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Magic the Gathering

Ninjamanda

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I can't believe that there isn't a thread about this game. The rules, attention to details, and the strategies involved in this game would be perfect for most people on here.

I used to be super obsessed with this game. I was in a league for a bit, I used to do drafts all the times and I played in a few tournaments.

Just wondering if anyone else loves it as much as I do.
 

Darby

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Used to, then realized that I wanted a girlfriend and to see daylight once in a while. I'm not even trying to be offensive, that's honestly why I stopped. That and I put way too much money into it and I thought that saving it would be a better use of it, and in so doing, I got behind on the sets and couldn't compete.
 

Ninjamanda

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Haha well I am not in the market for a girlfriend ;) so I don't need to stop. But if you get a good group of people and play league style, it doesn't cost a lot of money.

You could always play less than you did, you don't have to quit altogether. Don't you miss the excitement and intesity of it?

My favorite part was building limited decks.
 

Darby

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Well, to keep up with the people I played with, I kind of did have to put that much money in. There were many factors that went into me no longer playing, I still enjoy the game, and if someone wishes to play I wont turn them down, but I don't do drafts or buy cards regularly anymore.

My favorite deck was my Angel deck, I built it myself, at the time it was considered type 2, although my non-type 2 version was far better. I played it in multiplayer games and had 4 Luminarch Ascensions. After that it didn't really matter what people had, but I had things for that too. It was definitely a fun casual deck, if someone REALLY wanted to beat it, they could. The three Platinum Angels on top of my Indomitable Archangels made it a huge pain for everyone else.

Definitely a fun deck. I almost beat my friends Helix Pinnacle deck, after two hours, but I countereed the wrong spell like and idiot.
 

Ninjamanda

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haha I never played with decks that I could insert any card I wanted to into it. I was in leagues that only allowed standard decks. Or we only did drafts of a certain set.

I prefer it that way, because using the older cards makes endless opportunities and makes it more unfair.

But I got lucky drafting once, I got two Day Of Judgement cards and wrecked house.
 

RedN

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i used to collect these but i just played on the stores with random people - no card restrictions, just play what you got. i dont like being told what i can use or not
 

noksve

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I had a couple of decks plus assorted cards, but never spent money in a card myself. They were all gifts from an uncle. I used to be quite good for an amateur, I guess. Then I moved out of town and gave all my cards to my friends who were buying more cards themselves. I stopped mainly because I didn't really want to put my own money into it, had better things to buy I guess.

I had Plated Slagwurm as my main thing, 8/8 and can't be target of skills or abilities that your opponents control. And a shiny Thorn Elemental. I was mostly green I guess.

edit: man, this brings memories.
 

Darby

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haha I never played with decks that I could insert any card I wanted to into it. I was in leagues that only allowed standard decks. Or we only did drafts of a certain set.

I prefer it that way, because using the older cards makes endless opportunities and makes it more unfair.

But I got lucky drafting once, I got two Day Of Judgement cards and wrecked house.

yeah, we always did more casual games, but when we all sat down, we agreed on if it was type 2 (standard), or legacy. As a general rule we always played standard, but because of that the group that I played with would put TONS of money into cards at the prereleases, and I just didn't feel the desire to put that kind of money in to keep up.

Although I do remember the day I pulled my Mind Sculptor. I just took a deep breath and asked everyone to hold the game for a few moments while I ogled it. Especially since it was a week after I pulled my foil Gideon.
 

NinjaSurfer

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Haha well I am not in the market for a girlfriend ;) so I don't need to stop. But if you get a good group of people and play league style, it doesn't cost a lot of money.

You could always play less than you did, you don't have to quit altogether. Don't you miss the excitement and intesity of it?

My favorite part was building limited decks.

I played back in the day, like 15 years ago, when Ice Age was the new edition; I liked making speed decks with lighting bolts and shit; I had different kinds of damaging decks for different purposes; I had a healing deck too-- but my black speed deck of death with fireballs and stuff was the best; I took up chess recently because that is free lol
 

RedN

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ice age... thats like... how old are you? ahahahahaha

just jokin.

i think i stopped around mirrodin?

last shit card I remember was this legend where you cant lose as long as its alive or something? i cant remember... ugh..

i use a black white. im a low type that will kill you in one shot or with just 1 creature
 

Darby

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ice age... thats like... how old are you? ahahahahaha

just jokin.

i think i stopped around mirrodin?

last shit card I remember was this legend where you cant lose as long as its alive or something? i cant remember... ugh..

i use a black white. im a low type that will kill you in one shot or with just 1 creature

My stepdad stopped with Ice Age, I have a good couple thousand commons from that set and before, and then a couple thousand from Ravnica to present (Mostly Zendilkar block).
 

eagor

Senior Executive Lab Monkey
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i'm a prize in a cereal box near you, so buy, BUY,
i casually play with a green wurm deck
 

Hadoblado

think again losers
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I played somewhat casually, but then my friends started throwing hundreds of dollars at it and I didn't want to keep up. I gave all my cards away, making someone at my D&D group an incredibly happy nerd.
 

RedN

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i wanna play again but i dont know where to find people who would.

and i seem to have lost my deck ugh...

i will admit, playing that deck was ... the way it goes is how my head goes. i guess its true what they say sometimes that in the things that we do and make, we pinch in a bit of ourselves eh.

i still hate blue, i hate blue and i hate blue
 

sheepie

one of the sheeple
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Ha, why do you hate blue? I had this conversation which somebody like two days ago. His answer was its too controlling, it's like the type of play makes you a douche for the entire game. Just curious if its something along the same lines. I've watched my friend play magic for about 8 years now. My husband and his brother have boxes of cards that now reside under the brother bed and another of my friends has a box full of different decks he takes practically every group do we have and they all have a few really casual games. I'm fairly familiar with the game. I don't play well with others though so rarely play. Anybody know of Munchkin? I CANNOT play that game I turn into a hysterical mess.
 

Cognisant

cackling in the trenches
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Anybody know of Munchkin? I CANNOT play that game I turn into a hysterical mess.
Seen it, haven't played it, would like to, ditto for MtG except I'm less interested.

Personally I play UNO tournaments with stacking rules, you play many consecutive games and each card has a point value so by the end of something like five hundred games the person who has accumulated the least number of points wins, there's normally money involved, and lots of alcohol.

It sounds dumb but the "it's not over until it's over" nature of the game and the fact that people will plot against whoever happens to be winning makes it exciting right up until the very end.
 

RedN

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i hate fighting blue coz its the only one that can really fuck me over hahahahahah

mill concept decks too...
 

Hadoblado

think again losers
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Playing permission decks is sorta fun, but not for the opponent. I used to play with the state champion, and he had this blue/white control deck that won using 1-2 copies of a land that could turn into a 2/2 until end of turn. Every other card in the deck was designed to stop the opponent's deck from doing what it wanted. Fuuuuuuuuuuck...

I never really stayed with any particular style or colour, I liked tweaking about all over the place which made me a decent generalist, but never allowed me the kind of specialised understanding a lot of the tournament winner's had.
 

Santiago

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I started playing pretty recently. I only build decks from packs I have opened, have yet to buy an individual card. I think I spend more time thinking up strategies and decks then I do actually playing though lol. I plan on starting to play draft at my local shop, I am interested in the challenge in building a deck like that. I also wish I wasn't poor and could build a deck with snapcasters, I love the kind of possibilities that card gives. That U/W flicker control deck would be BEAST.
 

Hadoblado

think again losers
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The limited formats are very fun. We used to have a bag of cards we'd mix up and then organise into packs of 15 for drafting. This works better for drafting as any quality 'clotting' in your mix will be balanced for by the drafting process, as opposed to sealed where someone would end up with a godly deck straight off the bat. When you have enough cards and people to play with, this sort of arrangement can be very good practice for the limited tournaments where real money and/or cards can be on the line.

Limited is an entirely different creature to constructed, I could give you some tips on the card priority if you're interested. I was never amazing at the political aspect of the draft, but I had deck construction down pretty good.
 

Santiago

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The limited formats are very fun. We used to have a bag of cards we'd mix up and then organise into packs of 15 for drafting. This works better for drafting as any quality 'clotting' in your mix will be balanced for by the drafting process, as opposed to sealed where someone would end up with a godly deck straight off the bat. When you have enough cards and people to play with, this sort of arrangement can be very good practice for the limited tournaments where real money and/or cards can be on the line.

Limited is an entirely different creature to constructed, I could give you some tips on the card priority if you're interested. I was never amazing at the political aspect of the draft, but I had deck construction down pretty good.

Your an INTP... of course you understood the theory of deckcraft better than the political aspect of draft ;). I would really appreciate the help though :)
 

Hadoblado

think again losers
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Okay so... hmmm how do I start?

Constructed is a format defined by refinement to a known meta-game, where as in limited you are mostly adapting to opportunity and the added variable of probability distribution of cards on top of draw chance. You don't have any meta-defining super threats such as targomoyf, just average level threats across the curve.

- this means that the meta is largely defined by aggro and mid range decks.

- control is not impossible but it is more likely to crop up in sealed where you simply have the cards given to you, rather than trying to create a control deck from the onset in a draft where is is highly unlikely you will get the right tools.

- combo decks are practically impossible. You can work in possible combos as part of your synergy, but basing your deck on a combo going off is a baaaad idea.

- specific meta-cards such as board sweepers are much rarer in limited, which vastly increases the viability of a balls-to-the-wall aggressive mentality. Curving out (1cost critter first turn, 2cost critter second turn etc.) will win a lot of games if the opponent is not so lucky/equipped. Because of this you should try to at least start putting creatures down on second turn. I do not recommend trying to saturate your deck with 1cost critters in order to get the perfect curve, but you need to bare in mind that some people do and they will stomp you if you don't have some way to control them.

- you can pretty much throw anything that does not directly affect the game state into the unusable pile. Even if you opened a $10 rare, the use of indirect cards is reserved for a refined constructed meta. As a rule you can pretty much ignore counter spells unless you really know what you're doing.

- learn all the viable commons in the set. This includes all removal, all creatures with stats no less than 1/1 below their mana cost (so a 2/2 for 3 would be viable in a pinch), all large creatures or large spells (referred to as 'bombs'), anything that gives or converts mana, and any creature with both an attack stat and some type of evasion. The represent approximately 60-70% of the cards you will face. You also want to be familiar with cards if you are drafting to speed up your decision making.

- card choice priority is usually:
1) quality bombs
2) quality removal
3) quality curve/evasion creatures
3) poor bombs/poor removal
4) poor curve/evasion creatures
5) prioritise cards based on what your deck needs more of.

- This is far from an exact formula, as the quality of cards and compliance with deck plan and playstyle is extremely variable.

- Mana fixing and acceleration priority depends on the current set and your deck plan. When I was playing the set was high on multi-coloured spells so it was not uncommon for mana fixers to be first picked in the absence of an absolutely amazing bomb. If you are going for anything mana-intensive then any spells with double or triple mana costs go down in priority (cryptic command would be nigh unusable in a tri-colour limited deck.

Off the top of my head, a limited deck should look something like:
- 13+creatures
- 16-18 lands (generally 17 I think)
- the rest of your spells should generally be removal or some other board effect.
- there is no real limit to how many creatures you should have, just don't cut land.
- never go over 40 cards. Ever. If you are weak, 41 max.
- note that there is no 4card limit in for decks in limited. If you manage to get 6 of the same really strong card feel free to use all of them.

GETTING BANG FOR BUCK
If you are playing competitive limited it is likely you get to keep at least all the non-rares you pick. Looking up the cost of the rares and uncommons and prioritising accordingly can cover the cost of the draft before taking into account the possibility of winning it. This works particularly well if the card you pick is also good in limited (obviously).

POLITICS
As I mentioned before, this is not my area of expertise. It's not that I am incapable of understanding it, just that I've never really covered it on a theoretical level, and never had it explained to me. The fundamental principle is signalling. You need to send signals to the person 'downstream' from you, so that they will not be taking up the cards you want for your deck. An example of this is forgoing the white serra-angel bomb card for some other option, in order to ensure that the person to your left is going white. You then try and monopolise colours that are not white, preferably the colour that the person to your right is signalling you to go.
There is obviously some elements of luck involved in this process, people who commit to colours that other players are not taking are going to have stronger card pools. It is for this reason that non-committal picks take high priority, an adaptive mind-set is crucial.

Well there's your broad overview, I hope it's not too long :storks:

If you require any clarification feel free to ask. Also, these are good rules of thumb for a rookie, but someone who really knows what they're doing could easily break any one of these rules by applying the correct counterbalancing.
 

Santiago

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explanation

Thanks, the deck building aspect is much better explained than I have found in other places. Also I am a master of manipulation so the signaling should be fun :D
You know, once I have practiced it that is
 

Ninjamanda

Gunslinger
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I hate mill decks. I played magic a few days ago with a friend and I beat him every time haha. I then spent most of my time rebuilding all of his terrible decks.

Building decks is probably my favorite part of the game. :) :) I usually play with 40 to 41 cards in the deck.
 

RedN

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usually i fight blue with kjeldoran outpost and use everything else i got to control too. i have something there that destroys anything, its 3 to cast though ugh!!! but if that just his killer card, theres a black card that removes all instances of a named card on your opponents hand and deck. if itll slip though that is...
 

Darby

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I always enjoyed U/W control, but it always made people so mad (that and it's not very good for multiplayer games), that I stopped playing and tended to go for mono W. When I was younger (11-14) I played B/G a lot, but I no longer feel like that playstyle suits me at all. What I want to do is create a Demon/Angel B/W deck, I have a lot of angels from the angel deck I had, but no demons:(
 

RedN

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akroma was my main killer and i have desolation angel on the side. hot angels are hot... ehm.....
 

Hadoblado

think again losers
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I just started a magic online account if anyone is interested in playing. I have bought quite a few cards, but have shied away from buying a quality land base and planeswalkers, as they are waaaay expensive. I'm just playing casual while I fathom out the meta until I can construct a deck that will punish it without me having to spend hundreds.
 

Ex-User (9086)

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I recently spent month's worth pay on tragic, I and my friend plan to take a trip to Japan/elsewhere to combine the grand prix with holidays.

I'm building UW control with a few miracles, still in the meta-testing phase, I am getting 50%+ win ratios on quite a few archetypes so it looks promising.

It is funny how the two most popular archetypes are combo decks.
 
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