Social skills

[nthng]

Hi.
There is a girl. I want to be closer to that girl.
The thing is I don't think I communicate well enough.
Do you think it's possible for INTP person to learn very quick to be socially comfortable around people? Get rid of weird straightforwardness and be more feminine-like. Be soft, empathetic, yet still be tough man as I am.
How to learn social skills, when my analyzing abilities are the solid barier to this? How a computer such as me, can learn things, that are illogical to him, stupid, yet still necessary. Maybe you figured it out?
Intuition doesn't help anyway, I'm drowned in endless possibilities which are possible, going in abstract situations that are not gonna happen.
Oh, and I need it fast. The girl will not wait.

 

[ruminator]

Are you nthng the artist?

https://soundcloud.com/nthngnthng

 

[nthng]

Are you nthng the artist?

No, but I was a little inspired by him.
I like programming-like shorten names and to draw little distant black humans in a white background. I have no identity, so nothing is like none. I even use VPN now and safe email and my privacy is important for me, to not become someone.

 

[Black Rose]

Computers don't feel uncomfortable around people. So your not one and you have feelings. What you need to do is get in touch with those feelings. Acclimatise to them. That means take it little by little. Absorb them and be yourself. Not much more than that. Just don't ignore the feelings you have. You'll feel better and be fine with people.

 

[Grayman]

A girl!

Ctrl+Alt+Esc

 

[nthng]

Computers don't feel uncomfortable around people

That's a good point.

What you need to do is get in touch with those feelings. Acclimatise to them. That means take it little by little. Absorb them and be yourself. Not much more than that. Just don't ignore the feelings you have.

Thank you, I think it's solid advice. Still, I often don't know what I feel.

A girl!

Ctrl+Alt+Esc

Yeah, that's the first thing that comes to mind usually. Unfortunately I see her often and can't torture myself seeing her and doing nothing.

 

[Ex-User (14663)]

I didn't really understand OP. Is being feminine, soft and empathetic the equivalent of being comfortable with other people in your mind, or are these separate goals of yours?

 

[baccheion]

Watch videos on YouTube (see: RSDMax Manifesto). Iodine protocol. Oxytocin enhancers. Piracetam + aniracetam + alpha-GPC. Meditation and/or brainwave entrainment audio.

 

[Pyropyro]

I'm kinda confused OP. You want to be nothing and have no identity, correct?

So how does that exactly work with social functions which operates on self-identity and social identity?

 

[Niclmaki]

Eh, learn how to softly probe for information about her without being cutting. Find a thing that she may be interested in (idealy you will be too) and orbit around that.

Caution: you should be confortable all throughout, otherwise it may come off as phoney. But it may just be taken as nervousness if she is keen. An “advanced” tactic could be doing it all with confidence too, but that method needs to be tempered with genuine humour. Otherwise you’ll just cone off as an asshole.

 

[nthng]

I didn't really understand OP. Is being feminine, soft and empathetic the equivalent of being comfortable with other people in your mind, or are these separate goals of yours?

First one. I can be straightforward with men and everyone enjoys it. However it really sucks in romantic relationship. You can't just tell a girl that you want be father of her children. There needs to be a more cunning, around way, not straight. Some planning, etc. For me it's feminine way.

I'm kinda confused OP. You want to be nothing and have no identity, correct?

So how does that exactly work with social functions which operates on self-identity and social identity?

Fe people don't have identity. When they look inside, there is whole big emptiness. That's why they focus on other people. Have in mind I talk about preferences, not about extremes. Everyone have some identity, I just compare Fi to Fe.
Personally, my identity comes from things I believe (science mostly [about believing in science, you need to believe in theories, because they can't be proofed]).

An “advanced” tactic could be doing it all with confidence too, but that method needs to be tempered with genuine humour.

I don't have problem with confidence, I'm just not vulnerable, empathetic, sometimes I don't care about others, so how can I be close to them? I made this topic, because for me doesn't exist change or a way to change myself. So I give you a challenge, because maybe, just maybe one of you had similar problem and figured it out.

btw. this site sucks, I have problems posting here and it doesn't work sometimes.

 

[Ex-User (14663)]

First one. I can be straightforward with men and everyone enjoys it. However it really sucks in romantic relationship. You can't just tell a girl that you want be father of her children. There needs to be a more cunning, around way, not straight. Some planning, etc. For me it's feminine way.

It is the feminine way indeed. But you are male, I presume, which means this would be the wrong way to go.

Women are not opposed to straightforwardness and bluntness. If the goal is to be attractive as a male, as opposed trying to become another girlfriend of hers, you gotta think about the whole thing in a very different way.

 

[Niclmaki]

I don't have problem with confidence, I'm just not vulnerable, empathetic, sometimes I don't care about others, so how can I be close to them? I made this topic, because for me doesn't exist change or a way to change myself. So I give you a challenge, because maybe, just maybe one of you had similar problem and figured it out.

btw. this site sucks, I have problems posting here and it doesn't work sometimes.

Oh I see now. By “sometimes not care about others” do you mean that sometimes you do? When I’m in a “not caring” phase about people I OUGHT to, I just force myself to keep myself in line, and not do anything that’ll upset the status quo. The self control is tiring though, so I need to spend a lot of time alone.


So I guess it’s like this. You probably can’t change yourself to become more touchy-feely, but you can practice self-control. It might also help if you let people know that you aren’t exactly a “warm” person. It has worked for me quite well.

Emotional closeness is something I’ve really only managed twice. It just took a super long time / spending a lot of time together. Only other way may be alcohol poisioning or sleep deprivation, heh.

 

[nthng]

It might also help if you let people know that you aren’t exactly a “warm” person. It has worked for me quite well.

Funny that I never thought about it. This can be good, because I like to be sincere and feel I need to be more. Also I'll get rid of other peoples disappointments.

Sometimes I care about people, when they need help and ask for it. I like telling people what to do the most xD Funny that people have problems with it.

 

[Pyropyro]

@nthng

Okay fair enough.

Anyways, I have of the same mind with Serac here. If you're going for a relationship then just be upfront with the girl. Ask her out. Cunning and planning AFAIK are non-gendered values, not exactly feminine.

If you're going for a friendship then the empathy route works but don't mix the two.

 

[Ex-User (15145)]

I've had my fair share of nurses over the years. This is my strategy for success with a co-worker. I'm assuming she is in your day to day life so go with this.

Be an asshole. Not a total asshole, and don't attack her verbally. Be blunt and cocky, but also FUNNY. Tease her a bit, but not too much. Show very little interest, talk to her occasionally about herself. Then after several weeks if she's showing signs of attraction ask her out. She will say something along the lines of "I thought you hated me". Simply say "You're growing on me". Then she will ask you what you like about her the most. Tell her you don't know yet, but want to find out. If you're not getting signs she wants you it's better to leave it alone and move on.

 

[redbaron]

lol

just ask her out

 

[nthng]

Thank you guys, I made it very simple. Ignoring her for a few days, then asked her out. I forget mention that she's probably INTP, but I suck at typing introverted thinkers. They're impossible to type unless they trust you and speak sincere.
So the plan is to get drunk with wine. I'll tell you how it went.

 

[Ex-User (15145)]

Way to go brother,

I hope by "get drunk with wine" you are meaning to get her drunk, and not yourself.

 

[kora]

Way to go brother,

I hope by "get drunk with wine" you are meaning to get her drunk, and not yourself.

I should think he meant both of them, you know, like normal people having fun together do, not with some kind of creepy date rapey spin as you just put on it, as in, staying sober while getting the other purposefully drunk enough to get in their pants or something. Ew. Fucked up.

 

[Ex-User (15145)]

I should think he meant both of them, you know, like normal people having fun together do, not with some kind of creepy date rapey spin as you just put on it, as in, staying sober while getting the other purposefully drunk enough to get in their pants or something. Ew. Fucked up.

HAHA yes I see what you are saying. However, I wasn't going at this from that viewpoint. More or less from personal experience my verbal communication skills go out the window after one too many, hence ruining his chances with this girl.

 

[Turnevies]

It took me a while to realize that the proces is ultimately not difficult (just a bit counterintuitive for an INTP)

1) Ensure that you are a mentally strong and mature person.
2) Give away love to (all) people for free.

And then it is ultimately a matter of letting go. You don't want to come over as controlling or possessive. Also, you can't trick someone in a relationship (or at least, it is not a good idea). You ask how to become comfortable? Just by experience (aka patience). You also mention endless possibilities? That is a fantastic thing, because whatever happens in life, you'll have plenty of options left.

I think it is definitely a good thing to show both your male and female side. Of course, you want her to feel you are a man. But a certain feminine touch (e.g. use of language or brushing your teeth) can make her feel more at ease. Being too explicit can make you look like a socially inaproppriate barbarian. You can know what you want, but pack it in poetry. Well, it is often about finding a proper balance in this regard.

Anyway, just try something and learn your lessons.

 

[nthng]

So there's update.
She's INTJ. The appointment was very great, can't imagine things could go better (we spent nice 4 platonic hours together while drinking wine and shots. She was leading all the time, she picked a place then walked with me showing a city (because she knows it much better than me, I don't really leave my room).

The problem is in present. I am in a different city for a month and can't meet with her again. I noticed some obsessive thoughts, I can't stop thinking about her. Realizing and analyzing the problem helped me, a bit. I have some questions for you.

Should I call her or write to her during this month? Or will it be better to ignore her, get rid of obsessive thoughts and meet with her when I come back?

About social skills. Yeah, I lack them too. I'm currently intern in Institute of nuclear physics and there are a lot of new people, all of them are of course thinkers, most of them are intuitives. So there is a lot of INTP people, it's terrible xD All of them are near my age (23). Tutors are INTJ, ISTP, 2x INTP.
The problem here is that I don't have any will to talk to these people, I just feel that I can't learn anything from them. I already talk to nearly everyone (about 30 people). Still, I'm now writing to INTP people on the forum xD

Is there anyone old enough to tell me how to cope in such situations?

 

[baccheion]

So there's update.
She's INTJ. The appointment was very great, can't imagine things could go better (we spent nice 4 platonic hours together while drinking wine and shots. She was leading all the time, she picked a place then walked with me showing a city (because she knows it much better than me, I don't really leave my room).

The problem is in present. I am in a different city for a month and can't meet with her again. I noticed some obsessive thoughts, I can't stop thinking about her. Realizing and analyzing the problem helped me, a bit. I have some questions for you.

Should I call her or write to her during this month? Or will it be better to ignore her, get rid of obsessive thoughts and meet with her when I come back?

About social skills. Yeah, I lack them too. I'm currently intern in Institute of nuclear physics and there are a lot of new people, all of them are of course thinkers, most of them are intuitives. So there is a lot of INTP people, it's terrible xD All of them are near my age (23). Tutors are INTJ, ISTP, 2x INTP.
The problem here is that I don't have any will to talk to these people, I just feel that I can't learn anything from them. I already talk to nearly everyone (about 30 people). Still, I'm now writing to INTP people on the forum xD

Is there anyone old enough to tell me how to cope in such situations?

Iodine protocol.

Meditate and/or listen to brainwave entrainment audio (as you, and) to process any obsessions. As she's not a feeler, there's less pressure as far as being more social/feeler-like.

Watch videos on YouTube regarding socializing, conversing, and seducing (RSDMax, for example). Sit with it until it settles/registers.

There's also aniracetam (+ alpha-GPC), rather than alcohol. On the other hand, as you're in a nootropic-assisted state, that's not you. On the other hand, you can use it to observe what happens and to catch on.

INTPs may have nothing to say because they are trying to talk about something in particular. But then INTPs tend to just talk about random things or whatever they are interested in at the time. Also, there's an association in social/date settings with small talk or with stepping through the motions. Just get right to it, especially as she's INTJ. With other types, it may be more involved as they expect a particular (and often foreign or unnatural to you) series of actions and may be very different.

I still don't fully understand what you're worried about.

Also, does she know you're interested? It's better to be direct with INTJs. See type descriptions, especially regarding what they're like in relationships and how they prefer to be approached.

 

[nthng]

As she's not a feeler, there's less pressure

not exactly, she can forgive me many social mistakes as I don't care about her poor skills, but there are some issues like her completely lack of showing feelings, I don't know how she feels and what she thinks, I generally can't read her.

There's also aniracetam (+ alpha-GPC), rather than alcohol

sorry, I prefer alcohol, works for my feelings better ;p

I still don't fully understand what you're worried about.

I worry, that I could or can make one mistake, that will end possibility of romantic relationship. Moreover, I wrote her a message and she didn't reply (it's 2 days now). IDK if I should call or whatever.

Also, does she know you're interested?

I told her, that she is the most interesting person I ever met (she got really confused and told me that she probably isn't who I think she is). Moreover a few times I suggested it, when I told that I wait for this one perfect girl (she asked me why I don't have a girlfriend), she told me such person doesn't exist and I told her that it exist while I was looking straight to her eyes like telling it's her.

 

[Ex-User (14663)]

I told her, that she is the most interesting person I ever met (she got really confused and told me that she probably isn't who I think she is). Moreover a few times I suggested it, when I told that I wait for this one perfect girl (she asked me why I don't have a girlfriend), she told me such person doesn't exist and I told her that it exist while I was looking straight to her eyes like telling it's her.

I think the problem is that you have spent much more time thinking about her than interacting with her. That way you end up in these strange situations where you stare her into her eyes and tell her she is the girl of your dreams, and she doesn't know what the hell is going on.

Did you make any connection with her on the date?

My advice is the following btw: interact with her more and change your mindset form "I have to catch her in my net somehow while minimizing interaction" to: "I don't know whether she is the perfect girl, let's just hang out, have a good time, and explore each other's personalities". Don't try to force things into some outcome you have in your mind.

If you want fast ways of making her attracted to you:
1) Engage in socially risky behavior in the company of other males. For example ruthlessly interrupt an interaction she is having with another male (not in a hostile way though, but playful)
2) Show her that you have the option to bang many other girls. If you can make some other girl interested in you and have her know that, that would be very good.
3) Show her that you are comfortable as a sexual being. For example playing games with her that contain a sexual component is good.

As you can see, all of these contain a certain amount of risk and display traits which are relatively hard to fake. Which is the whole point. Read for example here on honest signalling.

 

[baccheion]

not exactly, she can forgive me many social mistakes as I don't care about her poor skills, but there are some issues like her completely lack of showing feelings, I don't know how she feels and what she thinks, I generally can't read her.

sorry, I prefer alcohol, works for my feelings better ;p

I worry, that I could or can make one mistake, that will end possibility of romantic relationship. Moreover, I wrote her a message and she didn't reply (it's 2 days now). IDK if I should call or whatever.

I told her, that she is the most interesting person I ever met (she got really confused and told me that she probably isn't who I think she is). Moreover a few times I suggested it, when I told that I wait for this one perfect girl (she asked me why I don't have a girlfriend), she told me such person doesn't exist and I told her that it exist while I was looking straight to her eyes like telling it's her.

Aniracetam is better. Iodine protocol.

Why don't you read type descriptions and post/ask in INTJ groups?

 

[Pyropyro]

Call her. If she replies then cool, if not then it's okay as well. It seems that you've developed some weird ideal perfect version of her in your head. Not exactly uncommon for someone experiencing limerence, but it's kinda unhealthy to keep said version up there for a long time. She sensed that when you complimented her and she was honest enough to tell you that. Have some more interactions with women and the girl to dispel that version.

As for coping, I suggest interacting with your peers and tutors more. Might be a bit dreary but it never hurts to build a network of professional acquaintances at your young age. It will probably help you forget about your obsession.