INTP pets

[doncarlzone]

there might be such a correlation, but not necessarily. it's more a question of pet prevalence in society.

a reminder of a biological origin that may be perceived as simpler, more natural than the progress which we should strive to make, is a hindrance. the truth is of course that approaching singularity we will find a simpler and more natural mode of existence.

companionship in itself is no problem but getting it from a pet is. disregarding all I've said, pets are also bad because they are submissive by definition and we must abolish all hierarchy.

yes, all stages of course are preceded by our whole line of evolution. but we should seek for gratification in the now, not in our past.

Interesting thoughts but I think I will decide to be behind the possible future zeitgeist on this one and enjoy a nice puppy.

I take it you don't watch any TV/Movies either?

And I was by no means sarcastic, I actually think it is an interesting observation and I will definitely use it.

 

[Brontosaurie]

Interesting thoughts but I think I will decide to be behind the possible future zeitgeist on this one and enjoy a nice puppy.

I take it you don't watch any TV/Movies either?

And I was by no means sarcastic, I actually think it is an interesting observation and I will definitely use it.

thank you for understanding it is much revitalizing

why wouldn't I watch tv or movies? might be a little slow here... I've been intensely opposed to motion picture before (for reasons I only vaguely remember and couldn't really articulate back then either) but have come to accept it as a legit form of expression and communication.

 

[Minuend]

there might be such a correlation, but not necessarily. it's more a question of pet prevalence in society.
a reminder of a biological origin that may be perceived as simpler, more natural than the progress which we should strive to make, is a hindrance. the truth is of course that approaching singularity we will find a simpler and more natural mode of existence.

I don't see any truth in this. I don't see how pets are a reminder of biological origin. Even if they are, I don't see how this prevents progress.

companionship in itself is no problem but getting it from a pet is.

Why?

disregarding all I've said, pets are also bad because they are submissive by definition and we must abolish all hierarchy.

I don't see how human hierarchy are relevant to pets. And why must all hierarchy be abolished?

yes, all stages of course are preceded by our whole line of evolution. but we should seek for gratification in the now, not in our past.

Pets are a thing of now.

Though, why shouldn't we seek gratification in the past?

 

[Sensi Star]

I really love cats. I find them to be mysterious and intellectually stimulating. Aside from their low level of neediness, what I like most about cats is when they show affection, they are always gentle. They will rub against you softly and will back off if you don't return the favor. When dogs show affection, they are often too aggressive for my taste and pounce/scratch all over one's clothes/skin and generally violate one's personal space, and can't tell when you are not in the mood to socialize.

Most of all, I am mesmerized by the way cats move. So ELEGANT!! They walk so smoothly and efficiently, and when they run/jump or do anything athletic it is with the accuracy and grace of an olympic winner. I can't think of any other animal that would be as entertaining to look at when doing normal things.

 

[Hadoblado]

I'm surprised there are no snakes yet. I am shit scared of snakes (I'm an ophidiophobe), but I would have expected at least one of you nerds to try one as a pet. I've had pet spiders, mantids, and scorpions as 'pets', but they were really no more than caged bugs.

 

[Brontosaurie]

I don't see any truth in this. I don't see how pets are a reminder of biological origin. Even if they are, I don't see how this prevents progress.



Why?



I don't see how human hierarchy are relevant to pets. And why must all hierarchy be abolished?



Pets are a thing of now.

Though, why shouldn't we seek gratification in the past?

well if you don't see I would like to explain but I feel most of it's on here already.

hierarchy must be abolished because it is destructive to humans in every way. power is the enemy of freedom and knowledge.

pets are a thing of now in the sense they exist yes. but in terms of "teleology" and progress, not so much. they are remains of a previous evolutionary stage namely the biological one.

seeking gratification in the past, past social structures, past values, amounts to conservatism.

 

[Etheri]

@Brontosaurie
I wouldn't mind a brontosaurus as pet! I could ride it to class / work each day!
Besides, it lives off plants (I think?! D: ), talk about green fuel!

/flinstone accent

 

[kantor1003]

"disregarding all I've said, pets are also bad because they are submissive by definition"
I think an elaboration would be in order. I don't agree with this at all. Hierarchical orders, or social structures, vary from animal to animal. A dog is supposed to be submissive if properly trained. You want them to be. Many types of birds, on the other hand, live in monogamous relationships, or in a group where there isn't really an alpha male, or female. Not having a rigid hierarchical structure in other words. When adopting a bird, then, like an african grey for instance, s/he is very much a part of the family and social hierarchy isn't something that makes much sense in that sense. If you are thinking that they are submissive in virtue of you feeding them, yes, but that doesn't have to have any behavioral, or relational significance what so ever - you are just transferring human-relational concepts to the animal when, in reality, that animal itself doesn't relate to it, or act upon it at all.

 

[Brontosaurie]

"disregarding all I've said, pets are also bad because they are submissive by definition"
I think an elaboration would be in order. I don't agree with this at all. Hierarchical orders, or social structures, vary from animal to animal. A dog is supposed to be submissive if properly trained. You want them to be. Many types of birds, on the other hand, live in monogamous relationships, or in a group where there isn't really an alpha male, or female. Not having a rigid hierarchical structure in other words. When adopting a bird, then, like an african grey for instance, s/he is very much a part of the family and social hierarchy isn't something that makes much sense in that sense. If you are thinking that they are submissive in virtue of you feeding them, yes, but that doesn't have to have any behavioral, or relational significance what so ever - you are just transferring human-relational concepts to the animal when, in reality, that animal itself doesn't relate to it, or act upon it at all.

yes that is a good point but still the dominance present in our relation to them, as you say their dependence on us for food and shelter, is crucial.

I don't think this kind of social order is beneficial. it is inhibiting for intellectual development to rely on thinking in terms of hierarchy, power, manipulation etc. to have an order of power in society is to promote certain arbitrary demarcations that impose constraints upon abstract thinking as well.

at the very LEAST anarchy (in its literal sense not connotation) is symptomatic of a healthy society. I think it's also a route by which to get there.

 

[Minuend]

well if you don't see I would like to explain but I feel most of it's on here already.

hierarchy must be abolished because it is destructive to humans in every way. power is the enemy of freedom and knowledge.

pets are a thing of now in the sense they exist yes. but in terms of "teleology" and progress, not so much. they are remains of a previous evolutionary stage namely the biological one.

seeking gratification in the past, past social structures, past values, amounts to conservatism.

Why is hierarchy destructive in every way?

If there is, say, an emergency, if everyone were to take charge and order others around, things will get messy quick.

In work, if everyone tried to organize it the way they saw it most efficient, we would also get chaos. Sometimes we need to acknowledge someone taking charge, it doesn't mean they are better than us or need to treat us like underdogs. It's just a form of co-operation, team work.

Stages of evolution? Evolution isn't something that has "levels" per se. It's a gradual process where we keep traces of the types of animal we used to be.

Is conservatism a bad thing just because it's conservatism?

Why are biological traits we have had for tens of thousands of year a bad thing just because they are old?

Animals depending on us for food and shelter. Humans depends on each other for the same thing. Few feed themselves directly without any form of payment.

 

[Brontosaurie]

Why is hierarchy destructive in every way?

If there is, say, an emergency, if everyone were to take charge and order others around, things will get messy quick.

In work, if everyone tried to organize it the way they saw it most efficient, we would also get chaos. Sometimes we need to acknowledge someone taking charge, it doesn't mean they are better than us or need to treat us like underdogs. It's just a form of co-operation, team work.

Stages of evolution? Evolution isn't something that has "levels" per se. It's a gradual process where we keep traces of the types of animal we used to be.

Is conservatism a bad thing just because it's conservatism?

Why are biological traits we have had for tens of thousands of year a bad thing just because they are old?

Animals depending on us for food and shelter. Humans depends on each other for the same thing. Few feed themselves directly without any form of payment.

you're completely right that organization is a good thing but when thinking subjects and agents are subsumed by an organizational structure it will be destructive hierarchy. the relation between pet and master is not temporary organization in a collaborative effort toward a common goal, it is tyranny and oppression. the pragmatic and goal-oriented systems we create should not possess us as people, but that is what happens in a hierarchy.

evolution has levels when considering the next stage which will be digital or transhuman or technological or what have you.

conservatism is bad provided we want to see development. I see it as imperative that we want it.

biological traits are not bad per se but they represent a constraint we should seek to free ourselves from. our minds are flexible. we can attune ourselves to the idea of transhumanism by entering a more self-sustained mode of living.

humans depend on each other but can also unite and cooperate whereas the pets are unknowing slaves.

 

[BigApplePi]

@Brontosaurie

when thinking subjects and agents are subsumed by an organizational structure it will be destructive hierarchy.

How so? The tribe next door raids us, steals and kills. We run around going crazy not knowing what to do. Someone has a solution and offers services. We are eager for their leadership and the trade off is to obey orders.

the relation between pet and master is not temporary organization in a collaborative effort toward a common goal, it is tyranny and oppression.

But isn't the human dominance over cat and dog an agreed deal? The dog starves without a provider. So the human says "hunt" and I will feed you. The cat would like easy food. The human say "protect my grainery from rodents" and I will feed you.

 

[Cherry Cola]

@BrontosaurieHow so? The tribe next door raids us, steals and kills. We run around going crazy not knowing what to do. Someone has a solution and offers services. We are eager for their leadership and the trade off is to obey orders.
But isn't the human dominance over cat and dog an agreed deal? The dog starves without a provider. So the human says "hunt" and I will feed you. The cat would like easy food. The human say "protect my grainery from rodents" and I will feed you.

You are aware of the fact that he wants to transcend tribalism as well?

The dog and cat would only starve because we've made them rely upon us in a state which Brontosaurie means for us to trascend.

If you're gonna argue with him at least understand what he says.

 

[Montresor]

Dear INFJ Douche,

You are aware of the fact that you're holding this person accountable for something they posted 7 months ago?

How very, J of you.