Fuck buddies?

[ashitaria]

You did a really poor job of stating what you believe. Explain how sex is different than a movie.

Explain how sex is similar to a movie, then I will see if this is worthy of my time. As for stating what by beliefs are, that wasn't the purpose of my initial post so I have no idea why you brought that up.

Dude, what are you talking about? Are you not familiar with the term "gigolo?" How do you explain "Ladies Only" male strip shows?

My closest friends have usually been women. I've heard them say things like "I'm really looking forward to sleeping with him." I've heard stories of occasional one-nighters with guys they met in clubs, late night booty calls, and hooking up with friends when they hadn't gotten laid in a while.

Women most certainly *do* have needs. Unfortunately, we live in a male-dominated world where female sexual desire and satisfaction are routinely downplayed, dismissed, and disparaged.

What? I don't think I said anything about women, or gigolos, or strip shows so I have no idea why you are exposing me to all this sexual information.

No, I can't say I am "that" sexually active if I am currently relationshipless as well as fuck buddyless, and don't really have much motivation to go out and get either. However, I don't see any sense in letting perfectly good sex go to waste.

You gotta at least understand that "feels wrong" is a very subjective thing that we are not all going to agree with. Even it I was "that" sexually active I don't see why I should be looked down upon. It's just fucking sex....

Urgh! INTPs...
Always bashing people for expressing their own view-points.
Alright Adymus, you win. And just five minutes ago I was arguing about the subjectivity about right and wrong...

But the fact is that you saying how you don't see any sense in letting good sex go to waste is again, subjective. Some people look at sex as a bad thing, some people look at sex as a good thing. Again, it's all relative, and people have reasons for seeing it their own way.

For my sake and yours...

Why sex is good:

-Relieves stress and tension.
-Alleviates sexual appetite.
-Produces babies for the country.
-Helps build an intimate relationship.

Why sex is bad:

-STDs
-Often can cause relationships to break up (affairs)
-Can cause people to lose innocence too early.
-Pregnancy too early.

 

[Adymus]

You are absolutely right about my opinion being subjective, I never said it wasn't. The only thing is, I kind of feel like I am the one defending my opinion here, after your response being "Wow really? Are you that sexually active?" as if I am supposed to be ashamed to myself for agreeing with casually alleviating the sexual appetite.

And in what way am I bashing you!? Come on, you are the one implying I should be ashamed here.

 

[onthewindowstand]

Explain how sex is similar to a movie, then I will see if this is worthy of my time. As for stating what by beliefs are, that wasn't the purpose of my initial post so I have no idea why you brought that up.



What? I don't think I said anything about women, or gigolos, or strip shows so I have no idea why you are exposing me to all this sexual information.



Urgh! INTPs...
Always bashing people for expressing their own view-points.
Alright Adymus, you win. And just five minutes ago I was arguing about the subjectivity about right and wrong...

But the fact is that you saying how you don't see any sense in letting good sex go to waste is again, subjective. Some people look at sex as a bad thing, some people look at sex as a good thing. Again, it's all relative, and people have reasons for seeing it their own way.

For my sake and yours...

Why sex is good:

-Relieves stress and tension.
-Alleviates sexual appetite.
-Produces babies for the country.
-Helps build an intimate relationship.

Why sex is bad:

-STDs
-Often can cause relationships to break up (affairs)
-Can cause people to lose innocence too early.
-Pregnancy too early.

The burden of proof is actually on you to explain why one activity is different morally from another. Teaching logic FTW! Again I ask how is sex different from a seeing a movie? And as far as claiming not be stating a belief you clearly were. ypu said, "what....the....fuck" that is clearly a statement trying to convey belief it was just done very poorly.

 

[ashitaria]

You are absolutely right about my opinion being subjective, I never said it wasn't. The only thing is, I kind of feel like I am the one defending my opinion here, after your response being "Wow really? Are you that sexually active?" as if I am supposed to be ashamed to myself for agreeing with casually alleviating the sexual appetite.

And in what way am I bashing you!? Come on, you are the one implying I should be ashamed here.

What!?

The last thing I want is to make people feel ashamed of their opinion! I value individual and unconventional views and I definitely do not wish for people like you to feel ashamed of their views.

Of course, when it comes to sex, I am a bit sensitive and immature....

And of course, I didn't mean anything of the sort. I think I must have exaggerated my views a little...

 

[VwllssWndr]

And Adymus, to answer your question, it just feels wrong to fuck a friend.

Why? What's the big deal? Isn't the "ideal relationship" supposed to be with someone whom you consider to be your best friend anyway? Sexual tension and chemistry are powerful forces. Sometimes stuff happens...does that make it wrong? Would you think less of a friend if something sexual happened with them?

 

[VwllssWndr]

What? I don't think I said anything about women, or gigolos, or strip shows so I have no idea why you are exposing me to all this sexual information.

Uhhh, no, that was in response to Beat Mango, who mentioned prostitution as an example that women have different sexual needs than men. Did the quote box not appear or something?

 

[ashitaria]

The burden of proof is actually on you to explain why one activity is different morally from another. Teaching logic FTW! Again I ask how is sex different from a seeing a movie? And as far as claiming not be stating a belief you clearly were. ypu said, "what....the....fuck" that is clearly a statement trying to convey belief it was just done very poorly.

Ah hem...did I say in my post that sex is different from seeing a movie? No, I did not. So I have no idea why you are asking me to prove something like that.

And that "what...the...fuck" was more of an exaggerated awestruck type of reaction for the purpose of humor, not a belief, damn it. Also, what you see "clearly" is subjective again. People might have seen my response in different ways than you did.

And that "burden of proof" part...ridiculous. Does it really require any proof to explain why killing someone is worse than hitting someone? Does it really require any proof to explain why being married and having sex is worse than only keeping sex within the premises or marriage?

 

[onthewindowstand]

Actually the examples do require explaining and guess what they exist! Trying to argue for something as being obvious will never get anyone anywhere. And you are totally backtracking. I think its clear that you exhibited a belief you even admit when you say "awestruck". Still if you are against F buddies can even explain how seeing a movie is different than casual sex?

 

[ashitaria]

Why? What's the big deal? Isn't the "ideal relationship" supposed to be with someone whom you consider to be your best friend anyway? Sexual tension and chemistry are powerful forces. Sometimes stuff happens...does that make it wrong? Would you think less of a friend if something sexual happened with them?

I didn't know that fuck buddies were restricted to only best friends. If I had known so, I wouldn't have responded that vehemently (and again, that was a major exaggeration of how I actually felt. I actually don't give a crap.)

What I was responding to was the idea that you could have sex with your friends and even those you just got to know, without maintaining a commitment. Sounds like date rape to me.

 

[Beat Mango]

Having sex with someone is not the same as seeing a movie with someone, ffs. See a movie with your best friend's girlfriend, then on another day fuck her. See which makes him more angry.

Vwllss, you may be right in that I perhaps underestimate a woman's sexual needs. I must admit I really have no clue about what goes on in their heads.

 

[onthewindowstand]

Dude sex=fun. Friends do stuff that is fun. How is that close to being date rape?

 

[Lobstrich]

eh, i wouldn't judge those who do but personally i haven't/wouldn't. It doesn't seem fair to the other party, it's like that person becomes a commodity for sex.

I've never understood when people say stuff like this.
Why is it always "Sex without feelings is a sad" Etc.

Why is your friend not just a "talk-commodity"?

 

[onthewindowstand]

Having sex with someone is not the same as seeing a movie with someone, ffs. See a movie with your best friend's girlfriend, then on another day fuck her. See which makes him more angry.

Vwllss, you may be right in that I perhaps underestimate a woman's sexual needs. I must admit I really have no clue about what goes on in their heads.

It really doesn't matter what makes him angry. Anything can make someone angry. Besides you are presenting a situation that I never did which makes this reponse kinda worthless. The situation I presented was two friends of the opposite sex go see a movie and then have sex. Both things were fun. Explain how they are different.

 

[ashitaria]

Actually the examples do require explaining and guess what they exist! Trying to argue for something as being obvious will never get anyone anywhere. And you are totally backtracking. I think its clear that you exhibited a belief you even admit when you say "awestruck". Still if you are against F buddies can even explain how seeing a movie is different than casual sex?

I seem to get into debates wherever I go...but oh well.
You have ten minutes window, so I don't have all day to answer your stupid questions. But let's go...

Why do such obvious things need explaining? Why? I see that the only people that need explanations for such things are incredibly stupid (ooooooh...stabbing someone is worse than hitting someone? I never knew that!)

And those obvious answers were to disprove your too open and therefore flawed reasoning of, "The burden of proof is actually on you to explain why one activity is different morally from another" because there are certainly forms of activity that is more immoral than the other, at least in modern society. There's no need for evidence and all that crap to prove that.

And "you think" isn't going to get you anywhere. Though I have to give credit to you for not openly saying that "you know". Also, with your view of whether I am expressing my beliefs or being "awestruck", I can only say:

....*sigh*

For your last question...

Dude, I'm fourteen! How the fuck would I know?

 

[VwllssWndr]

I didn't know that fuck buddies were restricted to only best friends. If I had known so, I wouldn't have responded that vehemently (and again, that was a major exaggeration of how I actually felt. I actually don't give a crap.)

What I was responding to was the idea that you could have sex with your friends and even those you just got to know, without maintaining a commitment. Sounds like date rape to me.

I said none of these things. Mistate my positions to reach conclusions at your own peril.

Wow, for a community of people who are supposedly "rational," I really didn't expect so much damned moralizing. If it weren't for at least a couple of other people in this thread, I might start feeling like the most sexually deviant person on Earth.

 

[onthewindowstand]

I seem to get into debates wherever I go...but oh well.
You have ten minutes window, so I don't have all day to answer your stupid questions. But let's go...

Why do such obvious things need explaining? Why? I see that the only people that need explanations for such things are incredibly stupid (ooooooh...stabbing someone is worse than hitting someone? I never knew that!)

And those obvious answers were to disprove your too open and therefore flawed reasoning of, "The burden of proof is actually on you to explain why one activity is different morally from another" because there are certainly forms of activity that is more immoral than the other, at least in modern society. There's no need for evidence and all that crap to prove that.

And "you think" isn't going to get you anywhere. Though I have to give credit to you for not openly saying that "you know". Also, with your view of whether I am expressing my beliefs or being "awestruck", I can only say:

....*sigh*

For your last question...

Dude, I'm fourteen! How the fuck would I know?

You clearly must not realize the difference that there is between evidence that is easy to come by, and no evidence being needed. It is impossible for something to be innately right; just some things seem like it because it is so easy to defend the said position. Again you need to explain your position as mine is the rebuttal position and I require no proof for it. You on the other hand do. So please do present it or just concede that seeing a movie is no different than casual sex.

And when I was fourteen I understood communication outside of strictly reading and I had regard to context and tone ect...

 

[onthewindowstand]

Ashitaria I just remembered how you recently broke away from christianity. I advice you to cleanse the stupidity that it left from its stay.

 

[Beat Mango]

It really doesn't matter what makes him angry. Anything can make someone angry. Besides you are presenting a situation that I never did which makes this reponse kinda worthless. The situation I presented was two friends of the opposite sex go see a movie and then have sex. Both things were fun. Explain how they are different.

And this is where I stop paying attention. Ridiculous.

 

[ashitaria]

You clearly must not realize the difference that there is between evidence that is easy to come by, and no evidence being needed. It is impossible for something to be innately right; just some things seem like it because it is so easy to defend the said position. Again you need to explain your position as mine is the rebuttal position and I require no proof for it. You on the other hand do. So please do present it or just concede that seeing a movie is no different than casual sex.

And when I was fourteen I understood communication outside of strictly reading and I had regard to context and tone ect...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morality

Read everything on here, and a few things to point out. Things became part of morality for a reason, things were out-waled because they are bad, and are not always subjective to irrational emotions. For example, allowing the rampage of murder is a really, REALLY, bad idea for the sake of the people, economy, and trust of the government. And you know what happens when there is no trust of the government.

Ashitaria I just remembered how you recently broke away from christianity. I advice you to cleanse the stupidity that it left from its stay.

I am assuming that you are not calling me stupid, so be glad I haven't exposed my really sharp and itchy fingers. And your ten minutes is up, so no more questions please.

I have two lab reports to do, three tests to study for, and three months of homework to catch up on.

 

[onthewindowstand]

And this is where I stop paying attention. Ridiculous.

Yet you believe this without reason, logic or thought. Ridiculous.

 

[onthewindowstand]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morality

Read everything on here, and a few things to point out. Things became part of morality for a reason, things were out-waled because they are bad, and are not always subjective to irrational emotions. For example, allowing the rampage of murder is a really, REALLY, bad idea for the sake of the people, economy, and trust of the government. And you know what happens when there is no trust of the government.



I am assuming that you are not calling me stupid, so be glad I haven't exposed my really sharp and itchy fingers. And your ten minutes is up, so no more questions please.

I have two lab reports to do, three tests to study for, and three months of homework to catch up on.

No I am saying that Christianity has diluted you and that you havent purged yourself of it. This is to be expected of any person who has recently stopped believing.

 

[Cavallier]

Fact checking accountant that happens to be my soul at the moment is begging me to make some clarifications...

Date Rape:

Rape of a woman by a man with whom she is acquainted.* The rapist is usually the woman's "date" (escort).
Although there are many possible date rape scenarios, in a common one, the man tries to weaken the resistance of the female by exerting undue psychological pressure upon her or by plying her with alcohol or even by giving her a drug without her knowledge, and then the man forces the woman to have sexual intercourse. Sometimes the woman has no memory of the rape because of the effects of the alcohol or the drug (or because of the traumatic nature of the event itself).

Would-be date rapists have used sleeping pills to sedate their intended victims. In addition to adding sleep-inducing medications to alcohol, date rapists also have combined them with marijuana, cocaine and other drugs.



http://www.medterms.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=12523


*Or women date rape men

 

[s0nystyle]

Fact checking accountant that happens to be my soul at the moment is begging me to make some clarifications...

Date Rape:

Rape of a woman by a man with whom she is acquainted.* The rapist is usually the woman's "date" (escort).
Although there are many possible date rape scenarios, in a common one, the man tries to weaken the resistance of the female by exerting undue psychological pressure upon her or by plying her with alcohol or even by giving her a drug without her knowledge, and then the man forces the woman to have sexual intercourse. Sometimes the woman has no memory of the rape because of the effects of the alcohol or the drug (or because of the traumatic nature of the event itself).

Would-be date rapists have used sleeping pills to sedate their intended victims. In addition to adding sleep-inducing medications to alcohol, date rapists also have combined them with marijuana, cocaine and other drugs.



http://www.medterms.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=12523


*Or women date rape men

but wait! since when did date rape = fuck buddy? Date rape -> no rational consent, whereas fuck buddy -> consent & -=> INSERT BANANA HERE <=-

 

[onthewindowstand]

but wait! since when did date rape = fuck buddy? Date rape -> no rational consent, whereas fuck buddy -> consent & -=> INSERT BANANA HERE <=-

He was responding to people earlier who that it was the same

 

[s0nystyle]

He was responding to people earlier who thought it was the same

im just dumbing it down

edit: FIX'T

 

[Irishpenguin]

Am I the only one who thinks it's fucking hilarious that we're having an on-going intellectual conversation about the concept of "Fuck Buddies"!? I mean , THIS IS INSANE!!! as well as great, Puts a smile right on my face. I mean, there I was, browsing the forum...oh you know the rest.


And now to actually reply to the topic of the thread

As for me personally, I guess I seem to have a more reserved or I guess what some might call "Traditional" view on sex than some of the people that have posted, or have at least developed more of a value on the act of sex. The whole notion of having sex at your fingertips or just having sex for the hell of it is kind of off-putting for me. Okay, not to be a textbook INTP here, but... sex is definitely one of those things where the journey to get to the treasure is what makes it worth so much, and you get a big pay-out at the end and feel all accomplished and what not, along with the obvious orgasm, that's pretty nice too (not that I've actually...done that sort of...*ahem....stuff....)...yea no but seriously, I really haven't.....meh

And the idea that the person that is the Fuck buddy usually being a friend!? That would freak me the fuck out. I mean, I couldn't just see myself having sex with my friend , looking at her through out the day, and just be thinking like

"I just had sex with you...awesome!" <------NOOOO!!!!! I could not be like that, not at all. Now you see where I have seemingly put more of a value on sex throughout my life. And also I believe Cavalier said something about you should look at the person while you're having sex...welp...that would just fuck me up that much more. Cause then my inner-monologue wouldn't have much room for doubt. It would probably go something like

"Did I have sex with her this morning?...nah...that didn't happen"

*Images of the scene come rushing back since I was staring RIGHT FUCKING AT HER.

"No dude, You fucking had sex with her...that totally did happen.....FUCK!!!"

So yea, that's my opinion on...that...


(I have a bad habit of starting long posts when I super tired)

 

[Words]

Why does it matter?

Why question the actions you choose to take? Is it better to have meaning than not? Should life have meaning? Should it be meaningful? your choices.

An event of touch and feel direct temporary pleasure is an event of what use? To succumb to plain sensual desire is what meaning? What is this continuous and repeating, ritual?

Ironically, to me, this "pleasure by itself" is quite senseless action.

I guess what I'm saying is entertainment should only be a small attachment to satisfaction and that a only a variety of meaning and experiences satisfies. But perhaps that's only me.

 

[Kuu]

Oh for google's sake, will everyone stop with the utterly idiotic comments?

Kthnxbye


Once I was close to a relationship of the sort with a friend, but nothing really came of it, mostly because of me aborting mission thinking that she'd be an emotional train wreck based on her history. I occasionally regret this decision.


I, for one, think that fuck buddies would be a most ideal scenario. I do think that sex can be a very intimate thing, and I do think it is possible to be intimate with friends. This whole exclusivity attitude about sex should be a thing of the past... it is the horrible enslavement of healthy and natural tendencies.

Why can't we just enjoy ourselves? I enjoy sharing a good meal with friends, sharing a good trip, indeed sharing a movie or a concert, or a good conversation, so why can't we also enjoy sharing some physical contact? It feels good, makes people happy... and what is wrong with that?

I have distinct and unique attractions to most if not all of my opposite-sex friends, emotionally and intellectually, not just sexually... but that is also a part of myself, a valid part of personal relationships, and due to the current moral attitudes of society it remains unexpressed. Indeed to me it seems to artificially deny friendships from reaching a closer level. There is always this awkward tension and dissatisfaction on both sides, when there could be more intimacy. I would love to caress A, to spoon with C, make out with E, and to fulfill several of M's kinky fantasies, because I enjoy making my friends have a good time, smile and be happy, and me having a good time with them... so why can't we?


Alas, modern society still continues to deny sexuality's essential place in human nature.


Edit: On further thought, I think this might tie in with that other thread about language limiting thought, in that our words used to describe relationships (either friend or lover) preclude the conception of other posibilities. If we had several more words in mainstream use to define "love" and relationships and sexuality, there would be less confusion and more understanding and acceptance. I think.

 

[onthewindowstand]

im just dumbing it down

edit: FIX'T

lol ty for catching the typo

Am I the only one who thinks it's fucking hilarious that we're having an on-going intellectual conversation about the concept of "Fuck Buddies"!? I mean , THIS IS INSANE!!! as well as great, Puts a smile right on my face. I mean, there I was, browsing the forum...oh you know the rest.


And now to actually reply to the topic of the thread

As for me personally, I guess I seem to have a more reserved or I guess what some might call "Traditional" view on sex than some of the people that have posted, or have at least developed more of a value on the act of sex. The whole notion of having sex at your fingertips or just having sex for the hell of it is kind of off-putting for me. Okay, not to be a textbook INTP here, but... sex is definitely one of those things where the journey to get to the treasure is what makes it worth so much, and you get a big pay-out at the end and feel all accomplished and what not, along with the obvious orgasm, that's pretty nice too (not that I've actually...done that sort of...*ahem....stuff....)...yea no but seriously, I really haven't.....meh

And the idea that the person that is the Fuck buddy usually being a friend!? That would freak me the fuck out. I mean, I couldn't just see myself having sex with my friend , looking at her through out the day, and just be thinking like

"I just had sex with you...awesome!" <------NOOOO!!!!! I could not be like that, not at all. Now you see where I have seemingly put more of a value on sex throughout my life. And also I believe Cavalier said something about you should look at the person while you're having sex...welp...that would just fuck me up that much more. Cause then my inner-monologue wouldn't have much room for doubt. It would probably go something like

"Did I have sex with her this morning?...nah...that didn't happen"

*Images of the scene come rushing back since I was staring RIGHT FUCKING AT HER.

"No dude, You fucking had sex with her...that totally did happen.....FUCK!!!"

So yea, that's my opinion on...that...


(I have a bad habit of starting long posts when I super tired)

And i totally would love to have a friend that was a girl and was good looking and ok with the casual sex thing. (sounds like a lot but really) Normally friends like spending time together and casual sex just means two friends will spend even more together

 

[Adymus]

Why question the actions you choose to take? Is it better to have meaning than not? Should life have meaning? Should it be meaningful? your choices.

An event of touch and feel direct temporary pleasure is an event of what use? To succumb to plain sensual desire is what meaning? What is this continuous and repeating, ritual?

Ironically, to me, this "pleasure by itself" is quite senseless action.

I guess what I'm saying is entertainment should only be a small attachment to satisfaction and that a only a variety of meaning and experiences satisfies. But perhaps that's only me.

Dude... What?



Words, I'm going to go ahead and call shenanigans if you are telling me you find deep philosophical meaning in every single thing you do for the sake of pleasure.

"I have a craving for cheese cake, and so I will have some. Not because I like the taste but because it's cheesy and cakey goodness will help me grow mentally and spiritually as a person."

 

[onthewindowstand]

Dude... What?



Words, I'm going to go ahead and call shenanigans if you are telling me you find deep philosophical meaning in every single thing you do for the sake of pleasure.

"I have a craving for cheese cake, and so I will have some. Not because I like the taste but because it's cheesy and cakey goodness will help me grow mentally and spiritually as a person."

All desire is void of any real meaning anyway. People who try to find meaning in mundane things are often just creating meaning for themselves. People love seeing what they want to...

 

[Words]

Dude... What?



Words, I'm going to go ahead and call shenanigans if you are telling me you find deep philosophical meaning in every single thing you do for the sake of pleasure.

It would be an ideal goal to lessen the craving. Hm....I'm sure you realize perfection is impossible.

 

[Deleted member 1424]

'Fuck buddies' is terrible terminology....

I would be very hesitant to enter into a casual relationship, it carries all sorts of risks. I'd have to be able to trust the person not to have or contract an STD, as well not to become emotionally or physically possessive. *sigh* Such people are actually rather rare.

I have been toying with the idea of having a small poly circle, but where can one find open minded individuals who won't actively sabotage such a thing? I have doubts it could even could work in our current society.

meh It's easier to be single.

 

[onthewindowstand]

you actually can't reduce any craving without feeding it. All other "ways" are just suppression and it just comes out stronger when you cant suppress it anymore

 

[onthewindowstand]

'Fuck buddies' is terrible terminology....

I would be very hesitant to enter into a casual relationship, it carries all sorts of risks. I'd have to be able to trust the person not to have or contract and STD as well not to become emotionally or physically possessive. *sigh* Such people are actually rather rare.

I have been toying with the idea of having a small poly circle, but where can one find open minded individuals who won't actively sabotage such a thing? I have doubts it could even could work in our current society.

meh It's easier to be single.

Maybe thats why the INTP forum is for you. LOL! If there is any type that is willing to get STD tested before a fuck buddy deal and then agree not to expose eachother to diseases its a INTP. Amiright!? I suggest you start trying to attract female members of this forum for such a cause.

 

[Adymus]

It would be an ideal goal to lessen the craving. Hm....I'm sure you realize perfection is impossible.

In what way is that Ideal? Why are we not supposed to be indulging in pleasurable activities? And don't pull the moderation card, we are not talking about out of control indulgence.

 

[Words]

In what way is that Ideal? Why are we not supposed to be indulging in pleasurable activities?

Perhaps it's simply my own opinion. But I doubt a life filled of indulgence is one so successful.

And don't pull the moderation card, we are not talking about out of control indulgence.

What or who defines "moderation" or "out of control"? Is "Fuck Buddies" a sign of "out of control"?


A card?

 

[s0nystyle]

"I just had sex with you...awesome!" <------NOOOO!!!!!

thats all i got from your post

 

[Adymus]

And don't pull the moderation card, we are not talking about out of control indulgence.

Perhaps it's simply my own opinion. But I doubt a life filled of indulgence is one so successful.





What or who defines "moderation" or "out of control"? Is "Fuck Buddies" a sign of "out of control"?

Damn it words, I told you not to play the moderation card!

Casual sex is in no way equal to "Life filled with nothing but pleasures of the body." That is like saying you should not eat ice cream at all, because eating too much ice cream is bad for you.

Moderation being defined as not allowing an indulgence become destructive, or get in the way of other aspects of your life.

 

[Words]

Damn it words, I told you not to play the moderation card!


Casual sex is in no way equal to "Life filled with nothing but pleasures of the body." That is like saying you should not eat ice cream at all, because eating too much ice cream is bad for you.

Moderation being defined as not allowing an indulgence become destructive, or get in the way of other aspects of your life.

I see your point...

The "extreme pleasure" I've defined is perhaps an "extreme" itself.

Only for practicality, if one is successful in control, then perhaps.

Though the mindset of this rational idea of not over consumption should not be taken away if one thinks about health and life issues.

Though I still stand with my "extreme" stance of casual sex being an "extreme" and less than of the ideal. By level of subservience towards the pleasure, eating ice cream is not casual sex.

 

[Anthile]

Wow, this thread is bad. Like, really bad.

Personally, I don't think that the concept of the 'fuck buddy' is such a great idea, simply because I very much doubt that people can really separate sex and feelings.

 

[intuitivet]

i totally agree with you. dont care if others do it, but for me i also have to have a connection with the person of some kind

Yes, it just seems wrong otherwise (well, not so much wrong as not-right, haha)

So your friend just randomly asked, "hey want to be fuck buddies?" LOL.

Pretty much, cursed younger male ESFJ that he is (needless to say we were not good friends anyway so him asking was kind of weird)

 

[cheese]

RE movie vs sex:

I think most frienships/non-romantic relationships are defined by the attitude towards each other. Friends do things with; lovers do things to. Movie-going, like most 'friendy' activities, is under the first category, and remains firmly in the activity-pal zone. Sex, however, falls largely under the latter category. There is no third and shared space for interaction to be carried out in*. There is only your space and their space, and activities are carried out directly by one (as opposed to a secondary mediator) with the sole intent of affecting the other. It's intensely personal, as the focus is each other. I think it's definitely a step forward in intimacy and for some people, this is too invasive without a strong emotional bond and trust as a foundation.

*Yes, we "have sex with" and "see movies with" but they are not the same; it's just semantical similarity. The focus is entirely different. Conversations, another major part of friendships/romantic relationships, depending on their subject matter, can be more than simple shared activities (see flirting below). I think most of us would agree that soul-baring and revealing conversations are generally different from watching movies, or talking about the movie you just watched. Sex isn't necessarily (and often isn't) as emotionally intimate as that, but the focus is an intimate one: activity is directed toward the other. I'd say 'masturbating with' is more akin to movie-watching than sex, although again there's an element of direct stimulation involved (mutual arousal).

Of course, there are varying levels of existent intimacy and desired intimacy in friendships, as Kuu pointed out, and I'd wager the depth of the bond corresponds to the amount of doing-to (or doing-for), as this impacts the person directly. Parent-child relationships are a good example, although of course other factors are involved as well.

This is also why flirting, mutual grooming, staring into each other's eyes, etc are such effective modes of bonding. The focus shifts from a shared external point at a mental/emotional distance from the participants, to the participants themselves. Unwelcome flirting or sexual advances are seen as encroaching upon personal territory, which is quite understandable.

Everyone has personal boundaries. Most people are just more willing to cede some territory because of the biological imperative. Those with lower-than-average libidos are perhaps able to see the issue with more clarity - or perhaps it's not an issue of clarity but simply differing needs. Regardless, a lot of the posters here have expressed extreme discomfort at being touched or having their space in any way invaded. Allowing pleasure into the equation doesn't change the fact that you are being made vulnerable; it simply makes you the culprit should you give in.

Of course, this is not to say vulnerability is necessarily bad, but allowing it before adequate levels of trust seems a bad judgement call, and personally I'd be wary of trusting anyone who allows their boundaries to be too easily transgressed - partly because it has possible ramifications for my own.

This isn't just regarding sex, either: friendships and other things follow the same general principles. Any sort of intimacy has to be earned. Intimacy that has not been paid for is dangerous.


(I think I may have jumped a few stones/made a few up in my dangerous crossing of my mental river, and it may well be a different one by tomorrow [ok, it WILL be different], but I've tried to give a fair-ish account of what I think the differences might be, to some people, between shared activity and shared activity.)

 

[Jah]

Hmm...

I am tempted to assume half of the people here have never had casual sex.
It certainly seems that way from the inadequate beliefs that are thrown about concerning it.

Analogy time:
Sex is like Food.
You Crave it.
Your body tells you to go out and get it.
It's an instinct, and your body will reward you for getting it with all sorts of pleasure, as well as giving your immune system a healthy dose of foreign bacteria to up it's efficiency, without getting sick.

Those who play around with Casual Sex and other forms of sex (should) mostly:
1: Take precautions, condoms, the pill, preventive measures.
2: Do it with somebody they know, and if not, More importance on precautions. Esp. Condoms !
3: Enjoy it for fuck's sake. (If you pardon the pun)


There is such a thing as obsession, and yes, that is definitely something to avoid.
But that doesn't mean it is purely bad.

Like the Ice-cream.
Have a little, perhaps make it really good quality so that it's worth the time, and if you take a few precautions, no harm.
If you start eating it off of the street. You're probably in too deep, and should stop.

Sex can be "exploited" to give you health benefits, as well as social benefits (it can up your self-esteem in a major way, bringing you to a point where you assume more social value, appear more confident, and in general, seem more appealing to people, trust me).


As a side note, you will automatically form closer bonds due to the release of oxytocin. This is natural, but it doesn't necessarily have to lead you into an exclusive relationship, though it will probably explain why you may feel a tinge of jealousy if you hear about the other persons escapades.



I'm still miffed as to what is the real question in here, though..
Anybody care to ask/answer ?

 

[onthewindowstand]

Yes, it just seems wrong otherwise (well, not so much wrong as not-right, haha)



Pretty much, cursed younger male ESFJ that he is (needless to say we were not good friends anyway so him asking was kind of weird)

It is really weird that someone who isn't good friends would ask something like that. At first I thought maybe it was that guy on the video you posted a while back. That would have been funny! LOL.

 

[BigApplePi]

Hey everyone just post what you think of em. Are they ok? Do you think they are immoral? Do you like them? Are you neutral about? Just post stuff like that here

Personally I say give it a try and see how far you get. Here is an impersonal observation.

Morally neutral. The issue has to do with desire and satisfaction. Desire and satisfaction are short term and immediate. So after a while the issue becomes stability as conditions of two people change and they are not likely to change in the same way for two people. That is why marriage was invented. Marriage is the prime setup for "fuck buddies" because it promotes stability. Otherwise a great many things have to work right to keep it going.

 

[BigApplePi]

cheese. Excellent discourse.

A comment about boundaries. Boundaries have two sides. We want to keep certain things out. But we want certain things in. In romance, friendships, sex there is an agreement on what we want in. That both agree is all the more pleasing as this is not what happens randomly. There is a possession factor although I don't know how to put it. We "possess" what is inside our boundary. This is pleasing and we want to hold onto it though I'm not sure why.

 

[cheese]

Pi:
Agreed; my point was that generally we're careful about what we let in, but re sex some might see this principle being ignored at the prospect of immediate gratification. (My mainest point though was just addressing the sex = friend-activity thing.)

We want to hold onto it because we're territorial. We don't want to lose what we have (boundary issue) but we'd like to expand if we can (possession issue). Once we have increased our territory, it becomes a boundary issue again - fear of loss, so we set the limits tight.

That's a neat answer anyway; dunno if it's true.

 

[BigApplePi]

Pi:
Agreed; my point was that generally we're careful about what we let in, but re sex some might see this principle being ignored at the prospect of immediate gratification. (My mainest point though was just addressing the sex = friend-activity thing.)

We want to hold onto it because we're territorial. We don't want to lose what we have (boundary issue) but we'd like to expand if we can (possession issue). Once we have increased our territory, it becomes a boundary issue again - fear of loss, so we set the limits tight.

That's a neat answer anyway; dunno if it's true.

We gotta keep this thing neat. Desire, satisfaction, territory, boundary, accumulation, possession, security, expansion, discards, new territory/new boundary, ...

Eating is far less territorial though there is that. Eating is shared. Sex is shared but extremely limited in scope. Movies are in between. There is an element of openness/closedness. Eating and movies are open. Sex is closed. Friendship is in between. Singles are open; marriage is closed. Affairs are in between.

 

[kantor1003]

Ah, just the thread I needed!
How do you guys convert one night lays into fb's? Do you have any usual way of going about it?

Oh, and I obviously don't have any moral objections to it whatsoever. Sex is fun, pleasurable and healthy.