Attraction - with regard for type, the parallel prequel...

[Zeke Johnson]

Re: type preference and attraction

I'm only interested in the dreaded ESFJ. But there is a very important logical reason behind this. There can only be two types of relationship, your compliment, INTP and your opposite ESFJ. But the rub is whats the point in going out with someone similar or exactly like you?.

The Heroic thing to do is to attempt ( Hard to achieve by any means ) a relationship with an ESFJ. Namely the energy between the two is very powerful, as with any opposites, but the point is, a path to the middle ground is through your opposite or shadow (ESFJ).

Through a relationship with an ESFJ, creating a total personality is possible. Coupled with the transcendent relationship proto-type, it can create a starting point to connecting with the world itself.

Do you really want to go out with someone just like you?

Zeke Johnson ( Ex-Captain )

 

[Ermine]

I really don't get why being with an ESFJ would be helpful. From what I've researched, when INTPs are under extreme stress, or experiencing extreme emotions or a mental/emotional breakdown, they start acting like their shadow, the ESFJ. Essentially, that means getting overly emotional over little things, closed-minded concrete perspective, more dependence on the opinion of others, everything the INTP is not. Personally, I don't ever want to be intimate with a person whose personality is like mine in a nervous breakdown. That would be horrible, especially in a fight.

 

[mm1991]

Re: type preference and attraction

I agree with weasel here.
A personality in eternal breakdown mode?
Not cool.

 

[Zeke Johnson]

Re: type preference and attraction

I don't ever want to be intimate with a person whose personality is like mine in a nervous breakdown.

So ESFJ's are like yours in a nervous breakdown, how ignorant.

A personality in eternal breakdown mode? Not cool.
How utterly ridiculous, how can you get off calling ESFJ's as being a personality in eternal breakdown mode? and I suppose your just so perfect?

You've just admitted that you both contain the ESFJ personality in shadow form, but is it any wonder that you have such a horrible time with it, when you have no respect or understanding of the ESFJ whatsoever.

That would be horrible, especially in a fight.

So being in ESFJ shadow mode, with an ESFJ would result in a fight? hardly, I find your lack of faith disturbing....

Zeke Johnson ( Ex-Captain )

 

[hairlessbluetick]

Re: type preference and attraction

To Zeke: I think you are misinterpreting what weasel has said. (S)he (? sorry, I forgot?) isn't saying that ESFJs are in eternal breakdown mode. It's not a judgment against that type. What they are saying is that when one type is in breakdown, they shut down so completely as to react to things in a way that is normal for their opposite type. Being in a relationship with a person who reacts to things in a way that for them is normal, but for you is a behavior that you only resort to when you are in a breakdown, would not be pleasant for anyone involved. Including the ESFJ!

 

[Ermine]

Re: type preference and attraction

^ I am female.

I suppose that post was somewhat ignorant of the possibilities, but I still think that in a relationship, there has to be some common ground so far as personality goes.

 

[hairlessbluetick]

Re: type preference and attraction

I agree.

I've found that I'm only even attracted to someone (I mean physically) once I've gotten to know them and have decided that their personality is acceptable. Rarely will I be attracted to a Sensor. I've been attracted to both Is and Es, both Js and Ps, and although generally I prefer Thinkers, I have been attracted to Feelers on the rare occasion I can find one with some sense. (It does happen!) My current crush may be a Sensor, which I find interesting.

 

[Wisp]

Re: type preference and attraction

Hmmm... I think Zeke may be mis-informed about the role of the shadow function... The role of the shadow function, if used properly, is as a way of softening your typological edges. However, trying to embody the shadow function will only result in stress. Embodying parts, for a short time, fine. But embodying the whole thing is impossible (typologically) and will, as weasel stated, result in breakdown state. Personally I believe that the optimal pair has 1-2 different letters, so they have differences to spice things up, but have similarities to find common ground....

Oh, BTW I got...

INTP/INTP/INTP

Oh, and all the letters were over 70%.... @_@

 

[Zeke Johnson]

Re: type preference and attraction

However, trying to embody the shadow function will only result in stress.

Only a true genius realizes that nothing is certain... right? ~Me

Lol,

Zeke Johnson ( Ex-Captain )

 

[Wisp]

Re: type preference and attraction

Lol?

 

[Ermine]

Re: type preference and attraction

I'm guessing that Zeke was noting at a bit of self contradiction created by his taking both quotes out of context and putting his own viewpoint into the mix. Hence the "lol". I personally don't find it hilarious, but whatever.

 

[Yozuki]

Re: type preference and attraction

I'm only interested in the dreaded ESFJ. But there is a very important logical reason behind this. There can only be two types of relationship, your compliment, INTP and your opposite ESFJ. But the rub is whats the point in going out with someone similar or exactly like you?.

The Heroic thing to do is to attempt ( Hard to achieve by any means ) a relationship with an ESFJ. Namely the energy between the two is very powerful, as with any opposites, but the point is, a path to the middle ground is through your opposite or shadow (ESFJ).

Through a relationship with an ESFJ, creating a total personality is possible. Coupled with the transcendent relationship proto-type, it can create a starting point to connecting with the world itself.

Do you really want to go out with someone just like you?

Zeke Johnson ( Ex-Captain )

Yozuki is the thinking the person that a like the human mechanical it concerns is the most a fun. Much difference in the databanks Yozuki thinks, too much the enjoyment to spend the time together. Alack! The together time it is less and less and Yozuki a question the human mechanical! Human the mechanical is strange breed and Yozuki cannot believe!

 

[Death]

INTP shadow functions are ENTJ right,not ESFJ.

 

[Zeke Johnson]

Thanks for your posts, I can understand why this concept is verging on 'repulsive' to you.

Again, any mention of ESFJ seems to have an adverse effect on everyone. I agree that I also once hated and mis-understood my shadow, but surely that's no excuse not to want to understand it better?

Zeke Johnson ( Ex-Captain )

 

[Cabbo Pearimo]

If they're a good person, go for it. Forget all this personality typing crap, it's not as specific as you'd think. It really depends on you. Even in ITNPforum, we're all not the same.

 

[Wisp]

That's the biggest truth in MBTI, and one any good MBTI book should emphasize, the differences within similarities.

 

[kd10]

Well, this brought up a question. What would it be like to be with someone EXACTLY yourself?
I believe it will workout for me. Yet conflicts arise, yet doesn't any relationship do.

Another question/statement. What would it be like to be with ANYONE. Think of every personality and simulate ever situation. However the ending. Refering back to a previously stated topic on relationships. Attraction is all on ones perspective. I believe, no matter who the person is, if you find yourself physically or mentally attracted to someone, go for it. It will only hurt if you don't. This may be easier said then done, as I have little to say about this subject, by my reasoning seems to be moreover accurate in my perspective.

 

[loveofreason]

Thanks for your posts, I can understand why this concept is verging on 'repulsive' to you.

Again, any mention of ESFJ seems to have an adverse effect on everyone. I agree that I also once hated and mis-understood my shadow, but surely that's no excuse not to want to understand it better?

Zeke Johnson ( Ex-Captain )

You're right, it is no excuse to not seek a better understanding. The very intensity of reaction indicates the fertility of ground to be examined.

 

[Jimbo2047]

ESFJs may be warm and enthusiastic, but if you're not on the same page with them, they got this tendency to attack your character.

 

[CowSavior]

My mom is an ESFJ... <_<

We get into giant fights every other month, so I don't really see how it would be good for an INTP to be in a relationship with an ESFJ.

But I think my previous girlfriend was an INTP, but I'm not sure...

 

[Wisp]

... *ouch* ...
My mother was tested as an INTP back in the days of HS, but I have doubts.

Also, Kd, the point isn't that it would be hard to be in a relationship with an INTP, more than it would be boring.

 

[Linsejko]

I can't imagine it being boring. INTPs are two off in the cloud people who relate with their intuition, which I can imagine becoming something deeply affectionate; they would just understand each other so well, you know?

And that's a big deal to introverted types. I can see that going well.

The INTP's ideal partner is typically said to be ENTJ, or ESTJ. ENTJ is said to be different enough to complement, but still on the same page with the NT; i.e., they both think clearly, and both have the same vibe 'sense' for each other.

Personally, though, I find myself put of by strong "J" types. And while I could easily see me being with an E type, I think I find an "I" type girl fairly alluring.

.L

 

[alierae]

I can see how us introverted people would be more happy with someone who is more outgoing. It creates a balance in the relationship which some people need. But in my opinion, who you have a relationship with all depends on Y--O--U. Although we are all INTP's...we can't just be categorized this way, it is our personality type based on 4 ideas. It isn't our entire personality and some people aren't the same way around everyone. You might be extremely shy around your peers at work or school and really outgoing and carefree around your friends or people closer to you. Whatever the case, you shouldn't try to look for somoeone based on their personality types or something like that. Believe me, you'll know when you have found the person you want to spend the rest of your life with.

 

[Ermine]

I can't imagine it being boring. INTPs are two off in the cloud people who relate with their intuition, which I can imagine becoming something deeply affectionate; they would just understand each other so well, you know?

And that's a big deal to introverted types. I can see that going well.

The INTP's ideal partner is typically said to be ENTJ, or ESTJ. ENTJ is said to be different enough to complement, but still on the same page with the NT; i.e., they both think clearly, and both have the same vibe 'sense' for each other.

Personally, though, I find myself put of by strong "J" types. And while I could easily see me being with an E type, I think I find an "I" type girl fairly alluring.

.L

Wow, that is really hard to believe. My mom is an ESTJ, and she is the last type of person I'd choose to live and work with, let alone be affectionate with. While an ESTJ wouldn't be emotionally demanding, from what I've seen from my mom, they are controlling, rely excessively on the authority, and are too scheduled for their own good.

However, I would prefer to have a more outgoing partner that can do logistics for me.

 

[Chimerical]

My shadow is ESFP. They annoy the living shit out of me. I dated on once, she liked me because I'm smart and she isn't. In the end I just couldn't take it and broke it off.

My ideal relationship is with an INTJ like me. They make me happy.

 

[Cabbo Pearimo]

I'm nearly an ISTP, and I think that that'd be pretty much ideal as a partner - but INTP works too.

 

[Ermine]

My dad's ISTP. We get along very well. We're hardly different except for the fact that he's a lot older than me and more tool oriented.

 

[Linsejko]

Wow, that is really hard to believe. My mom is an ESTJ, and she is the last type of person I'd choose to live and work with, let alone be affectionate with. While an ESTJ wouldn't be emotionally demanding, from what I've seen from my mom, they are controlling, rely excessively on the authority, and are too scheduled for their own good.

However, I would prefer to have a more outgoing partner that can do logistics for me.

Not to bash your mom, but an ESTJ who had some wholeness would be moderately controlling, but not excessively as your describe; this is said to go well with INTPs, who are generally said to be compliant, and not mind others taking charge. (sans 'controlling', of course, because of the high value on personal expression). The "too scheduled for their own good" can be softened. I have an aunt that is also like that...

But do you honestly think that every ESTJ suffers from that? That's a person problem that's related to her type, not a problem that is a direct result from her type.

I have the hardest time appreciating/understanding the "S" quality. By any description, if just sounds inferior to an "N" to me. Like, we idealize wonderful things, and then perhaps they would be the implementors who would be able to understand what we talk about.

Perhaps I am biased towards seeing the creation of wonderful thoughts and ideas as superior because I am that way? But I feel like actually making it...

... then again, I feel like I answer my own question. Now that I think about it that way, I can see a lot of beauty in putting those plans into action, solving the specifics of how to make it actually work.

Hmm.

.L

 

[Ermine]

I actually only added the "excessively controlling" as opposed to moderately controlling just because I don't like being controlled at all when I find no good reason behind it.

 

[Linsejko]

The idea is that, optimally, they would add initiative and inspiration to do, while the INTP usually doesn't get that far on their own.

The ENTJ takes the initiative, basically, which the INTP doesn't mind.

To speak of control is really beyond this.

.L

 

[Ermine]

I know. I just think I'd personally prefer someone on the same page as me (an NT).

 

[Linsejko]

Agreed. Just saying.

.L

 

[Devercia]

I as well have a ESFJ mother. I can't speak for more than 2 minutes with her before she fundamentally misunderstands me and takes no notice that she has despite whatever illogical inconsistencies that are assuredly popping up in her head. She then takes her interpritation and pins it on me as if it were my own words.

Communication is like archery, with the speaker the archer, and the listener the target wanting to be hit. I find that myself, like most INTPs, speak as I if my speech were a laser guided bull's eye seeking arrow. Being an ESFJ she interperates like some over zealous fatalist body guard ready to do a swan dive to take a bullet. For her it is a useful strategy when speaking with like minded people. Unfortunately for me if she would just stand still i wouldn't miss. Likewise, she speaks with verbosity, as if her words were a slew of lobbed arrows shot with as much volume as possible but with no attempt to aim, expecting me as the target to run around catching them.

I am under the impression that extraverts put the burden of communication on teh listener; introverts on the speaker. It is for this complete lack of communication that I could not imagine being attracted to my shadow, regardless of my mother being one.

 

[Wisp]

Hahaha,,, I like my "laser-guided bulls eye seeking arrows" of conversational dread. =) A good post all around, I must say...