INTP or INTJ?

[Prion]

I can't tell if I'm an INTP or an INTJ. Whenever I take personality tests, I always get different answers each time I take it, and the preference for P or J is often extremely low, sometimes at 1%.

I think it's mostly due to the fact that I find most of the questions regarding J or P to be nonspecific. For example, when it asks if I plan my actions ahead of time, what is the length of time?...perhaps this confusion is simply due to the fact that I don't really have a preference for J or P.

Can anyone offer more specific questions than most personality tests seem to ask?

 

[Cherry Cola]

INTJs and INTPs have no functions in common. Look at functions. Ask questions yourself.

 

[TBerg]

Here is where you can find the best descriptions of the psychological functions: http://psychclassics.yorku.ca/Jung/types.htm

Learn it well!

 

[TheManBeyond]

Tests are like choosing between different pokemon types without knowing the context in which the pokemons display their best. Water vs Electric ok, that's fair, but what happens if you are playing against Quaqsire? he is on level 100. You haven't learned thunderbolt yet.
You're blind and thus fucked. Have you ever considered to emphathise with moles and larvs?

 

[Prion]

You mean the 8 functions?

I looked at those. I have two that are correlated with INTP, and two that are correlated with INTJ .

 

[Black Rose]

You mean the 8 functions?

I looked at those. I have two that are correlated with INTP, and two that are correlated with INTJ .

in what order?

You can use the transcendental function and master all 8 functions.

Individuation

 

[Reluctantly]

I'm curious what you think:

In your thinking and approach with people are you naturally inclined to perceive and then judge them?
OR
to judge and then perceive them?

I know that I like to perceive people first and judge them later, often being at odds with those that judge or label people quickly and then later like to perceive how their judgments affected those people. This bothers me a little because I think they like to stir up shit in order to creatively see what happens from it and manipulate the resulting chaos; it's quite...disharmonious, creates intentional misunderstandings, and seems to create new problems to take place of the problems it's supposed to get rid of.

but anyway,

 

[TBerg]

in what order?

You can use the transcendental function and master all 8 functions.

Individuation

That might be misleading, because you cannot give up your ego. It got you this far, but you can get even farther by understanding what it vetos. It might veto a nice treasure, and you might want to have it dig up that treasure instead of burying it. But the ego will continue to use the same basic tools.

 

[Black Rose]

ego isn't so bad but it grows or withers from the qualities of attachments, must find refuge in that which is not impermanent but ever flowing.

"train yourself to let go of everything you fear to loose"- Yoda

"We thought of life by analogy with a journey, a pilgrimage, which had a serious purpose at the end, and the thing was to get to that end, success or whatever it is, maybe heaven after you’re dead. But we missed the point the whole way along. It was a musical thing and you were supposed to sing or to dance while the music was being played." - Alan Watts

 

[Trebuchet]

My husband and I (one of each) have found one obvious difference, which is how we approach planning a project. Neither way is easier. We are both about equally successful at completing tasks in the same amount of time, and with the same outcomes. It is more a matter of assumptions and ways of thinking.

He (INTJ) likes to have a list of all the steps necessary to complete the project, in order, that he can check off. When they are all checked off, the project is done.

I (INTP) prefer to have a list of all the project requirements. When they are all checked off, the project is done.

For example, we bought a new bookcase, which needed assembly. Here is how we would each make our lists:

INTJ:
Go to furniture store that we know carries the right kind of furniture
Select bookcase based on storage needs, color preference, and price (See separate list for reference while shopping)
Buy bookcase without delivery option
Compare truck prices and availability by calling Ryder and U-Haul
Rent truck based on price and availability
Pick up bookcase with truck
Return truck
Buy earthquake strap
Get out screwdriver, hammer, measuring tape, studfinder, drill, drill bits
Assemble bookcase according to included instructions
Find stud in wall behind bookcase
Drill pilot hole in stud for earthquake strap
Attach bookcase to wall with earthquake strap
Put away tools

INTP:
Any bookcase with at least 4 shelves and some closing doors at the bottom will be fine.

U-Haul is open until 5, so the bookcase needs to be picked up and dropped at home before then, so the truck can be returned the same day. Best to leave by 2 PM.

Once the bookcase is assembled, install the earthquake strap.


So the INTJ assumes very little, but all the details were considered up front (including contingency plans!) and it is all correct at the end. Nothing is left out, and even if something goes wrong, it is easy to see what step you are on at any point and what remains to be done.

The INTP assumes a lot of defaults, like the bookcase will need to be assembled, so there is no need to specify that as another step. Also, I like defaults, so I always rent from U-Haul, and Ryder is my backup plan. I already researched them both last time and see no need to do it again. "Use an earthquake strap" obviously includes buying one and finding a stud in the wall, so I think of that as one step.


Unfortunately, when I unpacked the bookcase, it had two right sides and no left side, so I had to return it and neither plan would have worked. My plan then had to include "talk to the condescending guy at the furniture store who thinks I'm just too stupid to follow instructions."

Of course, after a few years of marriage, I can make the INTJ's list well enough to create this example, even if I am probably exaggerating or missing things that he wouldn't.

 

[Prion]

I'm curious what you think:

In your thinking and approach with people are you naturally inclined to perceive and then judge them?
OR
to judge and then perceive them?

I know that I like to perceive people first and judge them later, often being at odds with those that judge or label people quickly and then later like to perceive how their judgments affected those people. This bothers me a little because I think they like to stir up shit in order to creatively see what happens from it and manipulate the resulting chaos; it's quite...disharmonious, creates intentional misunderstandings, and seems to create new problems to take place of the problems it's supposed to get rid of.

but anyway,

I usually judge them first, often quite harshly. I then determine if my judgements are valid and eventually objectively perceive them a little more.

 

[Prion]

My husband and I (one of each) have found one obvious difference, which is how we approach planning a project. Neither way is easier. We are both about equally successful at completing tasks in the same amount of time, and with the same outcomes. It is more a matter of assumptions and ways of thinking.

He (INTJ) likes to have a list of all the steps necessary to complete the project, in order, that he can check off. When they are all checked off, the project is done.

I (INTP) prefer to have a list of all the project requirements. When they are all checked off, the project is done.

For example, we bought a new bookcase, which needed assembly. Here is how we would each make our lists:

INTJ:
Go to furniture store that we know carries the right kind of furniture
Select bookcase based on storage needs, color preference, and price (See separate list for reference while shopping)
Buy bookcase without delivery option
Compare truck prices and availability by calling Ryder and U-Haul
Rent truck based on price and availability
Pick up bookcase with truck
Return truck
Buy earthquake strap
Get out screwdriver, hammer, measuring tape, studfinder, drill, drill bits
Assemble bookcase according to included instructions
Find stud in wall behind bookcase
Drill pilot hole in stud for earthquake strap
Attach bookcase to wall with earthquake strap
Put away tools

INTP:
Any bookcase with at least 4 shelves and some closing doors at the bottom will be fine.

U-Haul is open until 5, so the bookcase needs to be picked up and dropped at home before then, so the truck can be returned the same day. Best to leave by 2 PM.

Once the bookcase is assembled, install the earthquake strap.


So the INTJ assumes very little, but all the details were considered up front (including contingency plans!) and it is all correct at the end. Nothing is left out, and even if something goes wrong, it is easy to see what step you are on at any point and what remains to be done.

The INTP assumes a lot of defaults, like the bookcase will need to be assembled, so there is no need to specify that as another step. Also, I like defaults, so I always rent from U-Haul, and Ryder is my backup plan. I already researched them both last time and see no need to do it again. "Use an earthquake strap" obviously includes buying one and finding a stud in the wall, so I think of that as one step.


Unfortunately, when I unpacked the bookcase, it had two right sides and no left side, so I had to return it and neither plan would have worked. My plan then had to include "talk to the condescending guy at the furniture store who thinks I'm just too stupid to follow instructions."

Of course, after a few years of marriage, I can make the INTJ's list well enough to create this example, even if I am probably exaggerating or missing things that he wouldn't.

It depends on the circumstance. If I wanted to make a bookcase myself, and it didn't already come with directions, writing them would be pointless and time consuming.

However if the bookcase came with instructions or say, someone wanted me to make them a bookcase, I would definitely use instructions so I wouldn't screw it up.

Also, instructions are actually requirements...just very specific requirements .

While it's harder, I think I would enjoy not using instructions more though. That way it would be like a puzzle, and I would've truly put it together myself.

 

[Prion]

I just realized I actually get really anxious when I don't have a plan, especially if it has to do with an action that isn't easy to take back.

I assume this isn't characteristic of an INTP?

 

[Ex-User (9062)]

Hello,
i'm practically in the same boat as you.
Down to the 1% discrepancy.

Concerning planning,
everything out of my ordinary routine has to be laid out step-by-step,
all eventualities and plan B strategies have to be taken into consideration.
I'd like to be more spontaneous, but i get overwhelmed by factors i did not preconceive pretty fast, so i fall back on planning ahead, after being somewhat disappointed with myself for experiencing these episodes of failure.

 

[Reluctantly]

I usually judge them first, often quite harshly. I then determine if my judgements are valid and eventually objectively perceive them a little more.

That probably makes you INTJ then from the way MBTI approaches things. Though this is just a suggestion. I don't really know anything about you and I'm kind of just bored, lol.

 

[TheManBeyond]

Well find out if Te-Fi or Ti-Fe
An INTJ will have strong opinions.
An INTP will be a bit more open to suggestions.
From what I've read ISTJ is also an option.

 

[Reluctantly]

^ Ehhh, maybe, but judging from this forum, INTPs often have strong opinions too. Though maybe someone would like to argue that most here aren't really INTP; I don't know.

 

[nexion]

(including contingency plans!)

Contingencies, contingencies, contingencies. I find that before I even begin to act, I prefer to know probable evolutions in process and the actions I would take in any given conditional branch. This usually yields an in-depth knowledge of the dynamics of a system and the ability to operate within its contexts. It is much more difficult for me to work with a bunch of unknown variables, I at least like to have some idea of what's going on. If the system happens to shift in ways that are entirely unlike anything that was planned for, anxiety or panic could set in. Even still, I think that I can work decently within a rapidly changing system, so long as it is not too unpredictable. No plan is immutable; you get new information and adapt. The contingencies are designed to make on-the-fly adaptation irrelevant, you already know the probable ways in which an event will unfold and the rest is merely clockwork.

 

[Reluctantly]

...
The contingencies are designed to make on-the-fly adaptation irrelevant, you already know the probable ways in which an event will unfold and the rest is merely clockwork.

It's interesting that you say that because I've always preferred contingencies that allow me to make on-the-fly adaptation. Or maybe that's maximizing utility. But either way, after being in the Army for while now, I feel like I want to lose my mind when I realize we put more effort into contingency planning than we do in our actual jobs.

 

[Ex-User (8886)]

You should look at 3th and 4th functions. What better fits to you: Si-Fe or Se-Fi ? It helped me found that I'm INTP.

 

[Pizzabeak]

More like Si-Fe or Fi-Se

 

[Basilisk]

Who cares