philosophy of numbers

[sushi]

what do numbers represent and describe

why do we need numbers

can numbers describe anything in the universe, or is the universe made of numbers.

the property of numbers is to count measure and label. is there more to it?

i mean in terms of math and physical world and abstraction, not in terms of spirituality and personality, mysticism

there is the whole idea of mathematical objects and that they can be represented by numbers.

 

[sushi]

how can one number, become a larger number or more numbers in reality , nature, or in math.

isnt that the whole idea of succession numbers?

Predecessor and Successor in Maths (Definition and Examples)

Predecessor and Successor are one less and one more number of the given number, respectively. Find the method to evaluate the successor and predecessor of any natural number, at BYJU’S.

byjus.com

 

[ZenRaiden]

Numbers are just observable phenomena to me. Multiplicity is the name of the game to me. I think you are human, I am human. You aren't like me and I am not like you, but we are humans. We have mostly identical DNA.
This allows us to manipulate multiplicity of world for our benefit.
Humanity used arithmetic first to govern wealth and time.
Over the following millenia we became masters at doing so.
The other use of math was geodetics. Measure of distance for planning agriculture and building houses, walls, and cities and fortification.
Other obvious use was tool making and clothing.
In gathering and hunting math was pretty much limited as you don't actually need to know exactly high numbers and when you find something you simply take it.
However lunar cycles were important, as you could follow various things with it, including weather patters, and migrations.
Generally a number is irrelevant unless you are relating it to some other number.
So every first mathematical operation people do as they are born is more or less or equal.
Then it comes down to numbers when it no longer a matter of more or less and equal, but exactly by how much.

 

[sushi]

Numbers are just observable phenomena to me. Multiplicity is the name of the game to me. I think you are human, I am human. You aren't like me and I am not like you, but we are humans. We have mostly identical DNA.
This allows us to manipulate multiplicity of world for our benefit.
Humanity used arithmetic first to govern wealth and time.
Over the following millenia we became masters at doing so.
The other use of math was geodetics. Measure of distance for planning agriculture and building houses, walls, and cities and fortification.
Other obvious use was tool making and clothing.
In gathering and hunting math was pretty much limited as you don't actually need to know exactly high numbers and when you find something you simply take it.
However lunar cycles were important, as you could follow various things with it, including weather patters, and migrations.
Generally a number is irrelevant unless you are relating it to some other number.
So every first mathematical operation people do as they are born is more or less or equal.
Then it comes down to numbers when it no longer a matter of more or less and equal, but exactly by how much.

i think number serves as constants in a world of randomness

it is also a way to describe information and quantity.

but you cant have like 2+2=5 or any other value, it would break math

what are the building blocks of math, is it just numbers or is there more than that.

 

[dr froyd]

i would say numbers are a way to codify human perception of nature

like if you put one rabbit into a box, and then add another one, you end up with 2 rabbits. Which is correct for all practical purposes, but the rabbit you put in is no longer the same – it's really just a mass of molecules which is relatively stable, to the extent that it remains approximately the same object short-term. But it's also constantly changing, so it doesn't exactly satisfy identity relations like 1 = 1. So in this case 1 + 1 = 2 is a mathematical model you apply to your perception of the world, but it's an approximation of reality.

i haven't studied this topic whatsoever though

 

[ZenRaiden]

but you cant have like 2+2=5 or any other value, it would break math

It would not break math. It would break math.
It would break our cognitive ability to work with numbers.
Every relationship our brain has with reality is based in some awareness principal.
When it comes to numbers we are simply aware of quantity.
We became smart and realized that we can manipulate quantity in respect to other quantity.
Math did not discover quantity. Math simply made it possible to represent values in symbolic form that we can then use to end goals.
Math is simply a game. A game where we play with quantities.
It became a discipline as our skills became more formal and complex.
Realistically chess is also a game. You don't need to know math to play chess.
You can ask all kinds of questions about why chess is the way it is.
Essentially chess is the way it is, because we people decided it will be this way.

You might as well ask where does order of universe come from. Well it is what it is.
That is the way it is, and that is the way we are aware of it.

 

[Hourglass]

Numbers are the language of quantification.

Some are better at it than others.

Some apply it to reality better than others.

Some never learn the language of numbers at all.

Some utilize it to serve a practical purpose.

Some enjoy inspection of the purity of what might be considered logical soundness.

Animals don’t need numbers to the extent that humans do.

Humans rely on numbers whether we realize it or not.

It is easier than using tally marks for basic things and easier than using endless strings of numbers for gargantuan representations of things.

Will numbers ever change? Who knows.

What if someone told you that 0 = 1? It is possible depending on the input and output. Most people don’t understand that though.

 

[Bluehalite]

Numbers can represent levels of wealth when its dollars accumulated.
Numbers count data banks of information, such as Votes, Piles of Money -its exchangess, subtractions or divisions.
They can be what have to spend for a month or a year, or tell you if you need to go gather more to survive, and compare financial statements or measure economics.

Numbers are intellectual things, they don't bite, and are even tempered, they just give you a picture of how things are, how many pieces of pie are left, whether things are increasing or decreasing, and what needs to be done next if you run out. They help you construct a status of how safe you are each day. Is there enough milk, bread, eggs, have I paid the home insurance bill, can I risk $10 to play the lottery, do I need to shop for more.

Yes, there is more to it as well. The Golden Ratio, Fibonacci sequences, Music, Calendar days and events, Sonar, Scientific Waves of all sorts, sound, sonar, frequencies, brain waves, thought, esp, age, steps, building cities, learning, and much more, but thats just what I could free flow thing of. There is much more. Numbers of viruses versus numbers of white blood cells or T cells, wars, peace, votes, weight, height, health measurements, who is rich, who is poor, land that is overpopulated, population counts, etc.

 

[sushi]

i would say numbers are a way to codify human perception of nature

like if you put one rabbit into a box, and then add another one, you end up with 2 rabbits. Which is correct for all practical purposes, but the rabbit you put in is no longer the same – it's really just a mass of molecules which is relatively stable, to the extent that it remains approximately the same object short-term. But it's also constantly changing, so it doesn't exactly satisfy identity relations like 1 = 1. So in this case 1 + 1 = 2 is a mathematical model you apply to your perception of the world, but it's an approximation of reality.

i haven't studied this topic whatsoever though

i think its some form of mathematical information

how to define a number

for example

4= can represent 4 objects
4= a constant, to mulitply a group/set of objects by, divide, add
4= 10 to power 4 , 10x 10x 10 x10
4= geometrical properties of a square
4= 2 objects + 2 objects

this is my theory or speculation

math is more than purely numbers. there are mathematical blocks and building blocks which we cant see. there is something more fundamental than numbers.

 

[Bluehalite]

 

[sushi]

whats the difference between alphabets and numbers?

we all know b comes after a, and c comes after b, but does that mean b > a, or d>c , c>b?
every alphabet is equal while numbers are not.

2>1 or 4>3

that is the difference between alphabets and number system, the next number is always greater in some way than the previous number, while alphabets its only ordinal arragement.

in any given list of number, the next consecutive number is usually greater, unless its a random number arrangment.

 

[sushi]

i think that numbers should be reduced to more fundamental like a mathematical mass or block

like rocks , that are countable it cannot be abstraction itself.

numbers are containers and representation in the sense, 2 contains 1+1

3 contains 1+1+1 4 contains etc