicine has its limitations-- the common cold remains uncured-- but that is no reason to suggest that there cannot be progress. For example, the discovery of penicillin in the 1940s saved thousands of lives otherwise lost to bacterial infection: a success brought about only through rigorous, scientific study.

Is the system of researchers, drug corporations, and doctors perfect? No, and, since the disorder of the universe tends to a maximum, it never will be. There will always be a certain portion, no matter how small, of corrupt, sadistic, and even sociopathic individuals in any group, be they doctors, chemists, or executives. The question is how well their numbers can be reduced and their harm mitigated. However, their misdeeds are no reason to abandon the system of modern medicine as a whole, for even if its human element is flawed, its methods of discovery, development, and sale are well-nigh perfect.

-Duxwing

I would not call it sexual repression. I do not mind sex as long as it is not with myself. (Although if I do not like sex with my own person, could anyone else? ) That is not even what I am arguing for. I am pro-sex, and that is part of the reason why you should not masturbate.

Moreover, I do not agree that abstaining from masturbation, or even sex, leads to bursts of sexual overindulgence. I, personally, would certainly be an exception to that rule. I actual know people who are into fetishes. I would rather say that their problem always was the opposite of repressing. And as far as I know, it is rather masturbation which leads to the bizarre sexual gratification one gets from fetishes. The Tedx video I mentioned in the previous post goes into that. It can be likened to heroin or any other addictive drug; in fact, addictive chemicals are partially responsible. Our brain gets stimulation from porn and masturbation. However, you can repeat something y^x many times and it will stop becoming stimulating. Therefore, our brain seeks novelties. Fetishes certainly fulfill our brain's desire for stimulating novelties. I think the argument is similar to arguing that abstaining or moderation from alcohol causes an effect the opposite of what was intended.

As for the rest of your post, I am by no means arguing against western medicine. However, information and studies on this topic are scant; the small amount of it proving little on either side. so it is only my idea, influenced by the ideas of others and observations. I cannot help but note that your argument and position do remind me of that of the 19th century medical community towards Ignaz Semmelweis. Semmelweis, while having no proof had it completely right when he tried to persuade the medical community in initiating antiseptic procedures amongst practitioners of medicine. However, the medical community did not listen until after Semmelweis' death, when they found out that microorganisms existed and that they were perhaps the cause behind diseases. The simple act of washing your hands was shunned by the medical community, because there was no conclusive proof, although Semmelweis did make sense, albeit I will concede that it is far easier to say in retrospect.

To conclude: That this is not supported by evidence, although, as far as I know, the evidence currently available neither refutes or supports it completely, but that there is evidence that points to me being right, does not mean that the idea should be rejected. I find the idea to make sense.

 

[Duxwing]

Thank you. I cannot say much else than that I agree with you, that we are on the same track and that I could therefore not add much more. Additionally, I have little to no knowledge on TCM (Traditional Chinese medicine, I infer?).

The reason men may be affected more by masturbation is due to sex being (perhaps) the foremost factor of why men conquer and dominate. The will to power is a product of testosterone. (Metaphorically speaking of course.) Testosterone makes a conqueror. Men seek to conquer their goals, the other sex and earthly possessions; and, obviously, they are intertwined. A conqueror grows complacent when there is nothing more to conquer. Women are different: sex does not impede on their Will, if they even truly have the Will to begin with.



Do not fix something that is not broken, right? If your body thinks you are being alpha, it will think you are on the right track in life. Thus you become complacent and you lose the Will, as Snafupants mentions.

It is very dangerous. If you are content in the now you do nothing but preserve the now. That means you will not progress, which you should always seek to do. Bruce Lee said "Be happy, but never satisfied." I took his advice, I suggest anyone else who reads this does as well.



I would not call it sexual repression. I do not mind sex as long as it is not with myself. (Although if I do not like sex with my own person, could anyone else? ) That is not even what I am arguing for. I am pro-sex, and that is part of the reason why you should not masturbate.

Moreover, I do not agree that abstaining from masturbation, or even sex, leads to bursts of sexual overindulgence. I, personally, would certainly be an exception to that rule. I actual know people who are into fetishes. I would rather say that their problem always was the opposite of repressing. And as far as I know, it is rather masturbation which leads to the bizarre sexual gratification one gets from fetishes. The Tedx video I mentioned in the previous post goes into that. It can be likened to heroin or any other addictive drug; in fact, addictive chemicals are partially responsible. Our brain gets stimulation from porn and masturbation. However, you can repeat something y^x many times and it will stop becoming stimulating. Therefore, our brain seeks novelties. Fetishes certainly fulfill our brain's desire for stimulating novelties. I think the argument is similar to arguing that abstaining or moderation from alcohol causes an effect the opposite of what was intended.

As for the rest of your post, I am by no means arguing against western medicine. However, information and studies on this topic are scant; the small amount of it proving little on either side. so it is only my idea, influenced by the ideas of others and observations. I cannot help but note that your argument and position do remind me of that of the 19th century medical community towards Ignaz Semmelweis. Semmelweis, while having no proof had it completely right when he tried to persuade the medical community in initiating antiseptic procedures amongst practitioners of medicine. However, the medical community did not listen until after Semmelweis' death, when they found out that microorganisms existed and that they were perhaps the cause behind diseases. The simple act of washing your hands was shunned by the medical community, because there was no conclusive proof, although Semmelweis did make sense, albeit I will concede that it is far easier to say in retrospect.

To conclude: That this is not supported by evidence, although, as far as I know, the evidence currently available neither refutes or supports it completely, but that there is evidence that points to me being right, does not mean that the idea should be rejected. I find the idea to make sense.

Ah, well, I think that we're both in awkward positions to argue, then. I don't use porn to masturbate, just my imagination. When the fantasy gets boring, I simply change my method (no, not like that ) and imaginary girl. In fact, I've grown less bizarre and fetishistic over time, to the point that I can't imagine going back to the way that I did it as a ten year old.

However, your hypothesis does hold true if porn viewers' selections tend to the disturbing over time. The question, then, is whether the evidence supports your claim.

-Duxwing

 

[Teohrn]

Ah, well, I think that we're both in awkward positions to argue, then. I don't use porn to masturbate, just my imagination. When the fantasy gets boring, I simply change my method (no, not like that ) and imaginary girl. In fact, I've grown less bizarre and fetishistic over time, to the point that I can't imagine going back to the way that I did it as a ten year old.

However, your hypothesis does hold true if porn viewers' selections tend to the disturbing over time. The question, then, is whether the evidence supports your claim.

-Duxwing

That is probably for the better, porn seems to be the main problem. I would still say that it is better to go for actual women. It is wherein part of the problem lies; because 1. you satisfy your sexual urges, but not through actual sex and 2. the sexual urge is also the will to progress.

The following is an article written by Gary Wilson, the same person from "The Great Porn Experiment", in Psychology Today. I suggest you read it. It goes into exactly what we were talking about. http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...w/201108/porn-novelty-and-the-coolidge-effect

 

[Duxwing]

That is probably for the better, porn seems to be the main problem. I would still say that it is better to go for actual women. It is wherein part of the problem lies; because 1. you satisfy your sexual urges, but not through actual sex and 2. the sexual urge is also the will to progress.

The following is an article written by Gary Wilson, the same person from "The Great Porn Experiment", in Psychology Today. I suggest you read it. It goes into exactly what we were talking about. http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...w/201108/porn-novelty-and-the-coolidge-effect

Aha, now I understand and agree completely. I suffer this effect, too, should I masturbate to the same image for too long; much like that of chewing gum, the effect becomes stale. However, I keep going until every last bit of pleasure has been drained, then I switch.

-Duxwing

P.S. INTP Forum, the place where we let out all our darkest secrets.

 

[Teohrn]

Aha, now I understand and agree completely. I suffer this effect, too, should I masturbate to the same image for too long; much like that of chewing gum, the effect becomes stale. However, I keep going until every last bit of pleasure has been drained, then I switch.

-Duxwing

P.S. INTP Forum, the place where we let out all our darkest secrets.

I have a far too extensive personal experience with just that. I think that I made a good choice to stop masturbation and watching porn especially with the knowledge put forth by this article in mind. I would reccomend others to do the same. Abstaining from porn is the foremost priority in that case as it has been proven to be the problem.

I mentioned TEDx earlier, and here is another video: http://youtu.be/oVEHeY8sY5Q

 

[walfin]

Masturbation is necessary when sex is not readily obtainable.

Porn is not, the best porn is that played in an INTP's head.

 

[own8ge]

Masturbation is necessary when sex is not readily obtainable.

I do not masturbate and have haven't had sex recently, nor do I have a sexual relationship. That is, just to defy your statement.

 

[alchemist]

I'd say I average about 1.5 times a day. As for porn, while imagination is usually sufficient, porn serves as an excellent supplement from time to time.

Edit: Yes, I'm an INTP

1.5 eh? Is the .5 a teaser for the final finale?

haha sorry couldn't resist.

 

[SpaceYeti]

*rubs chin*

... Final finale... Finally the final finale. In Finland.

 

[BigApplePi]

In my experience I tend to take a top/down view.

 

[EyeSeeCold]

In my experience I tend to take a top/down view.

I prefer a 'bottom-up' view myself.