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what force is holding the universe together other than graivity

sushi

Active Member
Joined
Aug 15, 2013
Messages
296
#1
it seems that only gravity is the only valid force in large macrosocipic scale.
the other forces in standard model become irrelevant, like eletromagnetic force, strong nuclear force, weak nuclear force. they exist in nuclear and atomic scale.

this is where i don't agree with the standard model, this imply gravity is only force that exist in outer space which we can feel and experience? and the only force responsible for the structure of space time universe.

some people introduced dark energy, dark matter as the unknown forces, and i feel there is much more holding the universe together other than gravity.

PS: GR attempted to explain it but i feel its insufficient model.
 
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Cognisant

Condescending Bastard
Joined
Dec 12, 2009
Messages
7,585
#3
Why does our universe exist, if something exists why doesn't something else exist, why doesn't everything exist, indeed why does anything exist?

The answer to all these questions is: Bullshit.

There's no reason for any of it and that's bullshit, none of it makes any sense and that's bullshit, the paradoxical glue holding our universe together is undetectable, inconceivable, unbelievable bullshit.

In hindsight it's quite obvious.
 

Manipulator

analyse, manipulate
Joined
Sep 11, 2013
Messages
578
Location
my head is my home
#6
The idea is, that gravity can be much more complicated than our simplify. The dark matter can be just gravity working in other conditions.
If someone believes in dark matter, he is the same fool as people who believed in ether.
 
Joined
Jun 10, 2012
Messages
6,452
Location
38S 145E
#7
not really sure what's meant by 'together' in this context?
 

Cognisant

Condescending Bastard
Joined
Dec 12, 2009
Messages
7,585
#8
Are you in that solipsistic phase of the month, cog?
Shaddup! *goes off to wrap himself in a doona, eat icecream and watch battlebots*
 

Cognisant

Condescending Bastard
Joined
Dec 12, 2009
Messages
7,585
#11
The force that actually holds the universe together is Love, folks.
Love-bullshit, potato-tomato, it's all shit in the end.
 

Cognisant

Condescending Bastard
Joined
Dec 12, 2009
Messages
7,585
#13
All biomass is eaten by black holes and shat out as radiation which dissipates until there's nothing left.
 

Cegorach

Charnel Horror
Joined
Feb 7, 2009
Messages
749
#15
Hm, neither dark matter nor dark energy are really meant to be physical forces.

In the most basic sense, dark energy is an intrinsic property of space itself, theorized to explain an expanding universe, while dark matter is a unique form of matter with generally weak physical interactions meant to explain certain discrepancies between calculations and observations, they're more things for gravity to interact with than something held up alongside gravity as a fundamental physical interaction.
Though, like others, I may not be comprehending what you mean by "unknown forces" and "holding the universe together".

It is entertaining to speculate on or discover alternative explanations however. I tend to phase into the conceptual fringes myself, regardless of interference, but it's also crucial to acknowledge the validity of developing working models such as the above.
Science ought to be fancifully cruel, after all, with such theories being mere victims awaiting the knife.

Certainly elements of string theory attempt to provide a partial substitute for such murky apparitions, though it's often untestable to its detriment in a field almost entirely based upon a fulcrum of substantive corroboration; modified gravity, meanwhile, has been attempted many times, but has always come short of explaining everything required of it.

-

Matter and energy aside, regardless of their ethical inclinations, there are already some places you could begin searching for macro physical interactions beyond gravity; first of all, you'd need to peer into the smallest of scales...

An electronuclear force, or grand unified theory, combining the remaining three physical interactions into a singular model would be the first step, but the real prize is probably found in quantum gravity, where'd you smash together the resulting micro-scale grand unified theory with macro-scale general relativity to (presumably) spectacular insight.

COMBIIIINE!

Macro-scale quantum effects probably have very hard limits, if they exist, theoretically being more of an aggregate outcome rather than a literal mirror of the standard quantum effects, but there have been some feasible indications of them at such a grand scope at least; it's not necessarily entirely reasonable to expect quantum effects to always hit some imaginary barrier at some unspecified scale.

Outside of that, it's a bit more uncertain, these things are usually best taken in steps, otherwise you can end up rather disoriented, dancing along to the muffled, maddening beating of vile drums and the thin monotonous whine of accursed flutes.
azathoth_by_nightserpent-d4pwklf small.jpg

Additional tangentially interesting articles:
P.S. - I'm not a physicist, not even close, you'd be better served reading articles on all of these ideas than listening to anything I say.
 
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Animekitty

World A.I. transfomantion is Near
Joined
Apr 4, 2010
Messages
5,159
Location
4D Archaeology computer grid
#16
Long video (55 minutes) explains Dark energy/matter as time as being more than one dimension but 3 dimensions. There are infinite frames of reference in time thus. Redshift is a loss in time not an expansion in space. Antimatter travels back in time accounting for its absence in space and why it does not destroy matter with its spin reversed going back mirrored in time to normal matter.

Entropy is reversible when superfluid experiments demonstrate superfluidity is one capable of synchronized temperature change. Sum to say if the fluid is getting hot all the atoms are connected as being the same atom (Boise einstein condensate) so as one super unit the superfluid must have all atoms together as one unit get hotter if that direction is taken because it cannot get colder. The flow of atoms has no friction in the superfluid and all the atom s are still considered one atom unit, so the temperature can increase without resistance. (This is my understanding The movie is the primary source you should listen too)

 
Joined
Aug 26, 2010
Messages
4,578
#17
Why does our universe exist, if something exists why doesn't something else exist, why doesn't everything exist, indeed why does anything exist?

The answer to all these questions is: Bullshit.

There's no reason for any of it and that's bullshit, none of it makes any sense and that's bullshit, the paradoxical glue holding our universe together is undetectable, inconceivable, unbelievable bullshit.

In hindsight it's quite obvious.
Time to worship the one true god, Bullshit.