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Am I an Intj? or a intp? or a mix of both?

jamez345

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Hello my name is james and i am 14 going on 15. I browsing the internet and came across this test that told me my personailty. I was like ok ill do it! Now I am confused. the test said i was intj and well i looked at intj for a while and then looked at the intp traits and discover that I possess traits of both! For example i dont smile that much and i am shy unless around close friends. I love learning, and i dont think learning things i already know is useful. I do very well academically, and read on a college scale (1306 on the lexile scale). I know that i don't have to study for any test and I will do between an a or a b grade on it. i show emotions when I bottle them up (like i always do) and they explode in childish outbursts, and i am easily offended by bullies doing what they do. At my school I am labeled "ABNORMAL". (I do have bipolar and adhd so that might be a problem.) I am organized when i want to be but not obsessive about it, i love technology so thats probably why i am on the computer 24/7, i love things like computer programming to. can you tell me why i am a mixture of both?

thanks,

james
 

Ogion

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Hi and welcome to the forum.
Well, the thinks you described come from the INT-traits. The J or P changes some things itnernally (has deeper theoretical roots) but just for beginners sake:
P - This one is (very) spontaneous, is not very keen on order(neatness) and planning.
J - This one is very dedicated to rules and planning. Determined.

This is sort of the biggest difference. But i'd advise you to read more about it, and then to read the profiles, and perhaps do some more (different) tests.

(Perhaps Decaf shows up, he is much better at this ;))

Ogion
 

jamez345

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I am not really spontaneus but i can be organized when i want to be (and it comes naturally.) but I think I am not really organized because I am more worried about learning new stuff on the computer. (And this school year I am a lot better at organizing) I take things from a logical view; if it makes sense I follow it and find possible ways that it could be accomplished. I know basic java coding; not enough to be a master at it but enough to do enough with the launguage. I am amazed at technology and i think that might be why i don't focus on other things as much - i love learning how to use the newest things and how they work. I don't like to conform with the group and say "This is what is and that is absolute" I like to question everything. I love watching scientific shows on the science channel and the discovery channel; I dont know why that is but I just love learning. Around when I was 10 or 11 I Declared that i wanted to get the highest degree in computer programming. I hope that that is enough information. (PS: i Typed the intial question up in like 3 mins so thats probably why it was layed out bad lol.)
 

fullerene

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sounds more P than J to me... but it may have just been the way you wrote it.

What makes you think you're a J, besides the "find[ing] possible ways it could be accomplished"? I wouldn't count "can be organized when I want to be" as a J trait because, frankly, you don't want to be :p
 

jamez345

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I think I am a mixture of both because I love brainstorming ideas to problems. For example a computer came with a case without a hard drive holder. I will find resources at hand to make a hard drive holder simply based on my ideas. i've found that i can keep an argument going for quite a while espcially when its on something i beilve. I take a logical view to everything before anything else. I keep all my emotions behind a brick wall but it all escapes real quick because my bipolar and adhd intensify those emotions. for example one minute i could an emotionless figure and the next i could have my fist in your face. i don't know how this affects my results so thats partly why im confused. Oh and I found that i find more negatives than postives in a person and i love sharing all my information; making others percive me as a show off and a nerd. I am not social at all; if i go to someones door that i dont know to ask them for example if i want to mow there lawn; I suddenly freak out and say i need help and get someone like my dad to help me.

(PS: I've read like 20 webpages on the subject; they had the same information so I think i know what each personality means)
 

Decaf

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Ask yourself this question...

When you have learned how to do something and realize that you could be great if you spent the time fine tuning what you already know, how do you feel?

The INTJ feels energized because this is an opportunity to achieve or to become something. They now have the opportunity to apply what they've learned, which was the whole point, wasn't it?
The INTP feels dread because the thing that was so interesting moments before has become a chore that they believe they're supposed to finish despite their sudden lack of interest. After all, isn't their time better suited learning something they don't know then going back over something they do?


When I was introduced to the test I tested as INTJ. I believed I was one for a long time, seeing INTPs are slobs, where I as committed to improving myself. It was only much later did I realize that being a slob is a choice. It just so happens to be a more tempting choice to INTPs than to INTJs. Despite testing as INTJ several times, I now believe I am 100% INTP and always have been.
 

jamez345

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good point. the intp fits me pretty good but i also want to learn it to succed in this world so now i am confused. (PS: my adhd kinda attributes to my short attention span; google adhd you will see what i am saying.) on medication for adhd I am able to concetrate and get that task done. i do get it done i just do what i was learning for a while do some other stuff of a while and come back to it (but this is in the afternoon when my medication has worn off.) I feel that my bipolar and adhd contribute a lot to my personality. could you please explain more?
 

Devercia

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P - This one is (very) spontaneous, is not very keen on order(neatness) and planning.
J - This one is very dedicated to rules and planning. Determined.

Ogion

Be careful here about planning. Both can lack planning or be very good at it. I find that there are mature and immature manifestations of both.

An immature P will not make a plan until the last minute. An immature J will act before creating a plan. A mature P will make a great multitude of plans and eleminate them as time goes on and obstacles present themselves before choosing one; action taken to enact those plans will be that which is needed by the most plans as a priority before dedication is made to a single plan. A mature J will pick a plan and adjust it as obstacles come into view.
 

Decaf

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I know very little about how psychoactive medication affects how someone thinks, so I'll just say this: Many in the type community believe that ADHD and several other "disorders" are a misunderstanding of the human psyche, fixing problems that wouldn't exist if people were able to find acceptance for the things that come naturally to them.

I believe that I would have been medicated as a child for a number of things (ADHD is possible, Aspergers is likely, Depression is almost definite). I was never medicated and am now thankful for that. I believe that my growth would have been stunted had I not come to terms with the reasons why I behaved that way and made myself so miserable. I don't take aspirin for a headache because the headache is there for a reason and as long as it stays I am motivated to discover why. Others believe differently and that is their right.

I believe what I've said, but don't take my anecdotal evidence to heart without a stronger brand of proof to back it up. That I don't have, but others might.

____

I will say that some people have real disorders that may really need medication of some sort, but I don't believe they represent a large fraction of the people being medicated.
 

jamez345

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so your saying that adhd and bipolar medication are just treating a personailty? I started saying that too when I read about the intj and intp type chariteristics. Oh and Lots of people say that i talk like i just came out of college especially my grandma and other family members.

(PS: I am right handed and that means I am left brain dominate. here is a quote:
@Ogion
Right brain orientation is based on the generalities of here and now, and all that correlates with things outside of the past or future tense. Left focuses on the future and the past, on detail, and on planning.
I have deduced the following traits in a left/right brain algorithm as such:
Left brain: Si, Ni, Fe, Te
Right brain: Se, Ne, Fi, Ti

http://www.news.com.au/perthnow/story/0,21598,22492511-5005375,00.html
I have yet to see it anyway other than clockwise.

Anyways, despite this, I am indeed right handed.
)
 

Devercia

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IT is a common opinion here. The nature of an intp or even and intj is so rare that it is a cultural abnormality, but cognitively speaking, completely normal. With a good deal of introspection many INTPs attest to realizing that their socially defined weakness were just side effects of their nature, ones that a glaringly obvious to a society that largely ignores the side effects of its own personality.

It makes you wonder why there is a pill for social anxiety and not one for stupidity.
 

Decaf

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I think at some point people are going to have to admit that some students can't concentrate in school because its BORING. Because they're not interested in what's being taught and aren't motivated by things like "civic duty". I can't concentrate on the work I'm supposed to be doing right now. The difference between me now and me as a kid, is that now I know enough to say that I hate THIS stuff, not learning or stretching in general. Its terribly uninteresting and I don't need to be medicated to get through it. I just need to do something else instead. We need to stop making "good little workers" out of our kids if we want them to be happy.

I remember in school taking history class and despising it. I didn't know then, but I know why now. I have a very strong urge to find the truth of something, and history class was full of propaganda, the enemy of truth. I couldn't have defined it that way back then, but I can now and I weep for the millions of children undergoing the same dreadful process.

OK, so I'm on a soapbox, but I challenge anyone talking about the shortcomings of their education to not be as passionate.

____

But lets take this thing for what it is. Who says you have ADHD? Why do they believe it? Do you believe them?

(I apologize if its not something you want to discuss on a public forum)
 

Devercia

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Oh Im with you Little De (I'm sorry.) My major is education and I realized a few years ago just how many SJs own the the school system and the 'right way' of teaching. History is one of amy interestes and its entirely possible to teach it without just stateing 'this is how it happened.'

My Eastern Civ teacher is an S, His lectures are quoted "This kingdom you've never heard of was ruled by this king you've never heard of from random date to random date. It occupeid the region of somewhere from these cities you've never heard of that are of a name in a language that might aswell be as immemorable as random digits. Oh, it'll be on the test. Sorry I don't have a map."
 

Jesin

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Welcome to the forum. From what you've posted here so far, I'm pretty sure you're INTP, not INTJ.

By the way, that whole right-brain/left-brain thing has been shown to be mostly BS.

Also, *applauds Decaf*.
 

Decaf

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Oh yeah, as a final note... now that I'm out of school for the most part, I love history. I've spent hundreds of dollars on resources in various forms to learn more about it. What you're "learning" in the public school classroom (and many private schools) is not history. Its "Tall Tales with Uncle Nationalism". Woodrow Wilson was a racist bastard. I can barely believe I was taught that he was a national hero.

By the way, that whole right-brain/left-brain thing has been shown to be mostly BS.

Its remarkable how long it takes for ideas like this to work their way out of the public consciousness.

@Devercia... when are you gonna get around to introducing yourself. I'd like to put some details to the name when I'm getting teased for my relative lack of verbal creativity :p
 

Devercia

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And give you the chance to have a comeback? Your beginning to sound like an extravert, with your precious introductions and whatnot. :P

lack of creativity...are you speaking about the wordsmiffy thing? I'm actually kinda lost. Actually thats the main reason I havn't done the introit thing. I need a catchy thread name. OH! I have the perfect one.
 

loveofreason

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I'm going against the flow - you sound INTJ to me. :D

Welcome, whatever and whoever you may be.
 

Kidege

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Hey James, welcome to the forum.

Woodrow Wilson was a racist bastard. I can barely believe I was taught that he was a national hero.

:eek: I'm shocked. Didn't know he was a hero over there (but probably should have expected it)

Speaking of history, I was lucky enough to read some good historic tales/comic books when I was a kid. Then I went to school and I had to deal with the date- boring fact-date stuff. And then I had a teacher who didn't spout dates and made gigantic flow charts and wacky maps. It was nice to finally see how some events interconnect. That's what I like of history.
 

Decaf

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:eek: I'm shocked. Didn't know he was a hero over there (but probably should have expected it)

He's not. His name was picked from among a bucket of mediocre famous people to be called heroes in the version of the history text book I was given in public school. The whole point is that they're trying to convince us that things that have to do with America (i.e. founding fathers, in/famous presidents, lost explorers) are more important simply because they were connected to "Our Great Country".

I'm sure other text books chose different people to be their "heroes", but they would never suggest that a president was anything but a great man unless the scandals associated with him might be construed to call them "unAmerican".

Nationalism is a plague used by insecure governments who justify the means with which they accrue power by the ends they hope will result. Nationalism is a symptom of propaganda, evidenced by both the American populace and the Chinese. The happiest, most "patriotic" individuals are often the most misinformed, and often by the people they are patriotic to.

Sorry to derail the conversation :o
 

sagewolf

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heheh. Sorry James (and welcome to the forum!) but we may have lost interest in you. We're tend to do this... perhaps a thread split is in order? For my part, I'd say you sound like an INTP, and I highly agree with the notion that ADHD is made up. Apparently I have it too. We were too poor to medicate me, though... never thought I'd wind up glad we were poor. :rolleyes: I just like to think about other things than whatever the teacher's telling me, or I like to think of it for myself.

@Decaf: There's a quote by someone-or-other that says, "Patriotism is the conviction that my country is the greatest in the world because I was born in it." So nationalism is apparently an extremely advanced form of narcissism, according to him. :D I agree that it's a bit idiotic; I've lived in three countries in the space of my 18 years, though, so I don't really feel like I have a connection to, or a reason to be proud of, any of them. I think I'm lucky because of that; I'm not expected by anyone to be 'patriotic'.

The whole point is that they're trying to convince us that things that have to do with America (i.e. founding fathers, in/famous presidents, lost explorers) are more important simply because they were connected to "Our Great Country".

At least things actually happened in your 'great country'. In the Irish module of the history course I had to do for Junior Cert, we learned about the establishment of the national television/radio networks. Because f--all happened in Ireland in the 20th century, but we had to learn about it, because it was IRISH. WWII hardly even happened, for crying out loud. What a boring country...
 

EloquentBohemian

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First, a hearty welcome to James and how sporting of you to let us hijack your thread.;):D

I've lived in three countries in the space of my 18 years, though, so I don't really feel like I have a connection to, or a reason to be proud of, any of them.
I was raised in the U.S. for the first 14 years of life and then we moved to Canada. (Dad was American, Mom was Canadian)
From what I remember, history in school in the States was mostly about the States and their involvement in the history of other countries.
When I went ot school in Canada, I learned that their were Canadians in WWI and WWII and that there were important roles in which they played Vimy Ridge being one). I also learned about the French Resistance in Europe during the Wars. I don't remember this in American History class.

I don't really have a connection to either country, even though I am born Canadian (the benefits of parents living in a border town) and live here now.
Our flag is a leaf. A leaf!
Our national animal, a beaver! A beaver!!:o
Not some proud ferocious animal which could suggest power and fortitude. No!
A flat-tailed rodent with over-grown incisors whose life consists entirely of gnawing down trees and building dams.
*face-plant on desk*
*sigh*
And our money. The most utilised coin in Canada is nick-named the Loonie.
*another face-plant*


...and don't get me started on the RCMP who wear red coats so that they make excellent targets in the bush!:rolleyes:
 

Ogion

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You know, i actually find that more positive than a nation which has some predator as 'national animal'.
I thought of your list as a positive-list. ;)

Me i do not really 'identify' with my country of birth. I mean, of course a lot of my identity has something to do with germany (being my land of birth and growing-up), so to say i had nothing in common or in relation withit would be self-delusional. But i don't base my identity on it. Also i am neither 'proud' of 'my' country nor am i a patriot, because i am rather 'loyal' to all of humankind (or even mroe to every single human).

Ogion
 

EloquentBohemian

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You know, i actually find that more positive than a nation which has some predator as 'national animal'.
I thought of your list as a positive-list. ;)
True, we are not known for tromping around the world showing off our muscle, but we have a great Coast Guard.
Our politics are rather 'ho-hum'. Even the BQ has become rather mainstream.
I supposed, comical irony aside, a beaver is more prey than predator, but I suppose it's better than moose.
I can hear the Bullwinkle jokes from here.
"Hey Rocky, watch me pull a NAFTA agreement outa my hat."
 

severus

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James: I welcome you and happily pass on the title of Youngest Member of the Forum.
At least, I think you're the youngest now. I've rather lost track what with all these new members in recent weeks.
 

Jesin

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James: I welcome you and happily pass on the title of Youngest Member of the Forum.
At least, I think you're the youngest now. I've rather lost track what with all these new members in recent weeks.

Yes, I think he's the youngest now, but are you sure you even held the title?
 

severus

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Yes I most certainly did. I only just turned 15 a month ago.
 

Decaf

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Yes I most certainly did. I only just turned 15 a month ago.

This forum is depressing sometimes. I feel like at 27 I should be further along than I am if this is what 15 looks like.
 

Chimera

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James: I welcome you and happily pass on the title of Youngest Member of the Forum.
At least, I think you're the youngest now. I've rather lost track what with all these new members in recent weeks.

_________
____________

*whiny voice*
But but but...I'm 14 too!
My birthday is in March!

@Decaf --
Yeah, this forum is pretty depressing. . .I mean, I see all you INTPs older than I am, and I can't help but think "This is what I have to look forward to?"

@James --
Hey, nice to meet another kid on this site.
By the way, don't be intimidated by the old people. They're smart, but they're just as scatterbrained as we are. Not to mention they have the advantage of being able to make their babble sound highly intelligent.
:rolleyes:
____________
_________
 

EloquentBohemian

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This forum is depressing sometimes. I feel like at 27 I should be further along than I am if this is what 15 looks like.
You think you've got catching up to do?
Think of how it looks from 56.:eek:
I'm still trying to figure out how they get all those little tiny people and stuff in my t.v. set.;)
 

Ogion

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Not to speak of all the strange people with funny nicknames in 'online forums'... :p

But this is one thing i found to be very interesting, that we have many generations together, but i mostly coudn't tell from the posts who was which age...

Ogion
 

EloquentBohemian

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Age is something that really doesn't matter unless you happen to be cheese.:D
 

anemian

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I like online games... when I was 17 I was told to babysit a 32 year old before. Everyone thought I was 20 something at least and he pretty young until the infamous asl question came up.
 

severus

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@Chimera: fine then. When I first joined They told me I was youngest, so blame Them.
 

Jesin

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@Chimera: fine then. When I first joined They told me I was youngest, so blame Them.

I think you were the youngest active member on the site at the time. Chimera had faded into nonexistence for a while.
 

severus

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Ah, that would explain it.
 

Artifice Orisit

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You think you've got catching up to do?
Think of how it looks from 56.:eek:
I'm still trying to figure out how they get all those little tiny people and stuff in my t.v. set.;)

Wow, so what was the past like? (I'm 18, thus a self realised world noob)
 

EloquentBohemian

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Wow, so what was the past like? (I'm 18, thus a self realised world noob)

Well, after my dad had slain all the dinosaurs and invented the wheel... :rolleyes::D


What would you like to know?
"The past" is a rather large subject area.
The 60's perhaps? (...of course, there will be drug-induced gaps in that time period;))
Ask me some specific questions.
 

sagewolf

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But this is one thing i found to be very interesting, that we have many generations together, but I mostly coudn't tell from the posts who was which age...

You find that on fictionpress too. A couple of times I've been blown away by someone's writing and they're actually younger than me. I'm not even in college. And there's this 16-year old making me doubt my writing ability like real artists make me want to stab out my eyes with my own pencil. Then the next minute I find out someone who's studying English seriously in college has the same experience reading my work. It's mind-boggling. O_o

My mom mentions the fashion sense of the 70s and 80s with some horror every now and then. Let's hear about that. Should be funny. And forewarn us. (The Wispa is back; the rest of that decade may not be far behind...)
 

Saibine1234

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Hi, I'm Bipolar and try not to think about what MBTI I am anymore. I've tested as a lot of things, but overall, the personality that keeps appearing most frequently is INTP. Keep in mind, bipolar disorder is a mood disorder, this means that you can virtually be a new person every time you become manic. You can go from completely articulate to completely drained. Trust me, I've been there.

One thing that I really think that most people understand about INTPs is that we are not innately against organization and planning, we just prefer to do it on our own terms, when we see it as most beneficial for us. INTPs HATE feeling trapped by other people's rules, because we are logical enough to understand that most rules aren't worth following. In this sense we are sort of anarchic in our behavior. We are outwardly chaotic, but inside our mind we have created a system of rules that works for us.

I really think that perhaps it is this conflict that you dealing with when you say that you are an INTP/J.
 

Calamedes

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Though the INTP/J battle is understandable, it's a good one to deal with. On one hand, you get stuff done and you're alright with rules/ plans. On the other, you're totally content with letting thoughts be thoughts and you're not bothered by not trying to put everything into a tangible function.

best of both worlds?
 

INTJEVAN

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you could still be too young for your trait to be fully developed. Possibly a few years from now it will be clear which type you are :)
 
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