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Do you Long for passion or to be passionate ?

Yodon

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I dunno bout anyone else but i see everyday people alot of the time and wish i could be like them or maybe just for a while to see what it feels like
, to have that fire that burns inside almost everyone else except us cold rational people ,
to be like an untamed animal,
as opposed to the usual feeling of being of being caged by myself.its like having a savage chaotic untamed world locked inside a 6 inch thick iron box with no doors only tiny airholes, just enough so the life inside wont die but it can never leave and no one can ever truely see it . i dunno if thats just me an i dont presume to know how anyone else thinks but ah well just a thought.

leme hear ure ideas an opinions lol
 

Waugh

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I do not. It would get in the way of my goals. :/
Really though, I like to breeze through life, not have it be something with the word 'drama' in it, even if only applied internally.
 

Lithorn

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, to have that fire that burns inside almost everyone else except us cold rational people ,

I don't believe that we intps are really all that cold and rational. Sure, we love logic and a lack of drama in our everyday lives. It takes a lot to get us riled up emotionally rather than intellectually, but when it does happen, I think it's even more intense than for feelers.
An undeveloped emotional side doesn't mean that we Don't feel. It means that we lack the innate ability to sort through and control our feelings. This accounts for our (as it was stated in one intp description I read) "childlike loyalty" towards those we care about, few though they may be, and our distaste for dealing with people we don't respect. We're not good at faking it.
Personally, I both long for and dread those times when passion overwhelms reason. They rarely end well, usually due to my ineptitude at expressing what I'm feeling. In that sense, I know what you mean about feeling like a caged animal. Sometimes all those emotions are locked inside without any outlet, never mind that it's a cage of my own making, imposed by the rational side of my brain.
This is especially difficult in romantic situations. I simply cannot for the life of me be subtle or flirty, and I'm pretty much incapable of picking up on signals the guy might be sending. I quickly become confused, frustrated, embarrassed, and eventually just run away.
 

Deleted member 1424

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Most people are not passionate, who do you know that is really driven?

I want to be passionate, but not in the way that you describe. Far from it actually. Passion equates to an overwhelming desire. I want to find something important to me, that dominates my thoughts and gives me motivation. I do not know if this is in any way similar to the passion of which you speak. It's seems that you'd just like to see things shaken up a bit.
 

shoeless

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what adaire said.

i have my likes and dislikes. but that's all they are.

maybe even i have loves and hates. but that's all they are.

i don't feel a burning desire to create, to the point where i just can't ignore it. i just have... a vague desire. on the back-burner. i'm too preoccupied with myself to bother doing what i want.

that's the kind of passion i need. the kind you can't ignore. the kind you don't want to ignore.
 

ckm

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Oh yes. To be able to close one eyes and see from a single point of view would be amazing. Not permenantly of course. But Ti and Ne provide endless possibilities and explanations, making a single, subjective point of view exceedingly hard to identify and stand for.
 

Jennywocky

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Oh yes. To be able to close one eyes and see from a single point of view would be amazing. Not permenantly of course. But Ti and Ne provide endless possibilities and explanations, making a single, subjective point of view exceedingly hard to identify and stand for.
Great post.

Sometimes i actually try to "sink within myself" and see things from one point of view. I sort of manage. A bit. Sometimes.

As far as passion goes, yes, my passionate runs deep, a molten flood. On the surface you will generally just see the cool detached impartial me. In the last year or two I've allowed more passion to flare, but it can be disturbing to me since it breaks the placid mask I usually chose to wear.

In any case, passion is where I live. I am always looking for something that resonates with that deep molten spring inside, and the art and experiences I find most meaningful are those that make me feel the most.

I want to be passionate, but not in the way that you describe. Far from it actually. Passion equates to an overwhelming desire. I want to find something important to me, that dominates my thoughts and gives me motivation. .

Mine is sort of a mix, it DOES these things for me but feels "hotter."

I think basically one difference is that some of us rationals DISMISS certain experiences as fake or unstable (i.e., emotions and passion and social cues) while others of us feel them but have to learn what they are and want badly to understand them. I have spent a lot of my life trying not to be scared of the inexplicable and trying to let myself experience those feelings as another stream of data in order to synthesize and understand it.

But there is also a glory and transcendence in just experiencing it.
 

Chimera

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Ironically, I've been thinking about my lack of passion a lot over the past week.

Part of me thinks "Hey, this is great: the less I'm attached to the less I have to lose."
Another part of me is in the back of my head sobbing from the numbness, and afraid that at this rate I'll lose all drive to accomplish anything.
I'd like to have something I enjoy doing, something I have a passion for. In the past, I've had art (which I strangled the passion from through excessive self-criticism, and a teacher of mine killed the flare of passion I had for ceramic work), creating music (instead of making it I can only listen to it now), even a select few people (but that's unstable and fleeting; at the end of the day I'm still alone), videogames (it's been so long since I picked up a game that was actually fun or challenging). . .and now there's just nothing.

In the back of my mind, there's this thought that keeps nagging at me. . .am I really only staying alive because I don't have a reason to die? That's terrifying.
 

Anthile

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Ironically, I've been thinking about my lack of passion a lot over the past week.

Part of me thinks "Hey, this is great: the less I'm attached to the less I have to lose."
Another part of me is in the back of my head sobbing from the numbness, and afraid that at this rate I'll lose all drive to accomplish anything.
I'd like to have something I enjoy doing, something I have a passion for. In the past, I've had art (which I strangled the passion from through excessive self-criticism, and a teacher of mine killed the flare of passion I had for ceramic work), creating music (instead of making it I can only listen to it now), even a select few people (but that's unstable and fleeting; at the end of the day I'm still alone), videogames (it's been so long since I picked up a game that was actually fun or challenging). . .and now there's just nothing.

In the back of my mind, there's this thought that keeps nagging at me. . .am I really only staying alive because I don't have a reason to die? That's terrifying.


It's kind of scary that we think very alike about this. Well, except in my case it's literature instead of art.
 

Gather_Wanderer

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i think i long for passion. i have fantasized about being able to be a "superman" (or batman, since he's by far the most awesome) for some chick out there who i deemed worthy. and she would be a very hot, almost everything i wasn't and super-complimentary, type girl. couldn't be smarter than me though, because then she'd be better and i'd retreat into a cave somewhere.
but i've always wanted to make a girl feel like she was being courted by a superhero, and make her just scream with pleasure on the inside. i've almost done that once or twice (maybe not scream for pleasure, but you know, good stuff in general), after much work and convincing that i was actually pretty awesome and have lots of potential, even though as of yet i have done nothing. but my introverted side has defeated just about every girl i've ever been with. few girls see that, as an intp, you're not "crabby" (as one of my formers always puts it) and you could be anti-social but really only because most people can't comprehend the process taking place in your mind.
i don't really like shy girls because even though i'm not really shy, i am reserved and usually long for someone who will make things easier by initiating conversation so i can just sit there, listen, give back, and smile. i do like listening to women except for when they gossip and talk about fashion, unless of course they are descriptive of certain areas of the body that said clothing would cover. and then when they refer to my favorite athletes as "hot" when i'm talking about my sports teams....that's just, so wrong.
i may fall short of being seen as a superhero :), but i have been working on this part of me and one day hope to cross paths with a lady i can reward with the fruits of my labor.
 
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Da Blob

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As a cynic, I see it as a conspiracy. That is to say, I think that society has learned to frustrate expression of passion in the usual way for some individuals. The idea is to channel the tremendous passionate energy we have into venues that benefit society rather than the passionate individuals. I mean there are those who are passionate about social causes, there are those who are passionate about science and engineering, there are those who are passionate about art and music etc.

Truth is, I think, humans are naturally only passionate about pursuing their own physical pleasures...(?)
 

Chimera

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It's kind of scary that we think very alike about this. Well, except in my case it's literature instead of art.

Ironically, literature is my escape from everything right now. Except instead of reading myself away, I write.
I guess that would sound like passion to some people, but it's not. . .it's like a drug I've become dependant on; I don't feel the effects any more, but it's habit to resort to it.



Da Blob said:
Truth is, I think, humans are naturally only passionate about pursuing their own physical pleasures...(?)

I disagree. People react to different stimuli; that is to say, they derive different levels of pleasure from different things. Saying people are only naturally passionate about physical things is like saying people are only naturally happy in a group. Passion (as I define it: something that brings intense emotion and motivation) can be spiked by anything. It all depends on the individual.
 

MattKelevra

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In many ways, passion is synonymous with motivation and emotion, which INTPs distinctively lack for various reasons I'm sure you're already aware of.

The only things I've ever felt "passionate" about were those issues which threatened my own freedom or involved what I felt were people asserting false authority over me.
 

Lyra

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I agree with Da Blob in part, but my thoughts are more complex:

(This is only a preliminary sketch.)
Catharsis now etiolates us.

In Greece, Catharsis acted as a counter-balance to excess: excess of life, abundance which if not mitigated was presenced as a frenzy which the structures of the city could not survive. Stories dormant within humans that needed some means of awakening into externality were given life primarily through individual experiences, but the tendency towards ecstasy, stronger than the balance and limitation necessarily implicit in lawful society, lived through collective tragedy. In this way, people remained whole and retained the experience of divine madness without recourse to destruction of transpersonal structures which were weaker than their latent furies and unbound longings.


In the modern Occident, and other social structures bearing equivalence to its own, the stories which formerly lived predominantly through the personal are no longer the province of individual humans, tribes, or groups. Whereas Aristotelian catharsis was formerly a means of lessening energies too strong for the social structures which their undirected expression would have impacted, a specific poison administered in small enough quantities that it functioned as a medicine, its tyrannical descendants are dedicated to extinguishing any fire within our hearts. Lest we burn the paper-world we live in. Not only our latent ecstasy but all of the stories which we bear within us and which we have for millennia been the actors in are outsourced to collective media. The energy that imbued our lives, and that once was a real threat to all that which would utilise us, is not permitted to us in any lifelike quantity; it is expended through our engagement with endless stories which originate from without of the personal relations and oscillations of our own lives, and which rob us of what was once our birthright. Those endless stories: news, centralised language, television, films, books, art, fashion, and other media. That birthright: the living of our own stories, through us and those immediately connected to, influenced by, and influential over us.


Intense experience is no longer for real people—it is for the characters that anybody may access by technology and informational networks, and its intrusion into our own authentic experience is understood to be pathology. Our emotional narratives are welcomed only by collective means of dissipation, and are consequently structured by mediums which do not facilitate personal growth and change, over years and in an extensionally unique way, as inherent-experiential-potential-made-immediately-extant did for our ancestors.



We are meek as no ancestral Christian was meek. Our inherent personal passion is anathema in social dynamics whose ideological and conceptual components are not directly accessible to, or influenced by, the individual people and minor geographical groupings that are subject to them. These dynamics operate on a vast, transpersonal scale; one which denies individuality of conception and interpretation of experience to the human vessels through which they exist.



That little which still is ostensibly our own– relationships, family, perceptions, thoughts—is, for most, largely determined by that which is broadcast and distributed to us, and the structure of which, by functioning as the mediums through which the most intimate and uninhibited in us is awoken to life in the world, is dominant over us. Rare depths of emotion, rare psychophysiological incompatibilities with the available consumable, and rare experiences whose intensity makes the common irrelevant, such as intense and prolonged suffering, are now prerequisites for some limited autonomy of identity. And even these experiential heresies seem rarely sufficient to compromise the integrity of prevailing dynamics; usually they just provoke a more refined and specific taste in the outsourcing of one’s own energies to distant media.



The norm today: a levelling down, a flattening of the rhythm of experience. The potential for intensity which formerly enriched individual social experience sacrificed, without hesitation, to the endless impersonality of the consumable-by-anyone.


What might a person who recognises the above do to take back their stories from the distant media which own them, and to experience their personal and organic unfoldment through their own experience? To choose not to be subjugated to the level of a replaceable component in structures far vaster than the scope of their own lives and individual experiences? To express that which is their own (stories; potential actualisation) through that which is their own (the immediate and personal), not through that which is immune from them? To withdraw their scattered selves into themselves, that they might imbue their own life with their all that they previously extended away from it?


Work it out for yourselves.

[Actually, I might make a thread out of that.]
 

BigApplePi

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There is no need for passion if things are going along swimmingly. Needs satisfied. But what is there is an empty space? A void? Something one may or may not even be aware of? Then one happens across opportunity, unexpected. There can be a rush to fulfill. A joy in encountering the unexpected now possibility. Good luck. It is unnecessary to hold back. The rush is passion.
 

Lithorn

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Is it counterintuitive to have a passion for logic and reason?
 

Da Blob

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bluesquid

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The majority of humans get along fine with simple explanations.

I am passionate about so much, I yearn for passion.

as a INTP i get along fine with passion, but yearn for a reason to be passionate.

I think she is out there. If "you" are reading this, you were a station.

shit
 

ashitaria

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I'm not telling you, stalker! :P
Never was interested in passion. I'm just not that kind of guy to like hugs, making-out and things like that.

(Been back guys, after a week!)

If there was something I'd be passionate about though, it would be in a debate or an argument.

I usually try to see things from many points of view though, so detachment is what I'm used to.
 

Lyra

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ijustprotectedmyidentity

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i want passion that accords with reason.;

being passionate about something because that passionate thing makes sense and is not irrational. existentialism.
 

amorfati

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If anything I long to rid myself of passion.

What sets me apart from most other passionate people, however, is that I'm not really passionate about any real, particular, concrete thing. I've been burdened with some sort of blind, abstract passion that cares not one iota how it comes out, so long as it comes out.

If I didn't have such an over developed moral conscience I would be a dangerous person because of this.
 

Ermine

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Most people are not passionate, who do you know that is really driven?

I want to be passionate, but not in the way that you describe. Far from it actually. Passion equates to an overwhelming desire. I want to find something important to me, that dominates my thoughts and gives me motivation. I do not know if this is in any way similar to the passion of which you speak. It's seems that you'd just like to see things shaken up a bit.


Yeah, this is what I would mean by passionate. I used to be passionate, but I lost that somehow. A passionate time in my life that comes to mind was when I went to an art magnet school. I was totally consumed in my art, and very passionate about it. Of course, I am much more skilled in art than I was 2 years ago, but I still look at my work from that period and wonder how in the world I achieved what I did. In retrospect, it was all in the passion I had at the time. I really want to get that back. If I could combine passion with the skills I have now, the results could be astounding.

As for passion... I don't think I'm ready for that. I've been passionate in art, music, writing, non-living things. But passion towards a person? Yipes! Sounds like more than I'd be up for right now. Not that anyone is totally ready for passion anyway...
 
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