what is the most dominant/aggressive type?

[SkyWalker]

What is the most dominant/agressive type?

Or if it is about one function, what primary function will make a person more dominant/agressive?

 

[The Gopher]

Re: what is the most dominant/agressive type?

Seems to be the ENTJ.

 

[BigApplePi]

Re: what is the most dominant/agressive type?

What is the most dominant/agressive/alpha type?

The one who shows exactly what's what so forcefully you are intimidated into believing it. Alternatively ... there is no alternative.

 

[SkyWalker]

Re: what is the most dominant/agressive type?

@The Gopher

ENTJ's primary function is Extraverted Thinking > so its all about Extraverted Thinking?

Isn't extraverted thinking only "rationally" dominant?

But not really "one on one" domineering in an aggressive sense?


Maybe I asked the question wrong:
- I am not looking for the smart leaders (ENTJs)
- I am looking for the stupid aggressive type that likes to get into fights (they are not leaders, but they can be domineering when one-on-one).

 

[Bird]

Re: what is the most dominant/agressive type?

I know this man....

For about ever he's been claiming his INFJ-ness
and recently he has been persuaded by some sign
from god that he is now an INTJ. He is precisely
the kind of person you have described however
I am unsure his actual type.

 

[SkyWalker]

Re: what is the most dominant/agressive type?

I know this man....

For about ever he's been claiming his INFJ-ness
and recently he has been persuaded by some sign
from god that he is now an INTJ. He is precisely
the kind of person you have described however
I am unsure his actual type.

???

 

[EyeSeeCold]

On how you interpret it, it depends, SkyWalker.

Se doms - Most physically aggressive(in a liberal sense)
TeSi - Hot headed, physically aggressive also
Fe doms - Subject to their feelings, can be unpredictable (for a change)

 

[terraxceles]

Technically, the Se impulsiveness should make Se-doms the most physically aggressive, but the two Se-doms I've typed in real life are the least violent people... so I don't know.

 

[SkyWalker]

On how you interpret it, it depends, SkyWalker.

Se doms - Most physically aggressive(in a liberal sense)
TeSi - Hot headed, physically aggressive also
Fe doms - Subject to their feelings, can be unpredictable (for a change)

Can you tell me why TeSi?

TeSi is stubborn in their routines maybe, but aggressive??

 

[SkyWalker]

Why is Se the most aggressive?? Would that also make Ni (its polar opposite) the least aggressive??

 

[Words]

In a sense, Aggressiveness implies things that are physical. The most "physical" function is arguably extraverted sensing.

Also, in a sense, dominance implies a knack for external manipulation. The most "manipulating" function is arguably extraverted thinking. Extraverted Feeling may also be considered as manipulative. But Te is more likely to disregard ethical considerations ;therefore, it is more likely to appear as "dominant".

If E>I, T>F, and S>N, then, in theory, we have ESTP or ESTJ as more dominant.

Ni is probably most "subtle" function. It seeks hidden meaning and is not "in your face" unlike Se.

Nevertheless, my experiences have, at times, contradicted with these arguments. The reason why is probably because the argument relies on "tendencies" and not on the real world where there are many factors.

 

[Thaklaar]

The type with the highest androgen levels (I don't think it's connected to type in the least.)

 

[viche]

T is tied to aggressiveness overall from what I've observed. Se itself is not aggressive but it is the combination of it with Ti or Te. Basically any type with T function as dominant or auxiliary will be more aggressive. But how this aggressiveness may manifest will be determined by orientation of function (Ti inwards vs Te outwards) and person's other functions. So in case of ISTPs and ESTPs there is emphasis on personal competence (Ti) with propensity for physical displays (Se). While realm of aggressiveness of ENTPs (NeTi) is different and seems to be removed more into verbal/mental plane rather than physical plane (concepts, ideas, debates, being persuasive, etc.)

All in all I'd say ENTJs make the biggest impact. Te, logic expressed outwardly, in combination of expansionist Se, taking on new moves new action, is a pretty explosive mix.

 

[shoeless]

i think you're simplifying this way too much. have you ever considered that aggression may be determined by factors completely unrelated to personality?

 

[SkyWalker]

i think you're simplifying this way too much. have you ever considered that aggression may be determined by factors completely unrelated to personality?

i believe some personalities are more aggressive than others. this could be statistically checked and then we would have the answers.

 

[Thaklaar]

i believe some personalities are more aggressive than others. this could be statistically checked and then we would have the answers.

As aggression can be pretty clearly linked with levels of testosterone and other androgens, I don't see why you'd need to bring type into it. If there were significant variations in testosterone levels between types, that would produce significant effects on body types/musculature that would have been remarked upon by now.

 

[SkyWalker]

i have experience with androgens (bodybuilding)

although they build muscle in all people, the psychological effect differs per person.

androgens can only enhance aggression when already present in the personality: androgens make an asshole an even bigger asshole, but androgens have totally no effect on a nice guy (e.g. he doesnt become even the slightest bit more aggressive, even though he has 10x more active androgens in his blood than a normal person.)

and this is 100% confirmed for me in many cases. i swear that it is 100% true.

there are of course many factors that can enhance aggression, not only chemicals, but also circumstances etc. But a really non-aggressive nice guy can handle all the wrong chemicals and wrong circumstances and still remain calm. This seems to point to personality.

 

[viche]

As aggression can be pretty clearly linked with levels of testosterone and other androgens, I don't see why you'd need to bring type into it. If there were significant variations in testosterone levels between types, that would produce significant effects on body types/musculature that would have been remarked upon by now.

MBTI describes how your thinking is inclined. And how you think is linked to the architecture and biochemistry of your brain, which coincidentally also controls your hormone levels and a bunch of other things about your body. So there may very well be correlation between thinking style preference and some physical parameters, like levels on some substances in your bloodsteam or something like that.

 

[Thaklaar]

MBTI describes how your thinking is inclined. And how you think is linked to the architecture and biochemistry of your brain, which coincidentally also controls your hormone levels and a bunch of other things about your body. So there may very well be correlation between thinking style preference and some physical parameters, like levels on some substances in your bloodsteam or something like that.

I'm skeptical that in the 50 years MBTI has been around no-one would have noted significant physical differences between types. If they had, they would have trumpeted it to the heavens as experimental verification of their system. Said trumpeting has not occurred. Not everything is down to type.

 

[SkyWalker]

MBTI describes how your thinking is inclined. And how you think is linked to the architecture and biochemistry of your brain, which coincidentally also controls your hormone levels and a bunch of other things about your body. So there may very well be correlation between thinking style preference and some physical parameters, like levels on some substances in your bloodsteam or something like that.

yes viche i agree
i believe that we unconsciously control our own hormone levels. so an aggressive personality might not have this personality because he has higher androgen levels: He has higher androgen levels because he has an aggressive personality (which causes the upregulation of androgens).

It might also both be true: It's a loop! (much research was done on this loop, i've read it) the aggressive personality increasing the androgen levels and the androgens increasing the aggressiveness, and then again the same LOOP until a certain max-treshold is reached (because other factors balance it out when androgen levels become too high).

if you dont have the aggressive personality to begin with, you never go into the loop. and when the loop is artificially induced (by testosterone injections for example) it has no effect on the mind. this all seems to point to personality being the main cause of aggressiveness (although it needs enhancers to really come out strong)

 

[SkyWalker]

I'm skeptical that in the 50 years MBTI has been around no-one would have noted significant physical differences between types. If they had, they would have trumpeted it to the heavens as experimental verification of their system. Said trumpeting has not occurred. Not everything is down to type.

(Well... thats why I come out with this stuff now, finally AFTER 50 YEARS, it's about time.)

It might be missing in MBTI, or it might already be there, but we might be misinterpreting it. I don't know, I am just pondering about it, to find out the truth.

BTW There is not just MBTI, other personality systems exist with aggression as one of the main dimensions! What about agreeableness in the BIG 5 system, isn't agreeableness almost similar to saying non-aggressive?

 

[SkyWalker]

back to Se
------------
You were all pointing to Se. It's a perceiving function. How can perceiving reality in a different way make you more inclined to be aggressive?

Is it that when you dont look at future and past, and REALLY LIVE IN THE NOW, like a true Se, then you will want to reap benefits instantly. Actually so extremely instantly that you even want to use aggression if you have to, even though aggression is bad for your image on the long run (you dont see the long run anyway).

is it that "seeing your future" (non-Se) reduces aggression? because you dont want to look like a fool or have a bad image in the future? you will be thinking too much about spoiling your future by acting out aggression, which is more important to you than the moment, so you will just skip over the moment and not let yourself be heard, to reap benefits in the future instead of now.
While the Se will want to let himself be heard, because NOW is all he has got, he does not see a future anyway: So he HAS TO be heard NOW.

am I going in the right direction?

 

[viche]

I'm skeptical that in the 50 years MBTI has been around no-one would have noted significant physical differences between types. If they had, they would have trumpeted it to the heavens as experimental verification of their system. Said trumpeting has not occurred. Not everything is down to type.

MBTI has been developed as a career search tool for professional world. Socionics however has has been developed more 'academically' so to say, in framework of a social science. And yes there are multiple descriptions of how different types tend to look and act in socionics. Example (this is for INTPs): http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=LII_subtypes

It might also both be true: It's a loop! (much research was done on this loop, i've read it) the aggressive personality increasing the androgen levels and the androgens increasing the aggressiveness, and then again the same LOOP until a certain max-treshold is reached (because other factors balance it out when androgen levels become too high).

You'd need some sort of biomedical research for this, which for something like MBTI theory is unlikely to get funded. My own research consists of just reading forums of different types and noticing the themes that repeat for them. What do they enjoy, what do they value, what problems do they have, things like that. After a while adding 1+1+4+8 together I get a certain sum or intuitive vibe. So far my observations point that T is the function that correlates to aggressiveness (Te) or competitiveness (Ti).

back to Se You were all pointing to Se. It's a perceiving function. How can perceiving reality in a different way make you more inclined to be aggressive?

Is it that when you dont look at future and past, and REALLY LIVE IN THE NOW, like a true Se, then you will want to reap benefits instantly. Actually so extremely instantly that you even want to use aggression if you have to, even though aggression is bad for your image on the long run (you dont see the long run anyway).

"Benefit" implies Ti. It requires a judgement function to determine what would be of benefit to yourself. Se cannot make such judgement by itself. The word "instantly" relates to Se but "benefit" is something that you need Ti to make decision upon.

 

[SkyWalker]

"Benefit" implies Ti. It requires a judgement function to determine what would be of benefit to yourself. Se cannot make such judgement by itself. The word "instantly" relates to Se but "benefit" is something that you need Ti to make decision upon.

i agree, benefit requires thinking. i didnt say the judging functions were laying dormant

can't you also FEEL benefit BTW?

 

[BigApplePi]

What is the most dominant/agressive type?

Or if it is about one function, what primary function will make a person more dominant/agressive?

Aggressive? I don't know who this guy is, but he seems pretty convincing. Notice the use of hands, the gruff voice . And you want to go against him?
YouTube - Adolf Hitler - Speech (1933)

 

[SkyWalker]

and they say obama is a great pitcher while this guy was 100x better

he puts more "Feeling" to it than Obama, doesnt he?

 

[viche]

Hitler was typed as INFJ. On INFJ forums a few of us concluded that it fits. Just too many similarities, including all the whole Nazi symbolism thing. Intuitive subtype though which is higher on Ni and Ti. INFJ males tend to be that way on average. That feeling actually kind of sucks. Feels natural to you but then other people comment that it is really intense, which I think they perceive as aggressive There is a bunch of INFJs complaining about it lol guess they haven't discovered their true calling as orators for some political party.

Jung by the way met Hitler and this is what he described: "Hitler seemed like the 'double' of a real person, as if Hitler the man might be hiding inside like an appendix, and deliberately so concealed in order not to disturb the mechanism ... You know you could never talk to this man; because there is nobody there ... It is not an individual; it is an entire nation." I suppose Ni can give that effect.

Obama I typed as ENFJ also intuitive subtype higher on Ni and Ti, close relative of INFJ ... Hitler's type >.<

 

[viche]

opps double post

 

[SkyWalker]

the man might be hiding inside like an appendix, and deliberately so concealed in order not to disturb the mechanism ... You know you could never talk to this man; because there is nobody there ... It is not an individual; it is an entire nation." I suppose Ni can give that effect.

Ni? Seems more like he was simply "possessed" (by something bigger than himself)

 

[SkyWalker]

and they say obama is a great pitcher while this guy was 100x better

he puts more "Feeling" to it than Obama, doesnt he?

May I conclude this:

- Obama has more dominant Thinking functions than Hitler. (not making the seperation between extravert/introvert here)

- Hitler has more dominant Feeling functions than Obama. (not making the seperation between extravert/introvert here)

- Hitler is (e.g. seems to us) more aggressive than Obama.


(not drawing any extra conclusions, just want your approval on the above first).

 

[SkyWalker]

T is tied to aggressiveness overall from what I've observed. Se itself is not aggressive but it is the combination of it with Ti or Te. Basically any type with T function as dominant or auxiliary will be more aggressive.

I think you based this conclusion on your experience on forums (e.g. not in real life)

T's can show rational dominance ("viche's definition of aggression" which is an attack of rationalities/logic).
T's can attack/defend their logic with more logic and they are never tired of that, they can keep those logical attacks coming to you forever.

F's dont show this rational dominance, they show feeling dominance, but on forums this is not really interesting to them, because they cant really "feel" you. they will not keep attacks of logical statements coming on a forum, they will simply get tired of that and abandon the forum, they'd rather yell and scream at somebody in real life, so they can feel it.
But I think it is the F's which is the real personal relationship kind of dominance, the real in your face aggressiveness that is willing to take itself down just to take you down. This is a much more physical kind of dominance. THus this is why I say aggression is feeling related, not thinking related.


i was actually waiting for approval of my previous post, but....
take obama and hitler for example. both are rationally dominant, both can keep the logic coming at you, both can lead a nation and be rationally dominant. but if you put them in one room together, i think that hitler can dominate obama and kick his ass (obama is not ready to take himself down in battle, but hitler is, thus obama wusses out and complies to hitler to save his ass), it is because hitler has a bit more dominant feeling functions.

 

[viche]

May I conclude this:

- Obama has more dominant Thinking functions than Hitler. (not making the seperation between extravert/introvert here)

- Hitler has more dominant Feeling functions than Obama. (not making the seperation between extravert/introvert here)

- Hitler is (e.g. seems to us) more aggressive than Obama.


(not drawing any extra conclusions, just want your approval on the above first).

Why did you conclude that Hitler has lower thinking function than Obama? He is higher on thinking function.

 

[SkyWalker]

Why did you conclude that Hitler has lower thinking function than Obama? He is higher on thinking function.

ok hmm was afraid of that

both use logic & feeling.

i think obama expresses more logic and hitler more feeling, thats basically it.

actually i dont know any of them personally, i just base this on their speeches, which might be totally faked/simulated/acted and not the real personality. i am just assuming now, for simplicity's sake that this speech style is their personality

 

[EyeSeeCold]

Hitler = ENFJ

Only a domminant feeler can control crowds of such massive sizes. Ni gave him the ability to change into a role. It's also where the symbolism and desire for ideals comes from.

 

[viche]

I think you based this conclusion on your experience on forums (e.g. not in real life)

T's can show rational dominance ("viche's definition of aggression" which is an attack of rationalities/logic).
T's can attack/defend their logic with more logic and they are never tired of that, they can keep those logical attacks coming to you forever.

I think you're reacting a bit emotionally to this. This was not an "attack on rationality" or whatever you called it. You have to detach yourself in your thinking and not view aggression in negative light. Competition between people in society brings a lot of progress when it is channeled properly. Aggression is fine when it is within reasonable confines (video games, sports, martial arts classes, etc.) and only becomes a problem if it spills out massive scale like war for example. If you don't detach and think about these things more impersonally then your own ego is going to cloud the truth.

 

[viche]

ok hmm was afraid of that

both use logic & feeling.

i think obama expresses more logic and hitler more feeling, thats basically it.

actually i dont know any of them personally, i just base this on their speeches, which might be totally faked/simulated/acted and not the real personality. i am just assuming now, for simplicity's sake that this speech style is their personality

Well I read through their biographies and compared similarities to real life ENFJs and INFJs that I've known as well as the ones from forums INFJ for Hitler and ENFJ for Obama seems quite fitting. The oratorial power that you see is extraverted feeling in creative position (auxiliary function). INFJs sometimes complain about described by others as too "intense". This is Fe in creative position shooting out a bit like an intense energy pulse. But as auxiliary it is not always working. For ENFJs like Obama their extraverted feeling contrary to this is their base function, main lens through which they see the world, it is always 'on' so to say rather than producing this intensity of expression. This is very easy way to tell INFJs and ENFJs apart.

 

[SkyWalker]

infj = NiFe(TiSe)
enfj = FeNi(SeTi)

But saying Fe is a lens to see the world sounds so wrong to me, because only the perception functions are "lenses to see the world", Fe is just to judge/schedule/decide what to do with what you see in the lens.

When Ni is stronger than Fe, then more Ni info is preferred before making an Fe decision
When Fe is stronger than Ni, then making an Fe decision is preferred before taking more info from Ni.

But the Fe decision still comes only from what the lens Ni shows in both cases (and a bit of inferior Se etc of course).

This is how I see the NiFe vs FeNi????

 

[SkyWalker]

I think you're reacting a bit emotionally to this. This was not an "attack on rationality" or whatever you called it. You have to detach yourself in your thinking and not view aggression in negative light. Competition between people in society brings a lot of progress when it is channeled properly. Aggression is fine when it is within reasonable confines (video games, sports, martial arts classes, etc.) and only becomes a problem if it spills out massive scale like war for example. If you don't detach and think about these things more impersonally then your own ego is going to cloud the truth.

it was not ment to be emotional?
It's because you mentioned somewhere in a post that you were on all the forums of all MBTI types to observe them and drew your conclusions from that.

I am INTP, i dont take things personal, i only defend something if i think it is really true after deep thinking, not because i am stubborn. if you convince me otherwise, then i'll dump my old beliefs just like that.

I do not view aggression in negative light, I actually thought that you viewed it in negative light

at least we agree that aggression=competition (or close to it, or that they are very closely related at least).

so cooperation would be non-aggressive



can you also agree on the following:
- thinking is something you do not need others for
- feeling is something you need others for (the kind of feeling of Jung/MBTI of course, not feeling in general)

 

[viche]

infj = NiFe(TiSe)
enfj = FeNi(SeTi)

But saying Fe is a lens to see the world sounds so strange to me, because only the perception functions are "lenses to see the world", Fe is just to judge/schedule/decide what to do with what you see in the lens.

When Ni is stronger than Fe, then more Ni info is preferred before making an Fe decision
When Fe is stronger than Ni, then making an Fe decision is preffered before taking more info from Ni.

This is how I see the NiFe vs FeNi????

I'm talking about MBTI INFJ - Ni-Fe-Ti-Se.
MBTI ENFJ is Fe-Ni-Se-Ti.

Being a judging function doesn't preclude Fe from being a lens, just a lens that makes judgements all the time. Have you ever known any ENFJs or ESFJs in real life? Because you can really see it that their extraverted feeling never turns off. When I hang out with my ENFJ friend I get tired of her need to bond and relate to people. Though I am related type having my auxiliary constantly turned on wears me out. But dominant function I don't even feel. I suppose you should think about your own dominant and auxiliary functions and how do you feel them working in comparison to each other.

I went on ENFJ forum and they were describing having perception of a sort of a halo around other people. This was very interesting. Another thread was interesting that was posted around election time and one ENFJ was asking if other ENFJs can just "feel it in the air" how he described it.

 

[viche]

it was not ment to be emotional?
It's because you mentioned somewhere in a post that you were on all the forums of all MBTI types to observe them and drew your conclusions from that.

I am INTP, i dont take things personal, i only defend something if i think it is really true after deep thinking, not because i am stubborn. if you convince me otherwise, then i'll dump my old beliefs just like that.

I do not view aggression in negative light, I actually thought that you viewed it in negative light

at least we agree that aggression=competition (or close to it, or that they are very closely related at least).

so cooperation would be non-aggressive

Word "attack" sounded like I was waging campaign against T for some reason while I have NTs in my family and a couple of NT friends and co-workers. I don't have a reason to attack the function really. So far what I discovered that on human level it seems to correlate to drive for competition and being more aggressive. On more theoretical level I picture it more like the structuring, laddering process shown in pic on this website: http://player2000gi.host-ed.net/jungian_functions.htm. While feeling is this more equalizing process. If you picture competition you can picture it as people trying to climb a ladder seeing who can get to the top first. If you picture cooperation you can picture people treating each other on equal level.

On forums people talk about very personal things, so I find it is a good place to collect information relating to jungian functions. Besides that only people I can apply the theory to are family members, a few friends, and a couple ex-boyfriends, but that's a small sample size. Among casual acquaintances about 30 people from work and about that many from online games that I sometimes play. But casual relationships are difficult to analyze, so supplementing this with info from forums has been a very good addition mainly like I said because people are way more open on the interwebs.

 

[SkyWalker]

(1) If you picture competition you can picture it as people trying to climb a ladder seeing who can get to the top first.

(2) If you picture cooperation you can picture people treating each other on equal level.

Its not wrong what you are saying, but it is a bit of a messed up and incomplete picture of it to me.

I don't agree totally with (2). Ok if both parties are equally coopartive then they can be equal. But then they have to be exactly as cooperative as the other.

But in real situations there is always 1 party that is a bit more cooperative than the other, love/Cooperation then is more like: i wanted to climb the ladder, but you want to climb the ladder as well? that's cool, you go first!

( avoiding conflict. allowing others to do their conflicting task, even though our own task is delayed by it. )

because sometimes you both have to climb the ladder (not the ladder of competition per se) with no other option, but only one can go at a time

 

[SkyWalker]

I'm talking about MBTI INFJ - Ni-Fe-Ti-Se.
MBTI ENFJ is Fe-Ni-Se-Ti.

isnt that exactly what i typed? I put the last part between brackets because it is inferior

 

[SkyWalker]

Word "attack" sounded like I was waging campaign against T for some reason .

no this is not how i meant it. actually it is my theory that all conversations are conflicts with attack/defend etc inside, so maybe i talk in different language than you are used to because of this.

i was not thinking of a personal attack. any word is an attack in my slang

 

[shadowdrums4]

Based on people I know, ENTJs and INFJs seem to be the most likely to be aggressive.

Look at Adymus thread "Faces of an INFJ" and see some of the more aggressive ones. (Like revolutionaries and cobras)
I think Feand Te have the most to do with aggressiveness because of experiences I've had with my friends. If I had to tell you the ones I don't want to piss off, I'd say it's my ENFJ friends, INFJ friends (and mother) INTJ friends (and sister) or ESTJs in my life (I don't happen to actually be friends with any of them and one of them is my dad)

The Se types I know all have Fi as their auxilary, one with Ti as the auxilary may also be aggressive but I have no experience to really see it. The SeFi are physically aggressive, (my ESFP friend loves to fight and won't hesitate to when he sees something he doesn't like) but in the moment aggression doesn't seem as aggressive or "intense" to me as the prolonged aggression that FeNi or TeSi seem to experience. My INFJ friend showed me once how if he wanted to he could completely tear someone down. I watched him get someone to admit they were bisexual to an extent. He got really "in your face" He kept saying "You REALLY want to keep trying to lie to me?!" and explained that it pisses him off because people think they can lie to him and that he won't catch it. It's especially devastating if your someone whose talked to him and related with him, because he remembers all those details about you and can then use it against you. "I know you're still lying because you alway give that same insecure smile when you've been caught, and scared look in your eyes that says you want to change the subject! You really want to keep lying to me?!" He wasn't yelling but as it went on he started talking louder and louder.

Any time I've seen an ENFJ angry, it was different. At first they may try to relate to you how they want things to change, and be persistant with it, but when they don't think it's working, they blow up on you. One ENFJ only has to give me a look for me to know I'm pushing it. I watched her give that same look to a guy who was trying to get us to do drugs with him at a concert and lead me away from everyone. He had been getting annoyed and was starting to act like he was going to force us (or me at least) and she gave him that look, and talked to him in an almost venomous tone. "We're going to watch Disturbed now, we've said no." There was an unsaid "back off or you'll get it" that is just as "intense" as my INFJ friend was when he said "Do you want to keep trying to lie to me?" Now that I think about it, to me those two types are the most aggressive. (Yes I'm figuring this out as I type it, bear with me)

The ESTJs in my life are my dad and a guy that my brother and his friends use for rides. My dad is extremely physically aggressive. Even when I point out to them that what they are doing isn't making sense, they keep repeating the same conclusion they came to. The only actual scary one is my dad. My guess is it has something to do with the inferior Fi, because I would think the Fi would only be used as a "This is how I feel and that's not going to change damnit!" kind of reaction. It seems to be when I tell them what they are doing isn't logical that they get riled up and aggressive. Especially if they view themselves as some kind of authority. "Dad it doesn't make sense to do the dishes before we eat, that just makes me have to do them a second time later" "Just do it now" "but you don't even need them done now, nothing is in your way" "Do it now damnit! I'm your dad don't argue with me!" "Dad I'm in the middle of something else, I'll do it when I'm done" "No you'll do it now because I said so" He gets angrier and angrier as this goes on. It can get physical if I continue not to do it. I've asked him why it matters so much before, but none of his answers seem to make any sense to me.

The person that hangs out with my friends seems to be very similar in argumentive style, but because he has no authority, the aggression is ignored and the fear is gone. (This also has to do with the guy being a pussy, if he ever tried to hurt me, he'd lose. Even if he didn't, that ESFP from before would take him down.) I've noticed that he only really gets aggressive through things that hit his Fi or contradict/disregard his TeNi as well. We talked about the shootings of Calambine (spelling?) The only thing he had to say on it (and like dad, he kept repeating it with more anger/aggression) "All that happened was two kids got bullied, got sick of it and got revenge" I couldn't even bring up the video game theories because anytime I tried to give any other reason, I was hit with that statement. My answer to that was "maybe" and an attempt to check out other theories. Before long I stopped trying because he was being aggressive with it, but instead of being intimidating, it was just annoying.

Oh that makes me wonder about something else, it seems it's possible aggression is in the eye of the beholder in a way. The FeNi (or vice versa) aggression is much more intimidating and effective to me, but maybe another type would be more affected by the TeNi agression or the Se aggression?
Um yeah, make what you can out of that. :smiley_emoticons_mr

 

[viche]

Any time I've seen an ENFJ angry, it was different. At first they may try to relate to you how they want things to change, and be persistant with it, but when they don't think it's working, they blow up on you.

Yeah that's called "the grip of the inferior Ti". The way ENFJs blow up is described here: http://www.typologycentral.com/foru...nality-matrices/29057-form-inferior-efjs.html

isnt that exactly what i typed? I put the last part between brackets because it is inferior

yes I was just confirming

no this is not how i meant it. actually it is my theory that all conversations are conflicts with attack/defend etc inside, so maybe i talk in different language than you are used to because of this.
i was not thinking of a personal attack. any word is an attack in my slang

ah ... so what happens when you agree? what do you call that? temporary truce? :P

 

[Zero]

The ESTJ is often thought of as the most dominating type. The ENTJ likes to organize people, but the one I know I've met was very flexible (in his thinking) and seemed kind of crazy. I could rapid fire ideas at him and he would integrate them into plans and patterns.

I have the most difficulty understanding or getting along with ENFP/INFPs. The Is aren't so bad, but the ENFPs I've seen around are way too much metaphysical, spiritual connections and just... I don't know where the heck they're going with it all... They don't either...

I don't know much about ENFJs. I mean I haven't been around one as far as I know or as far as the people I've analyzed.

viche- The link: So True about EFs. I read Gender Outlaw and I know the author has got to be a ENFP. Drove me totally nuts reading her book. She wrote something like, "My people would have been the shamans and spiritual leaders. I am connected to my spiritual ancestors..." She's talking about her "gender", but I was like, "Yes. ENFPs would be like that."

 

[kibou]

I really agree with shadowdrums4, Pe's (E_SPs, EN_Ps) aren't really that dominating when it comes down to it, having extroverted perception functions. Fe and Te are extroverted judging functions so like to organize the world around them, this is more likely to turn into prolonged aggression since unliuke Ti and Fi which are more like "don't tread on my values" Fe and Te are more like "don't tread on my external world-making".

I personally find the FJs scariest in terms of being overly aggressive, if they are damaged it lasts long and gets translated into this social aggression that I don't really ever see TJs do for some reason. I've wondered if this is because Te is impersonal so doesn't really care as long as things get effectively done. Fe has more to do with creating rapport and longer-lasting loyalty, social networks and rituals so the anger from "disloyalty" lasts longer.

Zero, this is true with all types but if a type isn't just using their first two functions, then they're going to look quite different from another. Like the INTP Ne, the ENFP Ne has cross-contexualizing energy that can be hard to follow, but I know a lot of ENFPs who "translate" it to non Fi-dominant users into "Te" (or something of that sort) so people can be convinced of the same conclusions, even if they originally reached the thoughts by non-sequential means (through Ne).

Although the interest you're describing at the end is a kind of NF cliche interest, I always find it kinda weird to use "EF" as a category beceause I personally find Fe and Fi users (FJ vs FP) to be really opposite users, to the point of clashing. I feel more comfortable with TPs or TJs than FJs on average because I don't feel priority conflicts with my Fi.

 

[Taniwha]

ESTJ and ENTJ.
ESFJ and ENFJ follow in closely behind.

 

[viche]

Oh that makes me wonder about something else, it seems it's possible aggression is in the eye of the beholder in a way. The FeNi (or vice versa) aggression is much more intimidating and effective to me, but maybe another type would be more affected by the TeNi agression or the Se aggression?
Um yeah, make what you can out of that. :smiley_emoticons_mr

To me Fe coupled with anything doesn't appear aggressive I guess because I understand it. I'm probably most sensitive to physical type aggression - Se coupled with Ti. I'm kind of fascinated by it and fear it at the same time. I don't really get Te that much but appreciate its organizational power as long as it doesn't offend my Fe. So I think you are right - what is aggressive depends on the person ... and may be on that person's inferior function?

Also according to Wikipedia studies show that men are more aggressive than women. Further studies that try to differentiate between types of aggression show that men are more likely to display physical aggression, while women are more likely to show their aggression verbally.

I really agree with shadowdrums4, Pe's (E_SPs, EN_Ps) aren't really that dominating when it comes down to it, having extroverted perception functions. Fe and Te are extroverted judging functions so like to organize the world around them, this is more likely to turn into prolonged aggression since unliuke Ti and Fi which are more like "don't tread on my values" Fe and Te are more like "don't tread on my external world-making".

This is a good point.

 

[SkyWalker]

I personally find the FJs scariest in terms of being overly aggressive, if they are damaged it lasts long and gets translated into this social aggression that I don't really ever see TJs do for some reason. I've wondered if this is because Te is impersonal so doesn't really care as long as things get effectively done. Fe has more to do with creating rapport and longer-lasting loyalty, social networks and rituals so the anger from "disloyalty" lasts longer.

YES exactly, so TJs (e.g. Te or Ti as primary function) are not so aggressive when 1-on-1 because they are impersonal. They can only be aggressive in "attacks" of rationalities (which is usually only verbal or in writing). Although TJs can be very harsh and rigid and without any tact, I actually dont consider that aggressive, its just harsh.

The real aggrssion comes from damaged FJs (e.g. Fe or Fi as primary function), its good that you mentioned that these are "damaged". They have intense anger because they were hurt and everytime something reminds them of it, they can just shoot out in uncontrolled aggression. To me these are the scariest types, because they are ready to take themselves down in battle. (like they have nothing to lose, because they are not "thinking")