What do you guys think of mentalists, hypnotists, and mind readers?

[onesteptwostep]

This might be a scary thought for some of us, but for someone who has gone through schizophrenic episodes, I think there is such thing as being able to read or at least get a glimpse of someone's thoughts. This isn't an abstract idea that we can all easily talk about of course.

https://youtu.be/t8rRW_9P3Fg?t=4m40s

This guy is apparently the world's 'greatest' mentalist. He says that whenever we consciously think something, we transmit. I tried to make some kind of scientific connection with this, which is that whenever we choose to consciously think, a certain lobe within our brains is activated.

https://www.theguardian.com/science...little-voice-head-hearing-voices-inner-speech

I think it's possible that we transmit some kind of energy whenever we use these muscles in our brains, something like, when a certain someone walks in the room you feel a slight tension within your head. But it's obvious that being a mentalist also requires the reading of the body, for example swallowing, where the eyes dart to, pupil dilation, chest posture, unconscious movement (especially the 'kick' people do when they get to say what they want or hear what they want), and so on.

Oh and since we're on a type forum, what do you think Lior Suchard's type is?

Spoiler

here's more if you want
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQ6R5Z3_YxA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBSLTbHoRUc

Generally, has anyone had moments where they could feel like they could read someone's mind?

 

[Cognisant]

When I interact with people my brain generates a little fictional equivalent of them in my head, the more I observe and interact with them the more nuanced this character becomes. Using this character I can predict with a relative degree of accuracy how someone will react to a given situation by simulating it as imagined fiction. In reality their reaction may differ depending upon their present state of mind but the permutations, once observed, can be incorporated into the model and accounted for in subsequent scenarios.

 

[Urakro]

Mentalism is just part of the art of performing 'magic'. Disappearing, reappearing, and restoration being a little more for kids, and mentalism aimed to trick maturer audiences. When you see a performer make an orange disappear, you know it's just a trick. But a number of people have a harder time seeing mind-reading as the same. It's just an illusion.

Good mentalists (like fake fortune-tellers) use psychological subtleties and gimmicks to pull off extraordinary feats. As a very simple example, picking a number from 1 - 10, most say 7, but in the case that the person doesn't, the chosen number will be used for something completely different and nobody would ever know that the performer just changed his act. The mentalist would have an 'out' in case things went wrong by making a joke about it, and everyone would just think it's all part of the show. The way it's done is usually a lot simpler than what you'd think.

You can be rest-assured that nobody has any inkling of an idea of what's on your mind, except for those you talk to the most (which even then are just really good guesses depending on how open you are with the person). Thought-transmitting is more of a paranoid delusion, which can be made to seem very real to the sufferer as he twists all the contexts of the things perceived around him. My mind has been feeble in the past, and it has gotten as extreme as a news-caster on tv narrating all my thoughts. Not sure why this happens, but it seems like the brain was making way too many real-life connections that weren't even there. But after taking actual real trials and good study, I realized that my assumptions of what people are thinking, and their's of mine are slightly off-based and inaccurate.

If you see someone skipping down a side-walk, you could probably tell that they are in a good mood. Of what is anyone's guess, unless you previously seen them in a store buying a lottery ticket, then you'd probably have a good chance of working it out. Your intuition needs a stock of precondition to hit it's mark.

I have a friend where often she has noticed that when she thinks of somebody, that person will call her on the phone minutes later. Then she brought to my attention that she obsessively thinks about him, and the person actually calls her a few times a day. So statistically, it's bound to happen frequently. Or they are both really into this one T.V. series, which displayed something that both made them think of a real life incident they had together. They'd call each other and be stunned that they were both thinking the same thing, but not even going to the fact that they both were watching t.v. at the same time. Then like false witness reports, they filled in the rest of the gaps with fictitious material aimed to confirm the existence of telepathy and how they are linked.

Telepathy, spirits, and magic is just an easy-explanation for something we don't have all the information on. But there's always a more simpler, and realistic explanation hiding behind it.

 

[onesteptwostep]

@Urakro

The mentalism Lior pulls off isn't something that's done unilateral though, it's a participation and an interaction. The thought reading you're describing is just some sort of paranoiac panic attack.

He also guesses the names of the participant's first love and even pin number, so there's definitely something in there. But even for me, names and numbers I could understand, but being able to draw a similar picture? That I just don't understand at all.

 

[Sinny91]

On the one hand, there are lots of frauds..
On the other hand, there are the men who stare at goats.
Its a subject I'm interested in.. ill weigh in with my sources when I get to PC, but I'm not sure when that will be.

 

[Ex-User (9086)]

Hoax and charlatanry unless proven otherwise. They use a number of psychological and statistical "tricks" to establish good contact with the target and then zone in on their most obvious cues. People tend to give away lots of information to the observant eye or during a relaxed conversation and it can be used to build statistical models of relations and later put to make some pretty spectacular guesses. Also worth noting is that such magicians have a number of backup plans at their disposal, so when one of those fails they quickly use their signature winning card to win back the crowds.

About mind reading specifically, I'd assume that the reason it would be at all possible, if it is, is because of the artificial setting of the 'reading' and a very limited number of possible common reactions to being under such test.
Similarly to those silly quizes asking about the first number you can think of.
"6? Your answer is shared by 85% of participants, Einstein devised this test to see how many people think creatively, blah blah blah (bullshit ensues)"
Ignoring the innumerable cultural, developmental and leading factors that make 6 or whatever other number be the first one that fires in the head of a substantial majority. (Don't quote me on that, it may be totally not about 6, I'm using it as an analogy for related situations or tall guesses)

You can be rest-assured that nobody has any inkling of an idea of what's on your mind, except for those you talk to the most (which even then are just really good guesses depending on how open you are with the person).

Although I agree with the remainder of your post, I will mention that it's very much within the realm of possibility that technological progress may allow remote mind reading within the next 2 decades. Already it's possible to scan mental images and firing patterns to make statistically favourable guesses and approximations of subjects in the person's thoughts. So I wouldn't say one can be entirely at rest about it.

The mentalism Lior pulls off isn't something that's done unilateral though, it's a participation and an interaction. The thought reading you're describing is just some sort of paranoiac panic attack.

He also guesses the names of the participant's first love and even pin number, so there's definitely something in there. But even for me, names and numbers I could understand, but being able to draw a similar picture? That I just don't understand at all.

By the same token Nostradamus saw 1000 of years into the future. So many 'accurate' predictions.

Or maybe it's that if you make 1000 guesses and 2 turn out to be correct in a big way which is enough to impress a simpleton (Not implying you are one) If enough such impressionable people share their awe with others and yourself, others begin to think there's something to the whole thing since so many people are invested (it's kind of an avalanche reaction). There also are 1000's of guessers making predictions about the future and 1 of them will get 99% of what they said correctly, wow, such genius.

He also guesses the names of the participant's first love and even pin number, so there's definitely something in there. But even for me, names and numbers I could understand, but being able to draw a similar picture? That I just don't understand at all.

Numbers are a very biased selection pool. Humans are known for being unable to produce random sequences of numbers and being unable to use 4 digit keys to the full extent of their probability space. Without doing any reading on the topic I can guess that 80% of people use 20% of possible pin numbers.

Names? Again, cultural, database-mining thing, perhaps people sub-vocalise first sounds of names when asked, also many of the "hypnotised" feel euphoric and willingly cooperate and lie to the audience whilst being under the "influence" of awe and the thrill of performing on stage.

 

[Hadoblado]

May be worth looking into Derren Brown, Penn and Teller, and Vinh Giang. Magicians who don't claim to be magic.

https://youtu.be/M_oszzYm9uQ?t=517

Here's Vinh picking a card from someone's mind.

 

[deathvirtuoso]

There were many instances where I've observed/analyzed someone, and was able to accurately infer their thoughts. My friend told me to get lost after I've said out his thoughts, lmao. But I cannot literally read his thoughts/mind, only analyze and infer. So yeah, it's mostly my bullshit. I'm not an actual mindreader, and my body movements almost have follow no patterns, so it's pretty hard if anyone wants to bullshit me about being a mindreader. I won't believe until I've encountered it for myself. It's quite a scary thought tho, if someone can read my mind. That'd be fucked up.

 

[Black Rose]

When I interact with people my brain generates a little fictional equivalent of them in my head, the more I observe and interact with them the more nuanced this character becomes. Using this character I can predict with a relative degree of accuracy how someone will react to a given situation by simulating it as imagined fiction. In reality their reaction may differ depending upon their present state of mind but the permutations, once observed, can be incorporated into the model and accounted for in subsequent scenarios.

Can you create simulations of others creating simulations about you? I cannot simulate anything in a conscious way. Not even a blue dot. That is something I realized about others. They perform mental calculations faster than me.

Most of what I do is limited by it (mental calculation).
Anything too complex and I cannot go step by step.
Intermittent ideas are not complete enough to flesh out.

 

[Artsu Tharaz]

Of course mind reading is real. So is all the other psychic stuff you hear about. Duhh.

 

[TarnishedCrown]

What do you think the trick he used was? Could it be possible that he copied the movement of her arms to make a guess on what she was drawing? The camera pans focus into each person when they draw so its hard to see if there are any timing differences in their drawings. Also, right before they start to draw, and he states something along the lines of "don't change your mind" while raising his hand...that might be to give justification to a timing delay so she can start drawing first. Anyway, I think it's all misdirection and trick, but the end product looks cool and getting there might require some ingenuity.

What is the minimum set of humans required to capture 95% of thoughts? How does this number change as the percentage increases or decrease? I'll have to think on how to better define everything.... Where does subjectivity and objectivity come in? Are there only a limited number of general ideas or is the introduction of a specific thing increase the variation in generality?

 

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[Grayman]

Can you create simulations of others creating simulations about you? I cannot simulate anything in a conscious way. Not even a blue dot. That is something I realized about others. They perform mental calculations faster than me.

Most of what I do is limited by it (mental calculation).
Anything too complex and I cannot go step by step.
Intermittent ideas are not complete enough to flesh out.

Can you simulate someone through a feeling context rather than visual? Its a mental process that is harder to recognize since it is less tangible and strongly linked to an intuitive-feeling bond. I find that the visualization part of the process isn't necessary for understanding.

 

[Brontosaurie]

I would encourage everyone to read minds. Some are quite good.