What is authenticity?

[Absurdity]

Hi friends, Absurdity here with the latest installment of the unfolding existential crisis that is my life.

What is authenticity? What does it mean to be authentic? Obviously the dictionary and thesaurus would say it means to be true, genuine, sincere, etc., which really doesn't help very much, it just tosses around the puzzle pieces that I'd like to fit together.

Wikipedia yields the following (on the philosophical understanding of the concept):

In existentialism, authenticity is the degree to which one is true to one's own personality, spirit, or character, despite external pressures; the conscious self is seen as coming to terms with being in a material world and with encountering external forces, pressures, and influences which are very different from, and other than, itself. A lack of authenticity is considered in existentialism to be bad faith.

The first bit, again, is totally unhelpful to me: being true to yourself strikes me as a tautology. But the second part is more interesting: "the conscious self is seen as coming to terms with being in a material world and with encountering external forces, pressures, and influences which are very different from, and other than, itself."

Is authenticity just a matter of reconciling yourself and your expectations with the realities of the world? If so this seems like this entails two different but not entirely contradictory approaches: mastery of your circumstances and acceptance of your circumstances. This seems to be exactly the meaning of the serenity prayer by Reinhold Niebuhr:

God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.

So if authenticity is about mastering certain circumstances and accepting others, it seems to be a necessary consequence of wisdom. But what is wisdom? How do we acquire it? How does it help one discern one's purpose?

I've read a fair bit of "wisdom literature." The Bible, The Qur'an, Seneca, some introductory Taoist stuff, etc. It's all very general, which makes sense. It is meant to be applicable to all people, across millennia, but as a result it is not a step-by-step Wikihow guide to discerning my purpose life, which I guess is sometimes what I hope for.

I read some of Ignatius of Loyola's letters once. One was to a bright young man who had sold everything he owned and wanted to dedicate himself to an austere life serving God. He asked Ignatius for specifics on what he should do, and Ignatius' response was essentially, "Hey, you're a bright kid. Go somewhere full of life and culture, be attentive, and all will be revealed."

Was this just Iggy's way of telling this kid to fuck off?

I took Iggy's advice anyway. Things in life change slowly, like the movement of a glacier. I'm in a better spot in life than I was a year ago, almost incomprehensibly so, but still these questions nag. I feel an inner uncertainty that has not abated despite worldly success. Even though my achievements are admired by my peers and those close to me, I know I am performing below my potential.

How do you determine what to do with your limited time? Is there anything worth doing? Should you just smoke a joint and take a nap under a tree on a sunny day? Or move to India and help a poor village build a robust sanitation system? Is everything just "a chasing after the wind," as Ecclesiastes says?

This is obnoxious and sophomoric I know. At time's I've thought I'd found an answer to these questions, enough to propel me in an arbitrary but acceptable direction. But the momentum doesn't last. Friction always wins out, and the doubts return. I see people who dedicate themselves to a single idea or purpose, and I cannot comprehend how I could ever do that, even though it could possibly give me the peace I seek.

Feel free to respond to whatever you want here, or just keep going about your day.

 

[QuickTwist]

I'm no guru, so take what I say with a bat of salt if you so wish.

Realize that there is nothing. No matter what you do you will not be fulfilled. Its that whole a body at rest stays at rest and body in motion stays in motion: that kind of thing is garbage. The most important thing you can do is accept YOU, where you are, right now, all the time.

I suggest that you come up with a montre that is centered around acceptance since being self aware all the time is basically impossible. I also might suggest, in your case, not to plan so much. Like that part in Fight Club where Brad Pitt tells Edward Norton to "let go" as they are driving down the road and Tyler proceeds to take his hands off the steering wheel.

It is my understanding that Iggy was telling that boy that there is no secret. Its just about being aware and accepting what is.

And I know you've heard this one, but I think its applicable:

He also said "Be happy, but never satisfied."

 

[Grayman]

This has always been a thing everyone has had to find out for themselves. "Hey, you're a bright kid. Go somewhere full of life and culture, be attentive, and all will be revealed."

Just expose yourself and when you have found your answers then you will be able to settle down and be content.

Since you brought this up I cannot decide if I was lucky to have found my satisfaction so early in life or if I was unlucky to not have exposed myself more the many great things that are available but in my satisfaction I barely give it much thought. There is so much 'life' in the smallest of things. How could I not be satisfied when I have more than the smallest of things? I can barely find the time to soak in all there is to enjoy in even that.

 

[Black Rose]

Authenticity is the harmony between thoughts and actions. The opposite of a divided human soul. Meaning is internal, expression is external. Obligations can hinder you if you do not take the time to take care of yourself first. Responsibility is internal. You decide what is moral and immoral. You begin to embody the Ubermensch.

I have a mood disorder. Sometimes I am at my computer and I just stare. I cannot think what it is I want to do. After high school I had nothing to do for two years. I am still looking for Lifes Meaning and where I can find it.

I do not know if this helps, I am too tired to type right now.

A Free Will Zen Poem

The universe is inside you.
You are inside the universe.
The path of least resistance.
Is the existence without resistance.
We know we exist, we know that we know.
We are the mirror of this reality.
In this mirror we see ourselves.
When you know who you are,
you can act on this truth.
Just let go of control,
and nothing will control you.

 

[onesteptwostep]

Authenticity is not feeling guilty for trying all the samples in Costco for a 3rd time.

 

[Inquisitor]

Are you an INTP or INTJ? And how certain are you in either case?

 

[elliptoid]

The meaning of this term really depends on your philosophical orientation.

Consequentialists might see authenticity as entirely different from deontologists. In either case a philosopher likely views authenticity as the degree to which one's actions reflect their motivations and ethics. A virtue philosophe likely sees authentic deeds as being consistent with their ethical system as well.

Where one could be an objectivist, and view authenticity as goal-directed action consistent with rational self-interest, sufficiently balanced against a subjective valuation of high self-esteem.

 

[Nofriends]

If you live a fully authentic life you can say what you want to say, whenever you want to say it, and do what you want to do anytime you want to do it.
The possibilities are endless, maybe you are driving an emergency vehicle taking someone to the hospital, but because you live an authentic existence you might go stop by at the park to have a picknick, lol JK PLEASE DONT DO THAT!

 

[Absurdity]

Are you an INTP or INTJ? And how certain are you in either case?

In general I personally don't really find the MBTI to be a very useful paradigm for self-understanding. Gun to my head, I'm some sort of INXJ, and the tension here I describe could be the tension between inner Ni world and Se reality.

However I'm still interested in whatever you might have to say on this.

The meaning of this term really depends on your philosophical orientation.

Consequentialists might see authenticity as entirely different from deontologists. In either case a philosopher likely views authenticity as the degree to which one's actions reflect their motivations and ethics. A virtue philosophe likely sees authentic deeds as being consistent with their ethical system as well.

Where one could be an objectivist, and view authenticity as goal-directed action consistent with rational self-interest, sufficiently balanced against a subjective valuation of high self-esteem.

I also don't think this is a very useful paradigm for self understanding. On the one hand, I've always generally had a pretty strong intuitive sense of right and wrong that has served me well in life, and on the other I've never gotten past the core question of meta-ethics (Hume's guillotine) to really bother wondering if deontology or consequentialism or virtue ethics are correct.

 

[Hadoblado]

I think self vs. external pressure is a shitty way of thinking about it. By your nature you bow to external pressure the way you do because you're you. If you oppose your natural tendency to be influenced by external pressures because of an ideology of self (an idea externally implanted in you) you've given up being you in favour of someone else's idea of what being you is about.

Rather, I think authenticity is knowing yourself, and acting in accord with what you actually want. Not necessarily in a hedonistic way, but just not lying to yourself. Resolving dissonance. A con artist who knows what he is strikes me as authentic, even if he'll blow hot air up your arse about his virtue.

I guess this is similar to your notion of wisdom etc. Once you know what you want, you then figure out if it's possible and act in accordance with that want. Wanting something that's impossible is unrealistic, and another form of lying to yourself.

 

[Analyzer]

I think what your looking for is "practical" advice that is not suitable for something like this. Ancient wisdom supports this idea although you mention it being too general. But maybe that's how it's suppose to be. I think what's key is to have some mental compass or philosophical orientation as elliptoid says, in order to navigate your life in the manner which you believe will help get you to this understanding. What does that take though? Courage possibly?

 

[Urakro]

Not entirely sure about all this 'personal authenticity' either. I'm also trying to piece it together.

The first bit, again, is totally unhelpful to me: being true to yourself strikes me as a tautology. But the second part is more interesting: "the conscious self is seen as coming to terms with being in a material world and with encountering external forces, pressures, and influences which are very different from, and other than, itself." Is authenticity just a matter of reconciling yourself and your expectations with the realities of the world?

Even though it's basically just a more verbose version of the first part, the second part is interesting to tinker in thought. The way it's worded emphasizes that personal authenticity is found in the specific circumstances when a person is felt in conflict with the external environment. Or more succinctly, it's those differences between the whole of 'I' and everything / everyone else.

Which in my case is where I most often find I struggle. The things that make me different, being at odds with everything else, is where I face the hard decision of either fighting for, or suppressing those differences.

Or, instead of either fighting or repressing, there's reconciling I suppose. I can see in some ways it being difficult when it comes to reconciling differences with people. A different kind of battle.

But what is wisdom? How do we acquire it? How does it help one discern one's purpose?

I recently read (somewhere) about a meaning and interpretation of sapien, which described it as 'wise', or in it's interpretation of homo sapiens, 'a being which judges'. This sparked a whole bunch of random thoughts, including (and probably part of what I read), that other species are not termed sapiens, just humans. My memory is horrible but I think I also read something about the tree of knowledge, or fruit of the gods or something that went with it. Just want to also throw in a selection from the serenity prayer: "...the wisdom to know...", and it's reference to being able to judge between two choices of action. (Or when applied to other situations, many choices of action).

The end result of my thinking was wondering whether humans actually have the right capacity for judgement. Even on an individual basis, we prefer the easy approach of applying a generalized set of rules to make our judgements easier. But perhaps wisdom, while still retaining complete fairness, is found in judging each situation in it's unique way only with complete information of all its situational properties.

It made me wonder if humans are only 'pseudo-wise' in that we have the ability to often guess, make mistakes, learn, trial-and error, with incomplete information.

I've read a fair bit of "wisdom literature." The Bible, The Qur'an, Seneca, some introductory Taoist stuff, etc. It's all very general, which makes sense. It is meant to be applicable to all people, across millennia, but as a result it is not a step-by-step Wikihow guide to discerning my purpose life, which I guess is sometimes what I hope for.

I read some of Ignatius of Loyola's letters once. One was to a bright young man who had sold everything he owned and wanted to dedicate himself to an austere life serving God. He asked Ignatius for specifics on what he should do, and Ignatius' response was essentially, "Hey, you're a bright kid. Go somewhere full of life and culture, be attentive, and all will be revealed."

Was this just Iggy's way of telling this kid to fuck off?

I took Iggy's advice anyway. Things in life change slowly, like the movement of a glacier. I'm in a better spot in life than I was a year ago, almost incomprehensibly so, but still these questions nag. I feel an inner uncertainty that has not abated despite worldly success. Even though my achievements are admired by my peers and those close to me, I know I am performing below my potential.

How do you determine what to do with your limited time? Is there anything worth doing? Should you just smoke a joint and take a nap under a tree on a sunny day? Or move to India and help a poor village build a robust sanitation system? Is everything just "a chasing after the wind," as Ecclesiastes says?

This is obnoxious and sophomoric I know. At time's I've thought I'd found an answer to these questions, enough to propel me in an arbitrary but acceptable direction. But the momentum doesn't last. Friction always wins out, and the doubts return. I see people who dedicate themselves to a single idea or purpose, and I cannot comprehend how I could ever do that, even though it could possibly give me the peace I seek.

Feel free to respond to whatever you want here, or just keep going about your day.

Those are difficult questions, with many answers depending on the perspective. Maybe those answers are like the 'pseudo-wisdom' that I mentioned above. It's a harder question when applied to self "What is my purpose?", but it seems when others apply it to you, I, or someone else, they merely don't think that hard. For example, the guy who smokes under a shaded tree can be quickly scoffed by others that that's the epitome of his existence.

My guess is that it's all like a song (or a song is alike the purpose). A song's purpose isn't a minor third, but a playful accumulation of transitions and dynamics. A starting, a plot, conflict / contrast, tempo, interest, and resolution. It's all a torturing of the notes for the pleasure of the listeners and the composer.

 

[Inquisitor]

In general I personally don't really find the MBTI to be a very useful paradigm for self-understanding. Gun to my head, I'm some sort of INXJ, and the tension here I describe could be the tension between inner Ni world and Se reality.

However I'm still interested in whatever you might have to say on this.

Only you can know whether or not you are living authentically. That is to say, if you are living your life in such a way that it is a reflection of who you truly are, and not just some image you're trying to live up to. We were all put here to learn lessons, and those will be different for both of us.

Put another way: Do you feel self-actualized or do you feel like you're not living up to your full potential? If not, then by definition, you've missed out.

For me that's the most important aspect of this question. The superficial aspect of "authenticity" ie "not fake" is also important in terms of inter-personal relations. It's important to be genuine, honest, sincere and all that, but I'm more concerned with the spiritual and psychological aspect.

A life where you don't get to make full use of the most highly developed/conscious side of your psyche is a less than full life. That's why I do believe in Carl Jung but not necessarily MBTI and why I asked you the question.

 

[Ex-User (9086)]

"Hey, you're a bright kid. Go somewhere full of life and culture, be attentive, and all will be revealed."

Was this just Iggy's way of telling this kid to fuck off?

Not at all, at least I wouldn't think so. He was trying to show that young guy that he's still young and impressionable and he doesn't really know what he wants or stands for, though given he had made a commitment of this magnitude he had to receive some answer so Ignatius told him to be expansive and open to opportunities, to learn more about his needs.

I see people who dedicate themselves to a single idea or purpose, and I cannot comprehend how I could ever do that, even though it could possibly give me the peace I seek.

Perhaps you aren't the kind of person who wants to do the same? Maybe you are experiencing some kind of envy or peer pressure to conform to others in their specialities and narrowly focused excellence.

I've felt similarly at some point in life, then I decided it's far more important to find contentment and peace in everything I do, even if it means finding it in my dissatisfaction and realisation of my own wasted potential and my acceptance of it.

You might not believe this, but most of the time I feel frustrated or angry with myself I quickly think "oh frustration/anger, it's so human and cute" and I feel happy and relaxed again. That's my sort of way of accepting reality and future.

By asking about authenticity you've essentially asked "what am I". Finding out what you prefer to do, what judgments and actions you find true and right is the correct goal.

Authenticity is achieved by not experiencing anxiety or fears from not being able to understand the self and your desires or actions. Once you are following, acting or "being" is when you forget about what you are, you shed this burden of rationalising and solving those questions once you become comfortable with yourself and your judgment calls and emotions.

It's worth noting that it may be very authentic for you to feel lost or uncertain, or to feel uncomfortable with your inner uncertainty or lack of direction. Perhaps it's time to acquire some kind of drive, or to accept yourself for who you are and find peace in being unsure or unknowing of it all.

The most authentic moments are twofold:
When you forget yourself and when you accept yourself.

If you think about those kinds of (authentic) situations and what you were doing in them, it may give you some useful hints to later use in explaining what and who you are, given enough similar samples.

Acceptance of how you are "now" isn't enough, accepting how you want to be in the future or how you don't want to be is also vital to change or personal progress.

Assuming you've been reading up to this point you might notice some bits of taoism and generalised forms of related philosophies in this, that's fine, these are the answers I arrived at and I found they already existed to some degree in eastern philosophies. I had it in me, but reading about various other systems and methods helped describe what I wanted and what I was/am.

If at some point you identify in your values what you would call "disingenuine" or something learnt or borrowed from elsewhere, consider if it is really so or whether those acquired values are such that you agree with them. Not every thing external or acquired, even recently shouldn't be yours or should be evaded just because it didn't come from you.

I guess this is similar to your notion of wisdom etc. Once you know what you want, you then figure out if it's possible and act in accordance with that want. Wanting something that's impossible is unrealistic, and another form of lying to yourself.

Unless you completely acknowledge that what you want is unrealistic and you agree that you still want to aim for it, even if it may lead to your undoing or terrible suffering or mistakes.

Quite accurately, this whole thing is a conflict of perceived reality vs ideas and expectations of it, which should win out and which should be subdued and in what way depends on the person thinking about it.

The concept of sacrificing the self, or grinding, distancing or ignoring oneself to madness or death really should be at the table, it's an option to be chosen just as many others, it's not any less valid than the more commonly culturally endorsed choices.

 

[Brontosaurie]

To say to life "Kiss my ass goodbye".

 

[EyeSeeCold]

Heidegger's being-in-the-world, we are always going to be influenced some way or another and as we interact in the world we influence other people, situations and things as well. However to me this relativity does not mean nothing matters or that there is no individuality, on the contrary you will always have your personal experiences - it means that the existential cause is to at least acknowledge this and occasionally, if not continuously, examine one's own life because the alternative is to negate the higher consciousness that makes us human. You're already doing that. It won't necessarily provide us with a sense of fulfillment or purpose which is only a fleeting emotion anyway, that comes from satisfaction with one's position in life something different from authenticity.

 

[Brontosaurie]

I think self vs. external pressure is a shitty way of thinking about it. By your nature you bow to external pressure the way you do because you're you. If you oppose your natural tendency to be influenced by external pressures because of an ideology of self (an idea externally implanted in you) you've given up being you in favour of someone else's idea of what being you is about.

Rather, I think authenticity is knowing yourself, and acting in accord with what you actually want. Not necessarily in a hedonistic way, but just not lying to yourself. Resolving dissonance. A con artist who knows what he is strikes me as authentic, even if he'll blow hot air up your arse about his virtue.

I guess this is similar to your notion of wisdom etc. Once you know what you want, you then figure out if it's possible and act in accordance with that want. Wanting something that's impossible is unrealistic, and another form of lying to yourself.

Haha, most excellent post. Well put.

 

[QuickTwist]

I have a thought that most people have kinda said in one way or another all the while its a little bit different take that just came to me - I've been thinking about this and have done so in the past as well.

The question should not be "am I authentic" because in fact whatever you do is part of your nature and thereby authentic. Don't get swept away in shoulds or that kind of thing that can get you to feel guilty and separate the healthy you and warp it into a fabricated disingenuous you. Its all tied up in self perception. Its not that you are actually any worse a person because you have a corporate job and are trying to climb up the corporate ladder if that is in fact what you are doing.

The idea is to notice that you have two parts that make up who you are and having awareness of what those two halfs are and what their needs are and adapting to them. Then the hardest part is in finding some kind of unison between the two and realizing that it is all you, just two parts of you.

Like I said, it is not a matter of if but how. Realize that how you see yourself has a drastic impact on your happiness. So ask yourself how you are being authentic to yourself and the rest will just sort of fall into place.. Its about noticing what your wants and needs are and once you really get those nailed down through self reflection, then the matter of how to get there will come to you rather easily. I know this because I have/am going through the same thing. But I took a good long look at who I am, who I want to be and realize that I do actually have things that I want to pursue and it is really now all a matter of when I follow through what kind of results chance will give me.

Don't let that last bit trip you up; I can see how it would.

 

[Nebulous]

I've heard Fi described as 'authenticity', maybe we should get some IxFPs over here. Fi is an INTP's last shadow function after all...

~

I'm a lil messed up; I have emotional dysregulation. My sense of identity changes multiple times on the average day. Because of this, I get dysphoria a lot: gender dysphoria, body dysphoria, etc.

Right now I really want a short haircut. I can't get one because of my parents. I don't feel 'authentic' with long hair though. I feel better when other people aren't observing me- I get even worse dysphoria when I'm with my peers because they are seeing me as a girl with long hair. I want to be seen as a *whatever my gender is* person with short hair.
And I feel the need to tell them that "I WANT TO CHOP MY HAIR OFF" so they know that even though I have long hair doesn't mean I want long hair.


So I don't feel authentic when I'm around others. I feel like I'm lying to them. Or hiding things from them.

Think of someone who's "in the closet" about their orientation or gender identity. They don't feel as if they're being 'authentic.'

For me, being authentic means presenting yourself to others in the way you want to be seen. In a way that's comfortable to you personally.
It doesn't mean being honest about everything; if you feel more comfortable with being reserved, that's also being authentic.

"Follow your heart" and all that jazz.

 

[Hadoblado]

Unless you completely acknowledge that what you want is unrealistic and you agree that you still want to aim for it, even if it may lead to your undoing or terrible suffering or mistakes.

Quite accurately, this whole thing is a conflict of perceived reality vs ideas and expectations of it, which should win out and which should be subdued and in what way depends on the person thinking about it.

The concept of sacrificing the self, or grinding, distancing or ignoring oneself to madness or death really should be at the table, it's an option to be chosen just as many others, it's not any less valid than the more commonly culturally endorsed choices.

Yes, logically. I'd argue however, that if you find yourself wanting something you know is impossible, then part of yourself is still lying to the rest of you. It still believes it possible.

Lord but I sound like a quack.

What I mean is, I'd love to walk out my door and have this act cure cancer and the common cold. But no part of me believes that possible, so I don't really want it. I've no investment in that outcome. If I was invested in such a thing, part of me would have to believe it possible. Not necessarily at a rational level, but the output of 'want' comes about from a cognitive process, so somewhere down the path my brain has put this stuff together. The idea has been given more attention than it deserves, and now a part of me is wasting its time invested in the impossible (and unuseful).

A more realistic example might be if you were in love with someone yet 'knew' you'd never be together. In fact, due to melodramatic circumstances, even if given the opportunity you'd still not tread that path. How miserable is that? Your feels are not in accord with your thinks, and so now you've got a state of constant inner turmoil.

Maybe I'm shitting up the waters here. After all, this is my impression of what makes an authentic person. It's a perception, and it's possibly derived from a systematic bias:

1) I attributed authenticity to people who act in accord with the wants I believe they have to them.
2) People that have simple wants (for instance, being non-contradictory) are easier for me to understand.
3) So every time I'm able to see someone acting in accord with their wants, their wants are simple, and I attribute authenticity to them.
4) This does not rule out the possibility that more complex wants are also authentic, but I am unable to perceive them.
Conclusion: Shut up hado

The people I meet who I deem authentic in this way are often frightening to me. Narcissism can be like this. I had a boss whose soul was infused with the spirit of capitalism. Some PUA types. Sports followers. Spiritual gurus. When I approach that sort of consistency in thoughts it feels like I'm peering over a cliff, and if I take a step further there's no coming back. Self-love is another example I was discussing with a forum member the other month. I can't buy it completely. As a result I see myself as unauthentic. Other people are real and living, and I'm just sitting here pretending, not knowing what to do.

 

[Rualani]

Authenticity is a hard thing to grasp as it requires a good understanding of what one Desires from the world. That's already a grey area so authenticity becomes grey as well.

I think the pursuit of this desire is where authenticity can be seen. Many times I see that word used it's in the realm of social context. Essentially, an honesty about ones desires is rewarded with the label authentic.

I think I agree with Hadoblados ideas about how authenticity is a meeting between desire and action. Desire is such a tricky subject which is what confuses authenticity. Being inauthentic would be acting in ways that compromises your own desire, yet yields another result. The continuing sacrifice of your desire for something else can lead to more in authenticity. I suppose it's a scale.

Sometimes desire is sacrificed for ethical considerations, but if you are in agreement with said ethical considerations then you are still being authentic.

Perhaps authenticity is just a reminder to check your desire and what YOU WANT before making your choices.

TL;DR; Be true to yourself.

 

[Urakro]

This concept of consciously being 'authentic' could likely be absurd. A notion that deceptively spins the mind around in circles. An idea probably created by some insightful blunder, or an annoyed individual with a leaching copy-cat.

There are examples easily brought to mind where a person acting out of character is unbeneficial. Another way to say they were being inauthentic, is quite simply that they are lying. Yet just as many examples could be thought of where any person would need to act differently than their normal mode with understandable and helpful reasons. Choosing between the two is just a tough decision for whatever the aim is.

We make a lot of tough decisions, and this "be true to yourself" in half of these cases doesn't really help that much. It's always probably worth asking what type of person you are, and your limitations, but also what the situation is at hand, and the consequences for your actions.

Anyhow, that's my spontaneous thought for the moment. There may be no true answer to the question "How to be true to yourself?" because there is no such thing, or the answer is simple but unhelpful, and dependent on circumstances.

 

[TarnishedCrown]

Authenticity vs inauthenticity? Maslow's hierarchy is helpful in answering this:

Probably too fucking small to see, but my point is that you need to be at a certain level on the pyramid to even consider the question of authenticity vs inauth. But before that, how much is each rung on the pyramid traversable by your current abilities/resources? This determines where your attention or conciseness will focus. For instance, if you're experiencing starvation, all of your attention, energy, resourcefulness will be in acquiring food. The question of authencity/inauth arises after you're past the safety rung but below self actualization.

Now there are a myriad of paths to take. But taking certain paths might lock one into environments not conducive to their needs (the top locking the lower rungs). For instance, right now, if I choose X with my life. I will meet people that can offer me a certain type of acceptance. I will also be able to earn a pretty high salary. The question is whether this path allows me to gain the type of acceptance I want (i.e. I'd rather gain respect and love by those who I deem qualified about their judgments and trust, rather than just raw gratitude for knowledge that has become a callous over my real self).

So first, what sort of acceptance do you want? What are the careers/activities from which you can get this acceptance? You cannot act authentically and be rational/work in your self interest if you can never gain the type of acceptance you want (this also includes from yourself).

The benefit of acting inauthentically (i.e. abnegating self-actualization when you have the option to attain it) might be the abundance of resources (cash, respect, benefits). Regret from living a lie/stagnation might result from choosing the inauthentic path. Regret from burnout and frustration can result when choosing the authentic path. Both can block access to other paths.

How is self actualization reached? By doing a activity that is a source of pleasure. Once the resources to insulate oneself from pain or instinctual/social desires has developed, the key becomes in finding that which is hard to become desensitized by. But pleasure, by its very nature, is something one becomes easily desensitized to as the brain build models and creates expectations. This where challenge and novelty come in (i.e. like jacking off, having an orgasm, and then a refractory period vs having a switch to make you orgasm whenever you want).

As one deals with challenges, however, they experience growth. With enough growth, challenges diminish, and stagnation starts unless the field is large enough (something dealing with infinity or with depth/vastness like mathematics has a growth ceiling limited only by one's innate potential). The jobs which seem most appealing to me allow a growth besides just getting knowledge (i.e. an intrinsic characteristic) and would allow me to reach my potential. Max potential=point of absolute limitation. This is where acceptance and satisfaction comes in (to the thought "I gave it my all").

Anyway, overall I think self actualization is logically necessary for non-delusional authenticity, but is self actualization really worth it (or worth to go all the way in)? That's something else learned from experience and self knowledge. Maybe its better to not reach self actualization, realize that one is simply human and the hardship to reach 100% authenticity is not worth it/possible. Isn't there some beauty in imperfection and being flawed (this is contingent on not actually wanting to be beautiful)? Becoming authentic would certainly not reduce any flaws on its own. It would just fulfill one's desire to be a cohesive entity ('I' can do an action because 'I' want. I is a unifying term blanketing something too messy to unite fully; sort of wishy washy, but meh).

random extra junk (if multiple interests, is there a commonality between these things?, is there someway you can integrate these things together? Could help identify a desired growth area)

 

[Ex-User (11125)]

i disagree with hadoblado on attributing authenticity to people. imo authenticity is personal business and no outsider can ever really know who is living an authentic life and who isnt.

anyway i think the type of people who are stereo-typically described as authentic; the brash, unapologetic, self loving type, are just failed products of an awakening process. most people like this strike me as people who are desperately trying to compensate for the inner friction and suffocation they felt in the past, and so become so self assured and narrow minded, somewhat hostile/aggressive even, to those who challenge their new world view. that's not authenticity, that's letting your ego control you

 

[Grayman]

i disagree with hadoblado on attributing authenticity to people. imo authenticity is personal business and no outsider can ever really know who is living an authentic life and who isnt.

anyway i think the type of people who are stereo-typically described as authentic; the brash, unapologetic, self loving type, are just failed products of an awakening process. most people like this strike me as people who are desperately trying to compensate for the inner friction and suffocation they felt in the past, and so become so self assured and narrow minded, somewhat hostile/aggressive even, to those who challenge their new world view. that's not authenticity, that's letting your ego control you

Is that being hypocritical? Your first paragraph is in contradiction to your last.

 

[Ex-User (11125)]

You're right I got carried away
I read what hado wrote about viewing himself as inauthentic compared to narcissistic/self loving people and wanted to make a point that these qualities are not necessarily positive, nor indicators of inner stability(that this behaviour can be born from insecurity or unresolved inner conflicts or a distortion of reality to keep denial of self defeciency intact), so why attribute authenticity to them? but you're right this does sort of contradict my first paragraph

 

[Sinny91]

This concept of consciously being 'authentic'could likely be absurd.

created by some insightful blunder, or an annoyed individual with a leaching copy-cat.

There are examples easily brought to mind where a person acting out of character is unbeneficial. Another way to say they were being inauthentic, is quite simply that they are lying. Yet just as many examples could be thought of where any person would need to act differently than their normal mode with understandable and helpful reasons. Choosing between the two is just a tough decision for whatever the aim is.

We make a lot of tough decisions, and this "be true to yourself" in half of these cases doesn't really help that much. It's always probably worth asking what type of person you are, and your limitations, but also what the situation is at hand, and the consequences for your actions.

Anyhow, that's my spontaneous thought for the moment. There may be no true answer to the question "How to be true to yourself?" because there is no such thing, or the answer is simple but unhelpful, and dependent on circumstances.

Yea, some guy over an INFJ told me to 'let my authentic self shine through' .. I asked how someone goes about doing that, and the guy was just like 'I dunno'.

 

[EyeSeeCold]

I feel like people are discussing two different (but overlapping) types of authenticity. True originality & mastering one's destiny (philosophy) vs one's projected image and self-concept (personality).

 

[QuickTwist]

I feel like people are discussing two different (but overlapping) types of authenticity. True originality & mastering one's destiny (philosophy) vs one's projected image and self-concept (personality).

My position is simple: you can't do what you aren't.

 

[Grayman]

My position is simple: you can't do what you aren't.

I don't undedstand this simple concept...

Are you saying you are what you do?

 

[QuickTwist]

I don't undedstand this simple concept...

Are you saying you are what you do?

More like you are what you think, but yeah, basically.

 

[Grayman]

More like you are what you think, but yeah, basically.

... if I believe (think) I am president I am not president. If I become(do) president I am president.

 

[Brontosaurie]

It's a city that gets en-Ti'd by an author. Auth-enTi-city.

Perfect, just like porridge is fine dining.

 

[QuickTwist]

... if I believe (think) I am president I am not president. If I become(do) president I am president.

My point is that thoughts have power. It works very complicated and has some to do with what you wanted to be before you were born, but what you think has a huge impact on what you will do.

But to get to your president thing, its like you can always ask "do you really believe that?"

What you think about dictates your actions and your action dictate who/what you are.

 

[Grayman]

what you wanted to be before you were born,

Is that a typo?

 

[QuickTwist]

Is that a typo?

Nope, just a crazy theory.

 

[Grayman]

Nope, just a crazy theory.

I have crazy idea but it hasn't met the conditions of a hypothesis let alone a theory.

Consciousness is static entity that is in flux within a infinite number of possibilities. Each mind is an empty slot awaiting a consciousness and as the conditions change and we are presented with 'choice' the physical reality is predetermined but the consciousness can exit and enter a new reality where action occurs in a way that the best suites what the consciousness 'is'. The transition would be seamless.

 

[QuickTwist]

I have crazy idea but it hasn't met the conditions of a hypothesis let alone a theory.

Consciousness is static entity that is in flux within a infinite number of possibilities. Each mind is an empty slot awaiting a consciousness and as the conditions change and we are presented with 'choice' the physical reality is predetermined but the consciousness can exit and enter a new reality where action occurs in a way that the best suites what the consciousness 'is'. The transition would be seamless.

Are you like a mind reader or something, cuz that's pretty much what I think too.

 

[Brontosaurie]

I have crazy idea but it hasn't met the conditions of a hypothesis let alone a theory.

Consciousness is static entity that is in flux within a infinite number of possibilities. Each mind is an empty slot awaiting a consciousness and as the conditions change and we are presented with 'choice' the physical reality is predetermined but the consciousness can exit and enter a new reality where action occurs in a way that the best suites what the consciousness 'is'. The transition would be seamless.

This is some kind of dualism (as opposed to the emergentism of current science), probably reminiscent of Burke or something. I don't remember exactly.

 

[Ex-User (13503)]

Can something be legitimately authentic for you right now and inauthentic 5 minutes from now? I think the implied "yes" I'm inserting as an answer might be wisdom speaking.

I'd also remove "despite external pressures," but that's not too important.

I see people who dedicate themselves to a single idea or purpose

I think there is more going on in these circumstances. Something else is hiding there. Maybe they've managed to meet the rest of their needs internally? I think you should actually and actively question them.

Have you concluded anything between when this thread was made and now?