Husband emails wife "no sex" spreadsheet.

[deadpixel]

I feel bad for this guy but at the same time I think its hillarious, if you read the spreadsheet you'll see what I mean, I think. Unless I just have a bad sense of humor , other than that it kinda seems like something I would do if push came to shove haha.
http://www.theguardian.com/lifeands...-sex-not-tonight-spreadsheet-lays-bare-reddit

 

[Helvete]

I feel sorry for you

Sent from my GT-S5839i using Tapatalk 2

 

[deadpixel]

How come?

 

[Jennywocky]

Seems there's a lack of communication in the marriage, which his list accentuates rather than addresses in any meaningful way.

Also, sex seems to be a need of his like eating, without it rising out of a shared affection in the relationship. His attitude suggests he'd be happy screwing any woman to meet his need, not necessarily his wife.

 

[Deleted member 1424]

Obligatory sex
Gross

 

[Hadoblado]

I can see making a spreadsheet to show his spouse and acknowledge a problem they have (one wants sex and the other doesn't) as fairly reasonable though a little odd. To then go and show this spreadsheet to others via reddit implies he's attempting to win this relationship the way he would win an argument.

 

[Jennywocky]

I can see making a spreadsheet to show his spouse and acknowledge a problem they have (one wants sex and the other doesn't) as fairly reasonable though a little odd. To then go and show this spreadsheet to others via reddit implies he's attempting to win this relationship the way he would win an argument.

If you read the first paragraph of the article, you'll see that she is the one who posted it on reddit -- he emailed it to her before she left on a business trip. So She is the one who made it public, probably to wring out some Internet empathy and/or vent.

Pretty humiliating for both of them by this point, if people know who she is IRL.

EDIT: Oh dear. Read the Reddit thread. It was definitely a bitch session on her part.
http://www.reddit.com/r/relationships/comments/2b1f5a/my_husband_m26_sent_me_f26_an_immature/

Looks like she removed the meat of the post, but once you post something on the internet, it's GONE. You can't do TakeBacks on the 'net. Here is what remains of her OP:

My husband [M26] sent me [F26] an immature, inflammatory email as I was driving to the airport for a 10-day work trip. Now he has cut contact....

other relevant comments by her:

It's not normal. For the most part of our relationship, we averaged 3-5 times a week I'd say? Including a non-recipricated blowjob thrown in here and there.
A few months ago I looked in the mirror and didn't like what I saw. I looked horrible naked and none of my clothes fit nicely, I had a muffin top. I've been trying to eat better and go to the gym ever since.
My weekday routine has been shower, go to work, get off at 4pm, go home and cook dinner, go to the gym, watch some TV, sleep. He's never up to have sex in the morning, and I never want to have sex after being all sweaty and gross from the gym.

He's totally guility of bottling up his emotions and then they come out in one fell swoop. Once or twice a year I'll come home and he'll just start in on me. But it's always been real issues, discussed (for the most part) maturely. Not this spiteful, childish stuff.

So he blindsided her as she was leaving on a trip and then refused to talk to her.
But then she posted the grid on Reddit and the rest is history.

 

[Hadoblado]

Ooooops my bad.

 

[ProxyAmenRa]

I wrote a spreadsheet for Gopher and I as well.

Attempt 1: Tried to burn him to death.
Result 1: Gopher was not burnt.
Reason 1: Gopher ran away.

 

[loveofreason]

So is Gopher fire-resistent; too wet to burn, perhaps? Or was there some flaw in the attempt itself?



As for the other couple.... A woman that is disgusted with her body will not feel like having sex, regardless of how he sees her. Seems though that she did, from her point of view, the most effective thing she could to remedy her disgust. She exercised. Obviously this long-term investment in his and her happiness was lost on the husband. Not only did he not recognise her new gym habit as a caring gesture, he resented her for it. Classic miscommunication.



edit: oh, I see you've added the reason, Proxy. Seems a successful conflagration could be scheduled for the future if Gopher's capacity to run were disabled.

 

[ProxyAmenRa]

Classic miscommunication.

Yes. This is can not be emphasized enough.

 

[deadpixel]

I posted it because I just thought the entire thing in general was pretty effing hillarious, the contents of the spreadsheet is epic.

No sex last night, she wanted to watch the show (freinds re-run)
No sex last night, "I feel sweaty and gross" (Didnt take a shower until next morning)
No sex last night, "Im trying to watch the movie" (Fell asleep during movie)

Also one more thing id like to add is, you never truly know what you are capable of until you feel that your partner isnt sexually attracted to you or possibly not in love with you anymore, your brain will run wild with all kinds of crazy ideas.

 

[Helvete]

There is clearly miscommunication between both parties here with addressing each others needs, that or a complete lack of. We don't know if anything about it was discussed at all but I would assume if it had then it would of been mentioned.

I can't see that making a spreadsheet of this nature would serve to do anything positive and as it's probably the first time communicating the issue it was completely tactless and destructiveto the relationship. To my mind it's either an irrational brain fart or he's done with it anyway.the latterseems a shame for the lack of effort made to make a resolve.

this is why I said I felt sorry for you because an act like this serves no positive purpose.

Equally posting this publicly is just as bad in that respect.

Sent from my GT-S5839i using Tapatalk 2

 

[deadpixel]

There is clearly miscommunication between both parties here with addressing each others needs, that or a complete lack of. We don't know if anything about it was discussed at all but I would assume if it had then it would of been mentioned.

I can't see that making a spreadsheet of this nature would serve to do anything positive and as it's probably the first time communicating the issue it was completely tactless and destructiveto the relationship. To my mind it's either an irrational brain fart or he's done with it anyway.the latterseems a shame for the lack of effort made to make a resolve.

this is why I said I felt sorry for you because an act like this serves no positive purpose.

Equally posting this publicly is just as bad in that respect.

Sent from my GT-S5839i using Tapatalk 2

For me the purpose it served was comic relief, If you think this is disgusting then I guess I have a sick sense of humor. I just thought that the contents of the spreadsheet were really really funny, the excuses and the little sidenotes about the excuses that made the excuse irrelevant to begin with idk lol. I got this from CNN's website by the way, it was a topic on their MAIN page. You dont need to feel sorry for me helvette, I was just redirecting an article from CNN.
http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/us/2014/07/23/hln-husband-emails-sex-spreadsheet.hln.html

 

[Minuend]

Average intelligent people's problems

 

[Red myst]

I can see it being amusing as stand up comedy material, and IRL it can be attention grabbing like watching a train wreck. There has to be more to this story to help with the context of how this all came about. Perhaps they will get their 15 minuets of fame now when the tabloids come calling. I can see the use of a spread sheet as a way of displaying a pattern of behavior that some one else won't see or admit to unless it is presented in black and white. But his whole idea was really poorly executed, and her posting of private matters on the web is in really poor taste. Sure they have communication issues as PART of their problem, but makes me wonder how they function in other day to day aspects life? Are they typically this..... (for lack of better words)....... stupid? Or do they just bring out the worst in each other?

 

[Jennywocky]

Reddit = The Poor Man's Therapist.

(Because you'll never want to do things the same way again, after 80% of the Internet community hears what you've done.)

 

[Architect]

I did something like this once. I forget what the issue was, something silly like housework - she was leaving dirty clothes on the floor all the time or something and claimed it didn't happen that often. So to verify (good INTP engineer that I was) I kept a tally and yes indeed, she was a slob. So I innocently showed her the list thinking that would clear things right up; bad idea! She felt attacked, and for years later I had to hear what a jerk I was for doing that. I wasn't trying to personally attack her, just clear up a little difficulty but how else could that be taken?

The thing is we were both right. She was a slob, and I was a jerk. I've since learned the right approach which is to mirror their behavior, which we've both successfully used on each other. It's about the only way to show somebody their bad behavior. The problem is, and the reason marriage can be such a good teacher, is that we all don't realize what jerks we are to each other. Our brains filter that information out, so seeing it mirrored in another person viscerally brings it home.

So he should have just said the same; he feels tired, or gross and doesn't feel like sex. Of course the difficulty with their situation is that he'd probably not be able to wait her out on this one.

 

[Pyropyro]

A more appropriate spreadsheet

 

[Helvete]

A more appropriate spreadsheet

Spreadsheet sucks, since when did you need to have a girlfriend to get laid? It's a cop out excuse for lack of trying.

 

[Fukyo]

This thread generated 13 pages of lulz on INFJf, from feminist outrage to conspiracy theories about how Illuminati are trying to destabilize society by taming male sex drive and not allowing people to have loving relationships.

Step it up INTPf.

 

[Jennywocky]

This thread generated 13 pages of lulz on INFJf, from feminist outrage to conspiracy theories about how Illuminati are trying to destabilize society by taming male sex drive and not allowing people to have loving relationships.

Step it up INTPf.

Reasons for not posting more on INTPf


Date.........Posted?........Reason
07/14/14.....No..............Threads suck.
07/15/14.....No..............Members are boring.
07/16/14.....Yes..............Someone got banned! Finally, drama!
07/17/14.....No...............Was having sex
07/18/14.....No..............Internet cut off for non-payment
07/19/14.....No...............Internet still cut off cuz I couldn't pay through Internet
07/20/14.....Yes.............Posted from public library, saying I was off the 'net for a few days
07/21/14......No.............Dog pissed on my laptop
07/22/14......No..............Threads still boring
07/23/14......No.............*yawn*
07/24/14......No..............Fucking hate the Internet
07/25/14......Yes.............Someone hacked my account and posted under my name
07/26/14......No..............Illuminati wouldn't let me
07/27/14......Yes.............Posted on INFJ forum instead, more interesting

 

[Helvete]

Step it up INTPf.

Lead by example?

Wife is clearly a sociopath who doesn't actually enjoy sex and will only employ it as a tool of manipulation. The 'business trip' is just a guise for a love affair. It's cool though because only the sociopath wins here; when everything becomes fucked it's okay because they'll be emotionally indifferent afterwards and will move on to her next victims...

 

[Pyropyro]

Step it up INTPf.

But my Excel skills are weak Forgive me sensei for I have failed you!

*uses keyboard for hara-kiri*

 

[ProxyAmenRa]

Reasons for not posting more on INTPf


Date.........Posted?........Reason
07/14/14.....No..............Threads suck.
07/15/14.....No..............Members are boring.
07/16/14.....Yes..............Someone got banned! Finally, drama!
07/17/14.....No...............Was having sex
07/18/14.....No..............Internet cut off for non-payment
07/19/14.....No...............Internet still cut off cuz I couldn't pay through Internet
07/20/14.....Yes.............Posted from public library, saying I was off the 'net for a few days
07/21/14......No.............Dog pissed on my laptop
07/22/14......No..............Threads still boring
07/23/14......No.............*yawn*
07/24/14......No..............Fucking hate the Internet
07/25/14......Yes.............Someone hacked my account and posted under my name
07/26/14......No..............Illuminati wouldn't let me
07/27/14......Yes.............Posted on INFJ forum instead, more interesting

This made me chuckle. You're funny. You shall be the next entry in my spreadsheet.

A more appropriate spreadsheet

I have wasted too many hours on 9gag.

This thread generated 13 pages of lulz on INFJf, from feminist outrage to conspiracy theories about how Illuminati are trying to destabilize society by taming male sex drive and not allowing people to have loving relationships.

Step it up INTPf.

Well, we could make some drama by setting the 'human relationships' section to be visible to the public.

 

[Jennywocky]

This made me chuckle. You're funny. You shall be the next entry in my spreadsheet.

.... uhhhhhh what spreadsheet? *hides*

 

[The Gopher]

Reasons for not posting more on INTPf


Date.........Posted?........Reason
07/14/14.....No..............Threads suck.
07/15/14.....No..............Members are boring.
07/16/14.....Yes..............Someone got banned! Finally, drama!
07/17/14.....No...............Was having sex
07/18/14.....No..............Internet cut off for non-payment
07/19/14.....No...............Internet still cut off cuz I couldn't pay through Internet
07/20/14.....Yes.............Posted from public library, saying I was off the 'net for a few days
07/21/14......No.............Dog pissed on my laptop
07/22/14......No..............Threads still boring
07/23/14......No.............*yawn*
07/24/14......No..............Fucking hate the Internet
07/25/14......Yes.............Someone hacked my account and posted under my name
07/26/14......No..............Illuminati wouldn't let me
07/27/14......Yes.............Posted on INFJ forum instead, more interesting

Aww, lets face it. It's because I'm not posting as much!

 

[loveofreason]

Burn the Gopher!

 

[subwayrider]

Reasons for not posting more on INTPf


Date.........Posted?........Reason
07/14/14.....No..............Threads suck.
07/15/14.....No..............Members are boring.
07/16/14.....Yes..............Someone got banned! Finally, drama!
07/17/14.....No...............Was having sex
07/18/14.....No..............Internet cut off for non-payment
07/19/14.....No...............Internet still cut off cuz I couldn't pay through Internet
07/20/14.....Yes.............Posted from public library, saying I was off the 'net for a few days
07/21/14......No.............Dog pissed on my laptop
07/22/14......No..............Threads still boring
07/23/14......No.............*yawn*
07/24/14......No..............Fucking hate the Internet
07/25/14......Yes.............Someone hacked my account and posted under my name
07/26/14......No..............Illuminati wouldn't let me
07/27/14......Yes.............Posted on INFJ forum instead, more interesting

INFJ forum is NOT more interesting! Lots of drama, popularity contest-ing, attention-seeking, conspiracy theory...hence why I turned to the dark (INT) side.

Maybe to you guys it's interesting... O_o

 

[Jennywocky]

07/28/14...... Yes...... "13 pages of lulz" can't be wrong!

 

[Perfectly Normal Beast]

i don't understand why the female was so cross about the spreadsheet - the male was merely presenting evidence to demonstrate that he was justified in perceiving a problem.

personally i'd find it really hilarious if someone presented me with hard evidence like that proving that i was exhibiting some behavioural flaw or other.

she was a total cunt for sharing it though. i hope he realises that.

 

[Perfectly Normal Beast]

I've since learned the right approach which is to mirror their behavior, which we've both successfully used on each other. It's about the only way to show somebody their bad behavior.

that feels too manipulative for my taste. i prefer to discuss things honestly and directly.

 

[redbaron]

Both of them are idiots.

I've since learned the right approach which is to mirror their behavior, which we've both successfully used on each other. It's about the only way to show somebody their bad behavior. The problem is, and the reason marriage can be such a good teacher, is that we all don't realize what jerks we are to each other. Our brains filter that information out, so seeing it mirrored in another person viscerally brings it home.

You could just talk to them. I'm sort of amazed at how many convoluted ways (and their justifications of them) people come up with in relationships to try and avoid being open and honest with their partners.

So he should have just said the same; he feels tired, or gross and doesn't feel like sex. Of course the difficulty with their situation is that he'd probably not be able to wait her out on this one.

If I have to resort to passive aggression just to be heard, I'd rather just leave the relationship.

 

[Architect]

that feels too manipulative for my taste. i prefer to discuss things honestly and directly.

You could just talk to them. I'm sort of amazed at how many convoluted ways (and their justifications of them) people come up with in relationships to try and avoid being open and honest with their partners.

OK, but have either of you been married for a significant period of time? Those are fine sentiments and sound great, but are, well I'm sorry but naive. I'm drawing not just from my own experience but from many other couples I know. Of course people talk to their partner, don't you think that'd be the first thing we'd try? And talk again, and again. Just file that away until you've been married for 10 or 20 years. Marriage has a way of rooting out the deepest problems in a person.

If I have to resort to passive aggression just to be heard, I'd rather just leave the relationship.

Mirroring and role playing is a traditional psychological therapy, it's not passive aggressive. And 'just leave the relationship' - OK sure, that's a mature response to a problem. What about children? Have you considered divorce laws in some states (as in you might be supporting her and her boyfriend for years)? If you have children you are never really divorced. There's always some form of shared custody. Finally odds are you love them, but no matter how well two people are for each other stuff still comes up. Should you just walk away from that? As you get older the difficulty of finding somebody else - especially somebody compatible go way down. It's not like when you were 20 and everybody is single and horny.

 

[redbaron]

Of course people talk to their partner, don't you think that'd be the first thing we'd try? And talk again, and again.

Well that's nice but it's kind of the exact fucking opposite to what you said beforehand.

Anyway, we'll probably never see eye-to-eye on the matter since well-paying job, nice house, wife and kid aren't exactly high on my list of life aspirations. I wonder what's more immature: leaving a relationship you're dissatisfied with, or staying in one just because it's difficult to find someone else - as if it's such a bad thing to not be in a long-term relationship.

 

[ProxyAmenRa]

Anyway, we'll probably never see eye-to-eye on the matter since well-paying job, nice house, wife and kid are on the shit-list of my life's aspirations - I find the whole concept rather revolting really.

Why is the concept revolting?

 

[redbaron]

Why is the concept revolting?

Life goals: make money, find wife, buy house, produce offspring. Can't think of anything worse.

More power to people if those things motivate them. In and of themselves they're all irrelevant to me.

 

[Architect]

Well that's nice but it's kind of the exact fucking opposite to what you said beforehand.

No it's not, let me explain.

• Couple has problem, X has problem with Y
• X explains z to Y
• Y says it isn't a problem, can't or doesn't change it, or whatever
• Loop
• X instead cuts through the knot by demonstrating problem
• Y sees it and understands

My point is that all of the seemingly obvious things - like just saying "Honey, you're dirty underwear on the floor is really pissing me off" don't get across - much of the time. The OP demonstrates this issue, obviously the couple had talked about it.

You're not getting the point - the problem is that people have different perspectives. Getting another to see yours is extremely difficult. People have degrees in this subject. I've taken classes on it, with one point. People don't see outside of their narrow perspective, and usually don't want to change that.

Anyway, we'll probably never see eye-to-eye on the matter since well-paying job, nice house, wife and kid aren't exactly high on my list of life aspirations.

That's what you say now. I've seen many who said that and later regretted it.

I wonder what's more immature: leaving a relationship you're dissatisfied with, or staying in one just because it's difficult to find someone else - as if it's such a bad thing to not be in a long-term relationship.

OK, you're not getting it but that's OK. You're painting it in black and white. Good relationship and (problem) bad relationship. You're not getting that even in the best relationships there will be issues and it's a spectrum.

My wife and I have the INFJ-INTP "Golden Couple" relationship, and further we are highly compatible. Despite that there are many times when we want to kill each other. Those times are just opportunities for growth.

The attitude you describe is classically known as the "Puer Aeternis".

 

[redbaron]

No it's not, let me explain.

Yeah that's really nice and all but it's still completely different to what you said in the first post.

OK, you're not getting it but that's OK. You're painting it in black and white.

Uh, yeah. I'm the one painting it in black and white here. ROFL.

 

[Jennywocky]

Wow. Well,

- Each relationship is different. The dynamics differ, the approach differs, the things that can be tolerated vs not differ, the "love languages spoken" differs, the style of communication thus can differ.

- It's not even a static difference. People and relationships change and mutate over time. So depending on where the relationship is, communication needs and styles can mutate as well.

- I don't think there's a blanket answer on whether it's best to cut bait and run or to tought it out. This is what maturity and discernment is for, and there are lots of factors involved, and some of it is even based simply on what both parties do or do not want. I wouldn't say just because a couple is comfortable in many ways that they should stay together, and I wouldn't say that just because a couple has issues / is uncomfortable a lot that they should split up. Ultimately that is up to the couple to decide, although one course of action might seem more prudent over time than another. But again, there are a myriad of factors.

Anyway, depending on the couple, maybe discussion isn't helpful at a certain point in their relationship, so you resort to the emulation of the negative behavior, in order to remove the inequity and convey the idea that isn't getting through. [It reminds me of gently biting your kid's finger when he's not getting the idea that going around and biting people is wrong; on one hand, you're biting him which is what you've asked him not to do, but it's amazing how effective it is at leading to abandoning the behavior.] It's not done out of revenge or hate, it's done to convey information... but obviously it's a potentially volatile step in a relationship and could either succeed in creating an empathic understanding of the problem or drive the couple further apart.

Then again, maybe someone objects to asking your partner to change ANYTHING for you -- and you just assume rather than trying to stay in sync with each other, you'll just let each other drift away and find someone else if you start to veer apart. I suppose that can be valid too if both parties are amenable, but it's funny how much the lack of constancy can be bitched about once one has been a drifter for some years... it's just the same cycle. And it also can devalue anything to be gleaned from commitment as part of a relationship; can change (to make a relationship work) ever be positive, and are there things you can experience by choosing to change a bit that you wouldn't experience by leaving?

Anyway... just lots of ideas I am tossing out.

 

[TimeAsylums]

Life goals: make money, find wife, buy house, produce offspring. Can't think of anything worse.

In and of themselves they're all irrelevant to me.

heh, we actually share something in common, what.


/


too bored to quote everyone else and respond, but yes, mirroring is a very effective technique. (talking, unfortunately, doesn't always work) - it's the equivalent of asking someone "How would that(x) make you feel?" And if they can't imagine it in abstract-land about how it would make them feel, well then you make it real.

...unless you're dating a psychopath...

 

[Absurdity]

Uh, yeah. I'm the one painting it in black and white here. ROFL.

You kind of are.

 

[deadpixel]

When your partner denies you day after day, night after night, and you have exhausted every option, and you yourself have been through something similiar, then feel free to criticize the man. Until then, I wouldn't be so quick to wag my tongue around guys.

 

[Jennywocky]

Well, unless you see him as a total victim of his wife's callousness (which you might), I think the problem is less with him making and sharing a list with her (so they can properly discuss the matter), and more about him sending the list to her in e-mail/phone message and then refusing to answer her calls so that they could discuss it. It makes it sound more like revenge/PA than a mature attempt to resolve their marital difficulty.

(And, likewise, she was foolish to post it on a large public website, even if she might have simply vented -- "My husband gave me a list of my excuses for not having sex and now won't talk to me." She didn't have to post the list.)

 

[deadpixel]

Well, unless you see him as a total victim of his wife's callousness (which you might), I think the problem is less with him making and sharing a list with her (so they can properly discuss the matter), and more about him sending the list to her in e-mail/phone message and then refusing to answer her calls so that they could discuss it. It makes it sound more like revenge/PA than a mature attempt to resolve their marital difficulty.

(And, likewise, she was foolish to post it on a large public website, even if she might have simply vented -- "My husband gave me a list of my excuses for not having sex and now won't talk to me." She didn't have to post the list.)

Well we dont know all of the facts, hypothetically speaking this is assuming this man is a good husband and treats his woman like a queen. If not then scratch what I previously posted lol. Regardless, he totally went about presenting the spreadsheet the wrong way, its not necessarily that it was a bad idea. It would have been a good idea if executed properly. instead, he emails it to her then flies off? wtf.

 

[redbaron]

You kind of are.

Architect is long-windedly repeating the point I've already made back to me and then telling me I'm, "missing the point" (the one I made in the very first post). Do I seriously have to fucking spell this out?

Not to mention that he's committing fallacies at the rate of about five per post.

I just feel sorry for his wife.

The attitude you describe is classically known as the "Puer Asternis".

What's that? Could that be anything like Puer Aeturnus?

 

[Reluctantly]

Why do people assume something is wrong if they aren't fucking like rabbits? Some couple don't have sex that much. It doesn't always mean something is wrong with the relationship.

Obligatory sex
Gross

Agreed. And it makes the idea of having sex less emotionally appealing , which probably isn't helping this guy.

 

[Jennywocky]

Why do people assume something is wrong if they aren't fucking like rabbits? Some couple don't have sex that much. It doesn't always mean something is wrong with the relationship.

As long as the couple agrees on frequency, it's not really an issue IMO.

The problem is when they don't agree on frequency.
Then it becomes an issue.
Like here.

 

[Helvete]

I think penis size could be an issue too. Could explain a lot of the palming off.

 

[Reluctantly]

As long as the couple agrees on frequency, it's not really an issue IMO.

The problem is when they don't agree on frequency.
Then it becomes an issue.
Like here.

Woah, that sounds weird to me. I didn't know sex was planned with some people. I could never do that. I enjoy the spontaneity of it, having my desire provoked or provoking theirs. Otherwise it feels too much like a chore.