Do people deserve salvation?

[fractalwalrus]

Ngl, I got a new perspective on what the folks of the world are listening to nowadays. Reality TV shows about people whining over their petty desires and how various houses fail to fulfill their insignificant desires. A bunch of people who lack self-control, and more specifically, suppression of desires. If that's what most of us are destined to become, then, quite frankly, fuck us. Why should I ponder how people should have it better if all they are capable of doing is bitching about their lack of certain material comforts instead of debating philosophy or bigger picture things? Maybe we should stop even attempting to educate them or discuss politics/philosophy with them because it is a waste of time/energy? Maybe, just maybe, it doesn't matter. They'll never learn, because, they are simply incapable. They'll tear down the people that would try to help them, because they would not be able to understand those individuals or ascertain their motives. Fuck it all.

 

[fluffy]

A standard of basic living is attainable but we must not forget that life has questions in it that cannot be answered without some form of hardship. Eventually people ask what life is supposed to be about but that comes after they realize what they are doing is mondaine. They should at least be given a chance to come to that realization. To move in the right direction. Nothing is satisfying untill we realize we want to be unsatisfied. Friends can be a source of life purpose not just material goods. But some things I do want that requires better education. I am going to get in touch with a university person soon and show them my math paper.

 

[Cognisant]

We don't need more politics/philosophy, we need people to get back to reality.

Hard times create strong men.
Strong men create good times.
Good times create weak men.
Weak men create hard times.

It's not the literal strength of men that matters, nor is this exclusively about men, rather it's about working hard and being productive and the problem there isn't that people aren't working, rather that their work has become disconnected from what actually matters.

The foundation of every economy is primary industry, if you're a hunter/gatherer your primary industries are hunting and gathering because that's how you acquire the resources you need to live. When you have those resources you can afford to reallocate some of your time to other pursuits, such as crafting tools, weapons, clothing, building shelter, gathering wood for a fire. These secondary industries support the primary industries, hunting is a lot easier when you can set traps or kill an animal with a sling rather than having to chase it down. Having a hut to sleep in and a fireplace lets you cook your food, shelter from the rain, stay warm during the night, all things which will have you better prepared to hunt and gather the next day.

It's a feedback loop of productivity enabling greater productivity.
Strong men create good times.

But then there's clever people who find ways to exploit other people, and it happens more or less the same way every time, this bureaucratic/aristocratic class establish themselves as the asset owners (capturing the means of production) thereby setting themselves up as middlemen, tax collectors, landlords, who get in the way of the people who are actually trying to be productive.
Good times create weak men.
This bureaucratic/aristocratic class of asset owners then goes after primary industries like farming because they don't gain wealth from productivity, their wealth comes from manufacturing scarcity, why sell ten loafs of bread for 1 dollar profit each when you can sell one loaf for 10 dollar profit and nobody can compete with you because you're the only licensed baker in town who has a supply contract with the only mill in the region.
Weak men create hard times.
We don't need philosophers or politicians, we need people to get back to work on primary industries and in order for that to happen we need the bureaucratic/aristocratic class to get out of the way and stop making everything worse.

The housing crisis in Australia has been entirely manufactured by a bureaucratic/aristocratic class of asset owners who are blatantly abusing their political positions to enrich themselves at the detriment of the nation.

The housing crisis is their fault, the cost of living crisis is their fault (Queensland, a net energy exporter, has some of the highest power prices in the world) real wages stagnating is their fault, they know EXACTLY what they're doing.

Edit: @Hadoblado can we please turn off iMath, has anyone ever used it? Far from being useful it only seems to get in the way of discussions about math/economics as it fucks up any text alongside a dollar or percentage sign.

 

[EndogenousRebel]

Excommunication was a formal thing in societies. Being banished and such.

Now with the internet (long distance comms) that's pretty much impossible. We are all apart of networks that are parts of larger networks.

Even in jail you could in theory make international calls and organize resources and such. Think about someone who isn't bound to a cell and can move about freely due to their affluence.

The end result is that the synapses you have are being co-opted by AI algorithms that essentially function on 'pay to win' logic.

There are measures you can take to minimize this. "Media hygiene" is just another tool that humanity will have master and hopefully never suffer from again.

People are very concerned with AI, but so long as computers don't start putting on people's skin it shouldn't be an issue. This is assuming we have it in us to adapt this 'media hygiene' and feasibly have offspring.

For 95% of history when disagreements happened, and you got a paper cut, you were pretty much marked for death. Appendicitis, 1/1000, just dead, forget about it. This is a very different time where we can actually use our wit, what our brain was created to do, socialize with other human beings. Who promised that would be easy?

Indeed, what I'm not so sure of, is if it was ever an easy thing to navigate social relationships in the first place?

Oscar Wild playwrights usually carried with it themes of the social expectations of per-modern aristocratic culture. Then, even the slightest deviation from certain "norms" would be potentially seen as disastrous for an individuals or a whole family sect's status within the culture.

I think that this is because, if you suffer a loss of social capital, you may actual put yourself and people who depend on you in legitimate peril. Scarcity, as we see it today, would be a lot more common then, and would definitely deter people from being "open-minded" about being altruistic and "liberal".

SOOOOO, I guess what I would say is, if we do not have a certain "criteria" for why we would engage in such conversation at all, then you stop for some... personal? reason, then you are not being guided by reason, you are being guided by emotions.

It's why I keep bringing this up, PRINCIPLES of what we do, how, why, when, where, is what separates us from acting to achieve a higher purpose, vs being governed by our fears or anger, or apathy, or joy. Of which prioritizations of any of these emotions, will surely end in regret.