Unlocking the Emotional Potential of the INTP.

[Iximi]

The following is based on what I know about myself, and what I have read/observed about INTPs in general:​

Emotion can scare the shit out of us sometimes- so much so that we try and seal it away in our own mental vault. Why is this? It seems that this fear comes from our inability to restrain our emotions once unleashed.

Remember the last time you got angry, now I mean ANGRY- the kind of anger that, if focused on one person, could tear the skin right of their bones and boil their organs on the spot. If my assumptions are correct, most INTPs have gone through this sort emotional hellfire at one time or another. When we become enraged in this way we seem to become a COMPLETELY different person- all our rationality and reason just disappears. We shred people apart with harsh words and leave people completely stupefied and frightened.

When the calm comes we become appalled, confused, and frightened. What had we become? An embodiment of everything we despise and fear about people.

As a result we continue the practice of restraining and controlling our emotions as to not let the floodgates burst ever again. And in doing so we limit ourselves. Without emotion, how can we be motivated? How can we possibly bring ourselves to do any task when the purpose is so unclear? Without emotion, how can we bear to interact with other people? How can we possibly build a relationship without trusting ourselves to let our emotions out and open up to another?

Our containment of emotion leads us to apathy, depression, and social anxiety. If we continue to do so, holding back our emotions becomes second nature- an act of the subconscious. This is what an unhealthy INTP looks like.

On the other hand- remember the last time you felt true Joy or Love. These emotions can be augmented just as much as our anger or despair and it is wonderful- nothing can parallel the extacy a true friend or lover can bring you. But is it worth the risk? I think this is a fundamental question every INTP needs to ask themselves. But it leaves one to wonder... is there a way to unleash our unparalleled creativity and ideas to their full effect and still be safe? Can we come to trust someone else with our hearts for an equal share? These are things I am not sure about- so I open the discussion to my fellow INTP's: How can we unlock our vast emotional potential?

 

[Lobstrich]

The following is based on what I know about myself, and what I have read/observed about INTPs in general:​

Emotion can scare the shit out of us sometimes- so much so that we try and seal it away in our own mental vault. Why is this? It seems that this fear comes from our inability to restrain our emotions once unleashed.

Remember the last time you got angry, now I mean ANGRY- the kind of anger that, if focused on one person, could tear the skin right of their bones and boil their organs on the spot. If my assumptions are correct, most INTPs have gone through this sort emotional hellfire at one time or another. When we become enraged in this way we seem to become a COMPLETELY different person- all our rationality and reason just disappears. We shred people apart with harsh words and leave people completely stupefied and frightened.

When the calm comes we become appalled, confused, and frightened. What had we become? An embodiment of everything we despise and fear about people.

As a result we continue the practice of restraining and controlling our emotions as to not let the floodgates burst ever again. And in doing so we limit ourselves. Without emotion, how can we be motivated? How can we possibly bring ourselves to do any task when the purpose is so unclear? Without emotion, how can we bear to interact with other people? How can we possibly build a relationship without trusting ourselves to let our emotions out and open up to another?

Our containment of emotion leads us to apathy, depression, and social anxiety. If we continue to do so, holding back our emotions becomes second nature- an act of the subconscious. This is what an unhealthy INTP looks like.

On the other hand- remember the last time you felt true Joy or Love. These emotions can be augmented just as much as our anger or despair and it is wonderful- nothing can parallel the extacy a true friend or lover can bring you. But is it worth the risk? I think this is a fundamental question every INTP needs to ask themselves. But it leaves one to wonder... is there a way to unleash our unparalleled creativity and ideas to their full effect and still be safe? Can we come to trust someone else with our hearts for an equal share? These are things I am not sure about- so I open the discussion to my fellow INTP's: How can we unlock our vast emotional potential?

I'm not quite sure why people keep talking about INTPs being scared shitless of their emotions. They do not really scare me, I just do not have a lot (No I do not claim to be emotionlesss <_<)

I can relate very much to the anger though, last time I got angry I just wanted to destroy. Not the person, I do not like violence. But I just wanted to hit stuff, break something, I wanted to yell, scream, roar as if an animal. (which I did, the yelling part, I never really end up destroying, because I know I'll be like ".... *sigh*" afterwards, hehe) And experiencing such anger often, actually. I think I do try to limit my emotions as much as possible, because I feel like an idiot after such bursts most of the time.

I'd argue the point where you basically say that we should "Unlock our emotions" as your thread is called. There's no such thing as having no emotions, unless you suffer from a psychological condition. So there's always emotions, just less. Which is fine, in my opinion. It makes the T come forth. Which is even better.

 

[Solitaire U.]

I'm not scared of my or other people's emotions. I just prefer pulling the strings to being the puppet.

 

[Ex-User (4771)]

I am not afraid of emotions, i am just extremely uncomfortable expressing them. Always have been. My emotions are my business and not others, and i dont want other to be bothered or affected by them, be the effect be positive or negative. I have a secretive nature and i plan to keep it that way. I honestly dont understand how people can show them so carelessly. I cant understand why people are so open to those around them. My two best friends, whom ive know my entire life or i have hung out with more often than not for the past few years, and some old classmates are the only people(except family) i really feel comfortable enough showing some emotion around. Just thought i would clear that up for you

edit: As for the extreme anger, i can relate very well to that. As a gamer it happens quite often, however i cant remember the last time it was caused by someone irl. Unlike Lobstrich i find violence as a great release that gives a sort of odd satisfaction. Of course ive always been a violent person, it helps keep people and "bullys" off your back as they always want to ride the person that is the easiest to.

 

[Fresh Baked]

I've been bood-boiling red-seeing weezing-through-an-iron-clenched jaw angry. It was during a critical juncture in a rts. ....An Iphone rts.

I distinctly remember that I jumped down so hard my feet hurt for the next week. The rage lasted about a minute, and after I calmed down I felt a massive rush of endorphins. kind of like a runners high. that was nice...

In general though i'm emotionally neutral and don't try to seal away anything. I am mildly shocked when my emotional equilibrium sways either towards joy or sadness. And I wish that I had better control of my emotions, but luckily it seems I don't stray too far from erm, neutral or not currently feeling any particular thing at the moment.

Sorry I didn't really contribute anything to the actual question of how to unlock emotional potential.

This might set a dangerous precedent to my later posts. You have been warned

 

[The Gopher]

I have to make my mind up about what emotions I am going to feel.

 

[Iximi]

I'm not scared of my or other people's emotions. I just prefer pulling the strings to being the puppet.

This is exactly what I am talking about; if you regard emotion as something that makes you malleable and vulnerable to other's then of course you will shut it out to an extent. If that is the case there is *some* degree of fear.

Keep in mind, this is a new idea that I am throwing around in lieu of some recent experiences. I think INTPs are prone to quickly dismissing emotion as something of significant value and hiding behind a wall of stoic logic when threatened. Surely developing our feeling side can't harm us any more than it can help?

I am not afraid of emotions, i am just extremely uncomfortable expressing them. Always have been. My emotions are my business and not others, and i dont want other to be bothered or affected by them, be the effect be positive or negative. I have a secretive nature and i plan to keep it that way. I honestly dont understand how people can show them so carelessly. I cant understand why people are so open to those around them.

I feel almost exactly the same way- ever since I can remember. The only difference being that now I am beginning to wonder if my discomfort in expressing my emotions comes from fear- and I think if you look into the nature of what it means to "be uncomfortable"... well you must be afraid of something.

It seems to me that maturing as an INTP is a rather constant battle with this "fear" or whatever you want to call it. I would really like to hear what some older INTPs have to say on this.

I distinctly remember that I jumped down so hard my feet hurt for the next week. The rage lasted about a minute, and after I calmed down I felt a massive rush of endorphins. kind of like a runners high. that was nice...

That euforic rush happens to me as well. Storing up emotions without a release seems to produce stress- but releasing them feels pretty good. Perhaps we are just addicted to the high of releasing stores of emotions all at once? That would be interesting haha.

 

[Ex-User (4771)]

20 isnt old enough? Following your instructions i looked deep. If my discomfort dose come from fear, its the fear of showing some sort of weakness steaming from a desire to be a rock, or the fear of being too reveling steaming from paranoia. That is of course if my discomfort is caused by fear, which i doubt. I believe some people are just the way they are, even if there is no rational reason for it. Also one of the reasons fear exists is to be conquered, and even if i conquered the above fears i still would be uncomfortable showing emotion to those i am not very close with.

 

[Meer]

You can't really fear something if you're completely unaware of it. I've been living with my roommates for 7 months or so and it just recently dawned on me that we could be considered 'friends', and we do 'friend things' together. It takes me a long, long time to think of someone as my 'friend', probably because I'm completely oblivious to emotional things. I'm afraid of showing emotions and stuff because I have no friggin clue how all that stuff is supposed to work.

 

[GYX_Kid]

i don't recognize my emotions quickly enough, usually.

 

[Lobstrich]

edit: As for the extreme anger, i can relate very well to that. As a gamer it happens quite often, however i cant remember the last time it was caused by someone irl. Unlike Lobstrich i find violence as a great release that gives a sort of odd satisfaction. Of course ive always been a violent person, it helps keep people and "bullys" off your back as they always want to ride the person that is the easiest to.

I've never understood gamers that smash their keyboards and scream at the games, it's no use, hehe. (And I'm a hardcore gamer myself, so it's not like I play peggle once a week while judging you, hehe)

And the violence, I'm against it because in my very young years I was very violent, I was in fights pretty much every day. The thing is that I think fighting is good, it's a part of developing yourself. But I didn't just fight, I also just hit people who disagreed with me or that pissed me off. And that sort of behaviour got me nowhere, which is why I'm against violence now. I'd much rather have a raging debate with yelling and screaming. Than a fight, because what good does a fight really do? You're not exactly learning more on said topic.

 

[Ex-User (4771)]

Spoiler

I've never understood gamers that smash their keyboards and scream at the games, it's no use, hehe. (And I'm a hardcore gamer myself, so it's not like I play peggle once a week while judging you, hehe)

And the violence, I'm against it because in my very young years I was very violent, I was in fights pretty much every day. The thing is that I think fighting is good, it's a part of developing yourself. But I didn't just fight, I also just hit people who disagreed with me or that pissed me off. And that sort of behaviour got me nowhere, which is why I'm against violence now. I'd much rather have a raging debate with yelling and screaming. Than a fight, because what good does a fight really do? You're not exactly learning more on said topic.

I agree whole heartedly with what you are saying about debates, i always enjoy a good debate, but they can get pretty heated. As for the violence, i rarely got into actually fights, just made alot threats, which people usually backed down after hearing. (eg ive told people who get out of their cars to say something to me that i would break both their legs with the bat that i had in my hands then steal their car.) If they didnt back down i always showed the back up that i had and then they backed down.

 

[Lobstrich]

As for the violence, i rarely got into actually fights, just made alot threats, which people usually backed down after hearing. (eg ive told people who get out of their cars to say something to me that i would break both their legs with the bat that i had in my hands then steal their car.) If they didnt back down i always showed the back up that i had and then they backed down.

You seem kind of like a douche, lol. Nah, don't worry. I just got this picture of a buffed up frat boy in a Hummer threatening everyone while "fuck" being every second word in every sentence.

 

[Jennywocky]

I did a lot of stuffing when I was growing up, dealing with my dad's crap and the stresses of life, so I always appeared calm, diplomatic, unruffled, nice. And if something got too stressful, I would retreat and no one would follow me.

Then I got married, and that strategy no longer worked. Spouse wouldn't leave me alone after my stuffing quotient was full. Typical pattern was we'd get into a big fight, eventually I'd try to end things, spousie would follow, eventually I would completely freak out. Utterly freak. (This is like after two hours of direct continual stress and ongoing harassment without giving me a space in which to get a grip and release the anger somehow.)

I'd scream at the top of my lungs (to the point where, even though it happened less than ten times during our marriage, I've lost a few pitches at the top of my vocal range because I damaged my voice), throw crap (preferably non-damaging stuff, I was at least still self-awareness... but totally nuts), once I kicked a box as hard as I could just to get rid of the anger and unfortunately it was full of plates from when we had moved and hadn't unpacked, and I was limping for a good five days afterward. Obviously I still reined in any outright murderous impulse, but it freaked me out, I was so out of control for the space of about twenty seconds.

Eventually I learned how to negotiate those issues so that the pressure on me was reduced, and I also learned how to express more of my emotions (positive or negative) during my normal life, rather than immediately bottling bad ones and smothering good ones. Emotion has to come out somewhere, so you need to integrate it and accept that it exists, even if one's desire is to always be rational.

I've never understood gamers that smash their keyboards and scream at the games, it's no use, hehe. (And I'm a hardcore gamer myself, so it's not like I play peggle once a week while judging you, hehe)

I agree with that. I actually get mad when I'm around people who constantly are bitching and smacking their stuff around just because they got shot. it seems like a lack of self-control to me.

And the violence, I'm against it because in my very young years I was very violent, I was in fights pretty much every day. The thing is that I think fighting is good, it's a part of developing yourself. But I didn't just fight, I also just hit people who disagreed with me or that pissed me off. And that sort of behaviour got me nowhere, which is why I'm against violence now. I'd much rather have a raging debate with yelling and screaming. Than a fight, because what good does a fight really do? You're not exactly learning more on said topic.

Totally. All a fight means is that you can physically overpower the other person. It says nothing about which one of you is right, and it only makes trying to live with each other AFTER the fight worse, if they're someone in your life or someone you have to deal with regularly.

You can't really fear something if you're completely unaware of it. I've been living with my roommates for 7 months or so and it just recently dawned on me that we could be considered 'friends', and we do 'friend things' together. It takes me a long, long time to think of someone as my 'friend', probably because I'm completely oblivious to emotional things. I'm afraid of showing emotions and stuff because I have no friggin clue how all that stuff is supposed to work.

Thanks for admitting that. I know it probably sounded weird to say, since for some other people, I think such thoughts are intuitive. But I have had moments like that too that, afterward, I was like, "oh duh," but they end up flipping my view of the world on its head and things start to improve.

 

[Lobstrich]

I'd scream at the top of my lungs (to the point where, even though it happened less than ten times during our marriage, I've lost a few pitches at the top of my vocal range because I damaged my voice), throw crap (preferably non-damaging stuff, I was at least still self-awareness... but totally nuts), once I kicked a box as hard as I could just to get rid of the anger and unfortunately it was full of plates from when we had moved and hadn't unpacked, and I was limping for a good five days afterward. Obviously I still reined in any outright murderous impulse, but it freaked me out, I was so out of control for the space of about twenty seconds.

Yeah, I'll act like that as well sometimes. If I get really really really (writing it 3 times for a reason, hehe) mad I'll yell as well, and just want to destroy stuff. Took a chair once, smashed it into a cupoard, broke both, lol. But I'm still kind of self-aware like you say. I'll never take my PC monitor, or a stereo etc. And smash that, I know that would suck afterwards. The only thing that I got close to that with was my cellphone, threw it into the wall. But unlike you, I again, didn't smash the chair towards the person I was angry with. I just wanted to smash something, so I smashed the chair instead of the person (I would never really smash a person, lol. I'm just saying that if I didn't smash the chair, I'd probably be boiling even more after 5 more minutes)
I think it's all a result of me being violent as a child, I can look back and think "Wow.. What did that sort of behaviour towards other people ever benefit me?" Which is probably why I'm always 'calm' enough to never hurt other people, only 'stuff'

Alot of people would argue that "smashing" in general is bad, that one should always stay calm, I somewhat agree. That would be the best, if everyone could just talk it out, no yelling, no destroying. But some people are just not capable of that when they get to a certain point, so I think destroying stuff is fine, if you're prepared to pay for it (if you destroyed the property of someone else) and if you do not blame your opposition of your outburst "You made me destroy my TV, give me a new one" -ish

I agree with that. I actually get mad when I'm around people who constantly are bitching and smacking their stuff around just because they got shot. it seems like a lack of self-control to me.

Yes, exactly. I think it seems like a lack og self-control as well. But I also feel kind of hypocritical calling people who do that, out of control. Am I not as much out of control when I smash a chair against a cupboard?
But I think the difference lies in that they get angry at a game, a thing which is not trying to piss you off, it's only purpose is to be played. Not anything else. That's probably why I still get annoyed with such behaviour even though I get very "destructive" myself.

Totally. All a fight means is that you can physically overpower the other person. It says nothing about which one of you is right, and it only makes trying to live with each other AFTER the fight worse, if they're someone in your life or someone you have to deal with regularly.

Exactly. I have nothing more to add, just wanted to appreciate the fact that we're agreeing, hehe.

 

[Ex-User (4771)]

You seem kind of like a douche, lol. Nah, don't worry. I just got this picture of a buffed up frat boy in a Hummer threatening everyone while "fuck" being every second word in every sentence.

I am a douche and imagine a 5'4 ginger who looks like he might have worked out a few times, being a douche or threatening usually prevents the brunt of being made fun of. Plus im irish and german, so that dosent help. But i am in no way a frat boy and would be insulted to be called such in a serious manner. I hate frat boys

 

[Lobstrich]

I am a douche and imagine a 5'4 ginger who looks like he might have worked out a few times, being a douche or threatening usually prevents the brunt of being made fun of. Plus im irish and german, so that dosent help. But i am in no way a frat boy and would be insulted to be called such in a serious manner. I hate frat boys

Lol, fair enough

 

[Melllvar]

I've been bood-boiling red-seeing weezing-through-an-iron-clenched jaw angry. It was during a critical juncture in a rts. ....An Iphone rts.

I don't really feel like commenting on the main issue *right at this moment*, but I had a similar experience fighting Skorge on insanity difficulty the first time I played Gears of War 2. I died so many times that at one point I just hurled the controller across the room as hard as I could, started literally huffing in anger and repeatedly punching the recliner I was sitting in as hard as I could. I can't remember any part of any other game getting that kind of response out of me since I was a wee little kid.

Oh but when I finally conquered him, it felt so, so good...

-------------------------------------------

General remarks: I don't really see it as not experiencing emotions as much, just that you're more detached from them and it tends to be an all or nothing thing when they do occur. Plus I seem to be worse at dealing with them when they do claw their way out.

They're horrible things. Even when they're suppressed you have to be constantly vigilant lest they find some weakness or opening with which to sneak up and destroy you. Those sneaky little fuckers are always trying to work their way back into your life.

 

[xbox]

You seem kind of like a douche, lol. Nah, don't worry. I just got this picture of a buffed up frat boy in a Hummer threatening everyone while "fuck" being every second word in every sentence.

This is the second biggest reason I hate going to college.

 

[pjoa09]

I get angry at Windows 7.

It couldn't boot from CD so I booted it from XP and it left everything the way it was and just a different OS after 2 hours and I couldn't delete so many old files. So I thought I must have done something wrong and it turned out that this is the way it does it.

I spent 4 hours waiting for something that didn't matter.

I punched and kicked a concrete wall followed by hurling a stool and then proceeded by installing Slackware 13.37 which then couldn't boot because Windows 7's MBR was a big fat dick who wouldn't let anyone take his place.

I got upset smashed more shit and returned.

So I ran the 'cfdisk' and deleted both the motherfuckers to hell (Slack with KDE and Windows) .

Went for an errand that involved driving which was very soothing. Burned up a new XP disc formatted some NTFS for it and installed it then finally installed Windows 7 over it.

Deleting the junk was easy then and there was no shit trying to put its little weiner on the new software.

It finally ran like a charm until now. It BSOD me but it wasn't upsetting because I ran an update and updates are gay. (it is a known fact)

Normally I punch this wooden wall but it isn't sturdy enough and even though it is incredibly satisfying to see a wall being smashed it has splinters now and can be hazardous despite my frequent tetanus shots. But I still do it because it is very satisfying to see the cracks and just knowing I smashed a wooden wall so hard that splinters came flying right at me.

I am done ranting.

But yeah emotions are scary. Often I get mad and think to myself was that an overreaction by a really long shot? It is all frustration really.

I fail to threaten people or even confront them with my anger. I only do with people close to me and try to avoid getting physically involved.

 

[Meer]

When I was younger and living with my parents, I would sometimes flip out and punch holes in the wall, etc. I don't really remember why...Hasn't happened in a long time, though.

 

[xbox]

I would bash my head against the wall when I was little. It explains a lot of things with me now.

 

[Minamimoto]

"Is it worth the risk?" Heh; I ask this of myself daily. In the wake of recent events, the conclusion has always been the same.

Can we come to trust someone else with our hearts for an equal share?

I think so. However, I extend this only to open friendship. Based on my personal goals, as well as my limited experience with committed relationships, I'd have to say that any more is an unnecessary complication. I posted a long winded rant explaining why elsewhere; I can track it down and copy/paste for you, if you like.

@ Xbox, ROFL, that makes two of us. XD

General remarks: I don't really see it as not experiencing emotions as much, just that you're more detached from them and it tends to be an all or nothing thing when they do occur. Plus I seem to be worse at dealing with them when they do claw their way out.

They're horrible things. Even when they're suppressed you have to be constantly vigilant lest they find some weakness or opening with which to sneak up and destroy you. Those sneaky little fuckers are always trying to work their way back into your life.

Pahaha, indeed, Melllvar. I've become much more expressive of them lately; I'm smiling almost constantly these days when I'm chatting with friends; it makes me happy beyond belief to connect with some so well. It's also quite annoying; my split lip has been taking months to heal as a result.

Ugh, an INTJ friend and I are always hating on those emotions. Don't need them interrupting my life. She had one of those ridiculous emotional breakdowns awhile back; it was horrifying. I feel like there's not much I can do for people when they get that way; explosive emotion rarely submits to logic.

As for my own experiences with emotional overflow, it usually manifests itself with me pacing back and forth in my living room from 11pm to 4am.

However, I've had one lovely experience where I tried to submit to emotion for a rather long time; suppressed my logic left and right so someone could eat me alive and toss my corpse in a canal somewhere. Surely, you all know the story. Unconditional acceptance being met with the enigmatic needs of a feeler, which inevitably get neglected 'cause they won't explain it for the 'heartless' thinker. Shit happens, people get hurt, feeler waltzes on with their life while thinker feels like garbage.

 

[Lobstrich]

This is the second biggest reason I hate going to college.

What, buff frat boys?

 

[Lobstrich]

Shit happens, people get hurt, feeler waltzes on with their life while thinker feels like garbage.

Being a thinker, I never feel anything but win. Feelers are the ones who get depressed. I'm good, lol.

 

[Solitaire U.]

This is exactly what I am talking about; if you regard emotion as something that makes you malleable and vulnerable to other's then of course you will shut it out to an extent. If that is the case there is *some* degree of fear.


It seems to me that maturing as an INTP is a rather constant battle with this "fear" or whatever you want to call it. I would really like to hear what some older INTPs have to say on this.

I sincerely don't regard it as a vulnerability. Actually plays out as more of a strength the majority of the time...feeling nothing, that is, which is typical for me. This is not to say that I don't care, because I do care...I apparently just don't 'feel' things at a level most others appear to. This would include everything from minor annoyance to devastating loss. Others are happy/sad/joyous/elated/lonely/etc. while I'm simply neutral, or perhaps content is a better word.

Used to believe either something was wrong with me or I was a cold-hearted fuck who couldn't even feel remorse for not feeling remorseful. Over the years I've learned to exploit the strengths. For example...my kid comes in crying and tells me he just watched his cat get hit by a car. I tell him "That really fucking sucks and I'm sorry it had to happen...I'll go get your cat out of the street and tidy up the scene, then we'll find a nice spot in the back yard to bury him, ok?".

This is my unorthodox form of consolation. I don't have the traditional gestures of sympathy that seem to come naturally to everyone else in my family...I have this, and I'm the only person in the house who would voluntarily go scrape dead cat off the street so it all works out.

Years ago I would have stared at the floor speechless, feeling awkward at the tears and wishing for a logical formula to make them stop, while inside I'd be feeling guilty and ashamed over feeling nothing.

 

[xbox]

What, buff frat boys?

ALthough they are nice to look at, it's their personality thats just annoying.

Men who use the F word every other word, is just unimpressive. Its like they couldn't think of anything better to say, and use their anger and limited vocabulary to make up for it?

 

[tonbomon]

Hello I'm new on the forum! I'm really interested in this sort of topic, I only have one real life INTP friend who understands. Even my BF can only call me crazy when my emotions come out uncontrollably, and that really just makes it worse

I think I have had a similar experience as Jennywocky, growing up I was so used to just not being emotional and retreating when emotions start revealing themselves too much. I remember when my dog died I felt so bad but there was no way I could deal with it in front of family/friends. I went to school and was in and out of the bathroom to keep it all together, none of my friends new about it until years later....

But now living with my partner it's so hard to run away from these things, he is all about fixing problems and working it out and if I show a little emotion he digs around until he can find what I'm feeling. Unfortunately, sometimes that ends up in a "breaking things" situation. I've smashed a glass all over the floor and thrown stuff at walls..... :S When I get angry I get really angry and shaky and usually cry. And it's not really usually very productive in terms of "working things out", I usually end up being embarrassed or people think I'm crazy.

When people and situations involving other people aren't predictable enough for me I just don't feel on top of what's going on, if I feel like I'm not in control of what I'm feeling or don't understand what's happening in a social interaction I just feel really scared and defensive unless I can get out. I don't really feel empathy for people but I also just don't feel like anyone empathizes with me. Emotions are just way to subjective to try and analyze, but I can help but go over and over and try and rationalize these things and when I can't I sort of panic.

Thankfully most of the time things aren't like this I guess it would be much easier if I could show emotions in a more controlled way. But I would be a different person.....

 

[Lobstrich]

Men who use the F word every other word, is just unimpressive. Its like they couldn't think of anything better to say, and use their anger and limited vocabulary to make up for it?

I've never understood this sort of attitude. So (fucking) what if I a person uses the (fucking) 'f word' often? In my (fucking) opinion it doesn't (fucking) matter wether or not you use that word alot, as long as you (fucking) contribute to said debate, as long as you have a (fucking) informed opinion and you (fucking) think a little. A lot of people can have many (fucking) great ideas, opinions, beliefs and 'stuff' on their mind to (fucking) share. I don't think their (fucking) use of the 'f word' should matter and I don't (fucking) think that their (fucking) vocabulary should be used to (fucking) measure their competence or intellecualism, so to (fucking) speak.

And in my opinion it's just a word, like any other word. It's just some fucking (note that I didn't put that fucking in parenthesis) person who decided to put that label saying "bad word" on. Of course it can get a little to much, like I did first (On purpose.. If you didn't notice, hehe) But again, it's like any other word. If you say 'or' a lot or 'but' that gets tedious as well.

Other than that I do agree that "frat boys" are annoying. We don't really have these kinds of stereotypes here in Denmark. What's cool/fashionable is very different US/EU, but we have some people who could match, hehe.

 

[Melllvar]

However, I've had one lovely experience where I tried to submit to emotion for a rather long time; suppressed my logic left and right so someone could eat me alive and toss my corpse in a canal somewhere. Surely, you all know the story. Unconditional acceptance being met with the enigmatic needs of a feeler, which inevitably get neglected 'cause they won't explain it for the 'heartless' thinker. Shit happens, people get hurt, feeler waltzes on with their life while thinker feels like garbage.

Yeah, we've all been there. The solution is to learn to not really care very much. I mean you should care, in the sense that compassion is a rational course of action (or so I would argue), but learn not to really care on an emotional level. That shit'll just fuck you up. So many of people's problems could be solved if they just learned not to give a shit. Easier said than done, I admit (I think this generally occurs after experiencing severe extremes of an emotion and becoming desensitized to it, or with desensitizing due to age, perhaps).

On the other hand- remember the last time you felt true Joy or Love. These emotions can be augmented just as much as our anger or despair and it is wonderful- nothing can parallel the extacy a true friend or lover can bring you. But is it worth the risk? I think this is a fundamental question every INTP needs to ask themselves. But it leaves one to wonder... is there a way to unleash our unparalleled creativity and ideas to their full effect and still be safe? Can we come to trust someone else with our hearts for an equal share? These are things I am not sure about- so I open the discussion to my fellow INTP's: How can we unlock our vast emotional potential?

See, here's part of the problem. People think that there are good emotions (joy, happiness, love, etc.) and bad emotions (fear, hate, wrath, etc.) when in fact all emotions are bad things. It's not just that they skew your judgment. I can't explain it fully right now (the epiphany isn't with me at the moment), but I'm more confident about this than I am about most things.

As an example, I almost started a thread once about the destructive power of fear and hope, and how hope is often viewed as a good thing when in fact it's equally as dangerous as fear. (fear and hope, in my view, sit at opposite ends of a spectrum [the spectrum being expectations]) Fear's destructive power is fairly obvious (I think), but what's always overlooked is that hope causes the same sort of emotional responses that fear does, it just does it in a different way (by indulging positivity instead of negativity). They're essentially the same emotion, temporarily useful (fear leading to avoiding danger, for example, or hope being used to alleviate suffering while awaiting a positive outcome), but if you let yourself experience them in anything beyond the slightest, most self-controlled way, that shit'll fuck you up and destroy your life. That's how it is with all emotions - temporarily useful if taken in the smallest of quantities, but otherwise to be avoided at all costs. They're like a poison, or a really horrible drug.

Damn, I really wish I'd actually started that thread now, when it was all still fresh in my mind. I was going to do it after I finished God of War 3, because so much of the dialogue focused on the concepts of Fear and Hope, and it really got me thinking about it (the game takes a very positive view of hope, "Hope is what makes us strong. ... It is what we fight with when all else is lost.", but it's wrong).

Anyway, my point is that all the so-called "positive emotions" are like that. They're no better than the "negative" ones, they're just more seductive and deceptive. So really, why should we want to unlock our emotional potential? We should try and find ways to cut that shit out at the source, IMO. Or control and limit them for our own uses, but that seems dangerous, like using performance enhancing drugs or something (I'm reminded of Bruce Lee's statement, "It needs emotional content," which I think is true, but it's basically using them in dilute form for that kind of enhancement - still very dangerous).

I realize I might sound a little crazy saying all this, but I really think it's true. So let me reiterate:

They're horrible things. Even when they're suppressed you have to be constantly vigilant lest they find some weakness or opening with which to sneak up and destroy you. Those sneaky little fuckers are always trying to work their way back into your life.

 

[xbox]

Lobstrich, Hey you're the one who mentioned it first!

Chances of an intellectual conversation with a stereotypical frat kid are low when that word is used after every other word.

However, intellectual conversations with that word pattern are totally cool with me. I find them a lot more interesting..

 

[XenGoat]

Okay, so this is just too interesting not to partake; I've been dealing (well, to be honest, attempting to deal) with just this topic for the past couple of months. (What is it with the significant other wanting you to emote and shit? Where do they get the gall?)
So, first time poster, howdy everyone, don't mind me while I sit down and dig in.

See, here's part of the problem. People think that there are good emotions (joy, happiness, love, etc.) and bad emotions (fear, hate, wrath, etc.) when in fact all emotions are bad things.

All of them? I couldn't disagree more. In fact, I'd argue, as INTPs, emotions (every single one of them, even the slimy ones) are our most precious experiences. What other experience other than a truly momentous emotional meltdown gives you the sudden clarity that you're not just capable of thinking about things, they actually affect you? And I don't mean in a rational, "of course it affects me, we're in the same environment" kind of way. I mean, it gets inside of you and sets up shop and starts hawking all kinds of exotic wares without your permission.
Maybe I'm just an optimist about this, but the fact that emotions are such an uncontrollable force in my life makes me friggin' curious as all hell as to what exactly is happening within me. Especially because they have such a devastating power when neglected or outright abused.

Plus, like I insinuated (and Jennywocky and tonbomon posted), when you have to share emotions with another person in the shared interest of keeping a relationship alive, it's way easier to attempt negotiating with them (those pesky emotions, not the pesky SO) directly instead of neglecting them. I mean, you can't escape having them; it's part and parcel of being human. And although you can attempt to keep them all within safe little boundaries, just the fact that you're making that attempt means that eventually (and probably sooner than you'd like) one of them is going to grow in your unconscious and take a giant bite out of your ass (or someone else's, which is about 20x worse).

---
On a slightly unrelated note, I totally know what you mean about GoW:III and that whole Hope business. Ham-fisted much? And it's not like it was the best context for that message: Kratos doesn't fight with hope. He fights with knives, chains, disembodied souls, and whatever else he can get his ashy hands on.

 

[Lobstrich]

Lobstrich, Hey you're the one who mentioned it first!

Chances of an intellectual conversation with a stereotypical frat kid are low when that word is used after every other word.

However, intellectual conversations with that word pattern are totally cool with me. I find them a lot more interesting..

Yeah, I didn't say that conversations with 'frat boys' were very stimulating. (But I still disagree that the chances of a stimulating conversations are low because of excessive swearing. It's the attitude of the person that makes the conversation, not the vocabulary) I just said people who use the word fuck or if they just swear alot in general, doesn't bother me. Like you, I think it makes the conversation more 'alive' There's nothing that I hate more than people who've read a book or a page on wikipedia, memorized it and are then repeating it. See, I have conversations (and always try to put those conversations to a debate. I want to be in disagreement) because I bring an antithesis against their thesis, together we get; synthesis. That 'system' doesn't really work if the other person is just memorizing and repeating. He/she has no ability to change up their opinion or go "hmm, I can see that. But what if you did" Because their book only had "1, 3, 5" It didn't have 2 and 4, while a person with a geniune 'organic' knowledge on the topic would know all numbers. Or if he just knew the first 4 he'd be able to grasp number 5 since he as the basic knowledge.

I'm making a wall now. I could just go with: Yes, I think swearing is fine. No swearing or a lot of swearing doesn't make any difference to me as long as the knowledge is genuine! =)

 

[Dr. Freeman]

I don't fear my emotions at all, the only thing I fear about them is not being able to control them at a critical point, which would cause me to do something that I know I will regret.

 

[Melllvar]

In fact, I'd argue, as INTPs, emotions (every single one of them, even the slimy ones) are our most precious experiences.

I mean, it gets inside of you and sets up shop and starts hawking all kinds of exotic wares without your permission.

...the fact that emotions are such an uncontrollable force in my life...

Especially because they have such a devastating power when neglected or outright abused.

...means that eventually (and probably sooner than you'd like) one of them is going to grow in your unconscious and take a giant bite out of your ass (or someone else's, which is about 20x worse).

Well, have fun with all that then.

And although you can attempt to keep them all within safe little boundaries, just the fact that you're making that attempt means that eventually (and probably sooner than you'd like) one of them is going to grow in your unconscious and take a giant bite out of your ass (or someone else's, which is about 20x worse).

Nah, you just have to work to recognize them and cut them off before they grow to have any real power over you. The longer you wait and the more you indulge them the harder it will be. Easier said than done, of course, I certainly haven't mastered it, but I'm doing a hell of a lot better and an awful lot happier than I used to be before I realized these are demons to be cast back into the void from which they came.

 

[GYX_Kid]

If my assumptions are correct, most INTPs have gone through this sort emotional hellfire at one time or another. When we become enraged in this way we seem to become a COMPLETELY different person- all our rationality and reason just disappears. We shred people apart with harsh words and leave people completely stupefied and frightened.

When the calm comes we become appalled, confused, and frightened. What had we become? An embodiment of everything we despise and fear about people.

it needs to escalate way beyond "harsh words" in order to fully mirror/manifest/experience "despise" and "fear" in a truly enlightening moment of horror, love and adventure

 

[Seally]

One of my classmates once asked me (okay, I admit I don't recall the exact question) about my impressive ability to suppress emotions. I told her I do have them, I just don't display them. I also told her that when I actually do display them, I can get really scary. I think she already saw a good example of that once, but I'm not discussing the details.

Am I afraid of using feelings? No. I find them quite useful in making public speeches and debates sound more convincing, and it can get more people to listen to you. It's tiring, but useful in certain circumstances. But in others, it can get problematic. One has to know when and how to use it.

On the other hand- remember the last time you felt true Joy or Love.

I don't think I remember the last time I've felt something like that. Not to that degree.

 

[sheepie]

I can relate to the angry thing; I rarely get angry but when I do shit gets broken. I've found it's when I can't walk away from whatever is making me angry that I flip out. Like say you're trying to talk to somebody about something and they (and maybe even you too) are being a bit unreasonable but they follow you around the house being unreasonable. When it gets too much, to that point when it's time to leave unless something goes down and they still won't leave you alone, even when you've actually asked them fairly nicely to go away for a bit, that's when I actually lose control of that frustration and scream and throw stuff.

I think a lot of INTP issues with unrestrained emotion are largely a result of a tendency to leave unexpressed what they feel. When I was in high school I really had no friends, I hung out with other people at recess and talked to people. I wasn't cliche loner type but I had very little really connection with anybody (I had a couple, more specifically one, person who I could related to on any level at all, but the relationship there was based on mild mutual amusement from a distance rather than anything meaningful) and I tended to get seriously wound up in my own emotion and paranoia about whatever it was at the time I was entertaining myself with.

A while ago, situation had it that I was given the choice to either just lay it all out on the table, by it I mean me (the one that has feelings and doesn't make up crap to make social encounters less awkward), or to just give what I always give which pretty much is a load of crap if you're interested in who I really am. This was in a relationship situation obviously, like dating/commitment/babies relationship as opposed to friendship, with, actually the kid I was talking about before (the "only one I could relate to" kid) and anyway to cut a long story short I gave him everything that he wanted and more and it wasn't a huge disaster.

The relationship that we have is really functional. Just trust me on that one it's more than a little complex and I can deal with my emotions by just letting them out when they want to get out. I did a lot of suppressing when I was a kid and now I can just express it without being afraid of looking like a retard cause he expresses himself at me and looks like a retard everyday, so its okay. To keep everything sane for me when something happens that effects me emotionally I really need to debrief with somebody and I can do that now without going around in circles as I would by myself.

I was "safe" in high school with the exception of when it occasionally blew up in my face (which to be honest happened a lot more than i would like to admit) and I'm safe now because it can blow up in my face without any real consequences (in my opinion), but when I made the choice (I actually sat down with myself and went okay, I'm going to just let go) I wasn't safe I took a really big risk. I think the reason I did that was because I was so sick of banging my head against a brick wall when it came to relationships. I found it really difficult playing games with people about how they feel and what they want and I wanted them to just freakin tell me the truth but it dawned on me that to honestly ask that of somebody I had to do the same. It was a choice between being screwed around or taking the huge risk of being hurt/exposed/whatever and I chose the latter.

I know that's all a bit disjointed I have serious issues getting concepts out of my head but generally what I'm trying to say is that taking the risk in my case paid out big time; I'm enjoying life, which is kind of awesome. I still have all the emotional problems that I had but I stopped trying to kill/hide them because it stopped mattering if they got out.

 

[Zionoxis]

I honestly am not sure which emotions are truly mine anymore. While I understand what you mean by anger, I have exploded once and only once. On the other hand, I often show happiness and irritation to others around me. Of course, I am not sure if the happiness is always genuine as I have often questioned why I am laughing when I know it was not the least bit funny. I think that INTP's tend to either completely hide all emotion or they improvise with faulty ones to look more human to those around them.

I often catch myself doing so to at least have some social ability.

 

[scorpiomover]

I quite like my emotions. I know that I have them. I always had them. But I have to keep a tight rein on them. When I get emotional, things start going haywire: the scanners at the supermarket checkout stop working, bus doors start opening and closing without letting anyone on or off, and worst of all, I get super-strong, and break stuff unintentionally. I once slammed a door when I was very angry. Broke the hinge in 2, and part of the door with it. The door had to be replaced. I also get really, really confused when I'm emotional. Ask me a question when I'm feeling very emotional, any question, and the answer is "Don't know."

I'd also like to get to read them better. Until I was 30, it took me 3 months of knowing someone, before I knew if I liked her or not. My brain just wouldn't register emotion, any emotion, until much later on.

Far as women goes, same problem. If I like them, I get all confused, and struggle to think straight when they are around. Plus, I just feel way too much emotion.

 

[Col]

I have experienced the anger as well!! People are right about keeping a certain level of self control though. I think its like pushing into a syringe thats full of air, with your finger over the nossle... You compressing the syringe is akin to the release of anger. The air inside is the self control. The harder you push, the more difficult it is to continue.

 

[smithcommajohn]

Emotions by definition are irrational. INTPs, to my understanding, make a preference to the rational. "Unlocking our emotional potential" so to speak, would change who we are, wouldn't it?

Everyone has emotions, but how we handle them defines us as human beings.

 

[Melllvar]

...I get super-strong, and break stuff unintentionally. I once slammed a door when I was very angry. Broke the hinge in 2, and part of the door with it. The door had to be replaced.

If you think that's bad, I've broken my metacarpals twice and deformed my knuckles three more times punching things when I'm mad or frustrated. Usually there was alcohol involved.

Some 'funny' stories too. The first time I was pissed off about something, convinced two guys to trade punches with me (them vs. me) so I'd have someone to hit, then broke my hand on one of them and continued punching them with it until they both quit. Second time I was trying to do a proof from elementary calculus and got pissed off that I couldn't solve it and punched a slate-rock pool table. The third time was on the same pool table but I can't remember why anymore. The fourth time I tried to put my hand through a window, but it turned out to be one of those reinforced hurricane-proof ones. The girl in the orthopedic surgery department said she'd worked there more than 20 years and it was the worst break she'd ever seen. Fifth time I punched a door. And that's only the times I actually broke my hand hitting something while mad. There were plenty of others where I just knocked a hole in some drywall and had to get it fixed.

Three of those were over women, one was over money, and the other was over [feelings of worthlessness at inability to solve] the math problem.

 

[scorpiomover]

If you think that's bad, I've broken my metacarpals twice and deformed my knuckles three more times punching things when I'm mad or frustrated. Usually there was alcohol involved.

I think I'd feel better about it, if it had happened in some reasonable way, like that I had to keep punching, and that equal damage had been done to me.

But in my case, my strength just takes a giant leap. I remember that I had had some news, OK news, but news that made me feel particularly touchy that day. I was at a friends', reached for a cup, and pulled the handle right off. The cup itself didn't move.

Likewise, with the door, I only slammed it once. I didn't keep hammering it or anything. I've slammed doors before. They were always alright.

I had the same problem with people. When I was calm, I would hit someone with the force of a kitten. When I was upset, one punch would floor them. A lot of people would play-fight growing up. So if it was play-fight mode, then I'd act like a weakling. But if they kept pushing me to react, I'd get really scared and wimpy, or end up getting mad, and hitting them while upset, and then they'd see that as real fighting. Difficult either way.

So I really have to watch my temper. If I allow my emotions to flow too much, I'll break stuff that's important to me, or important to others, or, I'll hit someone, and no-one likes to be floored with one punch.

Three of those were over women, one was over money, and the other was over [feelings of worthlessness at inability to solve] the math problem.

Fighting over math is funny, especially if it's because you got yourself riled over maths. You can't solve a maths problem by getting upset.

 

[Jelly Rev]

Ive noticed throughout my life most of the time I feel little to no emotion. As a child I was a daydreamer and hypersensitive. As time went on just like others it seemed beneficial to just vault up emotions to prevent blowouts. Other people have blowouts that it seems to me they think of as no big deal. but it seems at least to me a blowout seemed like weakness a loss of control

People try to upset me but it has no effect. I logically know there words have no effect on me. this is behevior that many intp's know. Why would we let emotions control us for myself at least I feel as though Im above that.

I want to know why though, how do we unlock our emotions to have emotions on a relational level with others?

For myself currently relations are based either upon on excessive word play or acting, especially for the picking up of women, Ive just turned that into a game

but more importantly there are times when I am in the moment like how I imagine the more typical types may feel. These times include when I am in excess drinking, times of extreme fatigue or when I have a hangover. Its as though I'm just there.
The Ti function seems to turn off, the one that just has me daydreaming all day. but why?
Is this bc of something being deprived in the brain such as fluid or glucose levels? or a change in blood flow. introverts and extraverts do have different brain blood flow patterns(pre frontal lobes compared to temporal lobe)

Another problem I have to unleashing potential emotions in my normal state is just listening to people. Everyone is so uninteresting, esp compared to whats going on in my head
------
Lastly I can relate on the GOW madness, no game makes me as upset as GOW esp online

 

[PhoenixofVindemiatrix]

See, here's part of the problem. People think that there are good emotions (joy, happiness, love, etc.) and bad emotions (fear, hate, wrath, etc.) when in fact all emotions are bad things. It's not just that they skew your judgment. I can't explain it fully right now (the epiphany isn't with me at the moment), but I'm more confident about this than I am about most things.

If emotions skewed judgment, why would humans have developed them? Do you think it is because that in some situations, it does not benefit a person to think purely "rationally"?

 

[Sijov]

Hi, I've just stumbeld across this forum in an effort to better understand ym personality, and I couldn't resist posting.
I have been working on better understanding my emotions for quite some time, now, because I do have those episodes of unreasoning anger, and one time (over a girl), I punched a hole in my parents' wall (I was hoping to hit a stud and break my hand rather than the wall. I missed by about 100mm).

From that, I've (rather typically) put considerable thought into how I emote and why and when. Another thing I've done is actually to volunteer to a phone couselling hotline, which will (I'm still in training) put me in a position where I must confront and understand, and accept what others are feeling in order to help. This has so far been excellent for me to force me to accept that emotions are not intrinsically bad (or good) in and of themselves. From this, I have become much more adept at understanding the reasons for feeling an emotion. For instance, anger is felt when an expectation is not met. This allows resolution in two ways, either changing the expectation or to change the situation so that the expectation is better met.

Something else that has come out of this is a desire to feel and savour my emotions whether or not they are pleasant. When, in a later incident the above girl and I broke up, I was able to allow myself the time and space to sit in the emotion (in this case mostly grief) and allow myself to process it in those mysterious ways that grief is processed. While the processing of the grief was mostly non-logical (grief is usually a 'getting used to the new normal' thing, I find), it was helped by my thinking about the situation, and basically allowing myself to feel, even as I was thinking about it.

I find myself these days to enjoy emotion when it comes, particularly when in a controlled environment, such as the movies. I have found that letting a movie move me through a range of emotions can be quite cathartic sometimes, and it also allows a wider experience of emotion, basically improving on an emotional vocabulary. This occurs particuarly if I can retain a little distance and think through at the same time, or to remember the situation for Ti based processing later. This also means that I sometimes let myself cry at movies. My definition of art (I know that art is really hard to define, so this is highly subjective), or great art, has consequently shifted to something that can make me feel an emotion, regardless of how pleasant it is. My favourite music, for instance, will be able to evoke a certain emotion, and I will often select music to listen to depending on the emotion that I would like to evoke, or to match how I currently feel.

I should note that while I do have a greater emotional literacy, and a growing understanding of the emotions of others, I do still have the occasional angry outbursts which sneak up on me. But I do find that with the ides of changing the situation or my expectation, I can manage it much better. There are still times when I resort to violent catharsis for an emotional overflow rather than a more constructive way of dealing with it, but I feel that I have better control, through riding out my emotions rather than caging them.

I hope that makes sense, and that it is helpful.

 

[PhoenixofVindemiatrix]

Sijov, welcome to the forum!

I am relieved that another INTP thinks as I do, so I'm glad you posted here.

As I see it, emotions are the only thing worth living for. I know I will probably be ridiculed for this, but it is my view.

However, I think that experiencing emotions just for the sake of experiencing them is pointless. They are only meaningful when they derive from genuine experience, meaning Ti or Ne, I suppose.

Emotions are what make us human, and in order to feel so, I presume we need to endure the whole range of emotions. We must focus on the positive ones, however.

 

[Sijov]

Yeah, though I did notice that XenGoat did steal some of my thunder, and I agree with what he posted. I disagree with your idea of emotions being the thing to live for, but that is personal philosophy and something we can disagree on.

Experiencing emotions for their own sake could be viewed as pointless, however, for me they are educational (what buttons were pushed to cause this?) and I derive pleasure from them (so it is pointless in the same way that a videogame or trashy novel is). Besides, it is usually additional to what I am doing at the time. I don't go around trying to make myself feel a certain way. I derive pleasure from understanding why I am feeling a certain way and in savouring what the feeling actually is and how it is experienced.

I don't really understand why an emotion is less valuable if it is caused by a contrived manner, say through media or art, rather than through a circumstance that you're actually in. My guess is that our different views on living for emotion inform this outlook; if one lives for emotion, and yet can bring about emotion by way of a contrived means, then there is nothing to live for. To resolve this, the idea of a meaningless emotion is introduced. Is that approximately your view?

 

[PhoenixofVindemiatrix]

Yes, exactly. You are good at putting my thoughts into words.

However, I do not see all art as pointless. Much of it I see as a meaningful experience. I don't know exactly where I would draw the line between meaningful and meaningless.