Did you work in mcdonalds?

[Ex-User (8886)]

I actually work for a month and I think it's a hell for INTP. No thinking, stiupid orders and frustrating S people who make things perfectly and think you are stiupid because you make everything slower (intp's are phlegmathics generally).

The worst one month in my life ;x
I used my all super power to stay calm with theese idiots ;p

Anyone here worked in mcdonalds?

 

[Jennywocky]

I did pizza hut. It was interesting as a learning experience but quickly wears out.

My intp kid is currently washing dishes in a restaurant and is motivated to move on as soon as he has a direction.

 

[Inquisitor]

I did Trader Joe's. Worst. Job. Ever. I was thoroughly exhausted at the end of the day. Repetitive, and physically demanding tasks. Plus you have to be all smiles for the customer. INTP nightmare. I know a lot of people think TJ's is a great company, but they're actually The Great Satan of grocery stores. Look carefully and you'll see almost no organic food. The produce is conventionally grown, cheap, and of low-quality. There's also very little of it. Everything is packaged, which means it's also quite a bit older than it appears. Everything else in the store lacks artificial preservatives/flavoring, but they make up for it using loads of sodium and sugar. The suppliers are under NDA so you have no idea which companies are actually manufacturing a given product. Most of the store is just a combination of white flour, salt, sugar, and various other low-quality, cheap ingredients mixed in. The only way to get cheap, healthy food in this country is to buy from the farm directly. Interestingly, the Aldi brothers from Germany own TJ's, but they are extremely reclusive billionaires. Low quality shit masquerading as good value.

 

[_whispers_]

I was washing dishes at a restaurant as well. I truly believe that the real reason they didn't renew my contract was, because I was that antisocial

 

[Pizzabeak]

I used to wash dishes at this one place but it was really only a summer gig. It wasn't that bad and I would have liked to continue my stay there but it was in a yuppie part of town and they all thought I was weird. The only thing that was dumb to me was the hyper political atmosphere and how serious they took it. They thought I was too slow - in retrospect, during the interview I said dishwasher but I most likely would have made a better server or waiter even though they probably would have thought I was weird too anyway. The social climbing part was a bit lame too, almost everyone there was in a band or was bragging about how good their boyfriend is at math. It was also far away so it didn't seem that worth it to keep driving back and forth like that.

I did a shift at a closer location which was better, less pretentious. Probably could have fully transferred there too, they may have wanted me to but I never asked. They thought I didn't care and everyone kept saying just talk to the managers so when I did he just said wash the dishes faster. It was also the grand opening of a new location so they wanted some prestige but it wasn't even that busy half the time. Then a bunch of people started leaving, quitting, transferring; etc so IDK. The main excuse was location and timing. I did appreciate the opportunity though and the chance to obtain a servsafe food card.

I've been wanting to work fastfood for a while but they never seem to hire me. It's like there's a conspiracy. Someone tried to get me a job at Starbucks a couple weeks ago but they said make sure to show them how fun and outgoing I am when they call so I knew it was going to be tough. I wanted to deliver pizzas at this one place but right before it officially happened someone decided to be dumb and the opportunity was apparently squandered. Kind of a bummer but we still manage to pay the rent and gas. Whenever a friend says they can get you a job that surprisingly never works out either.

 

[TheManBeyond]

does washing yourself counts as a part time job? every 4 days?

 

[Jennywocky]

does washing yourself counts as a part time job? every 4 days?

I'd prefer you bathing to the incessant trolling, if I get a choice.

 

[Reluctantly]

I actually work for a month and I think it's a hell for INTP. No thinking, stiupid orders and frustrating S people who make things perfectly and think you are stiupid because you make everything slower (intp's are phlegmathics generally).

I've worked concessions at a theme park with terrible management that all got fired after I left and concessions for a movie theater. The theme park was kind of different, but for the most part, I had the same experiences as you. In some ways the theme park was worse because they would never restock my food cart when I ran out of stuff and then would come by and tell me to clean up the cart while there's a long line of people waiting for food or find something to say about how I'm not being perfect, like smiling or being friendly or not counting back the change or something that didn't matter. Very annoying that I couldn't void anything without their approval as well. So I'd have to make a record of what isn't right in the register or they'd start freaking out at closing when $5 was not accounted for. I hope those guys got stuck to a human centipede.

 

[Lot]

I did subway for a couple months. It helped me become more social and work as a team better. It was in the food court of a fairly popular mall here. Christmas time was truly some form of hell. Went back into pizza delivery as soon as a position opened up.

I love the dish washing part of my delivery job. It gives me time to stand and think, and be super stoned at work without having to deal with management. The repetitive motions distract the body like sensory deprivation.

More menial the task, with little to no human contact, the more I think. My body is such a distraction, but keeping it busy with something it can do n autopilot is ideal. Driving and cleaning are the next best thing to sitting in front of a computer. Driving is almost a transcendental experience. It is zen for me. High, low, sober. None of that matters when I'm on a long stretch of highway, or driving around a quiet town.

Cleaning is productive and distracting, or even engaging if the task is hard enough. I guess what I'm saying is, if you keep yourself occupied with cleaning on your down time, your manager will be less likely to put you in front of customers. And eventually you will have a reputation as a good employee. After a few weeks to month, your manager will stop caring if you blow off basic tasks and what not. They might even let you study, because you are a hard worker and they want the best for you.

Honestly I lost my train of thought, but I think food jobs can be rewarding. Give it time and the mundane tasks become a break from reality. It's stressful, but it'll give you more perspective than college if you give it the thought. I actually think a bit less of people that haven't worked as a slave for food, or retail. Although, construction is better for actual solitary thoughtfulness, and teaches a strong will. I'm lost again

 

[Oddity]

I actually work for a month and I think it's a hell for INTP. No thinking, stiupid orders and frustrating S people who make things perfectly and think you are stiupid because you make everything slower (intp's are phlegmathics generally).

Describes my experience perfectly. But I have been there almost 2 years. Every shift, I'm surprised I haven't been fired for, well, being an INTP in ESxJ land. But there's really nothing else for jobs here...

I love the dish washing part of my delivery job. It gives me time to stand and think, and be super stoned at work without having to deal with management. The repetitive motions distract the body like sensory deprivation.

You are stoned at work and nobody notices?

 

[Linsejko]

Worked at Sonic for 6 weeks. First job. I bought a car, needed to start paying my friend back ASAP, so I walked down the street and took the first job I got. I was 16.

Did not hesitate to leave for new job at first opportunity.

 

[Yellow]

I worked at a Whataburger for about a month. I had just earned my Master's degree, and after 3 months of being told I'm "overqualified" at all of my job interviews, I was desperate. I was the only non-Black employee they had at that store, and these were my first few months in the South. I didn't understand a single fucking word any of them said, and I quickly learned (after a huge tranny threatened to "fuck up [my] pretty face") that "what?" is considered disrespectful here.

When someone offered me $25 a pop to write medical articles (something I'd normally turn down), I almost cried in relief.

 

[Jennywocky]

That actually sounds like a decent gig (the medical articles thing). How many articles were you writing a week?

In my first job, we actually sent computer books out to be edited by freelancers... another one of those cool things where you could just pick up a project that would pay $300-1000 to go through and copyedit a manuscript. Alas, that company got absorbed by one of the publishing behemoths a few years later...

 

[Alias]

I worked at a Whataburger for about a month. I had just earned my Master's degree, and after 3 months of being told I'm "overqualified" at all of my job interviews, I was desperate. I was the only non-Black employee they had at that store, and these were my first few months in the South. I didn't understand a single fucking word any of them said, and I quickly learned (after a huge tranny threatened to "fuck up [my] pretty face") that "what?" is considered disrespectful here.

Oh God. The South. Another bad place for most INTPs. Full of either crazy conservatives, old people, rednecks, or a combination of the three. It does not help the INTP ego being the only one willing to question everything.

 

[Brontosaurie]

mig'dawnols

 

[Lot]

You are stoned at work and nobody notices?

Some people do. Mostly the people who also are. And even if the manager knows, he won't say anything. From his own words, I'm his best driver. My coworkers have thanked me on multiple occasions for going out of my way to help them. I'm valuable for now.

I was more open about drug use at my other job, though. I probably could have come to work on shrooms, and the manager there would have just laughed and asked if I could still drive. I wouldn't do that. Total waste of a high, and psychedelics aren't as easy to drive on as weed. Which is basically like normal driving, but the idiots on the road don't bother you so much, and the music on the radio sounds like a symphony.

 

[Minuend]

And even if the manager knows, he won't say anything. From his own words, I'm his best driver. My coworkers have thanked me on multiple occasions for going out of my way to help them. I'm valuable for now.

Huh, I was a very efficient worker in one of my previous jobs. Most considered me working for two people, and I worked alone 14 hour shifts a few times when we were behind schedule. It was a place divided in three small departments, and I was known among those I didn't even work in for working remarkably fast and efficient.

But, I never really got anything for it. I was surpassed in pay by two people where one had less experience than me and the other about equal for arbitrary reasons. Asking the manager about it made him very pissy and defensive. He talked down to me some. I let it go. At a later point he mistakenly thought I asked for an extra day off and he got angry again.

Well, I ended up quitting. I heard the lady replacing me was a controlling bitch. Two of my co-workers who were highly appreciated for being cheerful and lifting spirits eventually quit as well because of the increasing negativity in that work space.

I've had similar experiences in another job as well. Boss being all happy and cheery as long as you're working well. But if you get sick or there is a problem not even related to you, the boss got pissy as hell. Apparently he didn't have a problem with lashing out on the hard working ones. I wasn't the target for that, but I remember one of the more efficient worker got really upset because he was angry with her. She ended up quitting.

 

[Sinny91]

Well, I've just started at Burger King. (3 weeks ago).

My friends and family think I'm crazy because I've just left an office job of three years at the Chamber of Commerce. I completed a Business Apprenticeship with them in 2012, became their secondary admin, by 2013 I became their primary admin, by 2014 I became their auditor, by Feb 2015 I had become their Auditor/Co-Ordinator. Owned it.

The office is so repressing, and all my co-workers were 45+.
Honestly, they thought I worked miracles, but I just worked logically and efficiently.
I couldn't take being surrounded by busy idiots any longer, and I do not want the office to become my career, and so I quit. Surprised everyone, including myself.

I can't stay stuck in one place too long.
Burger King is just a stepping stone, I'm not sure what I want to do.
I do my degree part time, so I'll probably just stumble through the next few years.

Burger King isn't too bad, I deliberately chose a job I could do whilst brain dead.
If there was one thing my office job never allowed it was headspace, so I'm looking forward to having some of that. Will miss slacking off on my work computer tho

 

[Seteleechete]

Apprentice ---> Auditor/co-ordinator in 3 years.

Will miss slacking off on my work computer tho

Faith in humanity -5 points

 

[redbaron]

I worked at Mcdonald's when I turned 18. I was a manager in 6 months, became a restaurant manager at 20 and started out doing some operations consulting at 21. Quit when I was 23 because I was just tired of the type of work, but I actually enjoyed the experience overall. Like someone said, working in customer service gives people some perspective.

I guess I didn't hate it because I outright rejected the idea of formal education after finishing high school (I found school boring as fuck) and it was either find a full time job or live on the streets. So I figured I may as well put some effort into whatever I was doing currently since I didn't have any sort of plan for the future anyway.

My perception of the whole experience probably would have been much different if I'd been a university student or was planning on something more specific. Also I don't know how it works in other countries, but in Australia Mcdonald's actually pays pretty damn well, so that was kind of a bonus.

 

[Sinny91]

Faith in humanity -5 points

It' sonly a worthy note because in comparison, I'm not allowed any devices on me in my new hospitality role, I've never been resticted in this regard before.

 

[Jennywocky]

I worked at Mcdonald's when I turned 18. I was a manager in 6 months, became a restaurant manager at 20 and started out doing some operations consulting at 21. Quit when I was 23 because I was just tired of the type of work, but I actually enjoyed the experience overall. Like someone said, working in customer service gives people some perspective.

I guess I didn't hate it because I outright rejected the idea of formal education after finishing high school (I found school boring as fuck) and it was either find a full time job or live on the streets. So I figured I may as well put some effort into whatever I was doing currently since I didn't have any sort of plan for the future anyway.

My perception of the whole experience probably would have been much different if I'd been a university student or was planning on something more specific. Also I don't know how it works in other countries, but in Australia Mcdonald's actually pays pretty damn well, so that was kind of a bonus.

What are they offering over there? (Although i suppose I'd have to know how it compares to the standard COL to really grasp it.)

Over here, it's a crap job. Not as bad as some places, the average crew wage is only $8.20/hour, but that will of course vary up and down by city. Still, there's typically jobs available there. (Comparison to other McD's products: Average value meal is $6-7.)

I only did the Pizza Hut thing for two years, and it was enough to help me decide to keep going with my education and move out of that line of work. Still, it was a valuable experience. It got me used to working for money on the clock, it helped me learn some new skills (plus some old ones that I didn't like but that had to get done), I had to deal with customers, etc. it also expanded the kinds of people I interacted with, since it wasn't collegiate sorts where I was but low/lower-middle class folks for whom this might be their career high -- and there were just some cool people there, "great people" runs through all different types and isn't based just on education or some other single factor. Not bad for a basic-level job. And of course there was free food.

One of my friends working there once walked out with a 25lb box of high-quality mozzarella cheese and drove home. *doh* Some crazy stuff there...

 

[Cherry Cola]

I applied once or twice none of the times they hired me. Too many other youngsters with no qualifications.

 

[redbaron]

Well I managed to dig up this PDF:

http://www.sda.org.au/images/awards/award69.pdf

I'm in Victoria, so page 16. I counted as Level 4 but I also got certain bonuses from our store owner. They paid for some stuff like mobile and petrol usage, which was worth about $30-40 per week. I can't remember the exact figure but I did work out based on the hours I worked, plus bonuses and the salary package I was on and I was making roughly $26 an hour. Even just the average crew person over 21 was making about $17.70/hour plus annual and sick leave in a full or part-time role. Casuals over 21 were making $22/hour.

So yeah it's a pretty far leap from $8.20/hour. If I'd been making that money I'd have left and got my education ASAP.

Plus I often got job applications from older people with families who'd worked other careers, who were interested in doing a full-time maintenance or kitchen-hand role at the store just because the hours, work environment and job stability were actually better than most other jobs out there.

 

[Lot]

Spoiler

Huh, I was a very efficient worker in one of my previous jobs. Most considered me working for two people, and I worked alone 14 hour shifts a few times when we were behind schedule. It was a place divided in three small departments, and I was known among those I didn't even work in for working remarkably fast and efficient.

But, I never really got anything for it. I was surpassed in pay by two people where one had less experience than me and the other about equal for arbitrary reasons. Asking the manager about it made him very pissy and defensive. He talked down to me some. I let it go. At a later point he mistakenly thought I asked for an extra day off and he got angry again.

Well, I ended up quitting. I heard the lady replacing me was a controlling bitch. Two of my co-workers who were highly appreciated for being cheerful and lifting spirits eventually quit as well because of the increasing negativity in that work space.

I've had similar experiences in another job as well. Boss being all happy and cheery as long as you're working well. But if you get sick or there is a problem not even related to you, the boss got pissy as hell. Apparently he didn't have a problem with lashing out on the hard working ones. I wasn't the target for that, but I remember one of the more efficient worker got really upset because he was angry with her. She ended up quitting.

That really sucks. That is actually why I quit my last job. The new manager was such a negative cunt. Took away everyone's inspiration to work or care. I don't put up with negative managers for very long. I've been lucky enough to watch them all get fired, without needing to quit. Except that last one. Sadly, she was fired for stealing and cheating on her inventory numbers, a couple weeks after I walked out.

WE can only hope that all those bad people are shitty enough to each other that they all make a suicide pact lol

 

[Ex-User (8886)]

What are they offering over there? (Although i suppose I'd have to know how it compares to the standard COL to really grasp it.)

Over here, it's a crap job. Not as bad as some places, the average crew wage is only $8.20/hour, but that will of course vary up and down by city. Still, there's typically jobs available there. (Comparison to other McD's products: Average value meal is $6-7.)

I only did the Pizza Hut thing for two years, and it was enough to help me decide to keep going with my education and move out of that line of work. Still, it was a valuable experience. It got me used to working for money on the clock, it helped me learn some new skills (plus some old ones that I didn't like but that had to get done), I had to deal with customers, etc. it also expanded the kinds of people I interacted with, since it wasn't collegiate sorts where I was but low/lower-middle class folks for whom this might be their career high -- and there were just some cool people there, "great people" runs through all different types and isn't based just on education or some other single factor. Not bad for a basic-level job. And of course there was free food.

One of my friends once walked out with a 25lb box of high-quality mozzarella cheese. *doh* Some crazy stuff there...

I earn about $2/hour xD but well, it's Poland
average meal value is about 3-4 $

 

[Pyropyro]

Reading about your experiences makes me not want to eat at fast food restaurants anymore. Workers don't deserve to be treated like that.

Maybe I'll eat more at the mom and pop eateries instead.

 

[Yellow]

Reading about your experiences makes me not want to eat at fast food restaurants anymore. Workers don't deserve to be treated like that.

Maybe I'll eat more at the mom and pop eateries instead.

Most of the time mom&pop is better, sometimes worse. As with any business, if there is a high turn-over rate, they are either underpaying or otherwise disrespecting their employees.

 

[Pyropyro]

Most of the time mom&pop is better, sometimes worse. As with any business, if there is a high turn-over rate, they are either underpaying or otherwise disrespecting their employees.

Well the mom&pop's I visit seems to have the same employees even if I was away for a year or so. I guess they're doing something right.

 

[Ex-User (9086)]

Reading about your experiences makes me not want to eat at fast food restaurants anymore. Workers don't deserve to be treated like that.

Maybe I'll eat more at the mom and pop eateries instead.

It's either having to work at mcdonalds or having no job at all, with a 20% unemployment rate (among young polish people) it's sometimes the only choice.

Working at a place like this helps people realise they are worthless and mean nothing and that they are left alone to care for themselves. The earlier they learn this, the sooner they can do something about it, or accept/reject the rules of the game entirely.

 

[Jennywocky]

Well the mom&pop's I visit seems to have the same employees even if I was away for a year or so. I guess they're doing something right.

Well, isn't the name "mom & pop" (a small local business run by the owners, in a family-like atmosphere) suggestive that they hire their workers on the same basis? So your benefit is familiarity, and personal relationship among the staff; a larger faceless corporation with much more customer flow based on price and convenience rather than committed local familiarity won't establish relationships as easily among staff, the bottom line is cost.

 

[Pyropyro]

It's either having to work at mcdonalds or having no job at all, with a 20% unemployment rate (among young polish people) it's sometimes the only choice.

I thought only the PIGS in Europe had it bad. How are you guys over there?

Working at a place like this helps people realise they are worthless and mean nothing and that they are left alone to care for themselves. The earlier they learn this, the sooner they can do something about it, or accept/reject the rules of the game entirely.

As much as I don't like it, I agree with you here. This is probably the safest time to realize that. Being too young and they'll probably end up traumatized and helpless while being too old will probably make them too stubborn and entitled to actually do something about it.

 

[Pizzabeak]

I worked at a Whataburger for about a month. I had just earned my Master's degree, and after 3 months of being told I'm "overqualified" at all of my job interviews, I was desperate. I was the only non-Black employee they had at that store, and these were my first few months in the South. I didn't understand a single fucking word any of them said, and I quickly learned (after a huge tranny threatened to "fuck up [my] pretty face") that "what?" is considered disrespectful here.

When someone offered me $25 a pop to write medical articles (something I'd normally turn down), I almost cried in relief.

Easily one of the most racist things I've seen on this board in a while. I know this one Caucasian guy (not that it even matters, I normally wouldn't have even mentioned race in the first place) who works at Whataburger (we don't have those on this coast btw). It was kind of funny because one day he became friends online with like three black people then when I looked they all worked at Whataburger. I just figured he made friends with his coworkers or something.

That happens sometimes, there are a bunch of McDonald'ses over here operated by this Mexican guy and he only hires other Mexicans pretty much... If you walk into one and see mostly Mexicans then you can be sure it's one owned by him. I know someone who used to work there.

 

[Inquisitor]

I have frequently gotten the impression that older generations tend to think of college kids as entitled and having unrealistic expectations. They do have a point there...to an extent. You know...the kind of articles you see online that say Millennials are spoiled brats and need a firm worldview and attitude readjustment? Oftentimes the solution that's batted around is something along the lines of "just get a f*cking job" and "the harder it is, the more it'll teach you about the painful realities of life and help grow some hair on your balls." I'm being very approximate in my phrasing here, but I think you get the gist...

Anyway, my point is that psych research shows that 20-year-old brains are far more sensitive to negative events than more mature brains. I read this in Meg Jay's book:

The Defining Decade: Why Your Twenties Matter--And How to Make the Most of Them Now: Meg Jay: 9780446561754: Amazon.com: Books@@AMEPARAM@@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41UYuubxN8L.@@AMEPARAM@@41UYuubxN8L

Here are the studies she cites for that:

Unpleasant Situations Elicit Different Emotional Responses in Younger and Older Adults

Amygdala Responses to Emotionally Valenced Stimuli in Older and Younger Adults

Basically, I think an argument could be made that it's really easy for the older generation to just come down on twenty-somethings with a sledgehammer and opine that "hard" experiences are beneficial and help them grow up faster. Looking back now, I think it's total BS. If you batter young people (20+ y/o) right at this crucial developmental stage, it's necessarily going to be much more painful for them than for anyone in their 30s or older. We should do the opposite. Take it easy on the young. I was a baby when I was 22. Having a kind, and non-judgmental mentor to ease the transition would have been so nice.

In that context, working shitty jobs in fast-food and retail are the worst possible thing you could do in your early twenties. It's such a powerful blow to self-esteem that it may end up actually scarring people. Just saying...my post is motivated by the fact that I saw a lot of people on here posting about how it's better to have hardship when you're young.

 

[redbaron]

Needs to be follow up studies done to actually verify whether or not sensitivity translates to it actually being better to coddle younger people more.

The statement that it would have been, "nice" to have a mentor is meaningless in all honesty. Lots of things would be "nice" to have that don't actually confer any real benefits to people.

It's nice to believe in the Easter bunny for kids, but I think it's bullshit that people go to such lengths to protect people from literally, the truth.

 

[Yellow]

Easily one of the most racist things I've seen on this board in a while.

It wasn't intended that way. It was intended as a "fish-out-of-water" statement. In fact, this illustrated my problem. I offended most of the people there without even trying. I have significant hearing loss, and I was being introduced to a new accent/cadence of English, with brand new slang. There was one manager who spoke with a familiar accent, being from Detroit, and she was perfectly nice to me, but the rest of the crew and managers just assumed that I was just being a bitch and not understanding them on purpose.

 

[TBerg]

A lot of Americans still self-segregate, so what Yellow said doesn't surprise me. I have had similar experiences here. People are just spiteful when they operate in groups. Some black people have been downright cruel. White people aren't supposed to complain about it because it violates leftist anti-oppression dogma, but the fact remains that dogma does not depict the contexts of particularities. A white victim in a politically correct municipality can also go without protection or justice. That's why you will see progressive broadcasters never call victims white but will always call victims black.

 

[Yellow]

A lot of Americans still self-segregate, so what Yellow said doesn't surprise me. I have had similar experiences here. People are just spiteful when they operate in groups. Some black people have been downright cruel. White people aren't supposed to complain about it because it violates leftist anti-oppression dogma, but the fact remains that dogma does not depict the contexts of particularities. A white victim in a politically correct municipality can also go without protection or justice. That's why you will see progressive broadcasters never call victims white but will always call victims black.

It's been so weird living here. I knew there were still some racial tensions in northern Florida, Alabama, Louisiana, and Mississippi. But, when I got here, it was so shocking to see the extent of the social segregation. It's not a huge obstacle in the middle/professional class, but among people in the lower socioeconomic classes, it's staggering. Churches are segregated, neighborhoods are segregated -- Fuck, they still have busing in my region because otherwise, the schools would be segregated.

When I was working there, my roommate was a Colombian man who was half Native, half Black. After my first week, I remember relating my trouble, and he said, "In Colombia, everyone sees me as a Black man, and I felt like I only really fit in with the other Black people. Here, everyone finally sees me as a Colombian. Too bad no one likes Colombians." Of course after that brief moment of empathy, he started saying "what that is?" instead of "what is that?" every chance he got, just to mess with me.

 

[Inquisitor]

Needs to be follow up studies done to actually verify whether or not sensitivity translates to it actually being better to coddle younger people more.

The statement that it would have been, "nice" to have a mentor is meaningless in all honesty. Lots of things would be "nice" to have that don't actually confer any real benefits to people.

It's nice to believe in the Easter bunny for kids, but I think it's bullshit that people go to such lengths to protect people from literally, the truth.

Not "coddle more." Just "don't be a dick to them," will suffice, and when you have to teach them a lesson, err on the side of being gentle. More so than you would a more mature employee. Like a big brother/sister. It's not meaningless at all to have a kind someone teach you the ropes when you're just starting out. The short and long-term benefits are huge, and it's way more practical too. I'm not saying protect young people from the truth. Just do it with their long-term wellbeing in mind as well as the above research.

 

[redbaron]

Yeah I'd still like to see follow-up studies.

Also you said you were a baby at 22. No way would I take it easy on a 22 year old who can't do their shit right. In fact, the real problem isn't that people are harsh - they're harsh about the wrong things.

Harsh on results, soft on people.

I've done a little work with people in HR departments and work related problems nearly always boil down to the same issue: people blurring the line between professional and personal criticism.

So if that's what you're talking about, then yes I agree. Definitely don't agree about 22 year olds though - I'd still like to see a follow-up study to see the long-term effects of apparent "negative" work experiences and whether or not it at all effects the ultimate outcomes of people's lives.

 

[Minuend]

This might be moving towards a slightly irrelevant tangent, but I would suggest teaching youngsters from an early age (in school or whatevs) how to deal with and process emotions. Which would be knowledge and techniques to be refreshed at later ages. It doesn't seem like something a lot of parents think about or would even know how to describe and teach their children. There are exceptions where it's indirectly taught by parents by how they react to emotional distress in their child or teenager. But mainly I think some get stuck in their thoughts and feels and are just unable to unstuck.

Though, maybe the hows aren't really understood by "society" (lame term, I know) very well, even by like psychologists.

 

[Yellow]

This might be moving towards a slightly irrelevant tangent, but I would suggest teaching youngsters from an early age (in school or whatevs) how to deal with and process emotions. Which would be knowledge and techniques to be refreshed at later ages. It doesn't seem like something a lot of parents think about or would even know how to describe and teach their children. There are exceptions where it's indirectly taught by parents by how they react to emotional distress in their child or teenager. But mainly I think some get stuck in their thoughts and feels and are just unable to unstuck

I am stuck teaching parenting classes once a week, and this is part of the basic curriculum as a "best practice" for parenting education. We teach the parents to give their children words to describe their emotions as toddlers, then to encourage school-aged children to process their feelings productively. This increases the child's emotional intelligence, and gives them tools for self-regulation as they move into the teenage years.

 

[Inquisitor]

Yeah I'd still like to see follow-up studies.

Also you said you were a baby at 22. No way would I take it easy on a 22 year old who can't do their shit right. In fact, the real problem isn't that people are harsh - they're harsh about the wrong things.

Harsh on results, soft on people.

I've done a little work with people in HR departments and work related problems nearly always boil down to the same issue: people blurring the line between professional and personal criticism.

So if that's what you're talking about, then yes I agree. Definitely don't agree about 22 year olds though - I'd still like to see a follow-up study to see the long-term effects of apparent "negative" work experiences and whether or not it at all effects the ultimate outcomes of people's lives.

I don't know how old you are now, but speaking from the 30s, I regard my 22 y/o self to really be a child compared to what I am now. If you're in your 20s, I'm not suggesting you're a baby. I don't know you.

The studies I referenced suggested that no matter how clearly you define the line between professional and personal criticism, young people are much more likely to experience the criticism as a personal attack because it feels so much worse. Also, they haven't yet learned how to compartmentalize.

As far as studies go, I'm not sure what you'd like to see. Found this:

Heartbreak and Home Runs: The Power of First Experiences

Successful first experiences help breed further success in the long run by fostering greater self-confidence. Early failures are likely to lead to the opposite: feelings of worthlessness/lack of self-confidence. It's not impossible to bounce back from failure at all, but I think what the research shows is that for most people, negative first-time experiences in youth can have pretty far-ranging effects.