INTPs - lackeys?

[intpz]

Been discussing today about introverts, extroverts, and all that crap with one guy today. In his opinion, if you are an I and often if P, you are likely to work for somebody, are are likely to be taken advantage of.

Personally I haven't achieved anything, and I'm not likely to due to the situation in my country, however otherwise, I wouldn't want to work for somebody, instead I'd like to be the guy who people work for. I also don't believe in "doing what you're told," if I'd be a programmer and my boss would tell me to do statistics or help the other guys bring in 20 new tables and 30 new PCs, I wouldn't do that. Exception - extra pay.

 

[miggslives]

I could see it being true. I am very against being told what to do, which is why religion is such a struggle. I totally support the principles behind religion, but I absolutely hate the fact that it's some guy telling me how to run my life, so I completely reject religion. Same with authority. But at the same time, I try hard to blend in and meld in with what "everyone" is doing, and I won't try to stand out until I absolutely have to, or my personal boundaries have been crossed.

And if I am leading I want to be 100% confident that I can do the job. If for any moment I have a second guess at my abilities, I will immediately want someone to tell me what to do. I am always analyzing the impending doom or the eminent failure if I fuck up decision making, so I end up wanting someone to just tell me what I should do.

I'd say it depends on the task at hand. If it is something that requires spontaneous leadership and good improvisation, I would do horribly and want someone else to lead me. But if it is a task I can sit for hours and think about and analyze ahead of time, then yes I believe I would be the best to lead after having broken it down in my head beforehand.

 

[Solitaire U.]

Exception - extra pay.

So then you fancy yourself a whore rather than a peasant slave? I'm struggling to come up with a comparative adjective that fits such a scenario.

If I am indeed an 'INTP', then the INTP-ish thing to do would be to tell your boss to go fuck himself, go home, and starve in useless, stubborn bliss.

 

[intpz]

I could see it being true. I am very against being told what to do, which is why religion is such a struggle. I totally support the principles behind religion, but I absolutely hate the fact that it's some guy telling me how to run my life, so I completely reject religion. Same with authority. But at the same time, I try hard to blend in and meld in with what "everyone" is doing, and I won't try to stand out until I absolutely have to, or my personal boundaries have been crossed.

And if I am leading I want to be 100% confident that I can do the job. If for any moment I have a second guess at my abilities, I will immediately want someone to tell me what to do. I am always analyzing the impending doom or the eminent failure if I fuck up decision making, so I end up wanting someone to just tell me what I should do.

I'd say it depends on the task at hand. If it is something that requires spontaneous leadership and good improvisation, I would do horribly and want someone else to lead me. But if it is a task I can sit for hours and think about and analyze ahead of time, then yes I believe I would be the best to lead after having broken it down in my head beforehand.

Actually I'm not trying to blend in, I'm okay with expressing my opinion. I put my boundaries very far. You say "may god be with you," I can start a discussion saying "god doesn't exist."
However I can agree with the decision part. I'm more and more working on neglecting that feeling, so even if I do fuck up, I still make the next decision by myself. I find that others making decisions for you is often worse, and besides - it means LISTENING TO SOMEONE ELSE, an authority figure!

So then you fancy yourself a whore rather than a peasant slave? I'm struggling to come up with a comparative adjective that fits such a scenario.

If I am indeed an 'INTP', then the INTP-ish thing to do would be to tell your boss to go fuck himself, go home, and starve in useless, stubborn bliss.

Sure, if you put it this way. Do you have the same opinion about work - slavery or being a whore? Extra pay means extra work, to put it in numbers, $50 for half an hour of carrying heavy tables and PC cases, I've no objections to that. Of course depends on my salary, if it was $90k a year, I wouldn't do it for $50, as I'd get that in roughly the same time by not moving from my chair, but if it was $30k a month, why not get half day's payment in half an hour?

My conversation would go a bit differently:
"Come help us with the new tables and PCs."
"How much?"
"Huh?"
"How much extra for the work that ain't in my contract?"
*laughs*, "Nothing?"
*Something nitty along the lines of "go fuck yourself."

 

[Ruvr]

Be a motivational speaker.
It works with an INTP cousin of mine.

No boss, no strict working hours, no need to actually tell people to go fuck themselves if you find it troublesome to think of a nicer mean to say it while still delivering what you wanted to deliver...so it's a win-win.

 

[intpz]

I actually thought about that. It's more fitting for an ENTP though, but I quite liked the idea to talk about stuff. I'm kinda negative about things though, so being a motivational speaker on an anti-traditional stuff, like government, wouldn't go very well with our government. Last time someone did something like that, he and quite a few of his listeners went to the hospital for a couple months.

 

[Architect]

One of the problems with being a younger INTP is that your analysis can kill your opportunities before you get started.

What if I told you that you could have a job making 150k+ in 10 years, where you have liberal autonomy, respect from your management, and work on interesting problems writing software? All you have to do is start at the beginning and pay your dues, which means coming through and delivering for those ten years. It's not a hard skill to learn.

When you're young is the time to hustle and explore all your opportunities until one of the them pans out. Don't cut it off early with premature analysis.

 

[intpz]

Actually I'd rather create my own things, i.e., people working for me, instead of doing tasks I'm asked to do. That's kinda J-ish of me, when I'm a P. It's a matter of letting my creativity out, not the ability to write 100k lines of sort-of messy code. So even having management ain't a good option, unless the management gives me freedom of such a level that I can do what I want anyway, which means my own projects.

A bit off-topic: my teacher at school always used to say that my code's odd, "nontraditional." I like that. I like writing 20 lines shorter code that works just as well, and being done with the nonsensical software earlier that anyone else.

 

[Eris]

Been discussing today about introverts, extroverts, and all that crap with one guy today. In his opinion, if you are an I and often if P, you are likely to work for somebody, are are likely to be taken advantage of.

Personally I haven't achieved anything, and I'm not likely to due to the situation in my country, however otherwise, I wouldn't want to work for somebody, instead I'd like to be the guy who people work for. I also don't believe in "doing what you're told," if I'd be a programmer and my boss would tell me to do statistics or help the other guys bring in 20 new tables and 30 new PCs, I wouldn't do that. Exception - extra pay.

INTPs tend to be logical and not into authoritarian hierarchies.

The kind of person who takes orders does so to get along with a group structure and hopefully rise in it. That's more S and J ("Guardian") really.

I figured when I was a kid that I would either be egalitarian or on top of a hierarchy but most people didn't know what they were doing so I wouldn't be inside a hierarchy.

Som INTPs make a lot of money doing logical technical work but they're usually either smart or enough to avoid taking orders. Overall we tend to be either smart or nonconformist enough to avoid taking orders.

I and P basically means someone who is thinking more inside and not likely to agree to strict simple judgments, so I think overall the person you were talking to has the wrong impression.

I don't know how long I'll be on this forum as my email addresses were banned so I had to use someone else's. While I am here I would like to use these unusual smilies:

 

[Cognisant]

Overall we tend to be either smart or nonconformist enough to avoid taking orders.

Yeah, working for someone else is fine as long as I don't also have to work with them, or they're the sort of person I can work with without them telling me what to do.

Perhaps I'm an ENTP but employers like me for my ability to finger out what they're trying to achieve and autonomously pursue it, I don't need to be managed, just told what needs doing.

 

[Duxwing]

One of the problems with being a younger INTP is that your analysis can kill your opportunities before you get started.

What if I told you that you could have a job making 150k+ in 10 years, where you have liberal autonomy, respect from your management, and work on interesting problems writing software? All you have to do is start at the beginning and pay your dues, which means coming through and delivering for those ten years. It's not a hard skill to learn.

When you're young is the time to hustle and explore all your opportunities until one of the them pans out. Don't cut it off early with premature analysis.

Yes, analysis, analysis, it kills all the feelings, but I can't stop! Apart from that, your post is good advice.

-Duxwing