Psychological Paradoxes' affect on Behavior

[EndogenousRebel]

Just an interesting idea I thought of, probably is already thing. Thought philosophy is better suited for the discussion because it would be unscientific and include lots of conjecture. It think it would be a psychoanlytical/jungian discussion, which are very tied to philosophy anyway imo

The easiest way for me to describe it at this point would be through another idea. 'Rebel sins' assume no relation between the idea and my UN lol. Assume that someone is moderately ideologically possessed, not enough to be too predictable. The idea is that someone who is rebelling against something, whether it's a institution, or cultural mentality, would tend to do the opposite of what said force wants/expects it to do. In said rebels' mind, to do what an enemy wants would be a rebel (cardinal) sin against their personal intentions.

Avoiding rebel sins is simple enough when you are rebelling against one force of reality, but life isn't so simple, there is no shortage of of phenomena to align yourself against. So what if one is investigating what they are rebelling against, and find that, maybe by design, maybe by coincidence, rebelling against one enemy feeds/enables a different enemy. So what do people do? What should they do?

I think the way most people react to this is let themselves be controlled by biases and seek ignorance, to minimize the risk of destabilizing dissonance. Some are comfortable with this dissonance/can manage it. I think it's safe to say that those that have these attributes would appear to be more intelligent/knowledgeable, though I doubt it necessarily means they have higher cognitive ability. Limitations of understanding and autonomy. Why try to comprehend what you can never understand, nor change? Won't that make you more resentful? Is resentfulness even a bad thing?

 

[onesteptwostep]

Ignorance is bliss, but with great power, if one seeks it, comes great responsibility.

If you want to unplug from the system, the "herd mentality" so to speak, you would become a slave to economic realities. If you want to live the "herd mentality" or in better phrasing, "participate" in the ecosystem of society, as like in a 'macrofamily', you would live the story, or in other words, enjoy the journey.

"For whom the bell tolls? It tolls for thee" - John Donne, an English poet of the 16th century.

 

[Black Rose]

I had a psychological break once. The pressure was so great that I snapped. It's just the nature of opposing forces. It's got to give and that is dependent on what you can balance at any moment. People avoid pushing themselves to the breaking point. Something pushes you there, it is not voluntary. It doesn't matter how much you can handle it because it matters how much you are pushed to equal it. An unstoppable force comes into contact with an immovable object.

We are going to have to be as selfish as necessary to survive psychologically. Someone said once: that's beyond my paygrade.

 

[EndogenousRebel]

The example I give does lead to this discussion, but I don't want the scope to be limited to this. As someone who likely has something between moderate and severe PTSD, I've been able to find solace in learning things. I don't even know if I should call it healing or progressive, but it definitely helps me sleep. Basically abstractions and and ideas that arise from the memories of my experience (the thing that is traumatic) have been rationalized and developed to such as point, how it interacts with other things and people in the world, where the cycle of suffering begins. And recently it's moved into such a paradoxical space in peculiar way. It's big weight lifted off my shoulders, lots of anger and resentment released, but now I'm just so intrigued by it, for one I still have healing to do, but to me it's just interesting on it's face. The fact that I think that is even more interesting to me. It make me think about how people can actually love a supreme being that allows such catastrophic levels of suffering, how the brain sees everything as one thing and infinite things at the same time.

But yeah if every human expanded their knowledge to the edges of their understanding (obviously knowledge accrual supplements this) they would all basically be confused all the time, but again, it's a freeing feeling. I guess until you come up with an antithesis, but till then it's just really striking to me.

 

[Cognisant]

Cognitive dissonance is simply an indication that you don't understand something, for example in the comic AK posted (perfect choice btw) the Scottish chick has a concept for weight but doesn't understand density or mass. Her mental model of how the world works is incomplete, two equally sized masses of steel and feathers would indeed have different weights and steel would indeed be heavier but that's because their density (and thus their actual mass) is different.

Avoiding rebel sins is simple enough when you are rebelling against one force of reality, but life isn't so simple, there is no shortage of of phenomena to align yourself against. So what if one is investigating what they are rebelling against, and find that, maybe by design, maybe by coincidence, rebelling against one enemy feeds/enables a different enemy. So what do people do? What should they do?

They should seek out the source of dissonance and try to understand what's causing it.

I think the way most people react to this is let themselves be controlled by biases and seek ignorance, to minimize the risk of destabilizing dissonance. Some are comfortable with this dissonance/can manage it. I think it's safe to say that those that have these attributes would appear to be more intelligent/knowledgeable, though I doubt it necessarily means they have higher cognitive ability.

It's practically the definition of idiocy, people who cultivate their own ignorance in order to defend their cherished worldview will inevitably run afoul of a reality doesn't care about their beliefs.

By contrast intelligent people actively seek out sources of dissonance as they see these as opportunities to expand their understanding and thus empower themselves to make increasingly far flung predictions and achieve their goals with less effort.

Consider for example in the world of Minecraft the difference between a new player who doesn't understand much and a veteran player with a deep understanding of the game's rules and systems. While the former may struggle to stay safe and fed the latter will quickly make automated systems that produce endless food and make mob farming easy. If knowledge is power then understanding is doubly so.

 

[onesteptwostep]

The example I give does lead to this discussion, but I don't want the scope to be limited to this. As someone who likely has something between moderate and severe PTSD, I've been able to find solace in learning things. I don't even know if I should call it healing or progressive, but it definitely helps me sleep. Basically abstractions and and ideas that arise from the memories of my experience (the thing that is traumatic) have been rationalized and developed to such as point, how it interacts with other things and people in the world, where the cycle of suffering begins. And recently it's moved into such a paradoxical space in peculiar way. It's big weight lifted off my shoulders, lots of anger and resentment released, but now I'm just so intrigued by it, for one I still have healing to do, but to me it's just interesting on it's face. The fact that I think that is even more interesting to me. It make me think about how people can actually love a supreme being that allows such catastrophic levels of suffering, how the brain sees everything as one thing and infinite things at the same time.

But yeah if every human expanded their knowledge to the edges of their understanding (obviously knowledge accrual supplements this) they would all basically be confused all the time, but again, it's a freeing feeling. I guess until you come up with an antithesis, but till then it's just really striking to me.

That's good and all, but all learning is temporal. Pleasure gained from new knowledge, thus wisdom, and the sense of awe from it only lasts a certain amount of time. It's like purchasing a new shoe or the latest console or PC. Pleasure sought by humans are temporal.

But I understand that this method is has its utility in providing you relief, which I think is a great thing. Relief provides normalcy and from normalcy we stepstone onto other prospects.

But, that is where the discussion, as far as the subject matter goes, ends. Knowledge as utility in healing is only useful if the one being healed has a wound of some sort. To those who do not have a wound, knowledge is simply knowledge. If there is awe, then like already mentioned, is only for a moment.

When I was in high school, I was intrigued by the Heisenberg Principle or the concept of a particle being both wave and a beam, as in quantum mechanics. Learning about Hegel's historical dialectic or Thomas Aquinas's theological treatises were interesting to me at first.

But what value is that knowledge to my own being? What good is intelligence in life? I don't mean that as a rhetorical question.

If we go at the core of what life is, that being, ontology, we are set upon the question of purpose, teleos, or teleology.

If you were the first sentient human, what would your goals be? What is life to you?

 

[EndogenousRebel]

Some reflection made the mythological Hydra come to mind. The multiheaded serpent that as you cut of it's heads, they are replaced by two more. I searched it up and found this article, it's a quick read and cites a lot of sources. Quaint.

Herakles & The Hydra: From an Allegorical and a Psychoanalytical Perspective.

Given that Greek mythology offers a plethora of rich, multi layered symbolism,I’d like to provide a critical analysis of Herakles’ Second Labour – the killing of the Lernaean Hydra :firstly, from a psychoanalytical perspective and then from an allegorical one. Furthermore, I will provide a fairly br

www.linkedin.com

Yes, the satisfaction I initially had is already waning. It wouldn't be very Herculean of me to just tell myself I can never understand something and hope that events that play out in my favor. The idea is still interesting to me, behaviorally speaking. Puzzling things are all around us it's so obvious that we don't know shit and yet many act like they know everything. Yet, these people likely have a better quality of life. Are the stupid, or are we just hungry for genuine victories? Are our quality of life even comparable? My battle with the Hydra is barely a choice, the alternative is going on with my life feeling like I am not at ease, not knowing/dealing what to do and why I am being eaten by a deadly force. I suppose what I seek is genuine peace and prosperity. If I had a goal besides that it would probably killing other people's hydra, and destruction of the source that manifests them. Use hate to destroy hate, use hate to motivate knowledge acquisition. Hate can give one purpose evidently, maybe I that is why I defaulted to pushing this outside my conscious diligence.

I suppose I realized a certain level of futility and I associated it with something I could never hope to beat. The pursuit of knowledge in hopes of clarity, when you know all it will do is confuse you more is a contradiction, paradoxical. Something for the gods to workout. Which is why I mentioned why Christians are so attracted to the idea of God. They do not have the weight of troubles on them, they pass on their sins and worries to God who instantly forgives them for the situation he put them in and passes on good fortune. Sounds like a one-sided relationship.

 

[onesteptwostep]

Some reflection made the mythological Hydra come to mind. The multiheaded serpent that as you cut of it's heads, they are replaced by two more. I searched it up and found this article, it's a quick read and cites a lot of sources. Quaint.

Herakles & The Hydra: From an Allegorical and a Psychoanalytical Perspective.

Given that Greek mythology offers a plethora of rich, multi layered symbolism,I’d like to provide a critical analysis of Herakles’ Second Labour – the killing of the Lernaean Hydra :firstly, from a psychoanalytical perspective and then from an allegorical one. Furthermore, I will provide a fairly br

www.linkedin.com

Yes, the satisfaction I initially had is already waning. It wouldn't be very Herculean of me to just tell myself I can never understand something and hope that events that play out in my favor. The idea is still interesting to me, behaviorally speaking. Puzzling things are all around us it's so obvious that we don't know shit and yet many act like they know everything. Yet, these people likely have a better quality of life. Are the stupid, or are we just hungry for genuine victories? Are our quality of life even comparable? My battle with the Hydra is barely a choice, the alternative is going on with my life feeling like I am not at ease, not knowing/dealing what to do and why I am being eaten by a deadly force. I suppose what I seek is genuine peace and prosperity. If I had a goal besides that it would probably killing other people's hydra, and destruction of the source that manifests them. Use hate to destroy hate, use hate to motivate knowledge acquisition. Hate can give one purpose evidently, maybe I that is why I defaulted to pushing this outside my conscious diligence.

I suppose I realized a certain level of futility and I associated it with something I could never hope to beat. The pursuit of knowledge in hopes of clarity, when you know all it will do is confuse you more is a contradiction, paradoxical. Something for the gods to workout. Which is why I mentioned why Christians are so attracted to the idea of God. They do not have the weight of troubles on them, they pass on their sins and worries to God who instantly forgives them for the situation he put them in and passes on good fortune. Sounds like a one-sided relationship.

In theology, it's God who chooses His people, not the other way around. The foci of belief rests in God, not the human. Belief and faith is a gift from God, not from our own efforts or understanding; i.e. rationality. The agency of the human, while significant, is secondary. God is primary.

"Crede ut intellegas, I believe so that I may understand" - St. Augustine

 

[Black Rose]

meaning/nihilism both are condensed into feeling tones. Depression/ecstasy and form of nostalgia. Now both are not contradictions otherwise they would not exist. Meaning in all forms represents something important. Meaning is imprinted on the nervous system. It is an ideal condition our ancestors experienced in the environment. It was safety and thriving. The systems in the brain that correspond with emotion is wh things like music is meaningful.

I think that questions like: does the universe care? are misnomers. In order to care you need to be self-aware. Only part of the universe is like this. Music induces awareness but is not aware itself. The universe programs us so the universe is semi-autonomous. A point to make is that these engrams/memes are not meaningless, the structure of them is grounded in the biology the meaning arises from.

So meaning comes from feelings and feelings are induced from perceptions. Truth Beauty Goodness. Lies Ugliness The Bad. nihilism is a feeling, a perception of nothingness. The perception is not nothing but feels like nothing. Cog dissonance is failing to see order. Because currently in the mind is randomness but this is not the same as saying randomness is the way the universe operates.

At base the world is perception, perceptions are real or not but they are meaningful if ordered otherwise randomness causes cog dissonce. There are no contradictions accept in the mind. Only when we think no resolution exists do we find breaks occur. It is a failer to reorder things. It is not so much ignoring facts as it is seeing their place because the order is wholelistic. Facts fit into a specific order not that they are thrown away. Higher-order structures need a fit to wedge in dissonance.

Resolution is found in higher-order structures.

 

[Black Rose]

Psychological Paradoxes' affect on Behavior​

You have no skin in the game if they are just hypothetical ideas until you confront where such paradoxes test you. In my psychological break, I had to confront self-preservation vs saving a loved one. Just the hypothetical but it was a break. Pain vs family. Them or me. Very critical. And it came after I had done that magic ritual. So it was a real crack that I experienced. That is not a metaphor.

There is no change in behavior unless one is confronted.