F***ing sleep, how does it work

[Tannhauser]

I remember even as a child, I just couldn't understand the concept of going to bed. Like, no matter whether you feel tired or not, at a certain time in the evening you lay down, turn off the lights, and just wait? For me, it 1) seldom worked, 2) is extremely boring.

This is still a huge problem for me (I'm 25). I have never mastered this going-to-bed game. I practically never fall asleep within reasonable time after going to bed, and none of the usual nonsense sleep advice works. Maybe it's an introversion thing, but the usual idea of stressing down and remove stimulus seems to be the opposite of what works: laying down in a dark and quiet room only seems to increase the brain activity, all kinds of cool thoughts and ideas start to generate themselves. And moreover this seems to work independently of whether I am physically and mentally exhausted.

Sleeping pills have been tried, but I really dislike the mental fog they create the next day.

What are your experiences with this?

(and yes, I am writing this because I can't sleep)

 

[TheManBeyond]

i keep reading stuff in internet, but without reading, changing from page to page, coming back, listen over and over again the same songs, high pitching them in virtual dj, i think about things that make me sad, look for sad things and contemplate them and somehow it makes me feel warm, i think of how cruel life is sometimes and how stupid we are, until we learn from its pain, i think about improving, i think about finding a way to go back in time and fix all the mess behind me, i think of her.
i torture myself until my mind is on auto pilot.
then i sleep out of this nightmare.

 

[Kuu]

You might have a sleep disorder. Visit a specialist?

 

[Sixup]

Man...I'm the same way.

I generally lay there for what feels like 20mins-an hour. My wife falls asleep in like 5 minutes and I'm sitting there like wtf...how did she do that.

It's better when I stay off the computer/any screens within an hour of bed. Also when I have my shit moderately organized. So tasks for the next day written down, finances mostly up to date...stuff like that. Also, if I have a good day where I get shit done (which goes hand in hand with the previous organizational step), then I generally get to sleep faster.

Maybe those are things that could help you. Even though they're kind of the typical sleep advice.

 

[emmabobary]

My problem is exactly the opposite.
My case is the closest to a narcoleptic disorder lately. I just woke up from my third nap in the day.
Micronaps are the most pleasurable thing in the world.
I guess that people with sleeping problems have anxiety related issues. And those who can't leave the bed are more related to depressive issues.

 

[Brontosaurie]

^ Yes, and with bipolar disorder it fluctuates.

I have no suggestions to you Tannhauser but i must ask if the sleep problem is affecting your energy level, alertness, productivity, confidence or life progress? Also, do you tend to get too little sleep or to delay the pattern? Maybe you don't require so much sleep, maybe you are confused because of norms and expectations. Or maybe you need to change something.

What i've found to help at certain times is to lie down and meditate. I do a simple practice which is just going through the body with ones attention and trying to suggest a floating sensation that also engulfs the mind and greatly helps keeping straight ahead through appreciation of unity with cosmos and not veering off into the trenches of thought. One may then enter a state where the perception of time and space is altered. It's a continuation of the floating sensation. It also resembles the sensation of falling asleep, and one may enter sleep from there. I imagine there can be a way for you to somehow package meditative mind-clearing as one of your exciting nightly thoughts, even though it's in a way the opposite thing to a mind running wild.

 

[QuickTwist]

I'm usually on a ~36 hour schedule. I will stay awake for 24 and sleep for 12. This is just my bodies natural rhythm. I stay up till my mind wants me to sleep and then I sleep for a good long while. I think the longest I've gone without sleep is a little under 4 days. I have always been a night owl and I usually feel more alert at night + its when I don't have to worry about other people bothering me irl. Studies have shown most people naturally are on a 23 hour schedule, but I am not normal in this regard.

Also, try doing the 4-7-8 breathing method before you sleep or going into a meditative state like bronto suggests. It helps relax the body.

 

[Reluctantly]

I take an Herbal tea when I want a restful sleep about an hour before bed - Yogi-Tea-Bedtime. It helps me sleep and I only need 6 to 7 hours to feel rested compared to 8 to 9 as the usual.

It's got "Organic licorice root, organic spearmint leaf, organic chamomile flower, organic skullcap leaf, organic cardamom seed, organic cinnamon bark, organic St. Johns Wort Leaf and Flower, organic barley malt, organic raspberry leaf, organic rose hips, natural organe flavor, valerian root extract, organic English lavender flower, stevia leaf, passion flower extract, and kava root extract kavalactones 10%"

Drugs probably aren't a good answer, but fuck it. Drugs and herbs are awesome for me, especially anything that relaxes my nervous system. Maybe you have different issues though.

 

[redbaron]

Seems to work best for me if I just sleep whenever I want. Some days I sleep on my lunchbreak. Some days I go to bed at 3am and others I go to bed at 7pm.

Trying to have a set schedule just stresses me out and makes me feel like I'm living life by a checklist. I much prefer to just make sure I get a decent amount of sleep per night (at least 6 hours) and sleep more if I need it. I go to bed if I'm tired, even if it's before dark. It's not what you're "supposed" to do but if I stay up and get overtired I won't sleep later on.

Because I sleep when I'm tired and go by what my body is telling me, I tend to fall asleep within 5-10 minutes of putting my head on the pillow. Much more preferable than when I would try and force myself to get to bed by a certain time.

Then again this habit makes me vary between arriving either 30 minutes early or late for work depending on the day, so not really sustainable if you do a job where being on time is a thing. Fuck that thing.

 

[Redfire]

For a time at work I was working about 12 hours a day, and then swimming after work. Then I'd try to read a bit at night and after a couple of pages my eyes were burning, and I slept just fine.
So, my advice is: get busy.

(not that I follow my own advice, my sleep patterns have been terrible these last couple of months. Idleness is actually quite bad for health if you have an overactive mind)

 

[onesteptwostep]

The best way is to be around people who have the sleeping patterns which are ideal for you, but doesn't seem to be the case right now.

The things I've done that seem to work are, talking to friends, family, not going on the computer 1 hour prior to sleep, eating well, not drinking caffeine or sugar related products after 7 (pm), and good air circulation in the room prior to sleep. I've been using earplugs and a sleeping mask lately as well. Interestingly enough my sleep times are different but I seem to wake up around the same time everyday, which is odd. My general theory about sleep is that sleep comes about when you expend your emotional stressors, which basically quells your streams of consciousness/train of thoughts.

 

[INTPWolf]

Intelligent People All Have One Thing In Common: They Stay Up Later Than You

 

[Sinny91]

I'm usually on a ~36 hour schedule. I will stay awake for 24 and sleep for 12. This is just my bodies natural rhythm. I stay up till my mind wants me to sleep and then I sleep for a good long while. I think the longest I've gone without sleep is a little under 4 days. I have always been a night owl and I usually feel more alert at night + its when I don't have to worry about other people bothering me irl. Studies have shown most people naturally are on a 23 hour schedule, but I am not normal in this regard.

Also, try doing the 4-7-8 breathing method before you sleep or going into a meditative state like bronto suggests. It helps relax the body.

My story is like this. I generally go long periods without sleep, and then long periods sleeping.

Last winter managed to wrack up 56 hours sleep almost consecutively, whilst I retreated from reality for a bit.

 

[A Son of Two]

I think the key is allowing the chemistry to change and fatal of to sleep.

I say that because after x on out of years of holing a pattern of a defence attitude and shifting that pattern I have discovered that I am now able to fit down and generate different emotional experiential states by allowing myself or choosing to allow my brain to be washed to agree with dopamine.

Not shore if it's a Iv termed fifty and I feel more free new step in the evolution of ones own path or a new skill learnt that most happy free people learn in there most earliest years of formative like.

Anyway thinking about not being able to get to sleep will keep you awake for some time or at least that has been my experience when it was an issue for me some years back. A long time back before I purchased my first easy worker walking frame. lol

Wanted: a second hand set of lower teeth. Will pay between $50-$75 plus postage.

 

[mrrhq]

I've been going to bed at 5:30 and I really want to quit.
Lol, look at me using the term "quit", like insomnia is a drug.

Actually, you can take melatonin, which is NOT a drug but a brain hormone, between 30 mins to an hour before you go to bed. I get the Nature's Bounty high-strength melatonin one from Walgreens without those Godawful additives. I think they work acceptably enough for me, but some people may have to take 2 instead of 1.

Honestly, if you're like me, and you get glued to the computer screen, any hue of blue lights (including white) surpasses the melatonin receptors in the brain, therefore you'd have to kinda force yourself to go to sleep otherwise.

 

[QuickTwist]

I'm on trazodone.

 

[Aposiopesis]

My personal problem:

Sleep works... when it works. It works quite well, then. I get tired and eventually my brain turns off, and when it does, I sleep quite long and well if I am reasonably free of interruption.

Adhering to other people's expectations of when my sleep should work is an entirely separate matter. For example, I got roughly 3 hours of sleep last night as it is part of my schedule today to open. My brain was entirely unwilling to shut off at such an early hour as to get a healthy amount of sleep. My adaptation has simply been to learn to live with getting short sleep and playing catch-up when possible.

I wouldn't take advice from me on this matter; I'm likely a heart attack or car wreck waiting to happen. I mostly wanted to point out that I think the problem for a lot of us is in dealing with SJ expectations.

 

[rbpinheiro]

I guess that people with sleeping problems have anxiety related issues. And those who can't leave the bed are more related to depressive issues.

I have problem sleeping and/or I wake up in the middle of the night, but I have a hard time getting out of bed by the time my alarm wakes me up, making me usually late for work.
Hope I don't have anxiety and depression

 

[Yellow]

I have problem sleeping and/or I wake up in the middle of the night, but I have a hard time getting out of bed by the time my alarm wakes me up, making me usually late for work.
Hope I don't have anxiety and depression

Probably not.

Most sleep problems can be corrected with a healthier lifestyle. Unfortunately, sleep problems can leave you stuck in a vicious (unhealthy) cycle.

For example, if you were to eliminate stimulants (caffeine, nicotine, monster, etc.) from your diet, keep your sugar intake in check, and get regular exercise, you're likely to have an easier time getting to sleep. Your quality of sleep will also improve, and you'll have an easier time waking after the proper 7-9 hours of sleep time (except the first few times because you have a sleep debt).

If that doesn't work, there are natural ways to reset your sleep (though they kinda suck).

 

[bvanevery]

I agree with dietary advice. I will also say though, I cannot sleep when hungry. I have a high metabolism and all that stuff about "don't eat before you sleep" is total rubbish for me. Must eat.

Computer and TV screens mess up your melatonin production. Dad said the other day it's because they emit blue light. Haven't verified that; don't plan to. Empirically I know the stuff about screens is correct.

I have found the most fascinating way to enforce regular sleep. Live out of your car! The sun, or the heat of the sun, will wake you up at 8 AM every day. Because you are always forced awake at the same time, and living out of a car is somewhat physical and stressfull, you will find yourself becoming tired in the evening. All sorts of urbanites are out partying, you just want to crawl away and go to sleep. So you do. I'm usually pretty off-shifted from other people's nightlife.

I can get away with 10 AM if the weather is overcast, or if I can get behind a large amount of tree cover, and the ambient temperatures aren't bad.

 

[Intolerable]

I hit the bed like a rock and I'm out in less than 2 minutes most of the time.

Perhaps you can glean something from my thought process during this time.

All the doors are closed and locked. My windows are closed and locked.

The dogs are sated and nearby.

The firearms are nearby.

The work for the day is done.

The clothes are washed.

The dishes are clean.

The bills are paid.

The bank account isn't empty.

The bed is secure, almost like a coffin protecting me from the world.

By this time I am usually asleep. I suspect what is going on here is that I don't suffer from insomnia because my day starts with goals that I get done by the time I go to bed. True enough that means I don't get to bed if my goals aren't done. Then I think about scope creep and breaking down goals so that I can be satisfied with where they are by the time I need to sleep.

I think for you, determining what keeps you up at night is important. Then start thinking about how you can address that concern.

 

[Tannhauser]

I have pretty much found now that it depends on one thing: the level of mental exhaustion. I can be as physically exhausted as I want (I worked out 6 days a week when I wrote the OP), but if I haven't done some serious mental exertion throughout the day, my brain ain't gonna fall asleep. Now that I work 12+ hours a day doing math and programming, sleep is easier.

 

[Sinny91]

My sleeping habits are getting worse..
I'm now up for about 40 hours, and then sleep about 24.

I've been occupied by many subjects lately.. and I think all that drug usage might have had a knock on effect.

Now I've started a fitness regime, I hope my sleeping pattern 'calms down' a wee bit..

(Post 1974)

Spoiler

I don't feckin know what was going on.. Something groovy no doubt...




Well actually lots of espionage and murders were happening, along side the secret space program




Sometimes I just wish I didn't know.