Dont know what to with my life, Very URGENT

[Valentas]

This is an extreme case. I am currently enrolled in two unis, one in my country and other in the UK. In my country I chose medicine while I chose science, biochemistry IN THE UK.

the course of medicine is due to start tomorrow in the other city and I did not even start to pack stuff....I dont know if i want it. Some people say that medicine is bane for intps and i pretty much agree with this. i cannot handle interaction too much. on the other hand, I am not sure if i want study science and put on debt on my shoulders if i decide to dump that path... AnY advice?

I AM EXTREMELY SOBBING AT THE MOMENT...

 

[dala]

Flip a coin, and tell yourself heads you'll do one course, tails the other. Whichever one you hope comes up, do that one.

Good luck.

 

[Valentas]

i did this several times and received 5 herbs in a row which means Uk...But it is stupid to decide like this..

 

[Minuend]

the course of medicine is due to start tomorrow in the other city and I did not even start to pack stuff....I dont know if i want it. Some people say that medicine is bane for intps and i pretty much agree with this. i cannot handle interaction too much. on the other hand, I am not sure if i want study science and put on debt on my shoulders if i decide to dump that path...

First of all, you have already decided what you want to do, now you just have to figure out why you decided it. You know what you most want.

Bane of INTPs? Screw that. INTPs are perfectly capable of learning interaction just like any other human.

Debt? Screw that. What is money anyway? When you get a job you will have money, just a little less that goes to pay your loan.

 

[dala]

You misunderstand me. It's not which one comes up, its which one you want to come up.

 

[Valentas]

I am afraid to not complete degree....because i dont feel my heart is in it. What a failure i am...

 

[Minuend]

Then work for a year or two until you know what you want? You are not 50, are you? There's plenty of time to get a degree. No offence, 50 year olds.

 

[The Gopher]

I am afraid to not complete degree....because i dont feel my heart is in it. What a failure i am...

Yeah so was/(am?) I. The choice was made easy though as I jsut floated around and I ended up in a degree. If your heart isn't in it then I would suggest working. How did you end up enrolled in two uni's anyway? You can interact fine. But if your heart isn't in it you probably won't.

Assuming you are 17/18 starting a year late to go to uni is not at all a problem. You will have more money(if you work) and all this sort of stuff. Although it's unlikely you will find what you love and want to do for the rest of your life in an instant though. What you love might change as well. It's all a horrible mess of horribleness. Have fun!

 

[Valentas]

I am 19, 5 already...thus I feel that I cant skip a year. Eh...i am seriously doomed.

 

[Hawkeye]

I went to uni at 24. When I graduated, I went for a job that had nothing to do with the course I studied (nor was having a degree a pre-requisite to the job). My advertised age on this forum may confuse some and question the validity of this post.


However, my point is it's never too late to change. There are some jobs that have a "minimum age to train" threshold though. You can't take an apprenticeship at the age of 48 for example.

 

[Minuend]

19? That's nothing. You can start your degree when you are 30, 40.

 

[Architect]

@Valentas

Read this, there are two pages

INTP Careers

INTPs: Finding a Career Niche or Interest Area

The INTP

These amazing pages are written by an INTP who is a medical doctor. I can't put my finger on the reference at the moment, but in there he specifically suggests that INTP NOT go into medicine. We might be tempted by it from our haunting inferior Fe, but we'd be better to go into the sciences he suggests.

 

[Minuend]

MBTI is not science.

The OP can't base his life decisions on the recommendation of one person who might even have mistyped himself. Heck, the OP himself might be mistyped. Regardless, there are individual differences and saying someone shouldn't pursue that career due to his type is as crazy as saying Capricorns shouldn't pursue that career because of their type.

 

[Architect]

MBTI is not science.

@Minuend

Yes it is.

The OP can't base his life decisions on the recommendation of one person who might even have mistyped himself.

Then why is the poster coming to an MBTI INTP group to ask the question? Why are YOU answering on the same board? This isn't a happy happy chat room, if neither of you think MBTI is relevant to the issue then you should discuss it elsewhere.

Heck, the OP himself might be mistyped. Regardless, there are individual differences and saying someone shouldn't pursue that career due to his type is as crazy as saying Capricorns shouldn't pursue that career because of their type.

You really are in the wrong place.

Yes MBTI is VERY RELEVANT to this kind of discussion. Obviously the individual needs to make a decision for themselves, using MBTI and these links as relevant information sources. They are free to ignore it, as they are free to ignore half baked milk sop opinions people pull out of their backsides in a public sob fest.

I'm sorry but your suggestion of starting a degree later in their 30's or 40's is a really bad idea. I'm in my 40's, and I would be in a heap of trouble if I had gotten my degrees a few years ago. You absolutely want to get your degree, even if it isn't exactly the right one, in your early 20's. If you don't you miss the window to get yourself set up for life. Also, as you get older, your interests and energy changes; getting degrees (possibly from someone younger than you) is not in the cards. However I didn't highlight this, as the OP is free to listen to your advice or ignore it as OP wishes. Since you called me out I'm returning the favor.

In this case I'm offering hard facts, not opinions, that OP must judge the usefulness of. Type has critical importance for career - especially for an INTP. I'll give a simple, crisp example; would an INTP be happy as a salesman, gardner, or check out clerk? Unlikely.

After a lifetime of observing myself and others I see nothing but MBTI everywhere. I wish I had used it with my personal decisions earlier.

 

[Minuend]

@Minuend
Yes it is.

Source?

I am entitled to an opinion that's not based on MBTI. If we were to leave every forum once there was a difference of opinion, then it wouldn't be possible to be foruming.

There is one sub forum called MBTI and typology and one called INTP. I haven't seen any rule that states that every opinion and question must be grounded in MBTI.

I'm sorry but your suggestion of starting a degree later in their 30's or 40's is a really bad idea. I'm in my 40's, and I would be in a heap of trouble if I had gotten my degrees a few years ago. You absolutely want to get your degree, even if it isn't exactly the right one, in your early 20's. If you don't you miss the window to get yourself set up for life. Also, as you get older, your interests and energy changes; getting degrees (possibly from someone younger than you) is not in the cards. However I didn't highlight this, as the OP is free to listen to your advice or ignore it as OP wishes. Since you called me out I'm returning the favor.

Depends on the individual, like it usually do. I know people in their 30s and 40s who are pursuing a degree. I did not suggest that OP should start their degree then, I said that it is possible. If I were to make a recommendation, I would say that one should focus on what one want to do and wait until one knows, disregarding age all together. Often, it helps to work a year or two to get a feel for what tasks one like and dislikes.

After a lifetime of observing myself and others I see nothing but MBTI everywhere. I wish I had used it with my personal decisions earlier.

Which is a very subjective, biased perspective. The more you look for something, the more you will find it, enforcing the bias.

Since MBTI is science, then shouldn't people get scientifically tested as a type before making huge life decisions from it? How can you know your assumption of someone's type is true?

You don't see any problem with basing one's career on such vague grounds?

 

[Valentas]

Hello, Architect,

I know that you are physicist who works in software development right now? I believe that was important career move...I saw your post about this somewhere.

I have contacted personally with A.J. Drenth via GMail and he said that he does not recommend medicine for INTPs, except INTJ, he said make sure you are not INTJ... :d

My problem is simple: I like many things. I learn stuff on Coursera, Udacity, it is my holiday time while my friends play football outside lol...

I know that science is my path but I still have to choose what science...Medicine is hardcore science as well as biochemistry. My mothers friend who is surgeon and intp said that you can learn interact with people in medicine or if you feel uneasy you can always do research which I suspect I would do.

Problem that I fear the most is my impatience. I immerse myself into subject but I get bored quite fast even reading biochemistry or medicine just for fun.

Also I did incredibly stupid thing: I dropped IT and now I found it the most appealing subject I ever learned. But I could not work it for my whole life to be honest. As well as biochemistry. Also education(formal one in university...) is straight to PhD just to get an opportunity to get a decent job.

Also my ambition is to own business because I have read enough success stories about people who relentlessly waded through all obstacles to achieve financial and emotional success...I have ideas but implementation is far from my craving...I could use a partner here.

Also I have always wanted to experience real world and work somewhere in other country just to feel how it is like. I am not a city person. I am from little town where I spent my whole life.Usually reading...I know a lot about the world but just in theory. And now I see that I am being naive if I feel that I am able to just know stuff when I should use it in practice...I studied like 30 different subjects during my lifetime but still I am not able to decide...( from cryptography to biology lol)

I know that personality is not everything but I am in great fear that I lost interest for everything I ever learned...eh

 

[snafupants]

This is an extreme case. I am currently enrolled in two unis, one in my country and other in the UK. In my country I chose medicine while I chose science, biochemistry IN THE UK.

the course of medicine is due to start tomorrow in the other city and I did not even start to pack stuff....I dont know if i want it. Some people say that medicine is bane for intps and i pretty much agree with this. i cannot handle interaction too much. on the other hand, I am not sure if i want study science and put on debt on my shoulders if i decide to dump that path... AnY advice?

I AM EXTREMELY SOBBING AT THE MOMENT...

@Valentas

The issue only seems artificially pressing. One misstep isn't the end of the world. I guess my advice is to slow down and prioritize personal needs and wants. Postpone medical school in the event that you need more time, assuming the financial repercussions of not postponing are dire.

 

[snafupants]

@Minuend

Yes it is.



Then why is the poster coming to an MBTI INTP group to ask the question? Why are YOU answering on the same board? This isn't a happy happy chat room, if neither of you think MBTI is relevant to the issue then you should discuss it elsewhere.



You really are in the wrong place.

Yes MBTI is VERY RELEVANT to this kind of discussion. Obviously the individual needs to make a decision for themselves, using MBTI and these links as relevant information sources. They are free to ignore it, as they are free to ignore half baked milk sop opinions people pull out of their backsides in a public sob fest.

I'm sorry but your suggestion of starting a degree later in their 30's or 40's is a really bad idea. I'm in my 40's, and I would be in a heap of trouble if I had gotten my degrees a few years ago. You absolutely want to get your degree, even if it isn't exactly the right one, in your early 20's. If you don't you miss the window to get yourself set up for life. Also, as you get older, your interests and energy changes; getting degrees (possibly from someone younger than you) is not in the cards. However I didn't highlight this, as the OP is free to listen to your advice or ignore it as OP wishes. Since you called me out I'm returning the favor.

In this case I'm offering hard facts, not opinions, that OP must judge the usefulness of. Type has critical importance for career - especially for an INTP. I'll give a simple, crisp example; would an INTP be happy as a salesman, gardner, or check out clerk? Unlikely.

After a lifetime of observing myself and others I see nothing but MBTI everywhere. I wish I had used it with my personal decisions earlier.

@Architect

That's not going to cut it around here.

Your laconic conclusion may be true but where's the evidence?

Spoiler

Minuend's preceding statement was that MBTI was not science.

 

[snafupants]

MBTI is not science.

The OP can't base his life decisions on the recommendation of one person who might even have mistyped himself. Heck, the OP himself might be mistyped. Regardless, there are individual differences and saying someone shouldn't pursue that career due to his type is as crazy as saying Capricorns shouldn't pursue that career because of their type.

@Minuend

In Architect's defense, the MBTI is vastly more scientifically validated than astrological type.

 

[Valentas]

Medical school won't cost me anything....just a place to live :"

 

[snafupants]

Medical school won't cost me anything....just a place to live :"

@Valentas

That little intellectual enterprise sounds like fun. Maybe you're simply getting cold feet. I would go to medical school because the worst case scenario is some life experience without the accumulation of serious debt.

 

[Valentas]

I am just undecided individual who has wasted enough time in my life playing unrelated stuff and not stopping to think what I want from life. I am good at biology, chemistry, maths and physics thus I have many options. Also interest in Computer Science is shown too. But I decided that I could learn it by myself. My friend who is CS graduate said that there is nothing you cant learn on your own...

To be honest, if i study medicine, I won't go to primary care. Maybe will do something scientific or after learning programming rite software for medical firms...Yes, my feet are cold even now. I think I need serious stress in order to stop dreaming like working in the most dirty job to understand something...

 

[snafupants]

I am just undecided individual who has wasted enough time in my life playing unrelated stuff and not stopping to think what I want from life. I am good at biology, chemistry, maths and physics thus I have many options. Also interest in Computer Science is shown too. But I decided that I could learn it by myself. My friend who is CS graduate said that there is nothing you cant learn on your own...

To be honest, if i study medicine, I won't go to primary care. Maybe will do something scientific or after learning programming rite software for medical firms...Yes, my feet are cold even now. I think I need serious stress in order to stop dreaming like working in the most dirty job to understand something...

@Valentas

Perhaps you need to move beyond the abstract of interests, talents, and fields and ask what it is you specifically want to do in five, ten, twenty years time. Locate a job that would be satisfying on a daily basis rather than the ideal job - the latter's an unhealthy ideation right now.

 

[Valentas]

The problem is that i am impatient person. I take one subject and learn it day and night if i like it but after that I just dump it and move on...My favorite career would be one which offers a lot of autonomy, not bad salary, as much freedom as possible, ability to express my creativity. I would not like desk job. At least not for a long time. Unless it is a computer in front of my eyes.

 

[snafupants]

The problem is that i am impatient person. I take one subject and learn it day and night if i like it but after that I just dump it and move on...My favorite career would be one which offers a lot of autonomy, not bad salary, as much freedom as possible, ability to express my creativity. I would not like desk job. At least not for a long time. Unless it is a computer in front of my eyes.

@Valentas

Fiction writing, think-tank work, scientific research, and perhaps ESL teaching offer that balance of pay, freedom, and creativity. When creativity and autonomy are involved often the pay boils down to skill and popularity. For instance, singers, writers, and inventors experience an array of annual pay rates based on recognition, usefulness to society, and talent. Those are tough conditions to satisfy, though, especially as work becomes more automatized. Good luck.

 

[Mxs]

Valentas you are too young imo to worry about having wasted most of your life, and it might be better for you to focus on your skills and strengths instead of being so critical of your indecisiveness. Being only 19, and with the potential to get a good education without accumulation of serious debt is a great spot to be in.

Full disclosure , I have had several serious careers, none of which would be considered a good fit for intps. While this has not been the most beneficial for my professional life (as I am sort of starting over at age 30, again), it did allow me to work on aspects of my personality that were weaker and I picked up some extremely valuable skills along the way. That being said, I think a better way to go about it may be to develop in an area where your strengths and interests overlap. I don't think it's necessary to pick something immediately and feel stuck with it, but I would agree with architect that it is better to get something in your early twenties as it can be much more difficult to go back later.

I do know a couple intp types in medicine (both are anaesthesiologists) who like their jobs, but mostly they enjoy the lifestyle it provides and the free time they have to explore other interests. I believe both found med school difficult, and they still find their jobs mundane / repetitive at times but it can be done by an intp.

 

[Valentas]

I have done Tony Robbins test DISC on his website.

What I got is my strengths...

1) Average Aesthetic

You are able to appreciate the benefit for balance and harmony without losing
sight of the practical side of things.

2)High
Economic

Your high drive for economic gain helps provide motivation through long
projects and assignments.

Very High
You demonstrate high independence and project self-confidence.
Individualistic

Average
Political

You are flexible, able to take or leave the power or clout that comes with the
job title or assignment.

Low
Altruist

You won't be taken advantage of and protect your own turf and that of the
team or organization.

Average
Regulatory

You are able to balance and understand the need to have structure and order,
but not paralyzed without it.

Very High
Theoretical

You are passionate about learning for its own sake. You are continually in
learning mode and bringing a very high degree of technical or knowledge
base credibility.

 

[BigApplePi]

This is an extreme case. I am currently enrolled in two unis, one in my country and other in the UK. In my country I chose medicine while I chose science, biochemistry IN THE UK.

the course of medicine is due to start tomorrow in the other city and I did not even start to pack stuff....I dont know if i want it. Some people say that medicine is bane for intps and i pretty much agree with this. i cannot handle interaction too much. on the other hand, I am not sure if i want study science and put on debt on my shoulders if i decide to dump that path... AnY advice?

I AM EXTREMELY SOBBING AT THE MOMENT...

After reading this thread my impression is right now indecision is your biggest feeling of the moment. Are you always like this or is it because something is starting tomorrow? If you are predominantly an indecisive person, you could choose that which leaves you the least committment and the most options. What if you went with the medicine thing and then quit in a few months? Is that doable? That doesn't seem like good advice because I don't know you. I think you've already said if people interaction doesn't appeal to you so much, you could go into research. So what's to stop you from going toward medicine then?

 

[Absurdity]

Why not go into a field of medicine that does not require a lot of interaction? If I had to become a doctor, I would choose:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pathology

 

[Architect]

I know that you are physicist who works in software development right now? I believe that was important career move...I saw your post about this somewhere.

Correct

I have contacted personally with A.J. Drenth via GMail and he said that he does not recommend medicine for INTPs, except INTJ, he said make sure you are not INTJ... :d

I agree

My problem is simple: I like many things. I learn stuff on Coursera, Udacity, it is my holiday time while my friends play football outside lol...

Same here, a sign you are an INTP.

I know that science is my path but I still have to choose what science...Medicine is hardcore science as well as biochemistry. My mothers friend who is surgeon and intp said that you can learn interact with people in medicine or if you feel uneasy you can always do research which I suspect I would do.

I'm not recommending one course versus another, you have decide for yourself. I know I wouldn't have liked medicine ultimately unless perhaps I was doing research, and probably not even then.

Also I did incredibly stupid thing: I dropped IT and now I found it the most appealing subject I ever learned. But I could not work it for my whole life to be honest.

Medicine is IT too, most fields now are. I would have said the same when I was your age, when I got older I realized IT is the best solution and am happy to work in it my entire life.

Source?

It's a subset of psychology which is a social science. Do I really need to spell that out? The onus is on you to demonstrate it isn't a science, or to at least have left well enough alone.

I am entitled to an opinion that's not based on MBTI.

I never said you didn't. You were the one calling me out, saying that a response involving MBTI was inappropriate. I called BS on that. Ultimately the OP did contact the owner of PersonalityJunkie for further information, which validates that I was giving good advice.

Listen peeps - finding a path through life is the hardest thing an INTP has to do. I still struggle with it, we always have the Siren call of Fe telling us there might be something else ... I'm an old, hardened INTP, and I'm raising an INTP son (what is with that?), so I've taken up the INTP condition as a serious study so I can help him find his path sooner than I found mine.

My advice is ... keep listening to your Siren (well you can't help it anyway), but don't follow it. Pick a major, don't worry about it too much, and get on with life. Old age will catch up with you before you decide otherwise.

 

[Valentas]

Architect, I decided to take risky route - science. I promise to not change my mind from now officially until i see what it is in my own view. I have one doctor - dentist - in my family, grandmother but she has never pressured me into medicine. Also she is totally different person than me. She likes chatting, routine work while I'm impatient, reading maniac of new stuff, and not sociable. But I promise to work on this. I'll join toastmasters to increase my self-confidence. I may not like it but I must break through my shell and comfort zone. I chose medicine because my parent mentioned me that she wanted to do this. Thus I may be influenced by my mother's opinion. I had a talk with her and she even offered to take time to think through this and fly to another country to work and see some world.

I don't want this. I am already 19 and will turn 20 on January and I know science is my choice. It has always been, I spent my days reading through insane amounts of books, encyclopedias, and I prefered to read them instead of socializing a lot more. My bookshelf is full of science magazines some are over five-year old...

Architect, is it possible to learn CS on my own? I already found resources for physics(theoretical) and I may study it for my dumb head to understand that I did not leave it alone...

 

[Fukyo]

Same here, a sign you are an INTP.

I have to chime in here. How much of your ideas about what an INTP is are based on yourself? That would be a very biased position. It could be a sign he's an INTP, but also any other Intuitive or a lead Perceiver, if we were to generalize in terms of typology.

What I'm trying to say here is that I realize you have good intentions in advising the youngsters, and I realize you feel confident in the light of your own experiences but I find your confidence from an outside perspective a bit misguided, since there's no guarantee what worked for you will work for others, and I don't believe everyone here is accurately typed.

 

[Minuend]

It's a subset of psychology which is a social science. Do I really need to spell that out? The onus is on you to demonstrate it isn't a science, or to at least have left well enough alone.

Arguments from ignorance

I never said you didn't. You were the one calling me out, saying that a response involving MBTI was inappropriate. I called BS on that. Ultimately the OP did contact the owner of PersonalityJunkie for further information, which validates that I was giving good advice.

So, if a religious person gets another person to believe, that validates that belief?

Listen peeps - finding a path through life is the hardest thing an INTP has to do. I still struggle with it, we always have the Siren call of Fe telling us there might be something else ... I'm an old, hardened INTP, and I'm raising an INTP son (what is with that?), so I've taken up the INTP condition as a serious study so I can help him find his path sooner than I found mine.

My advice is ... keep listening to your Siren (well you can't help it anyway), but don't follow it. Pick a major, don't worry about it too much, and get on with life. Old age will catch up with you before you decide otherwise.

People tend to try to live up to certain behaviours they think are expected of them. It quickly turns into a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Many are helped by the myers briggs, but many are also striving to be something they are not because of it.

 

[Valentas]

I tested as intp on variety of tests also in A.J. website. However I could take more than one of four descriptions of each section and I received occasional E one time and one S. But overall INTP...

 

[intpz]

Well... The initial post an the title indicates F-ness to me. Other than that, definitely a strong P.

Anyway, I'd say decide for yourself. That's what I'd do. I'd have a decision made prior to the deadline and a few different plans for various outcomes of what I'm gonna do with it when the date arrives. You had at least 2 months for that, which is plenty of time to gather all the facts necessary to make a solid decision with less potential for a mistake.

 

[Valentas]

I gathered so much evidence on both routes, talked to postoctoral researchers, been invited to lab, they let me work on PCR, look through 250k pounds microscope and stuff...it was interesting but not mind-blowing.

Yes, I am sensitive person but only when issue targets me. I am completely indifferent to other people, except my close ones for whom I can give all myself completely.

I never use my feelings as a main guiding point because I read like million forums pages about INTP careers, questioned a lot of them and even chatted with one who left her M.D. on her wall...to join biotech and start over. Ill tell you honestly: I would do medicine for money(not for fame, I prefer my small room and encyclopedias) to retire early or at least run my own clinic for other doctors to work for me...while I learn astrophysics or something

 

[intpz]

After reading that, I've made an assumption that you've made a big mistake somewhere along your thinking process regarding this issue.

 

[Architect]

I have to chime in here. How much of your ideas about what an INTP is are based on yourself? That would be a very biased position. It could be a sign he's an INTP, but also any other Intuitive or a lead Perceiver, if we were to generalize in terms of typology.

If you read my other posts above, unlike others here, I'm mainly providing information.

Arguments from ignorance

Ad Hominem. Instead of showing that it isn't a science you turn it on me. At any rate a psychiatrist friend of ours believes it is science and uses it frequently, but I'll expect that isn't good enough for you.

Regardless our petty little fight here is pointless and I won't continue it.

I tested as intp on variety of tests also in A.J. website

OP seems to believe he's an INTP.

 

[Minuend]

How is pointing out a logical fallacy a personal attack? The burden of proof is on you.

MBTI validity

Should I prove the non-existenve of gods too while I'm at it?

Of course the opinion of one man doesn't prove anything. There are scientists who believe in god, after all.

 

[NinjaSurfer]

follow your heart

 

[Words]

"MBTI is not a science." taken literally, this is true. But Architect appeals to context by stating that seeing as how this is an MBTI forum, that is irrelevant and we should consider it true("sciency") anyways.

i think questioning MBTI or any type theory is always relevant, especially when it influences someone's life greatly. The quality of "being science", for many, is synonymous to "being certain." MBTI is not science therefore it is not certain, so don't take it so seriously.

That said, i personally don't care if something is science or not. If it makes sense to me or at least sense that it is describing something real, which i sense it somewhat does, then i'm cool with it. The only real problem, for me, is finding the most accurate, strict and concise definition or the best perception of the actual phenomenon, not MBTI per se. Most people, i find, are not even looking at it(simply following vague descriptions and gross generalizations), which, i think, creates the real problem amongst people that subscribe to this.

Oh and @OP don't do medicine. Please don't. It's bad for your critical thinking. It's just procedures and boxed thinking. I have a certified(yea, im really sure) INTP friend who did medicine and reported this to me. Said person went to computer science. Science, yea. Better for the questioning abstract mind (not necessarily the INTP mind.)

 

[Minuend]

It's interesting, because even if MBTI was more established in society, I would probably be one of those rooting for people to break out of their boxes and stereotypes, to live their life free of it.

Don't let anyone tell you how you are supposed to be and what you are supposed to love.

 

[pjoa09]

It's interesting, because even if MBTI was more established in society, I would probably be one of those rooting for people to break out of their boxes and stereotypes, to live their life free of it.

Don't let anyone tell you how you are supposed to be and what you are supposed to love.

It's just a suggestion.

Personally I don't know how OP likes medicine anyway. Biology was interesting but by the time I was studying Zoology I started to realize a mistake.

Now I can't stand the sight of anything related to medicine.

Maybe it is predicted in MBTI that OP might get bored with medicine?

 

[Minuend]

That last one was supposed to represent my attitude if said scenario existed.

 

[Architect]

But Architect appeals to context by stating that seeing as how this is an MBTI forum, that is irrelevant and we should consider it true("sciency") anyways.

No, that is not what I said.

I was taken to task for suggesting MBTI as relevant to the discussion. As an aside an assertion was made that MBTI isn't science. My reply about this being an MBTI forum was about the relevance of my reply, not about it being science or not. The MBTI as science thing was a different discussion.

What is interesting is that even in a case like this where the entire conversation is in print, people keep on getting the facts wrong. People are jumping on me for telling OP about MBTI, when this is an MBTI forum, and I'm not suggesting he necessarily follow it. I'm giving information only.

It's a hot button of mine when people blame me for something when it's due to their own lack of due diligence or understanding. This thread has entered some weird alternate reality.

 

[Minuend]

I never blamed you for anything. I said that it was crazy to base one's life on that. I never said you were crazy. I haven't taken anything you've said personally, and I have not attempted to attack you personally. I think you overreacted to my opinion.

 

[Words]

No, that is not what I said.

I was taken to task for suggesting MBTI as relevant to the discussion.


As an aside an assertion was made that MBTI isn't science. My reply about this being an MBTI forum was about the relevance of my reply, not about it being science or not.

People are jumping on me for telling OP about MBTI, when this is an MBTI forum, and I'm not suggesting he necessarily follow it. I'm giving information only.

I see. I did think about having misinterpreted your position, as I often do to many. I think I tried to make sense of it in relation to the "MBTI is a science" statement. But sometimes, the best method for clarification is through "guess and check." Declaring an answer, accurate or way off, and allowing that answer to be filtered through.

It's a hot button of mine when people blame me for something when it's due to their own lack of due diligence or understanding.

I can relate to this, so I do apologize.

The MBTI as science thing was a different discussion.

hmm...

--

Perhaps we could say that the point of argument is about the "relevance of MBTI."

1. MBTI is a not a science, therefore MBTI is irrelevant.
2. This is an MBTI forum and MBTI information could be good information, therefore MBTI is relevant.

Or perhaps this is a marginal argument. How relevant is MBTI?

Again, I might be way off.

 

[Valentas]

Well, a lot of stuff frightens me too about science. And this is going on for quite long time

http://wuphys.wustl.edu/~katz/scientist.html
http://perdidostreetschool.blogspot.com/2012/07/push-for-science-majors-but-lots-of.html

I had a confirmation about this from my relative at MIT in Physics too....

 

[Architect]

Well, a lot of stuff frightens me too about science. And this is going on for quite long time

http://wuphys.wustl.edu/~katz/scientist.html
http://perdidostreetschool.blogspot.com/2012/07/push-for-science-majors-but-lots-of.html

I had a confirmation about this from my relative at MIT in Physics too....

Yes I agree. I ditched out of a PhD physics program at one of the top five, my phd was to add a few digits to an already known many digit number. One of my undergrad profs was visiting and we chatted about things, he was pretty bitter about the prospects in fundamental science. This was the start of the dot.com, and a punk engineer with a few years in an easy engineering program could start making twice as much as a physicist. A theoretician told me to only go into it if I wouldn't be happy doing anything else.

With trepidation that the MBTI police will get on me for saying this, I don't think doing science is the ticket for most INTP's. Certainly Einstein - the poster child of INTP - had a wonderful, perfect INTP life. But the rest of us wouldn't get that. Kiersey in Personology (his latest book) prefers the name "Designer" to "Architect" for the INTP. This implies a degree of building, which I believe exists in the INTP psyche. At any rate the golden period in designing new Physics theories was 100 years ago.

I would encourage all INTP's starting out to take a serious look at IT of one form or another. Again, decide for yourself blah blah.

 

[Valentas]

Is this situation everywhere in the world? I know that Switzerland is not bad for PhDs because you are at least guaranteed employment when you complete your doctoral degree...One of our hm...famous scientists in biochemistry works here and he said he will never back to USA or our home country...I suspect he is lucky. I understood one thing today: economics rules because as an article says, there are twice as many PhDs educated only in the USA and a lot are coming from other countries too...Sad.

Architect, how did you manage to transfer to IT then? Did you complete degree or taught yourself?