Weak Fi in INTP leads to inconstant sense of self?

[brain enclosed in flesh]

So I was taking the cognitive processes tests earlier and it got me thinking of Fi (and my aptitude at it) in a way I never had before. Call it an epiphany if you like.

I've long debated whether I was an INFP or an INTP, amongst other types. I always considered both my Fi and Ti to be strong, which led to much confusion.

But today I noticed a theme in the Fi questions that apparently never registered before: a strong sense of self. This sense of self, it seems, helps the Fi-dominants (and I would presume Fi-auxiliaries) to stay true to themselves, no matter what obstacles and distractions life tosses their way. This introverted feeling operates as a judging function which always seems to ask the question, "How does whatever I am perceiving ally to or contrast with not only my personal values, but my mission in life?"

I feel like such a dumb ass typing this out because I know I've read this countless times, but it seems to have finally clicked that this is something I do not have- not to the extent that I can claim it as one of my top two functions, at least.

It has been a regular occurrence in my life to become consumed by whatever seduces my thought process, and the fact that I am totally wasting my time and not paying attention to what is truly important to me is not enough to divert my mind from the concept at hand. If I had more Fi, it seems, I would work on my novel more and contemplate theories less.

I see people attribute IXFP's ability to complete things to their inferior Te, but I don't think that's it. I have INFP friends and I would say Te is their Achilles heel. I argue that the reason they have jobs that matter to them and do things like complete novels is because the Fi is helping them stay the course. Who they are shines like a bright beacon along the path they want to take in life. It's not that they 'feel' more than me which makes them more prolific artists, they are just less likely to get distracted by trivial or inconsequential things.

What do others think?

 

[Starfruit M.E.]

... Mine was Ti, then Fi, then Fe, then Ne. And I do have a strong sense of self. But then my P kicks in and I don't take much action on that. I could lay out a format for how I should live my entire life based on my sense of self and my values and logic. But I have no desire to do so, and I still procrastinate. Comes with being an INTP I suppose. But I also worry that planning my life would take away something from living a full life I enjoy. I think I'd get bored.

I'm actually writing a novel, now that you mention it. I'm working on it pretty consistently at the moment. I still spend more time with theories though. Theories always trump novels. Or at least I've always thought so. But I have looked an the INFP profile and they are supposed to be pretty good writers. Never read anything by one, though, so I can't tell you for sure. But anyways, good luck with the novel!

 

[brain enclosed in flesh]

Thanks for the luck. You, too! My functions go Ti Ne Fi (in cognitive function tests), so I'm pretty close to you on this. But what I'm saying is that the sense of self that I have isn't as strong as it would be if Fi were one of my top two, and that keeps me from adhering to what I value with the vehemence of an IXFP, so I have a greater tendency to veer off course. It's like the Fi desire is there, but the constancy/values aren't strong enough to keep it on track. Without struggle, at least.

 

[Starfruit M.E.]

I believe I understand what you're saying, but would you like to illustrate it with an example of how this might work in a real life situation? I think that would help.

 

[Zygomorphic]

My functions rank in the order of Fi>Ne>Ti, so our Fi and Ti are essentially reversed about our Ne.

I infrequently use my Ti spontaneously (unless prompted) unless it's for the sake of fortifying my Fi; using Ti and Ne to guide and solidify my Fi to whatever truths and ideals are necessary for my self-identity.

The only reason I choose to participate in the rat race aspects of life is because I find it necessary to prepare for and do whatever is required to satisfy my Fi ideals. I love learning and education but I abhor the educational system, yet I press myself to succeed anyways so that I can pursue the career I desire. It's not the success of landing said career that I care for at all, but the self-satisfaction and the financial security it might bring just may help me actualize my ideals. Even if it only increases this prospect by a slight chance, it's worth it to me.

In a sense, I can't bear to let my Fi down - not after all the time I have spent nurturing it through emotional turbulence and hellfire. My ideals must come to fruition at any individual cost.

 

[Starfruit M.E.]

I've always wanted to meet an INFP! Do you write? Do you find your purpose in life to be finding your identity, or fulfilling it, or what else? What do you think of the pursuit of truth? Have you even planned out your life? How do you deal with feelings? How does the P play into your life? Wait. Maybe I should go lurking in an INFP forum and not bother you... but if you'd like to answer any of the above questions, I'd be delighted. Specifically the relevant ones to this post... I don't want to derail too much.

 

[Zygomorphic]

Do you write? How does the P play into your life?

Not as a career or anything, but I do like to write for enjoyment. I have a novel I intend on finishing someday; I've the characters, settings, plot and themes mapped out but I have to fill in the blanks. But I don't expect to finish this until I'm in my thirties (I'm seventeen right now, so that's how my P plays in my life outside of my goals).

What do you think of the pursuit of truth?

Are you talking about the pursuit of truth in varying ideas or a universal truth? Whatever, I'll address both of them.

The pursuit of a universal truth is a better "hobby" than many other trivialities. Every individual is entitled to their own unique manner in approaching this - I just hope people find the answers they need (as I did) rather than be crippled with existential crises. No doubt, the truth is out there, but humans will probably never find the answer. Yet as distant as the truth may seem, it's right within and without ourselves; it is experienced in every depth and breadth of reality. That's enough for me.

General truth is necessary for clarification. To be able to see the world as it is as objectively as possible allows one to determine what is subjective and where actions lie on the moral compass. Since I seek to be what is morally good, I must know what is true to assure myself that I am acting ethically. As to what defines "morally good," I recently explained it in another thread, but it is economical: all parties involved will experience either a neutral or positive gain in utils, and I seek to maximize the sum as well as possible.

Have you even planned out your life?

Nope. That sounds tedious and rather implausible anyways. Te stresses me out.

Do you find your purpose in life to be finding your identity, or fulfilling it, or what else? How do you deal with feelings?

(Answering two in one. I'm going to write a lot because I feel like it - maybe it'll be informative and helpful to someone. At least it will be nice for getting my thoughts down. But it will explain how I deal with feelings and self-fulfillment.)

I've learned to control them. The first negative emotions I abolished were anger and hate. Actually, I'm not sure if I was every really capable of hating anyone (not even myself), but I certainly felt anger during elementary school. Perhaps it was inevitable that I would overcome the capacity to feel anger - it is the worst possible emotion; it is irrational, it is impulsive, it is completely contradictory to the harmony I seek, and it leads to bad decisions. Through self-experience (read: Si), I have created nets that rebound any anger or irritation back into a state of harmony virtually instantaneously. I have no reason to feel anger.

However, in the wake of that "success," those negative emotions were redirected into depression. I know I said anger is the worst emotion, but that is only true when accounting logic. Subjectively, depression is the worst experience possible. It may or may not be true (it certainly feels like it), but INFP profiles often say that we are capable of both the most agonizing and the most euphoric levels of emotion. Most of my negative feelings in the past have stemmed from existential depression. To say it caused a state of melancholy or something is such an understatement; people think, "Oh, you'll get over it - just stop moping." No - if you experienced this, you wouldn't say that at all. Truly, instead of ignoring it and running away from it, I had to face the depression. For me, recognizing the insignificance of existence, the shackles of temporality, and the fickleness of happiness (not to mention the apparent impossibility of happiness at the time) created what I refer to as a black hole, which I felt both mentally (as depression) and physically (I could seriously physically feel this gaping [black] hole in my abdomen sucking out all will, hope, and positivity). I sometimes wonder how I did not commit suicide, but I am reminded why: the thought of non-existence was just as agonizing as existence - this is true depression; when one cannot escape a reality of an abyssal nothingness no matter what. Anyways, those issues have been solved as I have realistically-idealistically come to terms with an identity, a purpose, and the potential for sheer contentedness.

The only negative emotion I really experience these days is loneliness. For me, the experience of emotional negativity exponentially defeats positivity, so I am compelled to input the resources necessary to defeat this last obstacle to maintain complete inner harmony. Until I meet that someone, I substitute optimism, because wallowing in the loneliness is pointless since I cannot fix it alone (especially not this early in life). One might say I should not place my happiness in others. First of all, I am capable of being content alone, but we INFP's must seek emotional stimuli to ignite our passions and inspirations - we aren't living otherwise. Still, the reason I need to establish an intimate relationship is to become one; harmonious and synchronized with myself, the universe, and ultimately another person. I view all matter in the universe as linked as one in the dimension of abstraction, and in this manner adopt the self-dubbed concept of selfish altruism; the idea that we can view one another as an intact, sentient being working in self-interest. Yet because everyone is involved in this sum, the concept of selfishness loses all negative connotation and is indeed blurred into altruism. So I ride on this wavelength of thought, but it is unreal and not actualized if the "other" part of the sum does not reciprocate; if I do not have someone to experience the world (perhaps the truth) with similarly as I do, it is just another potential but unrealized ideal. Thus that is my purpose in life. Hopefully that answered your questions sufficiently.

Right, well perhaps what I wrote answers the original post's questions rather than going off on a tangent. I enjoyed writing that, though.

 

[brain enclosed in flesh]

I believe I understand what you're saying, but would you like to illustrate it with an example of how this might work in a real life situation? I think that would help.

Hmmm, I thought I did...

Again, I get side-tracked by things that aren't all that important to my eventual goals. What typically side-tracks me is new ideas/theories that grab my attention and seem to immediately take precedence over what really matters to me. I believe this is due to my Ti desire to understand and seek new knowledge. Conversely, it seems to me, someone with Fi would be more likely to stay the course because they are always evaluating things in matters of personal importance. They may also have curiosity about new ideas, but their sense of purpose trumps this curiosity.

IXTP: Hey, what's this new thing? I want to understand it!
IXFP: That new thing's interesting, but it doesn't fit into my ideals and what I want to accomplish, so who cares?

 

[Reverse Transcriptase]

A strong Fi also means that the IxFP (and even xxFPs) are extremely stubborn about their path, obnoxiously so. They see their life goal or future and you had better play your god damn part in it or get off their stage!!

 

[Agent Intellect]

I think the problem would be that Ti seeks truth, even if it's not conducive for attaining ones goals, or even pertinent to ones capabilities (what one would call 'disinterested knowledge'). Ne (or even Se) is sort of a catch all, taking ideas (or senses) and running with it, feeding it to Ti or Fi. Ti will then filter it through it's logic and use it to color in more of it's picture of "Ultimate Truth" where Fi will filter it through it's value system and use it to color it's picture of "What's Important?". In this way, Fi tends to put together a picture of things that are of personal importance, where Ti puts together a picture of things that are of detached importance. I guess one could even conceptualize it like: Fi likes to take the things Ne catches and turn it into a part of themselves, where Ti likes to take the things Ne catches and turn it into a cohesive object that is separate from themselves.

But, then again, I could be way off base.

 

[brain enclosed in flesh]

In this way, Fi tends to put together a picture of things that are of personal importance, where Ti puts together a picture of things that are of detached importance. I guess one could even conceptualize it like: Fi likes to take the things Ne catches and turn it into a part of themselves, where Ti likes to take the things Ne catches and turn it into a cohesive object that is separate from themselves.

But, then again, I could be way off base.

I think you're pretty much right. Even the things that are personal I separate from myself, finding some detached way to analyse it or describe it. When it's too much a part of me, I find it confusing. It's only when I can see it from a distance that it makes sense to me.

But that's kind of off-track from my OP, although you reaffirmed my hypothesis quite nicely.

 

[Ermine]

Another question about Ti vs. Fi - Both Ti and Fi seem to be individualistic in their own ways. Would it be fair to say that Fi assumes that there is only one "self" to be authentic to, and Ti is all about gathering lots of small bits of information about the "self" and putting it together into a cohesive whole, regardless of previous perceptions of the "self"?

Hope that made sense...

 

[cheese]

^Yes, I think so. Long-term: Fi defines the self, and Ti discovers the self. Short-term: Fi maintains, and Ti creates.

I think over time enough information is gathered to resolve apparently contradictory parts of the self, but from a short-term perspective we may feel like we're constantly changing.