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Can you be happy forever?

david251

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Recently I have watched some movies where it was portrayed how the protagonist/s people became rich and how it all turned out. Becoming rich was fun at start - during the transition phase - when they went from poverty to being rich. But after years passed by I witnessed that the protagonist wasn't happy any more and began to be deeply troubled about things that had no relation to money. He became unhealthy and defeated. I think I have witnessed this process happening in many movies and I believe it happens in real life as well. I have read Aristotle's works and I recall he said that happiness is not derived by wealth and I agree. Actually I believe that money is vital for happiness to the point where it fulfills your most basic needs, beyond that point more money doesn't make you happy. (Of course rich people marry more beautiful women so that's an exception to the statement I just wrote.)

So basically I have been thinking this: ''what if we have a finite amount of happiness to be released during our lifetime no matter the conditions in which we live in?''. I have read and heard stories of people who lived a miserable life but still managed somehow to be happy, maybe even more happy than the casual man. So what if happiness is an innate thing given to us since birth which can be triggered by specific events but which always expires afterwards? That would mean that happiness cannot last forever, no matter the conditions. What are your thoughts?
 

Cognisant

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Well it is all relative, natural selection abhors an underachiever so we're instinctively inclined to be discontent no matter how well off we are, even the uber rich compete for fame, power and influence.

If you want contentment a slow steady rise would probably work best.

Or just focus on the petty/banal pleasures and let life fly by in a meaningless hedonistic blur :D
 

Direwolf

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I believe that the people that you deem a miserable life actually have quite fulfilling ones because they live their lives so basically. If people in first world countries dont get their yearly iphone they could become seriously disappointed or depressed in their situation. (Might not be true everywhere but have seen it alot here). Whereas the people that live their lives so basically never taste the yearn for materialistic things like an iphone. Eliminating this yearn i believe takes away the dissappointment that most people experience in life. Without the materialistic things that only leaves the things necasary for survival. So they survive - they are happy
 

Jennywocky

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Recently I have watched some movies where it was portrayed how the protagonist/s people became rich and how it all turned out. Becoming rich was fun at start - during the transition phase - when they went from poverty to being rich. But after years passed by I witnessed that the protagonist wasn't happy any more and began to be deeply troubled about things that had no relation to money. He became unhealthy and defeated. I think I have witnessed this process happening in many movies and I believe it happens in real life as well. I have read Aristotle's works and I recall he said that happiness is not derived by wealth and I agree. Actually I believe that money is vital for happiness to the point where it fulfills your most basic needs, beyond that point more money doesn't make you happy. (Of course rich people marry more beautiful women so that's an exception to the statement I just wrote.)

I think money provides a person with more options to choose from in life, but otherwise it doesn't really impact who you are inside or how you view life, so if your framework and perspective is faulty or negative, you'll still have that to grapple with. Money can't fix that.

So basically I have been thinking this: ''what if we have a finite amount of happiness to be released during our lifetime no matter the conditions in which we live in?''

I wouldn't say it's finite. I would just say it's based on how we position ourselves to the world.

I have read and heard stories of people who lived a miserable life but still managed somehow to be happy, maybe even more happy than the casual man. So what if happiness is an innate thing given to us since birth which can be triggered by specific events but which always expires afterwards? That would mean that happiness cannot last forever, no matter the conditions. What are your thoughts?

Like I said, happiness is your attitude in how you deal with life. Having more options is generally good and alleviates some pressure which in turn makes it easier for you to work at being happy, remove pain, etc., but happiness is not an actual "thing" so it doesn't make sense to say it can be depleted.
 

Absurdity

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I think people who see wealth as an end in itself are the ones who end up miserable once they attain it. People who see it as a means are probably better off.

That said, the blind pursuit of happiness is a bit too simplistic in my opinion. There is a time for suffering and misery, and it can be a time of great personal growth.
 

Liebling

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Like Jennywocky, I think that happiness is more choice than it is a tangible thing that you can gain or manipulate in any way outside of your own perception. I don't think that there is anything material that can be defined as something that provides happiness as a rational truth in all situations, therefore you can rule material possessions out as a quantifier for happiness.

One chooses to be happy or not happy with the circumstances of any given situation or truth. It's really up to the person to decide whether that truth is something that pleases them on some level and that level is always their own perception. I have seen happiness and laughter in the most dire situations and circumstances and in all levels of life from the old to the young, rich or poor, simple and highly intellectual.

That said, if one sets his/her expectations too highly to be reasonably attained and held to any reasonable standard, they are likely to find themselves unhappy most of the time. There seems to be no temporal effect on it either, as it doesn't change with time or material, only with what one personally perceives. If you believe that money will make you happy and set a reasonable monetary level you believe will provide you with the happiness you seek then maybe money will make you happy, but depleting levels can set you off either way to not having any kind of measurable happiness that can be maintained. I think that is the major flaw in thinking that any material thing can provide happiness in the long term, it's too tangible to set reasonable benchmarks either way.
 

Red myst

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SONJA LYUBOMIRSKY
Professor, University of California, Riverside
Ph.D. Stanford University, 1994
(951) 827-5041 (msg only)
sonja.lyubomirsky[at]ucr.edu
Google Scholar Page Lyubomirsky CV
The majority of my research career has been devoted to studying human happiness. Why is the scientific study of happiness important? In short, because most people believe that happiness is meaningful, desirable, and an important, worthy goal, because happiness is one of the most salient and significant dimensions of human experience and emotional life, because happiness yields numerous rewards for the individual, and because it makes for a better, healthier, stronger society. Along these lines, my current research addresses three critical questions: 1) What makes people happy?; 2) Is happiness a good thing?; and 3) How and why can people learn to lead happier and more flourishing lives?

Why Are Some People Happier Than Others?
I have always been struck by the capacity of some individuals to be remarkably happy, even in the face of stress, trauma, or adversity. Thus, my earlier research efforts had been focused on trying to understand why some people are happier than others (for a review and theoretical framework, see Lyubomirsky, 2001). To this end, my approach had been to explore the cognitive and motivational processes that distinguish individuals who show exceptionally high and low levels of happiness. These processes include social comparison (how people compare themselves to peers), dissonance reduction (how people justify both trivial and important choices in their lives), self-evaluation (how people judge themselves), and person perception (how people think about others). All of these processes, it turns out, have hedonic implications – that is, positive or negative consequences for happiness and self-regard – and thus are relevant to elucidating individual differences in enduring well-being. My students and I have found that truly happy individuals construe life events and daily situations in ways that seem to maintain their happiness, while unhappy individuals construe experiences in ways that seem to reinforce unhappiness. In essence, our research shows that happy individuals experience and react to events and circumstances in relatively more positive and more adaptive ways. For a recent example, we found that happy individuals are relatively more likely than their less happy peers to “endow” positive memories (i.e., store them in their emotional “bank accounts”) but to “contrast” negative memories (i.e., “life is so much better now”) (Liberman, Boehm, Lyubomirsky, & Ross, 2011).
On-going studies in my laboratory are exploring additional cognitive and motivational processes that support the differing worlds of enduring happiness versus chronic unhappiness. For example, several investigations have revealed that unhappy individuals are more likely than happy ones to dwell on negative or ambiguous events (Lyubomirsky, Boehm, Kasri, & Zehm, 2011). Such “dwelling” or rumination may drain cognitive resources and thus bring to bear a variety of negative consequences, which could further reinforce unhappiness. These findings demonstrate some of the maladaptive by-products of self-reflection, suggesting that not only is the “unexamined life” worth living, but it is potentially full of happiness and joy.
To cast our work on happiness in a broader framework, we have also been exploring the meaning, expression, and pursuit of happiness across cultures, subcultures, and age groups (e.g., Boehm, Lyubomirsky, & Sheldon, 2011). For example, despite media reports, we have found that parents actually experience more happiness and meaning than do non-parents–both when evaluating their lives as a whole, when going about their days, and when caring for their children (versus doing other activities; Nelson, Kushlev, English, Dunn, & Lyubomirsky, 2013). Of course, parents’ happiness is impacted by myriad factors, including their age and SES and their children’s ages and temperaments (Nelson, Kushlev, & Lyubomirsky, in press). Furthermore, we are currently carrying out happiness-increasing interventions among Japanese engineers, Korean undergraduates, Spanish and German professionals, Canadian elementary school students, and British teens.
What Are the Benefits of Happiness?
Is happiness a good thing? Or, does it just simply feel good? A review of all the available literature has revealed that happiness does indeed have numerous positive byproducts, which appear to benefit not only individuals, but families, communities, and the society at large (Lyubomirsky, King, & Diener, 2005). The benefits of happiness include higher income and superior work outcomes (e.g., greater productivity and higher quality of work), larger social rewards (e.g., more satisfying and longer marriages, more friends, stronger social support, and richer social interactions), more activity, energy, and flow, and better physical health (e.g., a bolstered immune system, lowered stress levels, and less pain) and even longer life. The literature, my colleagues and I have found, also suggests that happy individuals are more creative, helpful, charitable, and self-confident, have better self-control, and show greater self-regulatory and coping abilities. On-going and future experimental and longitudinal studies that attempt to increase the long-term happiness of students and working adults are giving us the opportunity to assess whether increases in durable happiness predict changes in other positive outcomes, such as altruistic behavior, creativity, work performance, physical health, and social relationships. We are investigating whether both happiness and generosity propagate across social networks (funded by the Notre Dame Science of Generosity Initiative), and whether happiness is associated with more physical movement and greater social interactions (funded by Hitachi’s Central Research Laboratory). For example, a recent study found that 9- to 11-year old kids who practiced acts of kindness not only got happier but became more popular with their peers (Layous, Nelson, Oberle, Schonert-Reichl, & Lyubomirsky, 2013). We are also currently using new technologies, including ambulatory, sociometric, and smartphone methodologies, to assess happiness and the effects of positive activities (e.g., Parks, Della Porta, Pierce, Zilca, & Lyubomirsky, 2012).
Finally, a new line of research, supported by the John Templeton Foundation, focuses on the strength of humility — that is, how to measure it; what are its antecedents, causes, and consequences for individuals and organizations; and, perhaps most important, how people can develop it (Chancellor & Lyubomirsky, 2013).
The Architecture of Sustainable Happiness
A vibrant and continuing program of research is asking the question, “How can happiness be reliably increased?” (for reviews, see Layous & Lyubomirsky, in press; Lyubomirsky, 2008; Lyubomirsky & Layous, 2013; Lyubomirsky, Sheldon, & Schkade, 2005; Sin & Lyubomirsky, 2009). Despite pessimism from the current literature that the pursuit of happiness may be largely futile, my colleagues and I believe that durable increases in happiness are indeed possible and within the average person’s reach. Thus, following my construal theory of happiness, I am exploring how the thoughts and behaviors that characterize naturally happy people (i.e., “happy habits”) can be nurtured, acquired, or directly taught. To this end, my students’ and my current research is testing predictions from our new positive activity model (Lyubomirsky & Layous, 2013) —specifically, investigating the mechanisms underlying the efficacy of simple intentional effortful activities (which we call “positive activities”) to boost well-being.
We are presently conducting multiple experimental intervention studies in which participants’ cognitive and behavioral strategies are systematically retrained. For example, intervention studies with students, kids, community members, workers, depressed individuals, and hospital patients are testing the efficacy of six cognitive and behavioral volitional strategies: 1) regularly setting aside time to recall moments of gratitude (i.e., keeping a journal in which one “counts one’s blessings” or writing gratitude letters), 2) engaging in self-regulatory and positive thinking about oneself (i.e., reflecting, writing, and talking about one’s happiest and unhappiest life events or one’s goals for the future), 3) practicing altruism and kindness (i.e., routinely committing acts of kindness or trying to make a loved one happy), 4) pursuing significant, intrinsic life goals (e.g., listing and taking action on “baby steps” towards goals), 5) affirming one’s most important values, and 6) savoring positive experiences (e.g., using one’s five senses to relish daily moments or living this month like it’s one’s last in a particular location). Most important, we are testing our positive activity model by exploring whether the benefits of such activities differ across cultures (see above), and whether their success is moderated by such factors as person-activity “fit,” motivation, effort, social support, variety, dosage, intrinsic motivation, and expectations (e.g., Boehm et al., 2011; Lyubomirsky, Dickerhoof, Boehm, & Sheldon, 2011; Lyubomirsky, Sheldon, & Schkade, 2005; Lyubomirsky, Sousa, & Dickerhoof, 2006; Sheldon et al., 2010; Sheldon, Boehm, & Lyubomirsky, 2012; Sheldon & Lyubomirsky, 2009; Sin, Della Porta, & Lyubomirsky, 2011). We are also examining the “why” of happiness-boosting interventions by testing the mediating role of positive events, positive thoughts, positive emotions, and need satisfaction. Finally, we are investigating genetic and environmental influences on individual differences in responses to happiness-increasing interventions, and considering how such interventions might protect people from mental health conditions (Layous, Chancellor, & Lyubomirsky, in press).
Thwarting Hedonic Adaptation
Finally, a line of research focuses on hedonic adaptation to positive experience as a critical barrier to raising happiness (Bao & Lyubomirsky, 2013; Lyubomirsky, 2011; Sheldon, Boehm, & Lyubomirsky, 2012; Sheldon & Lyubomirsky, 2012). After all, if people become accustomed to (and take for granted) anything positive that happens to them, then how can they ever become happier? A new model suggests that adaptation to positive experience proceeds via two paths: 1) through diminished positive emotions and 2) through increased aspirations. The key to achieving increased and lasting well-being thereby lies in effortful, intentional activities that slow down or preclude the positive adaptation process. Current studies are testing the hypothesis that such activities share several properties that potentially help them to effectively forestall adaptation: they are dynamic, episodic, novel, and attention-enticing. We are presently applying our model to understand what produces materialism and consumerism, and how to design interventions that significantly depress people’s aspirations and bolster their humility, thereby allowing them to step off the hedonic treadmill and become more thrifty (e.g., Chancellor & Lyubomirsky, 2011, 2013).
 

Grayman

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"Contentment is a choice; happiness is a blessing."

To be content all you have to do is accept the good and the bad and move on.

Happiness is to perceive the environment as affecting what you value in a positive way.

To stay happy:
1. Choose how you want to see the situation.
2. Change the situation you are in.
3. Re prioritize your values adn what you think is important.

*************************************************

For someone who believes they cannot choose to be happy:
1. I cannot choose to see it any other way because I would just be lying to myself
2. I am not capable of changing my situation. It is done and my life is over.
3. I cannot choose to do something else, 'this is who I am'.

*****************************************************

Even if you are capable of doing 1-3 most of the time eventually something will happen and there will just be no good reason for it and no way to be happy about it. You could choose to put it out of your mind and be happy anyways but for how long? You can always choose to accept it and move on being content with life.
 

StevenM

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As someone pointed out here before:

There will often be times in life where you will not be happy. Life has it's ups and downs. Bad things happen to good people as well as the bad. (Not that I'm emphasizing a person being good or bad).

So my answer is no. While living on earth, you cannot always be happy, especially forever.


EDIT: (Sorry, didn't read all the original OP till now)

So basically I have been thinking this: ''what if we have a finite amount of happiness to be released during our lifetime no matter the conditions in which we live in?''. I have read and heard stories of people who lived a miserable life but still managed somehow to be happy, maybe even more happy than the casual man. So what if happiness is an innate thing given to us since birth which can be triggered by specific events but which always expires afterwards? That would mean that happiness cannot last forever, no matter the conditions. What are your thoughts?

Hmm.

Perhaps, it's kind of similar to becoming immune to certain psychoactive drugs. The more constant the happiness a person feels during a period of time, the more the feeling becomes 'dulled'. Which may need more amount of stimulation as time goes on to reach the same effect.

It's just speculation, I don't think I have read anything about that. But perhaps this is why a rich person ends up not being as 'happy' as the rest of people in the long-term.
 

Pyropyro

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Being happy all the time is like eating sugar all the time IMO.

I prefer my life where happiness is accompanied with despair, struggles and frustrations.
 

Helvete

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"Contentment is a choice; happiness is a blessing."

To be content all you have to do is accept the good and the bad and move on.

Happiness is to perceive the environment as affecting what you value in a positive way.

To stay happy:
1. Choose how you want to see the situation.
2. Change the situation you are in.
3. Re prioritize your values adn what you think is important.

*************************************************

For someone who believes they cannot choose to be happy:
1. I cannot choose to see it any other way because I would just be lying to myself
2. I am not capable of changing my situation. It is done and my life is over.
3. I cannot choose to do something else, 'this is who I am'.

*****************************************************

Even if you are capable of doing 1-3 most of the time eventually something will happen and there will just be no good reason for it and no way to be happy about it. You could choose to put it out of your mind and be happy anyways but for how long? You can always choose to accept it and move on being content with life.

So basically happiness is ones adaptability to change and or aptitude for change. This suggests more intelligent people would be happier, in general I'v seen the reverse to be true.
 

Pyropyro

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So basically happiness is ones adaptability to change and or aptitude for change. This suggests more intelligent people would be happier, in general I'v seen the reverse to be true.

I beg to differ. Most of the intelligent people that I worked with are quite happy campers and these are the guys that face government officials on a regular basis. It's usually the Dunning–Kruger effect um... sufferers that are negative and annoying to work with.
 

Grayman

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So basically happiness is ones adaptability to change and or aptitude for change. This suggests more intelligent people would be happier, in general I'v seen the reverse to be true.

Wisdom, perhaps emotional intelligence, brings happiness, not standard intelligence.
 

Deleted member 1424

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Actually I believe that money is vital for happiness to the point where it fulfills your most basic needs, beyond that point more money doesn't make you happy. (Of course rich people marry more beautiful women so that's an exception to the statement I just wrote.)


pft.

Plenty of beautiful people make the lives of their mates utterly miserable.

(of course ugly people do that too, but y'know what I mean)
 

Rook

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pft.

Plenty of beautiful people make the lives of their mates utterly miserable.

(of course ugly people do that too, but y'know what I mean)

Indeed.
Finding beauty in one's partner may appeal to base instincts, but that does not always lead to happiness, as your perfect partner may have certain personality defects and ulterior motives.
 

Pyropyro

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Jennywocky

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So basically happiness is ones adaptability to change and or aptitude for change. This suggests more intelligent people would be happier, in general I'v seen the reverse to be true.

I beg to differ. Most of the intelligent people that I worked with are quite happy campers and these are the guys that face government officials on a regular basis. It's usually the Dunning–Kruger effect um... sufferers that are negative and annoying to work with.

Yeah, I think it comes down to how that intelligence is applied.

I think intelligence can contribute to the ability to step outside oneself and look at one's perspective from multiple angles rather than being immersed and unaware of other views on one's life experiences. The better one is able to do this, the more opportunity a person has to choose a view that can be more productive and proactive for themselves rather than just being locked by default into a more rigid and reactive one.

But intelligence is not always applied in that direction.
 

Helvete

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I beg to differ. Most of the intelligent people that I worked with are quite happy campers and these are the guys that face government officials on a regular basis. It's usually the Dunning–Kruger effect um... sufferers that are negative and annoying to work with.

I don't really know about the Dunning-Kruger effect. Just an inflated ego about their aptitude covering their incompetence and vice verse?
You could also have two individuals of the same skill level; one with an inflated ego and one understating his talents. Even though they are both as good, the one who understates may be more aware of what can go wrong whereas the other may just be focusing on the task in hand. Leading to the latter to experience sad more often than happy.

A nice vid about happiness and sadness

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8li-3pRrA5Y

I think this illustrates it quite well. They both seem to be relative to each other: You start on 0 - neither happy nor sad. Go down to -1, then are able to feel 1 happiness later on.

Maybe though its more like: 0, -1 will then allow you .5. Read below.

In relation to your earlier post; people tend to express their lows more than their highs. I read somewhere that we are hard wired to think this way, we experience bad, it leaves impression and we are more likely to avoid this same bad later. Avoiding bad seems to be of higher importance than finding good. I think good is just an added bonus in our need for survival.

So maybe people express these the same, just the more intelligent (/experienced) a person is the more intensified these expression will become.

Sorry for the messy post.
 

Pyropyro

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I don't really know about the Dunning-Kruger effect. Just an inflated ego about their aptitude covering their incompetence and vice verse?
You could also have two individuals of the same skill level; one with an inflated ego and one understating his talents. Even though they are both as good, the one who understates may be more aware of what can go wrong whereas the other may just be focusing on the task in hand. Leading to the latter to experience sad more often than happy.

No, they don't even know that they're incompetent. That's how clueless they are.

I think it's the other way around. The more you understand your skills, the better you handle the challenge and the more happy you are while doing the work. (see Flow)

I think this illustrates it quite well. They both seem to be relative to each other: You start on 0 - neither happy nor sad. Go down to -1, then are able to feel 1 happiness later on.

Maybe though its more like: 0, -1 will then allow you .5. Read below.

In relation to your earlier post; people tend to express their lows more than their highs. I read somewhere that we are hard wired to think this way, we experience bad, it leaves impression and we are more likely to avoid this same bad later. Avoiding bad seems to be of higher importance than finding good. I think good is just an added bonus in our need for survival.

So maybe people express these the same, just the more intelligent (/experienced) a person is the more intensified these expression will become.

Sorry for the messy post.

You got it. Being happy is just a bonus. I'm rather content on being well, feeling content.

Sadness helps us identify what's wrong and probably can help you recruit others to help you.
 

Reluctantly

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I'm not sure what you define as happiness, but for me I need some kind of teleological direction in order to feel "centered"; then suffering and misery becomes acceptable because it aims to develop me into a more self-actualized me, rather than destroying that me. This does requires a certain level of self-awareness (which I'm always working on) and a level of achieved adaptability/resilience (mental and physical) that doesn't let the experiences of reality destroy my archetypal development.
 

Ex-User (9086)

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Eternal happiness is impossible, one of the basic obstacles to it is the way human organism adapts to living conditions and produces less happiness from repetition of the same interactions.
The lack of happiness is the basic stimulant to achieve it.

Unhappiness is an important and empowering element of growth.

The feeling of flow is achieved when neither strong happiness nor sadness are present and the mind is in the position of focus and anticipation of what is coming, that state is much more productive than happiness.
 

Liebling

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Eternal happiness is impossible, one of the basic obstacles to it is the way human organism adapts to living conditions and produces less happiness from repetition of the same interactions.
The lack of happiness is the basic stimulant to achieve it.

Unhappiness is an important and empowering element of growth.

It might even be said that the existence of suffering is the key to finding happiness. It's the benchmark from which all happiness is judged. It's a very buddhist perspective, but I do agree that it is material things and their nature of being impermanent that causes, not relieves happiness and inner peace. So basing your happiness quantification on money, material things and beauty is a losing gamble because they are not permanent. Basing your happiness on how you perceive the world and choose to react to it is the only way to be happy. But life is suffering, so you can never be happy all of the time.
 

Jaffa

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Get a prescription for SSRI's and yes... you can be happy forever.
 

Liebling

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Naw, SSRI's are a temp fix and usually change a person's chemistry so they are immune after awhile and have to find another, and another and another over time usually suffering debilitating depression while making medication adjustments. That's not to say that they don't save lives for some people, and make some people's path easier but it's not a permanent solution.

EST (Electro Shock Therapy) though... for some that has been a permanent effect that is worth the risks. I have a friend who lost a small portion of his long term memory because of it, but he's so grateful for the change in his demeanor. He had attempted suicide about 12 times and battled addiction and severe manic depression for years and now... nothing. He's happy, getting married (he could never hold on to a relationship for more than 3 months all through high school, college and adult years) and he's looking forward to life for the first time ever. He had it done 6 years ago voluntarily and it's saved his life. 46 and a totally new lease on life.

It's successfully treated some severe addicts and bipolars where all else failed.

Maybe if we found the right combination in the future, everyone could be eternally happy if their brains were rewired.

But you have to wonder what nightmare that would look like...
 
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