63 Genders

[Anthile]

http://www.apath.org/rede/23.html


Where do you see yourself? Be honest, at least to yourself.

 

[Hawkeye]

I'd probably say number 8. M A F

 

[Wish]

8​

M​

A​

F​

Androgine Heterosexual Man

 

[Hawkeye]

8​

M​

A​

F​

Androgine Heterosexual Man

:O

Apparently it's also known as The Male Lesbian although this makes no sense to me...

 

[Decaf]

Another 8

 

[Hawkeye]

Could this mean that INTP males are 'girly boys'?

 

[Wish]

It most likely means that INTPs in general don't submit to the societal standards of masculinity and femininity. We meet somewhere in the middle, after having taken both sides into account.

EDIT: So according to everyone else: yes

 

[Sparrow]

Androgine Heterosexual Man

 

[Shatokan]

8​

M​

A​

F​

Androgine Heterosexual Man

I'm that ^

 

[BigApplePi]

I don't get it. What does "Androgine" mean? If feel and give affection to my male and female cat and/or dog is that a female personality trait? If I like to hit a baseball is that a masculine trait?

 

[Agent Intellect]

I'm inclined to say 8 as well, but I'm not sure what constitutes a male or female personality (which is mainly why I'm saying 8).

 

[Vrecknidj]

I'd guess I'm a 2. I'm a guy, I have guy parts, I tend to think and act and feel like a guy, and I'm attracted to women. That said, I'm pretty clearly more "in touch" with my "feminine side" than a lot of my male friends. But, I'm not thinking this makes me a 5 or an 8.

I don't quite get it.

Dave

 

[wadlez]

I think the reasons the above chose 8 (MAF) could be due to them thinking or wanting to believe that they are detached and seperate from masculinity or femininity, as INTPS like to be detached from external un-permitted forces so they can be as logical as possible.
Masculinity would be better understood as traits which we developed during our hunter gatherer days which are unique to males. Femininity the same but for females.
Some more masculine traits are assertivness, competitiveness, less sentimentality, sacrifices nurturing and being in tune with relationships for being dominant or logical.
Not fitting the archetype of a dominant male or the social construct of the typical male does not mean you are not primarily masculine.

I am MMF, despite being comparatively more detached from what is expected of males.

 

[Decaf]

I'm inclined to say 8 as well, but I'm not sure what constitutes a male or female personality (which is mainly why I'm saying 8).

That seems to be precisely the problem. Masculine and feminine as associated to male and female are harmful misnomers. There's simply no such thing as a male or female personality.

I think the reasons the above chose 8 (MAF) could be due to them thinking or wanting to believe that they are detached and seperate from masculinity or femininity, as INTPS like to be detached from external un-permitted forces so they can be as logical as possible.

That rests on a number of assumptions, not the least of which is that those professing their "8-ness" haven't thought about it a great deal. I think there is a temptation to believe this, but by ignoring it you're reppressing a part of your personality. That detachment that you feel isn't necessarily the cause of your androgyny, but rather the result of not accepting it.

Its just a thought, but it rings true for me.

 

[wadlez]

That seems to be precisely the problem. Masculine and feminine as associated to male and female are harmful misnomers.

I disagree, there are characteristics of brains wired to be males and females, the contrasting idiosyncrasies due to this wiring is masculinity and femininity (as understood in psychology).

That rests on a number of assumptions, not the least of which is that those professing their "8-ness" have thought about this less than you

I chose my words cafefully and said "could be due" for this case. But from the number of people choosing 8 and people stating they do not understand what is meant by masculine and feminine I thought it would most likely be for the reasons I stated.

 

[Decaf]

I disagree, there are characteristics of brains wired to be males and females, the contrasting idiosyncrasies due to this wiring is masculinity and femininity (as understood in psychology).

I agree that there are some differences in wiring, but the implications of those differences are, at best, vaguely understood. Attributing behavior to the characteristic is a function of convention, not scientific research. They've shown corrolations that suggest women are better at multitasking, and that testosterone makes a person more aggressive, but that's a far cry from the specifics we learn growing up in our culture.

Since we're bringing in popular perspectives from psychology, how about some reading material.

Masculinity
Feminity
Androgyny

An androgyne is a person who does not fit cleanly into the typical masculine and feminine gender roles of their society.

I chose my words cafefully and said "could be due" for this case. But from the number of people choosing 8 and people stating they do not understand what is meant by masculine and feminine I thought it would most likely be for the reasons I stated.

Actually, I apologize for the wording. I changed it shortly after posting, but I notice you caught the first version. It was needlessly aggressive. I think your suggestion was merited as presented.

 

[Fedayeen]

I don't know what I am personality wise.

I am physically male, and attracted to women.

I am unsure of what exactly Male/Female pursuits and interests would be.

 

[Adymus]

This is such an unnecessary system of social grouping...


But I'm an 8.

 

[Cavallier]

Social scientists Deborah David and Robert Brannon (1976) give the following four rules for establishing masculinity:

1. No Sissy Stuff: anything that even remotely hints of femininity is prohibited. A real man must avoid any behavior or characteristic associated with women;
2. Be a Big Wheel: masculinity is measured by success, power, and the admiration of others. One must possess wealth, fame, and status to be considered manly;
3. Be a Sturdy Oak: manliness requires rationality, toughness, and self-reliance. A man must remain calm in any situation, show no emotion, and admit no weakness;
4. Give 'em Hell: men must exude an aura of daring and aggression, and must be willing to take risks, to "go for it" even when reason and fear suggest otherwise.

(Levine, 1998, p.145)

3 and 4 fit me. I've been known for having a strong "Give 'em Hell" streak. I've also been described as exhibiting the "Sturdy Oak" quality from time to time.

Traits that are traditionally considered feminine may be categorized into biologically-based physical differences (such as narrower faces and shoulders, larger breasts, wider hips in relation to body size, less body hair, warmer skin, larger amounts of body fat, longer legs, shorter waists, better sense of smell, etc.); psychological and behavioral differences (such as a concern for relationships, empathy, sympathy, better verbal skills), which result from an interaction between biology and social environment; and purely social differences (such as ornamentation of home and person; career choices, and leisure pursuits).

Okay. Well, I've got good verbal skills and I have a concern for relationships though these qualities don't seem all that feminine to me so much as social qualities. I also like to ornament myself and my home though I'd like to argue that I've never known a man in my life that didn't also take some pleasure in ornamenting themselves and their homes.

Also the question of sexual attraction is difficult for me. I have only ever had heterosexual relationships though I'm open to homosexual relationships given the right person. All of the girls I've been attracted to were heterosexual or at least identified themselves that way. I can't say I've ever met an openly gay or bisexual girl I was attracted to but there have been several straight ones. Sadly, I suspect my lack of choice in female partners has more to do with our culture's homosexual and bisexual phobia than my own preferences.

So, given these variables, I think I will say I'm 18. Androgine Bisexual Woman


Why is masculinity defined by it's psychological manifestations but femininity defined by its physical manifestations more then its psychological?

 

[BigApplePi]

This is such an unnecessary system of social grouping...

Yes. There is something about the social grouping that is arbitrary. What is our sexuality? Physical, chemical, brain structure, hormonal, character traits. These are different things. One thing that affects me is my family. My sister was femaie (!) and younger. So I would want to be classified male and be male if only to establish a competitive identity. Now that I'm out of the family this is no longer necessary.

Don't like to be put in that box, but after readling wadlez and Decaf I'd go with MMF = 2. But relative to John Wayne, I'd be 8.

Was Frankenstein a 2 because he was gruff and wanted a mate, but an 8 because he was friendly with those who didn't know he was a monster?

 

[Agent Intellect]

I don't deny that there are general differences in the biology of males and females, but what is seen as masculine and feminine is a societal structure. Women are "supposed" to be more concerned with relationships, yet every guy at my school is on their cell phone talking or texting just as much if not more than the females. Women are "supposed" to be concerned with ornamenting themselves? What does that even mean? What counts as an ornament? All of the guys I see are just as preppy, wearing their expensive abercrombie and fitch, or wearing pants with holes put in them already etc etc.

The most consistent psychological test for gender differences is that men are "supposed" to be successful and women are "supposed" to look young - and even this is only a generality. So, by this standard, my personality is androgynous. I am not motivated by money at all (I would work for free if it was something I enjoyed doing and I didn't have to worry about my financial situation, even if it meant living in a shack with internet connection) nor am I even interested in females that would want me for any sort of success; and I am not good looking by anybodies standards nor am I interested in any female that would like me for my looks.