young enfp, changed to entp, now intp

[sorenlaw]

Law, 45, male, married, no kids, one dog
I like the discussions so far, its nice to be among thinking people. They are rare in my circles.

I was an enfp for a long time, with a real weak f. Then I grew up and became a moderate t. But I just tested again and as I suspected my obsession for the past few years in academics has happily made me an i. I finally feel at home. It's been a long journey.

 

[Systems]

You changed outward behaviour - not type.

 

[Architect]

You changed outward behaviour - not type.

Correct. The true test is the functions, do you spend most of your time in Ti?

Anyhow, how do you like law?

 

[NinjaSurfer]

Law, 45, male, married, no kids, one dog
I like the discussions so far, its nice to be among thinking people. They are rare in my circles.

I was an enfp for a long time, with a real weak f. Then I grew up and became a moderate t. But I just tested again and as I suspected my obsession for the past few years in academics has happily made me an i. I finally feel at home. It's been a long journey.

...is that self-jab at the legal profession?

 

[Intellect]

Welcome home.

By the way, I love Kierkegaard's work. Which are your favorite books/essays?

 

[redbaron]

...is that self-jab at the legal profession?

Sounds more like a jab at circles to me.

 

[pjoa09]

Sounds more like a jab at circles to me.

Sounds more like.. damnit. Was going to say professionals then you have to consider the fact that he might have friends that are not lawyers or of that sort.

But if there is a circle with legal professionals that includes him then he's definitely jabbing at his peers.

It's impossible to go ENFP to INTP. You must have not read the definitions or something. ENFPs in my experience, are attention-desperate spiritualists. They only feel comfortable when they are the center of attention and everyone is listening to their unstructured bullshit.

Okay, might have been a bit of a rant.

 

[Solitaire U.]

45...nice. You should definitely start a thread concerning MBTI as a self-modifiable concept. I think a lot of 'Typology enthusiasts' are fearfully opposed to that idea.

Welcome.

 

[snafupants]

45...nice. You should definitely start a thread concerning MBTI as a self-modifiable concept. I think a lot of 'Typology enthusiasts' are fearfully opposed to that idea.

Welcome.

@Solitaire U.
@sorenlaw

The confusion appears to stem from the conflated meaning of two separate terms - social introversion and cognitive introversion. That said, I'd definitely be interested in hearing an elaboration of that theory.

The weak feeling comment leads me to think that this person overly subscribes to the four letter interpretation of the MBTI to the detriment of the cognitive processes.

For this reason and in my estimation, flipping the second and first cognitive processes and the third and fourth cognitive processes (i.e., ENTP to INTP) is the more plausible transition, presupposing a veritable transition, which I'm really not at this point.

I'm also doubting ENFP initially, presuming INTP now, because, unless it's some outcropping of law dealing with civil rights or social justice, jurisprudence is much more ENTP friendly. The socratic method is undeniably more geared towards an ENTP than an ENFP.

 

[sorenlaw]

Sounds more like.. damnit. Was going to say professionals then you have to consider the fact that he might have friends that are not lawyers or of that sort.

But if there is a circle with legal professionals that includes him then he's definitely jabbing at his peers.

It's impossible to go ENFP to INTP. You must have not read the definitions or something. ENFPs in my experience, are attention-desperate spiritualists. They only feel comfortable when they are the center of attention and everyone is listening to their unstructured bullshit.

Okay, might have been a bit of a rant.

My names is "Law", im not a lawyer. I'm a teacher and would like to go to Harvard Extension School for my MA in Government or something else at this late age.

there is good amount of truth to what you say "attention-getting" blah regarding enfp. The current president is an enfp. enfp's in my experience, typically have a weak f or a strong one, usually girls.... I was always close to the middle. I was also a weak e. But I felt myself to be a bit stary eyed. Some enfp can be more intellectual then you might think, but some are NOT, stong f's and e's.

Anyways, I do feel a bit more confident about my type now. I really never wanted to be an intp. They seem socially out of touch, But given my improved understanding of society's superficial nature , that's not such a bad thing. They seemed focused on minutia at the expense of the big picture, this is simply not true regarding myself and I suspect many others of you. However I like minutia, especially if it serves my larger understandings.

years of independent study, history, philosophy mainly, but lately economics, have made me question the validity of my conservative religious beliefs. The beliefs that perhaps made me break the enfp way. I know this is new to some of you but this is my true experience.

Ive been reading Unscientific Postscripts, really great stuff.

Thanks for all your comments, look forward to more thoughtful discussions

 

[snafupants]

My names is "Law", im not a lawyer. I'm a teacher and would like to go to Harvard Extension School for my MA in Government or something else at this late age.

there is good amount of truth to what you say "attention-getting" blah regarding enfp. The current president is an enfp. enfp's in my experience, typically have a weak f or a strong one, usually girls.... I was always close to the middle. I was also a weak e. But I felt myself to be a bit stary eyed. Some enfp can be more intellectual then you might think, but some are NOT, stong f's and e's.

Anyways, I do feel a bit more confident about my type now. I really never wanted to be an intp. They seem socially out of touch, But given my improved understanding of society's superficial nature , that's not such a bad thing. They seemed focused on minutia at the expense of the big picture, this is simply not true regarding myself and I suspect many others of you. However I like minutia, especially if it serves my larger understandings.

years of independent study, history, philosophy mainly, but lately economics, have made me question the validity of my conservative religious beliefs. The beliefs that perhaps made me break the enfp way. I know this is new to some of you but this is my true experience.

Ive been reading Unscientific Postscripts, really great stuff.

Thanks for all your comments, look forward to more thoughtful discussions

I wouldn't conclude that whatsoever about INTPs - where are you getting this information?

 

[pjoa09]

My names is "Law", im not a lawyer. I'm a teacher and would like to go to Harvard Extension School for my MA in Government or something else at this late age.

there is good amount of truth to what you say "attention-getting" blah regarding enfp. The current president is an enfp. enfp's in my experience, typically have a weak f or a strong one, usually girls.... I was always close to the middle. I was also a weak e. But I felt myself to be a bit stary eyed. Some enfp can be more intellectual then you might think, but some are NOT, stong f's and e's.

Anyways, I do feel a bit more confident about my type now. I really never wanted to be an intp. They seem socially out of touch, But given my improved understanding of society's superficial nature , that's not such a bad thing. They seemed focused on minutia at the expense of the big picture, this is simply not true regarding myself and I suspect many others of you. However I like minutia, especially if it serves my larger understandings.

years of independent study, history, philosophy mainly, but lately economics, have made me question the validity of my conservative religious beliefs. The beliefs that perhaps made me break the enfp way. I know this is new to some of you but this is my true experience.

Ive been reading Unscientific Postscripts, really great stuff.

Thanks for all your comments, look forward to more thoughtful discussions

First off, honest mistake. Would have not guessed that your name is Law.

INTPs are always focused on the big picture, they tend to ignore details. Except, when I am under stress I tend to start obsessing over little details.

Also I don't think you can't like being INTP. It's just a set of preferences. An introvert tends to be exhausted by socializing. An extrovert tends to be exhausted by solitude. Just by communicating more you are not an extrovert. In the end if you are swearing at people in your own time and asking them to get out and leave you alone then its very likely you are an introvert.

Mid-life crisis maybe? Just a shot in the dark. I mean, something has to be there to change religious beliefs.

 

[snafupants]

First off, honest mistake. Would have not guessed that your name is Law.

INTPs are always focused on the big picture, they tend to ignore details. Except, when I am under stress I tend to start obsessing over little details.

Also I don't think you can't like being INTP. It's just a set of preferences. An introvert tends to be exhausted by socializing. An extrovert tends to be exhausted by solitude. Just by communicating more you are not an extrovert. In the end if you are swearing at people in your own time and asking them to get out and leave you alone then its very likely you are an introvert.

Mid-life crisis maybe? Just a shot in the dark. I mean, something has to be there to change religious beliefs.

@pjoa09

I'm not sure that's exactly how Jung used the terms introvert and extravert.

 

[pjoa09]

@pjoa09

I'm not sure that's exactly how Jung used the terms introvert and extravert.

I must have gotten that off of the forums. I think it's the Myer Briggs definition. In case you'd like a link here it is.

Might have made the assumption that the opposite of energizing is exhausting. That is it. I don't think there is any other problem with that statement.

 

[snafupants]

I must have gotten that off of the forums. I think it's the Myer Briggs definition. In case you'd like a link here it is.

Might have made the assumption that the opposite of energizing is exhausting. That is it. I don't think there is any other problem with that statement.

@pjoa09

Sure but perhaps you should read Psychological Types.

http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=Psychological_Types

 

[pjoa09]

@pjoa09

Sure but perhaps you should read Psychological Types.

http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=Psychological_Types

That is Socionics and I thought OP was referring to Myer Briggs INTP not ILI.

I now understand why you were referring to Jung.

As fascinating Socionics is, it's witchcraft to me. I mean somehow they made wild predictions of how I look and they nailed it and I was scared.

Got to read that stuff at work!

For some reason while I am skimming through it, it doesn't make sense, am I too tired or is stuff challenging to read?

I thought we had some real strict people around here hating on Socionics too.

 

[snafupants]

That is Socionics and I thought OP was referring to Myer Briggs INTP not ILI.

I now understand why you were referring to Jung.

As fascinating Socionics is, it's witchcraft to me. I mean somehow they made wild predictions of how I look and they nailed it and I was scared.

Got to read that stuff at work!

For some reason while I am skimming through it, it doesn't make sense, am I too tired or is stuff challenging to read?

I thought we had some real strict people around here hating on Socionics too.

@pjoa09

Yeah isn't Jung's Psychological Types the source material for MBTI and the cognitive processes?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mbti

 

[eagor]

1. make up your fucking mind

2. welcome to the other side have some refreshments and you can have any corner in the house.

 

[skip]

How does a big picture thinker make it through law school?

 

[Architect]

How does a big picture thinker make it through law school?

Law is described as good for the INTP but I've wondered. Of course individual jobs vary, but then again I suspect lawyer jobs are pretty much alike. The logic and argument would be fun, but yeah no big picture ...

 

[skip]

I meant law school specifically, not law as a career. There's a lot of critical analysis in law school but it also demands quite a lot of memorization of details.

 

[Architect]

I meant law school specifically, not law as a career. There's a lot of critical analysis in law school but it also demands quite a lot of memorization of details.

I know you meant that. Agreed on that point - same for med school.

 

[pjoa09]

@pjoa09

Yeah isn't Jung's Psychological Types the source material for MBTI and the cognitive processes?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mbti

That's like saying isn't Unix the source material for Mac OS X and Linux.

They branched off of the same idea but as far as I can see Socionics became Russian warfare witchcraft to understand personalities. You have to dedicate a few hours to even grasp the beginning of the concept. I mean look at that wall of text! I believe some INTPs are ILIs (intp) and some are LIIs (intj) in Socionics. I am in some ways SLI(istp).

MBTI, basic idea grasped in 5 minutes. In depth maybe an hour if you are slow. Before you know it, you are debating whether it's pseudoscience and typing your dog.

 

[NinjaSurfer]

How does a big picture thinker make it through law school?

My names is "Law", im not a lawyer. I'm a teacher and would like to go to Harvard Extension School for my MA in Government or something else at this late age.[...]

 

[snafupants]

That's like saying isn't Unix the source material for Mac OS X and Linux.

They branched off of the same idea but as far as I can see Socionics became Russian warfare witchcraft to understand personalities. You have to dedicate a few hours to even grasp the beginning of the concept. I mean look at that wall of text! I believe some INTPs are ILIs (intp) and some are LIIs (intj) in Socionics. I am in some ways SLI(istp).

MBTI, basic idea grasped in 5 minutes. In depth maybe an hour if you are slow. Before you know it, you are debating whether it's pseudoscience and typing your dog.

@pjoa09

All right, the Socionics schema is complex. That was never in dispute. I'm contending that the eight cognitive processes used in MBTI came from somewhere, and that somewhere is partly Jung's thought. I'd hoped the link to MBTI would have made that position clear.

 

[pjoa09]

@pjoa09

All right, the Socionics schema is complex. That was never in dispute. I'm contending that the eight cognitive processes used in MBTI came from somewhere, and that somewhere is partly Jung's thought. I'd hoped the link to MBTI would have made that position clear.

That is definitely not in dispute either. I just thought INTPf catered to MBTI rather than Socionics and he is an MBTI INTP not a Socionic one.

 

[snafupants]

That is definitely not in dispute either. I just thought INTPf catered to MBTI rather than Socionics and he is an MBTI INTP not a Socionic one.

@pjoa09

Seriously? That link is to Jung's Psychological Types...not Socionics...not MBTI.

Have you clicked on the hyperlink yet? Damn, this is ridiculous.

There's nothing in that fucking linked page which talks about Socionics.

 

[pjoa09]

@pjoa09

Seriously? That link is to Jung's Psychological Types...not Socionics...not MBTI.

Have you clicked on the hyperlink yet? Damn, this is ridiculous.

There's nothing in that fucking linked page which talks about Socionics.

Okay, my bad. Didn't read the title. Totally missed out the Carl Jung 1921 and ran for the text.

I have been to that website before and that is where I found socionic descriptions for all the personality types. As in this link there are ILI descriptions.

 

[sorenlaw]

Welcome home.

By the way, I love Kierkegaard's work. Which are your favorite books/essays?

Further evidence I am likely in the right place, .... I love S.K. I read around here and there, mostly I like to contemplate a segment or two of his at a time, so deep and insightful. If you like Kierkegaard, you may like Ernest Becker, "Denial of Death" Ive read and reread regularly. Very insightful look at the human condition from a wide field of sources, heavy on the SK. Great to have a fellow SK fan, I think there's about 5 or 6 of us country wide?

As regarding the first comment, Interesting that the first comment was that I changed outside behavior, inotherwards, I have been inauthentic up to testing an intp?

 

[Jennywocky]

As regarding the first comment, Interesting that the first comment was that I changed outside behavior, inotherwards, I have been inauthentic up to testing an intp?

It could be either; I just think your bold assertion that INTP's get caught up in minutia and miss the big picture so much runs against the actual working of the type from a big-picture perspective, that it needs more context to see what you really think an INTP is like.