Busting the Myth that INTPs are Not Emotional

[Jason Evans]

If you've been following my articles on The INTP Experience, I've just posted my fourth! This one explains the surprisingly powerful role of emotions in INTPs. (Previous articles were on isolation, overload, and romance.)

Also, I've created a permanent home for the articles on a new website. It seems like a much more easy-to-navigate way to find and read them compared to a blog format.

HERE is the link to the new article. Enjoy!

 

[Lot]

Great article once again. The story of my life. The main reason my bed room wall was covered in holes, growing up. I kind of wanted more. I feel as if I've been battling emotions the same way my whole life, only to explode periodically in anger, or depression, mostly anger. I may have missed the solution in the article, so I'll read through it again.

 

[Jason Evans]

Lot, glad to hear that it resonated with you!

This article was more about explanation and analysis, especially for the sake of non-INTPs who may be very perplexed by us. It wasn't focused on solutions this time. I needed to write this one to be the foundation of future articles and explorations.

Do you feel that wild, angry emotions are still something that weighs on you?

 

[Lot]

Do you feel that wild, angry emotions are still something that weighs on you?

Very much so. Maybe once every two months I'll have an explosion of anger, although I'm able to do damage control. I let out curse words, and I try not to direct them at anyone, instead of breaking thing. Even then, I've had a few times this year I punched the ceiling of my car shouting the f-word, over a bad night. Then again, I hardly remember the times that I keep things in check, nothing all that notable happens when I keep it in check. Focusing on the warts, is a common thing for me to do.

Romantic feelings have been another area where I tend to loose control, but mostly inwardly. At first it starts with a thought or two about the person. Then I find my self trying to put them out of my head, because they'll only distract me. (Why I don't talk to them about it, is probably cowardis, but also I don't see the need for a relationship until one is ready to have a family, which is what the person is distracting from getting ready for in the first place.) Then I successfully put them out of my head for maybe a month, and that's when it happens. I get a flood of thoughts and feelings for the person. I begin to obsess over them. Eventually I can't hold back and come off way to strong, and look creepy (which I am). This is the point I swear off women, again. Maybe next time I'll roll with it, prepared or not, and see where it takes me.

 

[Nocturne]

Eh. How interesting.
And all that while, I had a the terrible notion that my Fe were suddenly becoming dominant and I would lose my Ti.
Or perhaps I am bipolar.

I sometimes get angry and frustrated with my cramped up life.
As a result, and very much like Lot, I let out a string of curses and either damage some of the furniture or myself.
Unlike before, I now have some of these explosions in control.

 

[NormannTheDoorman]

Nice article but the picture on the right usually means I am dehydrated or lacking energy and about to pass out. Or that is how it looks like to me. But I honestly have a hard time sharing my emotions, I tend to keep them in.

 

[Dapper Dan]

Good article. I look forward to reading more of these.

 

[skip]

I don't understand where the myth comes from. My understanding is that most INTPs experience very intense emotions, high highs and low lows. Not feeling emotions and not expressing them are two different things.

 

[Architect]

I struggled with this one.

First I disagree that we are overly emotional. On an absolute basis our emotionality is lower than many others. For example, I compare my inferior Fe to my wife (INFJ) dominant Fe. She clearly gets more emotional, about more things than I do, more frequently. She will blow up (Fe) over small household problems that I'll take in stride, like finding that something got left at the grocery store. She'll Fe over nuanced things that people say or do that I don't even notice. This is natural, as a Fe dominant she has developed her extraverted emotions and derives strength from them. Not so for me or the few other INTPs I know!

What you are getting at, in too many words, is that INTPs have emotions like everybody else, and because we suppress or ignore the wild inferior we are prone to huge blow ups. I did as a kid. I would explode with such ferocity I think people feared for their lives. My INTP son did the same thing, until he got old enough that my Fe dominant wife was able to work with him on his Fe, and he was able to bring that more into his conscious forefront. For him this followed the natural progression too, where individuals normally develop their dominant first (Ti) and inferior second (Fe) as a counterbalance to the dominant.

So it is quite clear to me that INTP's and our close cousins ISTPs with their inferior Fe (who I know quite well as my brother is one) are less emotional overall from others, and INTPs in particular are prone to uncontrolled outbursts due to latently expressed emotions*. A quantitative example, my INTP son would go for a month without showing and apparently consciously feeling a negative emotion, then a huge blow up from the accumulated psychic Fe energy. In that same time period my Fe dominant wife would have outbursts on the order of at least one per day if not more. His outburst however certainly didn't equal having one or more Fe outbursts per day.

I do encourage you to continue with these and am simply offering constructive criticism.

Extraverted Feeling (Fe): INTPs’ & ISTPs’ Inferior Function

INTP Personal Growth and the Inferior

INFJ, INFP, INTP, INTJ Relationships, Compatibility, & the Inferior Function

* ISTPs are so close to us, with the main difference being an impatience with the theoretical in preference for the practical. However they also have a closer relationship with their inferior than INTPs do for unknown reasons to me.

And by the way, the one type I would also say has an 'interesting' emotional life is the Tertiary Fi ISTJ, but that is a different topic.

 

[Obrens]

I'd say it's as simple as having less o' those but stronger and less controllable. Now, it might very well be as Jason Evans says: that we have less of these emotional reactions because we've learned to avoid them exactly because we are not good at dealing with 'em.
Yeah, what's my point? I don't think personality type is directly related to the strength of emotions. It goes like this:
- our emotions are as strong as anyone's
- but we are less skilled in controlling them
- thus we avoid them
- finally, suppressed emotions accumulate into strong outbursts (which are, , even less controllable)

Edit: Forgot to say, love reading your "INTP Experience", Jason.

 

[EditorOne]

Good one, Obrens.

 

[intpz]

In over 20 years, I've never blown, or was close to it. Not even when I could've related to Fe a lot.

 

[Obrens]

The last time I couldn't suppress my anger I was able to channel it into breaking very hard-to-break sticks and then chewing on them. And the last time I really expressed my happiness, those around me thought I was on some serious drugs. But I didn't have a crying + screaming kind of outburst in years. Hitting stuff usually helps with that.

 

[skip]

I'd say it's as simple as having less o' those but stronger and less controllable.

- finally, suppressed emotions accumulate into strong outbursts (which are, , even less controllable)

I must be missing something. Emotions don't need to be controlled. Emotions are merely information: they are feedback about how the outside world is affecting you. Only behavior needs to be controlled.

 

[Obrens]

I must be missing something. Emotions don't need to be controlled. Emotions are merely information: they are feedback about how the outside world is affecting you. Only behavior needs to be controlled.

...that we have less of these emotional reactions...

...is what I said.

 

[BigApplePi]

JasonE. Well written and good thoughts. I've yet to read the other three.

My view on emotions are that INTPs wouldn't have a problem with them, except that thinking is a different dimension than feeling. INTP's simply specialize in thinking and that's why they do well failing to pay attention to the other.

Quoting you:

What is a preference really? Let's say you have amazing agility, physical height, and accuracy. You naturally begin playing basketball, and you excel. Is a preference like that? Is it something so good and strong that you can't help yourself from doing it?

I say no, it's not that simple. I'm going to show you that skills only solidify and take shape as a preference when something else comes first. You don't know it's a bright clear day until you've already experienced dark and rainy ones. To fully recognize a strength, you have to compare it to a weakness. And for us, that weakness is hard-rocking, hotel-room-trashing emotions.

INTP's for whatever reason are fond of thinking. So they will develop it for whatever reason came first and are more likely than others to excel in that. Sure they have emotions, but they don't develop them ... unless they decide to pay attention. As long as they are unexamined they will remain crude and INTP's will get into much more trouble than those who specialize as ExFJ's or IxFP's do. Is that okay?

I had some fun with this thread because it directly addressed emotions:
Name That Emotion

 

[Architect]

Obrens et. al - no, no, no! I bet all the INTPs on this thread would agree that we have stronger intellects than other people, oh and we also have emotions that are as strong. Heads I win, tails you lose.

The functions aren't a handy reference sheet, they are skills with associated preferences that people develop over life. Emotions are a developed skill, as are intellectual skills. I've honed my intellect over a lifetime, and I guarantee I have a stronger intellect and a more developed one than any of the Feelers in my life. Conversely, they have have a more developed feeling side.

Instead of general belief statements back up your assertions with evidence of some form, as I did above. I'll give you another, in a former life I was a musician and I used music to develop my Fe (unknown to me at the time since I didn't really know MBTI - but that was what I was doing). I guarantee that my emotional response to music, both in strength and nuance, was better then than it was before and after. Now I spend most of my time working with computers so the emotional life gets even less play.

 

[Obrens]

Nope, functions aren't skills.
http://www.personalitynation.com/jungian-cognitive-functions/1708-jcf-defined-c-g-jung.html

Spoiler

Feeling

Feeling Function refers to an individual’s sense of value or worth. It tells an individual what is acceptable or agreeable or not. When an individual witnesses an action, he or she may determine what value that particular action is worth. Is that action wrong or right? Is the action worth it? Meaningful? The Feeling Function interprets our data with sense of worth, excellence, usefulness, or importance. (Jung 12)

Now, Feeling Function is not to be mistaken for what is physiologically affected. In other words, Emotions and the Feeling function ARE NOT related (Jung 26). For example, when we hug someone and it makes us feel happy and bubbly, that is not the Feeling Function. When we cry or become angry, that is not the Feeling Function. When we go crazy over the cuteness of kittens, that is not the Feeling Function.

ALL 16 TYPES ARE EQUALLY CAPABLE OF EMOTIONS!!

All 16 types are equally capable of understanding, not understanding, suppressing, and expressing their emotions. Cognitive Functions, however, may approach the expression of emotions in different ways. In a sense, you can have ENTJs be very depressed and emotional and INFPs who can be very clear-minded and rational.

Oh, here's another one:
http://www.personalitynation.com/jungian-cognitive-functions/6938-other-four-functions.html

Spoiler

All functions are emotionally driven, not just the F function. The F function is related primarily to morality, spirituality, and aesthetics, which often require strong emotional awareness.
[...]
(This is what I've been looking for, finally found it.)
You don't have "great Ne" because you're good at word games, and you're not "using your Fi" when you empathize with someone. These are skill sets that may commonly occur in people who operate on the assumptions of those functions, but these skills/actions on their own do not represent the essence of the mindsets themselves!

It is because of our preferences (and avoidances?) that we develop certain (intellectual for INTPs) skills, while remain underdeveloped in others. We don't have less emotions, nor do we have more.

 

[skip]

I'll give you another, in a former life I was a musician and I used music to develop my Fe (unknown to me at the time since I didn't really know MBTI - but that was what I was doing).

Singing did this for me as well.

 

[Architect]

Nope, functions aren't skills.

Either you're confused or we're debating terms. Functions aren't skills but are preferences. Those pages you link obfuscate the issue by turning the simple concept of a preference (I like ice cream) into a sense of value (I value eating ice cream higher than not eating ice cream). However it seems like the same idea.

Regardless individuals develop their talents as if they are skills - by doing them. An INTP will spend most of their life thinking by themselves, hence Ti will accentuate, develop and become stronger. If that wasn't true than a Fe dominant like an INFJ would strategize and analyze as well as an INTP. And, they don't.

ALL 16 TYPES ARE EQUALLY CAPABLE OF EMOTIONS!!

Of course. Obviously. That is not what is being discussed. If you read my posts carefully I'm talking about developed skills, not raw ability. We all have raw ability to have emotions, and we all use our emotions. However, conversely to the Ti example above, a Fe dominant INFJ will have more frequent emotional outbursts and stronger ones than a lifeline Ti dominant. They will also 'life' their emotional life more than an INTP, see below.

You say

We don't have less emotions, nor do we have more.

Your statement isn't precise enough to debate. A Fe dominant expresses or cognates or thinks about their emotional state more than an INTP, and they certainly develop it more than one; by choice. As does an INTP with their dominant Ti. I could say some stupidly vague statement like "INFJ's don't think less than INTP's", which would be equivalent to the above, but that would confuse the issue.

 

[Hawkeye]

We are not Vulcans.


btw, I really enjoyed reading your articles Jason. I look forward to more of them in the future.

 

[Obrens]

A Fe dominant expresses or cognates or thinks about their emotional state more than an INTP, and they certainly develop it more than one; by choice.

Yeah, we can agree on this.

However, conversely to the Ti example above, a Fe dominant INFJ will have more frequent emotional outbursts and stronger ones than a lifeline Ti dominant.

But this is... hmm. INFJs' outbursts are not something to be feared. They are a normal part of their life. INTPs on the other hand avoid theirs and are thus less proficient in dealing with them. We can't express emotions in nuanced ways. It's all in extremes. Our emotions are, indeed, more extreme than those of others.
I have this niece that my family started calling "little Obren" because she's just like me (I mean behavior, not appearance). I haven't tried to type her cause she's little, but reading what Jason wrote about INTP kids... that's her, that's her exactly.
I have this other niece, who I also haven't typed but isn't likely to be an INTP. If her mom's not home and she wants her, you better start talking about how mom's at work, she needs to make money for the family, blah, blah, the same old story for a 100th time.
But "little Obren" is different. You just tell her the truth. Mom's in the store, or wherever. Say that she'll return soon if that's the case. And than pray. Because she can either be rational about it and accept the explanation or she'll fly off into a rage where nothing helps but letting her alone to calm herself down. And not trying to interact with her in any way until that happens.
The second reaction is both stupider and stronger.

 

[Jason Evans]

This topic sure got some legs. Great to see a vigorous debate.

I'm not arguing that we are more emotional than others, that we have a greater volume of emotions. What I'm arguing is that we are less skilled at handling them when they arise. One person's party is another person's deafening noise. Perhaps we assume that emotions contain important information, so we tend to augment them by throwing thought and intensity at an already charged siutation. Let's face it, no one does their best thinking when they are filled with emotion (incidentally, an intriguing point), yet that's exactly what we try to do. The result is a hyper-charged, wild experience of emotions that feel like they do us harm.

I think opposites are important. We order ourselves by them. If it's not this, it must be that. Getting slapped by emotions makes us snap to our rational skills. An opposite. We then begin to proactively suppress those emotions in the future.

One last point. Although I feel obligated to mention cognitive functions in my articles, I am consciously trying to describe INTP in gritty, real world situations and to stay away from cognitive theory. I'm not saying that cognitive theory is wrong, but I find that folks spend 80% of their time debating the definitions of the functions and what each function means or refers to. I'm trying take it to a more basic level that people can relate to. That's why I use so many analogies. And humor.

 

[Jason Evans]

Obrens,

You're describing my younger daughter too.

 

[intpz]

It's about the control. Can you control yourself? I know I can. I'm constantly surprised how many people can't. I was giving this to the INTP "title," but it seems like it's the opposite here.

As for the feelings, it's the attitude towards stuff, offense in this case. I don't get offended very often, almost never, thus I don't get emotional. I wonder if I get equally or less offended than an average INTP, it seems that significantly less from reading these posts.

 

[redbaron]

INTPs on the other hand avoid theirs and are thus less proficient in dealing with them. We can't express emotions in nuanced ways. It's all in extremes. Our emotions are, indeed, more extreme than those of others.

You're making general assumptions as to how others behave. Your statements could be true for a some INTP's, but aren't true for all of them.

I don't know how you can assume that all INTP's avoid emotions, and that this is the reason they're less proficient in dealing with them.

Or that they simply can't express emotion in nuanced ways.

Or that our emotions are indeed more extreme than those of others. More extreme as judged by what exactly? What basis are you judging emotional extremity off?

 

[Jason Evans]

Interestingly, I don't disagree with most of the counter-points to the article. In fact, what they describe is what I had in mind. I'm honing the article a bit to make sure that it's not suggesting things that I didn't intend. Especially how we tend to super-charge positive emotions by using rational skills to find great depth and importance in them. Thanks for that feedback!

 

[BigApplePi]

A personal story. I joined a bulletin board in 1999 so that was thirteen years ago. I was new and shy and didn't know what to expect. The particular board was a religion board. I was immediately flamed. I replied with calm and reason. After all I was interested in the subject, not what I thought were irrelevant manipulations and emotions of posters. I kept up the cool demeanor for years. The whole thing was a challenge: how to make sense of things. I was probably the only INTP or at least others were scared away. I was so cool (Fe) I refused to ever use exclamation points no matter what is said but never mentioned that!!!

I kept all emotions to myself. What were they? Concern I would never be listened to. Pleasure when I was. Caution and sometimes fear when those who attacked management decided to attack me when I defended mgt. More, but mostly a desire to remain having a rational persona with all the flack flying around. To me my personal emotions had nothing to do with subjects being put forth. Actually I now think this was wrong of me.

 

[BigApplePi]

What I'm arguing is that we are less skilled at handling them when they arise. One person's party is another person's deafening noise.

What are emotions for anyway? I suppose they have something to do with how we intend to deal with the outside world. INTP's have an alternative way of dealing so they use that.

Let's face it, no one does their best thinking when they are filled with emotion (incidentally, an intriguing point)

Sounds right. Emotions are not for thinking; they are for actions. When we try to think in the face of emotions, we've already been hit. The brain (I guess) is temporarily taken over and we have to deal with that. Let it roll.

Spoiler

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XWQrt00_NM&feature=related

 

[skip]

What are emotions for anyway?

Well...

Emotions are merely information: they are feedback about how the outside world is affecting you.

 

[kaisaki1342]

Hello, a very nice discussion here.

I always struggle with my emotion. Particular in a way that they come out when I don't want them and would not show when I need them.
I am too patient and calm in situation that somehow needs to show a bit of anger and get angry at situation I don't even though that very moment I am trying to cage those emotion.
Recently I am being overly emotional, and my patience being very short to the people around my work , my emotions are starting to come out, I don't want it to be like that.
That is my struggle. The people around my work are SJs Pity I love books somehow they don't share the same passion as I do and yet they have work longer than me in the library.

 

[BigApplePi]

Do you have something specific you get angry at ... no matter how seemingly foolish? And the other one ... do you have an example where you are too patient? If so, then we can think about it ... one way or the other ... like INTP's.

 

[kaisaki1342]

Thank you BigApplePi ,

Yes there are specific things.
Once when still in college there is this classmate of mine who just does not like me and do horrible things like throwing trashes not once I got angry and I just ignore him (he is gay - not a derogatory statement but rather that really how he consider himself ). Only when he transferred that my classmates told to me that he pretty much hate me and that I should have confronted him. They said he does not like me that time because I usually explain simple things and make it look so complicated to them , even though it is very simple to me, I am not certain about that). After that my mind backtrack to everything and I told myself I should have at least said something.
Other things are pretty mundane , I once ordered an ice coffee and repeated it several times to the cashier only to receive a hot coffee. When talking to my ISP provider who would tell me all things I have already done. Other things is I can't empathize to other people. Once there is I always talk to and I saw her crying because her grandmom died, I want to help but I can't empathize. I don't know if it is pretty common to INTP's, or something I am experiencing.

About times I burst or get my voice up are when for example I fix their computer and explain to them what they need to do to avoid it or explain to them what they did wrong and they go all defense I get so irritated. Other times is when people ask me to do something so against my very principle that I cry in front of them. (Like things I equate to deception). Other is when my co-workers want me to do things that are not work related for them , (Like saving their picture, uploading this or that) or doing the work that is for them I get really irritated since they kind of invading my space.

I work in a library as Technical Staff and Internet Monitor. Which a good work for me I get the books I do my stuff and I don't deal much with people.

My Fe is getting hyperactive lately the more I want to control it. I don't know if this things are normal or I am getting confused of it.

 

[BigApplePi]

That's a lot of stuff.

Once when still in college there is this classmate of mine who just does not like me and do horrible things like throwing trashes not once I got angry and I just ignore him (he is gay - not a derogatory statement but rather that really how he consider himself ). Only when he transferred that my classmates told to me that he pretty much hate me and that I should have confronted him. They said he does not like me that time because I usually explain simple things and make it look so complicated to them , even though it is very simple to me, I am not certain about that). After that my mind backtrack to everything and I told myself I should have at least said something.

At first saying nothing was a try. When that didn't work, then try something brief. "Why did you do that? You don't like me?" He may answer. If he does you have a clue. If he acts silly, you can try a mild threat: "Don't do that again." After that ... well I'm not there.

Other things are pretty mundane , I once ordered an ice coffee and repeated it several times to the cashier only to receive a hot coffee.

Tell them you ordered ice and will refuse to pay or ask for an exchange. See what they say.

When talking to my ISP provider who would tell me all things I have already done.

If you did something in error, admit it and apologize.

Other things is I can't empathize to other people. Once there is I always talk to and I saw her crying because her grandmom died, I want to help but I can't empathize. I don't know if it is pretty common to INTP's, or something I am experiencing.

Yes. Common to INTP's I think. If you can't empathize, just be polite. Think about what should be said, say it and say no more.

About times I burst or get my voice up are when for example I fix their computer and explain to them what they need to do to avoid it or explain to them what they did wrong and they go all defense I get so irritated.

If you think you were too harsh, realize people are not as quick as you are.

Other times is when people ask me to do something so against my very principle that I cry in front of them. (Like things I equate to deception). Other is when my co-workers want me to do things that are not work related for them , (Like saving their picture, uploading this or that) or doing the work that is for them I get really irritated since they kind of invading my space.

Do you think you can learn from those experiences? The first time if it happened to me, I'd mess up. After that you have a chance to think about it and give a better response.

I work in a library as Technical Staff and Internet Monitor. Which a good work for me I get the books I do my stuff and I don't deal much with people.

My Fe is getting hyperactive lately the more I want to control it. I don't know if this things are normal or I am getting confused of it.

Seems you are doing okay as long as you don't get too out of control. Use your Fe experience to learn about people. They are not as easily controlled (not for INTP's) as is technical stuff.

That has me wondering about the difference with dealing with technical stuff versus people. Similar things happen with technical stuff. You try to fix something. It doesn't work. Your fix can make things worse or not. But you don't get all that mad at the machine because it tends not to "invade your space." Yet it can frustrate you. People are not mechanical so finding the right response requires broader knowledge about people. What can I say?

 

[ememisya]

All this for denying an essential fact. We're stinky and sweaty common jungle animals at the core of it.

Result of a force against the expansion of the Universe coupling in self-similar patterns like a fractal, through time, through the dinosaur era to be the imaginative beasts we are today. You know, monkeys who know what they see in the mirror is themselves, and also ones who can look away and do something interesting when bored.

INTPs tend to fast on emotions, I personally like them in short intense bursts, like rocking out to metal. Or pretend to fight with my friends. And all the sweet emotions are left to those who can see and appreciate them. Which seems to occupy the monkey while I think about the most important stuff.

There are emotions, I just don't care for them all the time. I simply ignore them in my head, like my heartbeat or my breathing.

Okay another way it came to me, it's like the ultimate "No". Are you sad? "No." Are you angry! "No." Then, you must be happy? "No." Do you feel nothing? "No." Are you going to say anything other than No? "No." And into the bag it goes.

Oh also, Gnarls Barkley kicks ass.

Okay, now onto some interesting facts. Did you know there is a new 0 day exploit out where you can tell Java to modify itself using the reflection API and bean patterns? Fortunately it only affects 1.7 users (Don't update from a stable release if there is no clear cut necessity), and most people don't have Java installed on their home computers anyways.

Believe it or not, not being random here. May read like I lost my train of thought, but some trains are better off without me And that's how I avoid emotions. Just demonstrating how I operate, and apparently I'm one of those INTP things.

And yes, I can already feel the wave of disapprovals, and will most likely read this post like a day from now and think I've been an idiot.

 

[PhoenixRising]

Personally, I take pride in my lack of emotions. It makes me more dependable and trustworthy when making decisions. It also allows me to be less biased about facts. INTPs do have emotions, but I wouldn't exaggerate the significance of them.

 

[intpz]

Personally, I take pride in my lack of emotions. It makes me more dependable and trustworthy when making decisions. It also allows me to be less biased about facts. INTPs do have emotions, but I wouldn't exaggerate the significance of them.

Same here, I enjoy being emotion-free. After reading all that, I'm also glad that I don't burst. That would suck ass...

 

[ememisya]

Personally, I take pride in my lack of emotions. It makes me more dependable and trustworthy when making decisions. It also allows me to be less biased about facts. INTPs do have emotions, but I wouldn't exaggerate the significance of them.

Here's how I read that reasonably:
You find that ignoring feelings gives you a clear head and focus which you believe to be helpful to you in achieving your tasks. Having a state of mind without purpose seems insignificant.

And here's how I read that emotionally, sentence for sentence:
So you feel self content. You feel like you are worthy of other people's trust. You feel like you are a fair person. You don't think it's significant to share a wider range of feelings outright.

We generally communicate feeling along with the neuron activation patterns which happen to be the "story". But you can't take pride in lack of feelings.

 

[ememisya]

Same here, I enjoy being emotion-free. After reading all that, I'm also glad that I don't burst. That would suck ass...

Again, if you are enjoying it, you're not emotion free, you're content. You're also afraid of the consequences if you were to lose control of faculties.

So I read, happy, fear and happy-that-no-fear in monkey. I speak monkey :P

 

[intpz]

Again, if you are enjoying it, you're not emotion free, you're content. You're also afraid of the consequences if you were to lose control of faculties.

So I read, happy, fear and happy-that-no-fear in monkey. I speak monkey :P

Okay, I think I need to rewrite his post to say what I wanna say.

I feel good to not take emotions into account when thinking and making decisions. I do feel good when I enjoy what I do, I feel bad when I don't do what I enjoy.

I feel good because I know that what I do isn't based on emotions, it's based on logic. I don't feat the consequences of making a decision based on feelings, often I don't even think about the outcome. However, when I do, I see the outcome and the chain of events that would follow that outcome of how I would act.


Let's discuss an example, a decision that I have to make by the end of the week:

Over here we have mandatory health insurance. If I am unemployed and not a student, I have to pay 30 bucks or so every month for the insurance. If I don't pay, they can seize my property and make me pay 10 times what I'd own in 2 or 3 months. Since I don't get any money and I don't want to do mundane worthless job without any prospects or useful outcomes (except very little money), I am unemployed.

I live with an E/ISFJ, very manipulative, controlling and absolutely ignorant of facing anything out of the scope of her reality, mother. She gives me some food from time to time, so I don't die.

She called in the unemployment center and spoke to one of the representatives. She always tells a lot of bad things about my behavior (I'm abnormal, as well as most of the population, according to her), as well as good things, things that come with good parenting. Except that most of the things (in both sections) aren't even half true. Basically, the woman left with an impression of an idiot on cocaine who disrespects everything and someone who can do a lot of shit, and someone who has great ass-licking skills. She also made an appointment without telling me anything about it prior to making the call. Obviously I didn't go.

Since I have to either pay the money that I don't have or register in the unemployment center by the end of the week, I have to make a decision:

1. Go to the same person who thinks that I am a bad person with lost of skills that I don't have (...creating short movies? Wtf? How the fuck did she even came up with that? And anyway, what good would it do, we don't have a company that does anything even remotely similar to that!) and possibly be paid a couple hundred bucks in exchange for me going to some kind of specialized courses
2. Go to the unemployment center, be an asshole and ask for another person, tell him the truth about what I can do and who I am, possibly get the same benefit. However, a guy who did that in another city says that you cannot choose your representative, you just get what you get
3. Don't go there and hope that I'll get a job in two or three months, get no money now, don't

Now here's my thinking process:

1. I don't wanna go to that woman, she knows too much. I also don't wanna pay the money, nonetheless I don't have it... And I most likely won't get to choose the guy who will represent me
2. Why don't I wanna go to that woman, is this an emotional decision, maybe I just don't like what my mom said? Let's see now... The woman knows a bunch of bullshit about who I am, although she also knows a bunch of shit about my skills. If she will think that she knows me, she won't give me proficient courses and job opportunities. If she will ask me about me, I will either have to lie by making her tell what I know and stick to my mom's story, or I will have to imply that my mom's an idiot by telling the truth. But wouldn't that make my mom appear as a lying bitch trying to push her son through? It would, which might cause the lady to think the same about me, a lot of people think that kids are reflections of the worst (or sometimes the best) of their parents... And if that's the case, which most likely is, as she's most likely an ESFJ judging from her photo and her moto, I'm not gonna prove that I'm not like my mom. Okay, so in short we have got ourselves a rational decision about why I shouldn't go there.
3. Hm, I ruled out the emotional decision, so let's see this rationally. If I'd go and be an asshole, ask for a specific representative, I might get it. But I might also get the woman... What can I do then? *a few minutes of random thoughts* Seems like I can't do anything here, it's pure chance...
4. But what about not going at all? I don't have any money to pay, but I like this decision. After all, they don't offer you any jobs according to your profession, especially not IT jobs... How does the process work? Hm... I know that you are forced to pick one job every X period of time, I think... 2 months? I'm not sure. Well, in any case, you can either decline the jobs 3 times, or you can go and be either employed or unemployed. If I decline 3 jobs, I will be kicked out of the unemployment center... I can't get fired, can I? It would put an extra bullshit line in my resume, saying that I was fired. I can't quit either, it would count as a "time." Shit. Pure bullshit... Why can't this fucking country have a sophisticated IT system for fuck's sake? Fuck, going offtopic... Let's see now...
5. Well, the most rational decision that I have thought of is to take my chances and go to the fucking center... Shit, I will have to waste two hours in a fucking line... Goddamn people... What if I go early? Gonna have to go to bed early. I don't wanna go to bed early, that would cause suspicion to my mom... That ain't good, she's up to no good if she notices any change in my behavior... I have to keep it the same so she wouldn't do any bullshit family meeting with my ISTJ godfather. or something. Damnit. If I wouldn't have gotten much sleep, I will be fucked up. I have no coffee, I barely eat, sleep deprivation would fuck me up even more. Hm...
6. *this is where my final thoughts on the matter would go. They are due tomorrow 4PM, so I could call the fuckers and see if I can make an appointment if I'll decide to go. I'm confident that I will go and try to be an asshole though.*

So that was my thought process, I know it's not a resemblance of my thought process if I was a boss deciding what to do with my team members, but I believe I would make a quick decision based on the facts gathered or gather more facts and quickly decide what is the best solution. But I still think that this does represent my thought process a little related to this topic.

P.S. Damn, this is a long post! And I bet I won't get any comments on it. Just wasted 30 minutes of my time. Oh well.

 

[ememisya]

Okay, I think I need to rewrite his post to say what I wanna say.

I feel good to not take emotions into account when thinking and making decisions. I do feel good when I enjoy what I do, I feel bad when I don't do what I enjoy.

I feel good because I know that what I do isn't based on emotions, it's based on logic. I don't feat the consequences of making a decision based on feelings, often I don't even think about the outcome. However, when I do, I see the outcome and the chain of events that would follow that outcome of how I would act.


Let's discuss an example, a decision that I have to make by the end of the week:

Over here we have mandatory health insurance. If I am unemployed and not a student, I have to pay 30 bucks or so every month for the insurance. If I don't pay, they can seize my property and make me pay 10 times what I'd own in 2 or 3 months. Since I don't get any money and I don't want to do mundane worthless job without any prospects or useful outcomes (except very little money), I am unemployed.

I live with an E/ISFJ, very manipulative, controlling and absolutely ignorant of facing anything out of the scope of her reality, mother. She gives me some food from time to time, so I don't die.

She called in the unemployment center and spoke to one of the representatives. She always tells a lot of bad things about my behavior (I'm abnormal, as well as most of the population, according to her), as well as good things, things that come with good parenting. Except that most of the things (in both sections) aren't even half true. Basically, the woman left with an impression of an idiot on cocaine who disrespects everything and someone who can do a lot of shit, and someone who has great ass-licking skills. She also made an appointment without telling me anything about it prior to making the call. Obviously I didn't go.

Since I have to either pay the money that I don't have or register in the unemployment center by the end of the week, I have to make a decision:

1. Go to the same person who thinks that I am a bad person with lost of skills that I don't have (...creating short movies? Wtf? How the fuck did she even came up with that? And anyway, what good would it do, we don't have a company that does anything even remotely similar to that!) and possibly be paid a couple hundred bucks in exchange for me going to some kind of specialized courses
2. Go to the unemployment center, be an asshole and ask for another person, tell him the truth about what I can do and who I am, possibly get the same benefit. However, a guy who did that in another city says that you cannot choose your representative, you just get what you get
3. Don't go there and hope that I'll get a job in two or three months, get no money now, don't

Now here's my thinking process:

1. I don't wanna go to that woman, she knows too much. I also don't wanna pay the money, nonetheless I don't have it... And I most likely won't get to choose the guy who will represent me
2. Why don't I wanna go to that woman, is this an emotional decision, maybe I just don't like what my mom said? Let's see now... The woman knows a bunch of bullshit about who I am, although she also knows a bunch of shit about my skills. If she will think that she knows me, she won't give me proficient courses and job opportunities. If she will ask me about me, I will either have to lie by making her tell what I know and stick to my mom's story, or I will have to imply that my mom's an idiot by telling the truth. But wouldn't that make my mom appear as a lying bitch trying to push her son through? It would, which might cause the lady to think the same about me, a lot of people think that kids are reflections of the worst (or sometimes the best) of their parents... And if that's the case, which most likely is, as she's most likely an ESFJ judging from her photo and her moto, I'm not gonna prove that I'm not like my mom. Okay, so in short we have got ourselves a rational decision about why I shouldn't go there.
3. Hm, I ruled out the emotional decision, so let's see this rationally. If I'd go and be an asshole, ask for a specific representative, I might get it. But I might also get the woman... What can I do then? *a few minutes of random thoughts* Seems like I can't do anything here, it's pure chance...
4. But what about not going at all? I don't have any money to pay, but I like this decision. After all, they don't offer you any jobs according to your profession, especially not IT jobs... How does the process work? Hm... I know that you are forced to pick one job every X period of time, I think... 2 months? I'm not sure. Well, in any case, you can either decline the jobs 3 times, or you can go and be either employed or unemployed. If I decline 3 jobs, I will be kicked out of the unemployment center... I can't get fired, can I? It would put an extra bullshit line in my resume, saying that I was fired. I can't quit either, it would count as a "time." Shit. Pure bullshit... Why can't this fucking country have a sophisticated IT system for fuck's sake? Fuck, going offtopic... Let's see now...
5. Well, the most rational decision that I have thought of is to take my chances and go to the fucking center... Shit, I will have to waste two hours in a fucking line... Goddamn people... What if I go early? Gonna have to go to bed early. I don't wanna go to bed early, that would cause suspicion to my mom... That ain't good, she's up to no good if she notices any change in my behavior... I have to keep it the same so she wouldn't do any bullshit family meeting with my ISTJ godfather. or something. Damnit. If I wouldn't have gotten much sleep, I will be fucked up. I have no coffee, I barely eat, sleep deprivation would fuck me up even more. Hm...
6. *this is where my final thoughts on the matter would go. They are due tomorrow 4PM, so I could call the fuckers and see if I can make an appointment if I'll decide to go. I'm confident that I will go and try to be an asshole though.*

So that was my thought process, I know it's not a resemblance of my thought process if I was a boss deciding what to do with my team members, but I believe I would make a quick decision based on the facts gathered or gather more facts and quickly decide what is the best solution. But I still think that this does represent my thought process a little related to this topic.

P.S. Damn, this is a long post! And I bet I won't get any comments on it. Just wasted 30 minutes of my time. Oh well.

I see. It sounds to me like you love your mother no matter how hard her opinion is of you. This can be a problem due to causing you difficulties with forming relationships, mostly trust in general though. Nothing worse than a heartbreak but I'd say you have to cut off your mother from your life, and I would start looking into being a student immediately.

Also lets face it, most of us have jobs which are mundane, but it's about finding uniqueness in something which appears very boring. Even going to the Moon every day can be boring.

You'll certainly get more interviews with a masters, even more with a PhD. Those HR pools are ruthless. But also, getting a job isn't the only way of making money, remember that you can always sell something for more than its worth, and blam profit, get others to do it for you, profit + laziness and in time tax breaks. The latter is more risky of course.

 

[intpz]

I see. It sounds to me like you love your mother no matter how hard her opinion is of you. This can be a problem due to causing you difficulties with forming relationships, mostly trust in general though. Nothing worse than a heartbreak but I'd say you have to cut off your mother from your life, and I would start looking into being a student immediately.

Also lets face it, most of us have jobs which are mundane, but it's about finding uniqueness in something which appears very boring. Even going to the Moon every day can be boring.

You'll certainly get more interviews with a masters, even more with a PhD. Those HR pools are ruthless. But also, getting a job isn't the only way of making money, remember that you can always sell something for more than its worth, and blam profit, get others to do it for you, profit + laziness and in time tax breaks. The latter is more risky of course.

...What? I'd move in a blink of an eye and I wouldn't share my number 10 years ago. Wtf have you been reading?

As for the student part, can't be this year. And I hate school, by the way.

Don't give me that "other people do X" bullshit. I don't care what other people do, I care what I do; I don't give a fuck what jobs other people have, I care what job I (will) have. And yes, going to the Moon can be boring... I don't get the relation to this example of yours.

Sure I would, after wasting 4 years on something boring that I won't use in the long run, hence useless. And anyway, I need a job for a year, even if I will go to college. I'd like not to though. Anyway, we've had this conversation with another guy in another thread, so if you wanna continue, before that, I suggest you read it, as there's a lot of stuff discussed over there, including what we've just discussed.

And I believe this was also discussed - I have no money and I have no stuff to sell; local market sucks ass, as people don't have money, and aren't interested in electronics for the most part. A lot of them speak Russian instead of my language too, and I don't speak Russian and am not going to start learning it at this point.

So yea, all of this was discussed already in another thread with another guy, except the mom part... I think you made a huge mistake somewhere when reading my post dude.