Probably not the first one to post about this...

[nag404239]

I'm fairly new to this forum and I was hoping a few of the more knowledgable members would be willing to provide some explanation to a problem I've been having.

First off, I'm definitely an INTP and on the outside I'm proud of it, always wanting to display my superior intelligence and walking around proud. But I secretly despise being so intelligent at this point in my life. Sure, it's easy for me to retain knowledge in my Calculus class, or perform well at work...but my social skills are absolutely atrocious. I literally cannot make new friends. Every time I have the thought to talk to someone new, I talk myself out of it with reasoning such as: 1. They're not as smart as me 2.will think I'm weird for enjoying intellectual conversations and pursuits. 3. I don't even know where to begin a conversation. My girlfriend is quite the opposite, having a large social group and always meeting new people. On some level I'm jealous, and that jealousy displays itself in the form of anger. I hate the fact that she's always socializing.

Another subtopic of this problem is having severe anxiety. I worry about everything there is to worry about before it happens. Give me one piece of information and I take it, figure out every possible outcome there is, and seem to focus on the other worst one. I'm always double checking, looking ahead, asking tons of questions. It's like I'm afraid there's some tragedy around the corner at all times. As they say, if you look for something wrong you'll find it. Well i sure do find it and when I do, it can get as bad as to stop my ability to function and act rationally. I become single minded and only focus on whatever the worry is and will not stop until it's directly proven that I'm wrong. Which is really hard to do as I'm "never wrong". Any missing piece of information in a description of something, is replaced with the worst possibility.

If anyone has any insight into this, please post your thoughts, advice and stories of your own if you have them. Thanks guys!




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[Jennywocky]

First off, I'm definitely an INTP and on the outside I'm proud of it, always wanting to display my superior intelligence and walking around proud. But I secretly despise being so intelligent at this point in my life. Sure, it's easy for me to retain knowledge in my Calculus class, or perform well at work...but my social skills are absolutely atrocious. I literally cannot make new friends. Every time I have the thought to talk to someone new, I talk myself out of it with reasoning such as: 1. They're not as smart as me 2.will think I'm weird for enjoying intellectual conversations and pursuits. 3. I don't even know where to begin a conversation. My girlfriend is quite the opposite, having a large social group and always meeting new people. On some level I'm jealous, and that jealousy displays itself in the form of anger. I hate the fact that she's always socializing.

　
Well, the deal there is that if you don't find a way to shift the attitude, the relationship will not endure. Jealousy will destroy it.

You say you're not great at connecting with people. Have you ever talked about why your girlfriend finds you attractive? She has a ton of people skills, yet she picked you. Obviously she values something about you.... something you can feel good about.

Also, couples are there to bolster each other's weaknesses and benefit from each other's strengths. Are there ways you can learn some socializing skills from your gf or get your foot in the door with other people, to expand your own connections? Does she come to you for ideas or rationalities when she wants to figure something out? you guys can contribute to each other.

What do you do together, that is enjoyable for the both of you?
It sounds like your relationship needs to be more balanced. She needs to accept more private time with you, you need to accept that she needs time with others beside you; and it doesn't mean that either you is disappointed in the other, it's just the way you're both built.

The anger and jealousy suggests to me that you might be disparaging of those with more people skills, which can come off as antagonistic/critical of who she is, and it could lead to a breakdown of the relationship. Those with people skills and focus on connecting/socializing can be frustrating to those of us who are not, especially early in life... but I found that moving from school into the workplace and further that I experienced far less resentment and just saw it as their gift. They can use those powers for positive reasons besides self-strokes, just like you can use your brain for non-indulgent pursuits. You can be angry at people who abuse their gifts or lord it over others, but the gift itself is a strength; it's good not to confuse the two.

Another subtopic of this problem is having severe anxiety. I worry about everything there is to worry about before it happens. Give me one piece of information and I take it, figure out every possible outcome there is, and seem to focus on the other worst one. I'm always double checking, looking ahead, asking tons of questions. It's like I'm afraid there's some tragedy around the corner at all times. As they say, if you look for something wrong you'll find it. Well i sure do find it and when I do, it can get as bad as to stop my ability to function and act rationally. I become single minded and only focus on whatever the worry is and will not stop until it's directly proven that I'm wrong. Which is really hard to do as I'm "never wrong". Any missing piece of information in a description of something, is replaced with the worst possibility.

Yeah. I slowly got through that by realizing that my extreme negativity was actually irrational (since I hate irrationality). Things don't always go bad. Typically they go average, and sometimes they go better and sometimes they go worse. (like the bell curve.) So why would I want to be illogical and always fear the worst to the degree it controls my life and makes me miserable and derails my efforts? It can be a self-fulfilling negative prophecy.

Also, we can impact the curve by investment a significant amount, without having to over-invest. You're looking for that sweet spot where a general amount of investment will provide the most bang for your buck, but not kill yourself trying to do that last crazy 20% which provide very little change in outcome. Face it, you can't control every little detail in life; control what is reasonable, trust your ability to cope for the rest.

Also, the worrying thing can change as you acquire more life experience; I found that once I had gained some experience, I could better gauge when something would go bad versus not, and I also gained some confidence in my abilities to deal with something that has gone bad. The problem with deterministic thinking is that the outcome remains static -> we add it up in our head based on current conditions and think, "Oh no, it's doomed," where the reality is that by investment a little or changing our approach (changing the variables), we can change the outcome. No outcome is really fixed; we can change something to change the outcome. We only realistically get fatalistic when there is nothing we can change that can change the outcome. Developing Ne can give you some feeling of power over your situation, to balance out hardcore rationality. (it might also impact your socialization issues a bit as well.)

Anyway, have you ever been diagnosed with anything like OCD? It's not necessarily in play here, but obsessive thinking is not just the venue of a Ti person.

 

[Ex-User (9062)]

One thing i could recommend to you is taking a select amount of herbal remedies that put you in a confident spot and just embark on a ride (to hell).
Take things as they come.
For the recipe, contact me via PM.

 

[nag404239]

In terms of our relationship, I would consider it of high quality. The problems I outlined above mainly remain internal (not that it's any better that way). I only externalize them when it's something I absolutely cannot keep in. I've gotten better at rationalizing in a way that can reverse my worrying but it seems like a timely process. It takes a full and complete analysis of the situation, sometimes even more research until I find a point in which I can negate my worrying. I'd like to essentially work on establishing a faster process for rationalization.


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[Ex-User (9062)]

In terms of our relationship, I would consider it of high quality. The problems I outlined above mainly remain internal (not that it's any better that way). I only externalize them when it's something I absolutely cannot keep in. I've gotten better at rationalizing in a way that can reverse my worrying but it seems like a timely process. It takes a full and complete analysis of the situation, sometimes even more research until I find a point in which I can negate my worrying. I'd like to essentially work on establishing a faster process for rationalization.


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As i stated above, i can give you a short-cut to being acceptable to the various systemic pressures you have to face in day-to-day life.
But the reality of the problem is, that you can only numb to it,
the real problem is the system and you may never overcome the system in your lifetime, you can only be given an option to exist in ignorant bliss.

 

[nag404239]

I think there's more to it than just "the system". Others are perfectly happy after overcoming the troubles I go through, it's just a matter of finding out what works for me. I've tried the numbing tactic and it doesn't work. I just wound up in a ton of legal trouble. The next few weeks were hell coming back to reality, worse than it was to begin with. I'd rather conquer these things head on rather than live through like ignorantly.


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[Ex-User (9062)]

I think there's more to it than just "the system". Others are perfectly happy after overcoming the troubles I go through, it's just a matter of finding out what works for me. I've tried the numbing tactic and it doesn't work. I just wound up in a ton of legal trouble. The next few weeks were hell coming back to reality, worse than it was to begin with. I'd rather conquer these things head on rather than live through like ignorantly.


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The herbal remedies i had in mind were not of an illegal nature,
they are free from any harmful side-effects and numb you just a tad bit,
barely noticeable, but effective.
By system, i meant external and internal variables that are simply out of your control.

 

[thoughtfully]

You say you are INTP. For me I'm not so sure. You say you are intelligent and are proud of it. I'm sure there is truth in that not completely. I will take you down a peg. You are intelligent in Calculus class not as a social person. There are social skills and you don't have them. Is that intelligent?

From your self-description you are terribly one-sided. I've had that problem also. The result was superiority and inferiority feelings at the same time. You are afraid and with good reason for being one-sided. If you are passive in a conversation you will be at the mercy of others. To get more active try inquiring into their interests for practice. It won't matter if your other skills are superior. Their interests will excel yours in skill. Don't try that with your girlfriend. She does it for you.

 

[nag404239]

I am proud of being Intelligent, but at the same time I'm not. I definitely understand where I lack social/emotional intelligence, and being so logical and analytical as I am, it frustrates me that I lack the skills to effectively handle my emotions and life life as person, rather than a machine.


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[mooncrater]

Go have fun playing games with kids.

 

[jus]

If you get bored, under-stimulated and whiney its on you to make it work or leave the environment all together. People are actually pretty neat once you learn how to quickly land into intimate conversations you know.

Sometimes we have to move on and leave environment/friends/family behind. And if thats the case dont be a coward, stop wasting time, take the leap and follow your fucking curiosity man. Key to a rich stimulating life is the quality in the network you build inside and around you - all happy madafakkas knows this.

About the anxiety; find someone intuitive and brave to talk to. Figure out the root of the root, try to understand it, let it go, ..and forgive it if you can.

Also, stop obsessing over being right all the time, re-evaluate what rational means to you and others, introduce some more magic/intuition into your life and for fucks sake love yourself.

to consider: studying/move abroad? Being an expat forces you into a mindset that i think is very healthy for an INTP.

 

[nag404239]

Very blunt and to the point, thank you. I think a lot of the problems i struggle with are rooted internally, well actually I know this to be true. I understand the anxiety through and through, but letting it go and forgiving it seems to be infinitely difficult


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[mooncrater]

to consider: studying/move abroad? Being an expat forces you into a mindset that i think is very healthy for an INTP.

I agree. Another option would be to quit your job (or take a break from school, or whatever) and go on a solo backpacking trip overseas - at least three months. I did this, and for the most part, I didn't know anybody else around me, it was my first time going to any of the places I went to, I had no set plans on how to go about my journey - just an arrival date in one city, and a departure date in another. Stay in a place, make some new acquaintances, then leave it all behind and go to the next place and start over...and do it again and again. Isolation. Arrive at a new hostel. Try to enjoy your time. Seeing how others can help you do this, and how you can help others do the same. Leave the hostel. Isolation. Start again in a different setting with different variables. It's training.

 

[nanook]

In my view, these are the kind of subjects that interest the TiNe type the most. You people take care of exploiting the possibilities of life. Of course entp are ahead of you. anyhow, you don't want to be dragged down by clumsy thoughts about unrelated things like typology and the kitchen sink. it's all about video games and getting pussy or dick in the case of never mind. only architect and me and some other mistyped ISTJs care about typology day in and day out.

Have you ever talked about why your girlfriend finds you attractive? She has a ton of people skills, yet she picked you. Obviously she values something about you.... something you can feel good about.

the Fe is so strong in this one


bunch of feeling types, y'all

 

[Oddity]

First off, I'm definitely an INTP and on the outside I'm proud of it, always wanting to display my superior intelligence and walking around proud. But I secretly despise being so intelligent at this point in my life. Sure, it's easy for me to retain knowledge in my Calculus class, or perform well at work...

Consider INTJ.

If you get bored, under-stimulated and whiney its on you to make it work or leave the environment all together. People are actually pretty neat once you learn how to quickly land into intimate conversations you know.

What do you mean by this, and "intimate conversations" exactly?

I agree. Another option would be to quit your job (or take a break from school, or whatever) and go on a solo backpacking trip overseas - at least three months.

How can people even afford this? (especially if they're a student and have a shit ton of student debt)

it's all about video games and getting pussy

I don't think most of us (INTP) are the types who can even figure out where to start getting it

 

[Bijection]

You sound quite INTJ to me.

+1 on the "talk with your GF about how she likes you and wants to be with you among all the people she knows/gets to know".


Lastly: join a voluntary association that works for people in need, play with kids (babysitting or whatever you can find), random travel as explained by Mooncrater, having to work with animals also I find of help (we ain't that much different at all on an emotional side).
It doesen't happen othernight.
But it totally works in the long run.

 

[cheese]

You do sound a bit INTJ as Bijection said.

Yeah, the important thing is practice. You don't see benefits immediately but you must remember not to give up at that point, even if you see yourself making many mistakes. With time, the small but invisible improvements you're making add up and you will start to see significant change.

Also, if you genuinely immerse yourself in trying to learn about other people, your mind will be distracted from its worrying. Essentially you're shifting focus.

Mainly you want to:
1. Ask people about themselves
2. Find common ground

Things usually grow from here. IMO there's very little people can tell you that you can't connect to something in your own life, or that you've read or studied. Use the common ground to scaffold an understanding of what they're saying, which you can then use to generate more questions or discussion. When in doubt, rephrase what they've said to check you've understood (or just for social echo). I think the difference between social people and introverts is that social people are comfortable asking or stating things we would find too banal and unworthy of note. But this is where a lot of conversation gets started - you start small, and build depth over time.

The other thing I'd add is that if you're afraid or ashamed of being weird (or anything), you will often find the root in how you perceive and judge others. If you judge others for being ostracised, or incompetent, you will fear being so yourself. Learn to see everyone as an unfolding process - we are all learning, and the people you see just happen to be caught in your perception at a certain stage in their development. Then the next time you catch yourself worrying about this, remind yourself it's just a snapshot, like anyone else, and soon the picture will change. You are not your image.