Ti in INFPs

[OrLevitate]

Fi is very different than Fe. The Fe strong individual will often have a good understanding of their emotions and see the Fi as emotionally underdeveloped. A hallmark of the INFP is emotional frailty, and this is why Ti is important to them. Ti being on the opposite end of the spectrum for INFPs makes little sense to me. Ti is cultivated in order to logically reason through their intense and frequent negative emotions, as well as to curb their altruistic tendencies. The thinking is not for thinking's sake, it's a means to understanding the feelings of their Fi, which they tend to take pretty seriously.

I'm an INFP, guided by emotions tempered by analysis, and the cultivation of the Ti is a big part of why I'm posting on this forum rather than on an INFP forum. The INFP forums tend to be a big meaningless circle-jerk with little substance that just makes me wonder why they bothered posting.

This cultivation of Ti for Fi's sake is also a reason why on whatever test I've taken, the Fi / Ti has always been pretty close. The first test I took had me at 1% Thinking over Feeling. Others have diagnosed me as almost fully thinking. I have been careful to avoid bias from the get go. The Enneagram listed my top 2 numbers as 9 (48%) and 5 (44%) with the rest relatively low.

I remember having taken this test when I was in middle school (in college now) and getting ENTP. I clearly remember that I had intentionally answered the questions about E vs. I in favor of E because I wasn't okay with being introverted and saw it as a fault, so I answered what an ideal me at the time would answer. The Ti I was very proud of, because I did, and still do, prize logical thought, but it's due to my Fi.

 

[The Gopher]

I would completely disagree. I wouldn't say Ti is cultivated just Fi does exactly the same job that Ti does for emotions. Fi looks like Ti at times if it so happens to be "logically" aligned. (this along with Te which is the bi-polar function can help make it seem like Ti)

Also Fi tends to focus on their own emotions and individual emotions compared to Fe which is group emotions. I do ENTIRELY relate to INFP groups seeming... meaningless at times. However, it is generally accepted that at times and in public INFP's put on an INTJ skin so to speak. Also was talking with an INFP about social pressure and males being required to be "logical" as such. May also influence that...

Anyway I'm rambling. Fi acts as a introverted judging function in exactly the same way as Ti acts as an introverted judging function. However Fi does it for emotions as a means to understand it's feelings and others. (which you mentioned) Te is often highly developed in males due to social reasons (you seem male I may be wrong but either way the next part applies to both) and highly developed in general in the seconds stage of life (teenagers) as it has a bi-polar relationship with Fi.

Personally this puts some types of INFP's in a perfect spot where they at least appear the thinkers among F types and still retain the ability to manipulate all the T types to their bidding.

Also I love your visitor wall.

 

[Grayman]

Fi is very different than Fe. The Fe strong individual will often have a good understanding of their emotions and see the Fi as emotionally underdeveloped. A hallmark of the INFP is emotional frailty, and this is why Ti is important to them. Ti being on the opposite end of the spectrum for INFPs makes little sense to me. Ti is cultivated in order to logically reason through their intense and frequent negative emotions, as well as to curb their altruistic tendencies. The thinking is not for thinking's sake, it's a means to understanding the feelings of their Fi, which they tend to take pretty seriously.

I'm an INFP, guided by emotions tempered by analysis, and the cultivation of the Ti is a big part of why I'm posting on this forum rather than on an INFP forum. The INFP forums tend to be a big meaningless circle-jerk with little substance that just makes me wonder why they bothered posting.

This cultivation of Ti for Fi's sake is also a reason why on whatever test I've taken, the Fi / Ti has always been pretty close. The first test I took had me at 1% Thinking over Feeling. Others have diagnosed me as almost fully thinking. I have been careful to avoid bias from the get go. The Enneagram listed my top 2 numbers as 9 (48%) and 5 (44%) with the rest relatively low.

I remember having taken this test when I was in middle school (in college now) and getting ENTP. I clearly remember that I had intentionally answered the questions about E vs. I in favor of E because I wasn't okay with being introverted and saw it as a fault, so I answered what an ideal me at the time would answer. The Ti I was very proud of, because I did, and still do, prize logical thought, but it's due to my Fi.

I feel like none of this requires a response as if this is not a discussion. It feels odd when I read your OP in your threads as if you simply providing a statement about youself and your thoughts for your own means of organizing your feelings as opposed to discussing a topic. You seem open to discussing them but have no directive or questions. You seem to want the wind to blow the discussion in any direction or none if it pleases.

 

[OrLevitate]

My MBTI-fu is weak, I've only just begun this foray into myself (hehehe) a week ago. I learned from your post, thanks. And yea I'm male.

 

[The Gopher]

http://personalityjunkie.com/infp-personality-type-profile/

This might help more than the straight fluffy profiles that are often on INFP's :P

 

[OrLevitate]

I feel like none of this requires a response as if this is not a discussion. It feels odd when I read your OP in your threads as if you simply providing a statement about youself and your thoughts for your own means of organizing your feelings as opposed to discussing a topic. You seem open to discussing them but have no directive or questions. You seem to want the wind to blow the discussion in any direction or none if it pleases.

That's precisely right, it doesn't require a response. I had no specific question in mind. I don't see any mistake though as you seem to. Or maybe you're just doing the same thing as my OP in parody. I'm getting what I wanted out of it, the resident INFP disagreed and learning ensued. All is well.

 

[The Gopher]

I'm getting what I wanted out of it, the resident INFP disagreed and learning ensued. All is well.

Heh.

 

[OrLevitate]

I'm getting what I wanted out of it, the resident INFP disagreed and learning ensued.

I didn't mean that I was trying to engineer your response specifically, just that someone disagreed. I don't manipulate people! Just wanted to make sure we're on the same page even if it's a fabrication of my 'magination.

 

[Grayman]

That's precisely right, it doesn't require a response. I had no specific question in mind. I don't see any mistake though as you seem to. Or maybe you're just doing the same thing as my OP in parody. I'm getting what I wanted out of it, the resident INFP disagreed and learning ensued. All is well.

I have difficulty communicating with people when I don't understand them. If they say a person is tall, what is tall to them? If they say they love someone, what is love to them? If they say that life has beauty, what is beauty to them?

When your other thread began talking about how much time you spend on selecting names I saw something about you. While everyone else saw you as disliking the process of selecting a name I saw you as respecting the process. I know that any processs drawn out can push at ones level of tolerance, but I did not see your statment as a complaint of reaching that threshold.

I saw your persuit of a name and your respect of the meqnings of names to be important to you. I wondered what values you saw in the name you chose as OrLevitate. I thought it an important question to understanding a small part of who you are.

I was accused of asking stupid questions and so I thought I misunderstood you. I began to be intimidated by this. I felt i needed to regain an understanding of what it is you seek so that I can post what may be more relevant to what you seek from these threads.

 

[OrLevitate]

I didn't see your post in my intro section as negative until base groove, an established INTP member of the forum, deemed it poking fun at me. I had originally wrote out a page length response that detailed my identification with INxP and much attached frustration rather than addressing your actual question, but it was only posted for a few hours before I deleted it when I thought of what everyone would think of me via that post.

So, to answer your question: I felt an intro was necessary because I didn't want to just start posting things as if I were above needing to do an intro. I didn't see the point of doing an intro but I ended up using it to try to convince myself and you all that I was INTP by listing some things I saw as INTP in myself. I was quite intimidated and full of respect for you all from my lurking so I also just wanted to get the intro post over with, as I was afraid of what you'd think of me.

My username is an anagram for 'relative to'. I would've done an anagram of 'relative to existence' but that's too long for a username. I have a problem with people defining themselves relative to other people, the rat race etc, and not thinking up actual ways to live their life but rather just being better than the other lives according to the present institution. Or when someone sees me, a misunderstood INFP, as being stupid because they're extroverted a-holes who see silence in a group as having rocks in my head. Yet while I'm a dumb dumb they conform to the most basic and philistine mode of living, worrying constantly about how much money they're making. I do see the irony in not liking to define myself relative to other people, yet feeling inclined to alter my communication around others, that's probably part of why I have a problem with it, I dunno.

Bottom line I think you guys are smart so I'm here hoping for intellectual osmosis. It's actually already affected my mental acuity for the better. I'm used to having... slothful mental influences around me.

 

[TimeAsylums]

My username is an anagram for 'relative to'. I would've done an anagram of 'relative to existence' but that's too long for a username. I have a problem with people defining themselves relative to other people, the rat race etc, and not thinking up actual ways to live their life but rather just being better than the other lives according to the present institution. Or when someone sees me, a misunderstood INFP, as being stupid because they're extroverted a-holes who see silence in a group as having rocks in my head. Yet while I'm a dumb dumb they conform to the most basic and philistine mode of living, worrying constantly about how much money they're making. I do see the irony in not liking to define myself relative to other people, yet feeling inclined to alter my communication around others, that's probably part of why I have a problem with it, I dunno.

Bottom line I think you guys are smart so I'm here hoping for intellectual osmosis. It's actually already affected my mental acuity for the better. I'm used to having... slothful mental influences around me.

Much liked you will be here

See users:

@The Gopher
@TheHabitatDoctor

 

[Base groove]

I didn't see your post in my intro section as negative until base groove, an established INTP member of the forum, deemed it poking fun at me. I had originally wrote out a page length response that detailed my identification with INxP and much attached frustration rather than addressing your actual question, but it was only posted for a few hours before I deleted it when I thought of what everyone would think of me via that post.

Base groove is actually an INTJ, hardly established (mostly a whore), and did not deem it "making fun" but actually in reality (actually, in JEST) deemed it a collection of "stupid questions". It's a small but significant difference because one is an expression of Te and the other is an expression of Fi.

My username is an anagram for 'relative to'. I would've done an anagram of 'relative to existence' but that's too long for a username. I have a problem with people defining themselves relative to other people, the rat race etc, and not thinking up actual ways to live their life but rather just being better than the other lives according to the present institution. Or when someone sees me, a misunderstood INFP, as being stupid because they're extroverted a-holes who see silence in a group as having rocks in my head. Yet while I'm a dumb dumb they conform to the most basic and philistine mode of living, worrying constantly about how much money they're making. I do see the irony in not liking to define myself relative to other people, yet feeling inclined to alter my communication around others, that's probably part of why I have a problem with it, I dunno.

Bottom line I think you guys are smart so I'm here hoping for intellectual osmosis. It's actually already affected my mental acuity for the better. I'm used to having... slothful mental influences around me.

I'm totally willing to accept you are INFP.

It's highly unlikely that as an INFP you know much of anything about Ti from a subjective point of view because it would contradict your dominant function and would be impossible to differentiate.

Using 'logic' doesn't necessarily mean one is employing a 'thinking' function at any given time and even if that was the case, it's far more likely that an INFP is using the Te function to reason logically. It provides an alternative and functionally opposite mode of discernment to counterbalance the dominant Fi but it does not mean you are given to make every decision based on emotional content nor does it mean you are naturally weaker at utilizing logical reasoning.

Thinking as a function is predominantly oriented towards neutral analysis while feeling is predominantly focused on value analysis. Where thinking is introverted the standards for neutrality as well as logic are subjective determinants that belong to the subject alone. To contrast this, extraverted thinking relies on shared norms or objective parameters that dictate the boundaries of the problem as well as the sequence of logical progress.

You can see how both are forms of the thinking function however the attitude of the function is totally reversed. It's impossible to witness the co-occurrence of Fi and Ti for example as each relies on subjective determinants for reasoning, and you can not simultaneously have a subjectively neutral and subjectively value-based position when discerning or judging.

 

[Grayman]

I
So, to answer your question: I felt an intro was necessary because I didn't want to just start posting things as if I were above needing to do an intro. I didn't see the point of doing an intro but I ended up using it to try to convince myself and you all that I was INTP by listing some things I saw as INTP in myself. I was quite intimidated and full of respect for you all from my lurking so I also just wanted to get the intro post over with, as I was afraid of what you'd think of me.

You are who you are regardless of what I might think. If you fear that I might treat you differently because of how I see you I will not be able to absolve your fears. It is only wise to assume that people will do this. I can tell you that you do have my respect and this respect grows with your honesty and the confidence you have shown in posting this. You seem to function more as an infp but we are not defined by this. It is but a very slim skeleton to understanding who you might be.

I see some INTP who wish to be INTJ because they think INTJ are smarter. It is interesting that an INFP might think and INTP as smart. Intelligence is not so limited. It exists in different places for different people and groups. An INTP may seem smart in some areas but we have our difficulties in other areas.

My username is an anagram for 'relative to'. I would've done an anagram of 'relative to existence' but that's too long for a username. I have a problem with people defining themselves relative to other people, the rat race etc, and not thinking up actual ways to live their life but rather just being better than the other lives according to the present institution. Or when someone sees me, a misunderstood INFP, as being stupid because they're extroverted a-holes who see silence in a group as having rocks in my head. Yet while I'm a dumb dumb they conform to the most basic and philistine mode of living, worrying constantly about how much money they're making. I do see the irony in not liking to define myself relative to other people, yet feeling inclined to alter my communication around others, that's probably part of why I have a problem with it, I dunno.

I can understand not defining yourself relative to others but I suppose understanding yourself requires you to at least compare yourself to others.

Protecting yourself and how you are treated requires that you alter your communication around others.

Bottom line I think you guys are smart so I'm here hoping for intellectual osmosis. It's actually already affected my mental acuity for the better. I'm used to having... slothful mental influences around me.

All things should be considered but never fully accepted. I cannot speak for the others but beware what I might put in your head.

 

[PmjPmj]

The Fe strong individual will often have a good understanding of their emotions and see the Fi as emotionally underdeveloped.

Actually, you've got that back to front.

A person using Fi has a rich inner emotional landscape; they are able to discern how they 'feel' in the moment, and exploring these feelings is important to them.

Fe users extravert their feelings; most everything is processed externally. As a result, we tend not to know how we feel about things - especially in the moment (extremes aside).

Example: I'm an INFJ. It can take me days, sometimes even weeks to figure out how I 'feel' about something. Inner feelings really aren't all that important to me; Fe is about warmth and compassion towards the object. It does not have an internal focus.

Conversely, the INTJ I work with has a good grasp of his feels. Hell, even ENTJs have a better grasp of their inner feels. If you are experiencing yourself as 'emotionally underdeveloped (as you put it) you may want to consider the possibility that you aren't an Fi-dom

 

[OrLevitate]

Portrait of an INFP

Actually, you've got that back to front.

A person using Fi has a rich inner emotional landscape; they are able to discern how they 'feel' in the moment, and exploring these feelings is important to them.

Fe users extravert their feelings; most everything is processed externally. As a result, we tend not to know how we feel about things - especially in the moment (extremes aside).

Example: I'm an INFJ. It can take me days, sometimes even weeks to figure out how I 'feel' about something. Inner feelings really aren't all that important to me; Fe is about warmth and compassion towards the object. It does not have an internal focus.

Conversely, the INTJ I work with has a good grasp of his feels. Hell, even ENTJs have a better grasp of their inner feels. If you are experiencing yourself as 'emotionally underdeveloped (as you put it) you may want to consider the possibility that you aren't an Fi-dom

Thanks. I don't actually consider myself as emotionally underdeveloped, it's just what an acquaintance of mine who has a laughable grasp on her temper called me for going through a bit of an existential/life crisis exhibited by lifting weights on the toilet, walking around in my boxers, getting drunk or otherwise under the influence frequently and having it coincide but not interfere with my pointless work on occasion with no regret, not recognizing conventional social boundaries (due to recent prolonged social isolation) i.e. telling people I love them and meaning it but having them become severely apprehensive about me wanting to have sex with them but they're just phonies who won't live in a loving world 'cause they hold on to their cynicism to reconcile their shortcomings and validate their diffidence, getting into very personal conversations very quickly with complete strangers at the bar divulging a little too personal of experiences of mine and always being the listener to the people in dire situations there, driving around the city (sober) at 15mph, causing traffic, making 'vroom vroom' noises in the comfort of my driver's seat without direction or destination but hoping for some greater guidance and occasionally producing tears. I divulge in hopes you'll have something to tell me about myself. Usually, I'm the most mild-mannered, civil, considerate, walk-overable person. I still am walk-overable, civil and considerate, I've just been going full throttle on the love everyone and find meaning aspects lately.

I actually score as thinking on ~3/4 of the tests I take, as INTP. I did the mypersonality.com one again tonight with a week's knowledge that I'm almost definitely INFP and still scored 63% towards thinking. I've concluded that the mypersonality.com test is not very accurate due to only having 2 answers for each question. The time I took it before I scored ~90% Ti. I'm skeptical by nature, but trusting, but anyways I kept bias in mind while taking the test as I always do.

Some of the reasons why I think I'm INFP:
-I'm often considerate to a fault, I'll say 'yes' to help people before I've even thought about whether or not I'm realistically able, and often find I'm just too apathetic to follow through.
-I don't ever get in fights. I'm the one who, when a fight broke out at a party, would be between my best friend and the antagonist while taking blows from the antagonist's henchmen.
-I prefer to keep things as anger-free and harmonious as possible, to have everyone on the same page in order to mitigate the growth of animosity. When a previously unmentioned acquaintance of mine lately told me he had had an angry dispute with a total stranger (he's sort of slow) I talked to him about the reasons he's especially susceptible to being angry at this point in his life, and steps he can take in the future to minimize the chance of this happening again.
-I have a habit of talking to hobos since mid-high school, hearing them out, and trying to give them hope and make them feel empowered. One homeless woman I spoke to at length in this fashion ended up asking if I "Have a car around here...?" after hugging her, because she took the whole thing the wrong way.
-Don't care what my clothes look like: $, practicality, and comfort before looks. 2nd hand or free furniture is all my furniture even though I could buy stuff.
-Feel music intensely, good at musical endeavors, play guitar (prefer acoustic)
-Write a bit of fan fiction and like to try and come up with ideas to progress humanity

This bookmarked


The IN and P are certain so if I'm definitely not a Ti (I doubt any INTP identifies with the above?) I gotta be an Fi. I don't really have any doubt anymore about my type, so I suppose I don't require a response or anything and will leave this here for ambivalent posterity.

 

[redbaron]

Some of the reasons why I think I'm INFP:

They actually all sound like INTP things. Or rather, they don't exclude INTP in any way.

 

[PmjPmj]

For a start, forget the indicators. The ones you take online are just that - 'indicators'. They indicate only what your perception of self is.

You say you are definitely a 'P'. Thus, I assume you mean that you identify with traits such as openness, adaptability, lack of punctuality, etc.

Now let me put it to you this way - an INFJ leads with Ni; obviously, this is a perception function.

An INFP leads with Fi; obviously, this is a judgement function.

Thus, the J/P dichotomies within the MBTI when applied to introverts can be very misleading. In actuality, an INFJ is 'more P' than an INFP. The INFP judges first whereas the INFJ perceives first.

I'm not for one second saying that you aren't an INFP - that isn't my place to say. What I am saying is that you should forget online tests, forget stereotypes and do an assload of reading. Get yourself a copy of Jung's 'Vol. 6 - Psychological Types'. Or consult a professional (I can guide you to an exceptional company via PM if you wish).

 

[Base groove]

Except the prevalent theme is harmony rather than truth.

 

[OrLevitate]

For a start, forget the indicators. The ones you take online are just that - 'indicators'. They indicate only what your perception of self is.

You say you are definitely a 'P'. Thus, I assume you mean that you identify with traits such as openness, adaptability, lack of punctuality, etc.

Now let me put it to you this way - an INFJ leads with Ni; obviously, this is a perception function.

An INFP leads with Fi; obviously, this is a judgement function.

Thus, the J/P dichotomies within the MBTI when applied to introverts can be very misleading. In actuality, an INFJ is 'more P' than an INFP. The INFP judges first whereas the INFJ perceives first.

I'm not for one second saying that you aren't an INFP - that isn't my place to say. What I am saying is that you should forget online tests, forget stereotypes and do an assload of reading. Get yourself a copy of Jung's 'Vol. 6 - Psychological Types'. Or consult a professional (I can guide you to an exceptional company via PM if you wish).

Why must you keep offering logical arguments to bring me out of my relieved state of certainty? I really do appreciate it though. I'll probably get that book even if I become certain of my type.

Except the prevalent theme is harmony rather than truth.

Yea, I tend to need to see the point in why I'm learning something. I don't find myself learning things purely for knowledge's sake.

 

[TimeAsylums]

I'll probably get that book even if I become certain of my type.

http://psychclassics.yorku.ca/Jung/types.htm

 

[redbaron]

-I'm often considerate to a fault, I'll say 'yes' to help people before I've even thought about whether or not I'm realistically able, and often find I'm just too apathetic to follow through.

I'd almost say this indicates inferior Fe response, followed by Ti aversion to the task. Especially the fact that initial enthusiasm is followed by apathy.

-I don't ever get in fights. I'm the one who, when a fight broke out at a party, would be between my best friend and the antagonist while taking blows from the antagonist's henchmen.

Not really indicative of INFP specifically. I've been in only one fight ever, and have gotten between fights several times.

-I prefer to keep things as anger-free and harmonious as possible, to have everyone on the same page in order to mitigate the growth of animosity. When a previously unmentioned acquaintance of mine lately told me he had had an angry dispute with a total stranger (he's sort of slow) I talked to him about the reasons he's especially susceptible to being angry at this point in his life, and steps he can take in the future to minimize the chance of this happening again.

INTP's are generally speaking, excellent at giving sound advice to people in this manner. They avoid partaking in the same emotional state as the other person, and focus on rational methods others can use to circumvent issues. He's basically describing problem-solving, which simply indicates a Ji-preference - not necessarily Fi, and not necessarily Fi-lead. Though it doesn't rule it out.

-I have a habit of talking to hobos since mid-high school, hearing them out, and trying to give them hope and make them feel empowered. One homeless woman I spoke to at length in this fashion ended up asking if I "Have a car around here...?" after hugging her, because she took the whole thing the wrong way.

Again, not indicative of Fi specifically. I'd say it actually indicates Ti more than anything. Ti has the, "oddball" persona, and often relates to other oddballs. Especially the fact that it's a stranger and someone of low social status, it can actually make it feel like a safer way to connect with another person since there's no chance of a backlash...assuming you don't think they're dangerous.

I'd say that this indicates XXTP more than F-anything.

-Don't care what my clothes look like: $, practicality, and comfort before looks. 2nd hand or free furniture is all my furniture even though I could buy stuff.

Again not really indicative of anything specifically INFP. At best I'd say this more correlates to being NeSi over NiSe.

-Feel music intensely, good at musical endeavors, play guitar (prefer acoustic)

Doesn't seem to be all that telling. There's lots of people who are good at musical endeavors, and there's many different ways in which people can be musical. I'm good at musical endeavors too, so are several people I know. None of them are INFPs.

-Write a bit of fan fiction and like to try and come up with ideas to progress humanity

Progress humanity is trademark Fe. Writing fan-fiction is such a broad thing, hardly indicative of a type.

Yea, I tend to need to see the point in why I'm learning something. I don't find myself learning things purely for knowledge's sake.

Quite INTP really. Go try and get an INTP to do or learn something they don't see a point in.

Take bandages and gauze. Maybe a riot shield
~

Disclaimer: as with PmjPmj, I'm not purporting that he is or isn't any specific type. Just promoting further thinking about things, because even if he is INFP - it's not really born out of an understanding of MBTI.

Forget whatever you scored on a test. Most of the tests are stupid.

 

[Cherry Cola]

Re: Portrait of an INFP

You supposedly put harmony above everything but you're still willing to act in disruptive ways so long as you're doing your thing? That's totally not Fe but Fi.

Reason you get thinking is because when most other people appear to be incapable of making any sense you become very sense-making relative to them, hence you pick answers that give you T points on MBTI tests. it seems to you that since the reasoning of most other people is so obviously faulty they must be under the influence of their intuitions and feelings about things rather than their reasoning and thinking. This is not true, plenty of stupid idiots are T's they just don't look like thinkers when you view them from a birds eye perspective, look at them deal with specific things and their T'ness becomes obvious however.

What are your typical social roles in groups and in 1v1? In formal situations as well as informal.

 

[OrLevitate]

http://psychclassics.yorku.ca/Jung/types.htm

Thanks.

Quite INTP really. Go try and get an INTP to do or learn something they don't see a point in.

Take bandages and gauze. Maybe a riot shield

I can only laugh at my recurring confusion. This is interesting, thanks for taking the time, but I guess you're enjoying it anyways.

I read a thread a while ago in my lurking, I think it was on this site, about INTPs jumping the college ship. I dropped out of college after freshman year because I didn't know what I wanted to do and didn't see the point in carrying on and getting a degree in something I wasn't sure I wanted to do. I could do well when I applied myself but just didn't see the point so I kept sabotaging myself until I dropped out at the end of the year. I think everyone should have that one freshman year regardless, it's good to be with people your own age who have just been granted a good deal of freedom right after high school.
I'm just reinforcing the evidence for that stubborn trait I suppose.

 

[OrLevitate]

Re: Portrait of an INFP

What are your typical social roles in groups and in 1v1? In formal situations as well as informal.

Well lamp's usually being all haughty in the corner looking down at everyone so relative to him I'm the humble one, not as humble as table though he's always bearing the burden of the group. Chair too, but he puts more back into it. Cup is pretty interesting to talk to day to day because one he's all roses and the next he's borderline suicidal. Chilli today hot tamale that's what we say about him, but don't tell him unless he's full.

I don't have social.

 

[Cherry Cola]

Going by your earlier posts you have social you illogical feeler.

 

[BigApplePi]

Re: Portrait of an INFP

Excuse me as I'm not good at judgment people's types. I never see enough information. I do have an impression though, however faulty of you. Since you seem to have doubts and are presenting arguments, I will too. You seem to be in your head rather than making value statements. It seems like you are looking at your feelings from the outside. Isn't that more Fe rather than Fi?

Thanks. I don't actually consider myself as emotionally underdeveloped, it's just what an acquaintance of mine who has a laughable grasp on her temper called me for going through a bit of an existential/life crisis exhibited by lifting weights on the toilet, walking around in my boxers, getting drunk or otherwise under the influence frequently and having it coincide but not interfere with my pointless work on occasion with no regret, not recognizing conventional social boundaries (due to recent prolonged social isolation) i.e. telling people I love them and meaning it but having them become severely apprehensive about me wanting to have sex with them but they're just phonies who won't live in a loving world 'cause they hold on to their cynicism to reconcile their shortcomings and validate their diffidence, getting into very personal conversations very quickly with complete strangers at the bar divulging a little too personal of experiences of mine and always being the listener to the people in dire situations there, driving around the city (sober) at 15mph, causing traffic, making 'vroom vroom' noises in the comfort of my driver's seat without direction or destination but hoping for some greater guidance and occasionally producing tears. I divulge in hopes you'll have something to tell me about myself. Usually, I'm the most mild-mannered, civil, considerate, walk-overable person. I still am walk-overable, civil and considerate, I've just been going full throttle on the love everyone and find meaning aspects lately.

Sounds Fe to me.

Some of the reasons why I think I'm INFP:
-I'm often considerate to a fault, I'll say 'yes' to help people before I've even thought about whether or not I'm realistically able, and often find I'm just too apathetic to follow through.

Why are you "considerate"? Are you considerate because it's reasonable to be so or do you feel considerate? What is your position on people treated unfairly?

-I don't ever get in fights. I'm the one who, when a fight broke out at a party, would be between my best friend and the antagonist while taking blows from the antagonist's henchmen.
-I prefer to keep things as anger-free and harmonious as possible, to have everyone on the same page in order to mitigate the growth of animosity. When a previously unmentioned acquaintance of mine lately told me he had had an angry dispute with a total stranger (he's sort of slow) I talked to him about the reasons he's especially susceptible to being angry at this point in his life, and steps he can take in the future to minimize the chance of this happening again.

That could be me, and I'm a presumed INTP.

-I have a habit of talking to hobos since mid-high school, hearing them out, and trying to give them hope and make them feel empowered. One homeless woman I spoke to at length in this fashion ended up asking if I "Have a car around here...?" after hugging her, because she took the whole thing the wrong way.
-Don't care what my clothes look like: $, practicality, and comfort before looks. 2nd hand or free furniture is all my furniture even though I could buy stuff.
-Feel music intensely, good at musical endeavors, play guitar (prefer acoustic)

If feel music, but for me it is unconscious. I observe that from the outside. I feel it without knowing why or controlling it or trying to. If I want to know why, I think about it. I don't rate the music as a personal value except as an accident.

-Write a bit of fan fiction and like to try and come up with ideas to progress humanity

Pure Ti. Ideas for humanity or feelings for humanity?

The IN and P are certain so if I'm definitely not a Ti (I doubt any INTP identifies with the above?) I gotta be an Fi. I don't really have any doubt anymore about my type, so I suppose I don't require a response or anything and will leave this here for ambivalent posterity.

Hah!

 

[The Gopher]

INTP and INFP identify with very similar things. I don't think anything you have said really stops you being either. We need to go deeper o-o.

 

[Grayman]

I'm working on a book with an Fi individual and how he tackles problems is very different than me and seemingly different than most everyone on this forum.

When writing he concentrates on the general feeling that the story gives him while I simply create a huge problem and try to give the characters clever solutions to the problems. With his Te he sometimes gets caught up in symetrical and logical layout of the bones without regard to the inner web of the character building. He also can get caught up in his view of the feelings he wants to give the story without being to intimidated by the massive contradictions the changes might make. Seems somehow worth the extra work for something so small to me.

He likes to compare the feelings of the scenes and movies to give examples of what he wants to achieve in the book but he internally finds and has deep answers as to why he the movies give him the feelings he has. I have a hard time with his comparisons and want a more definitive step by step explaination of what he seeks and luckly he can explain it as if he has thought on it deeply.

 

[Cherry Cola]

INTP and INFP identify with very similar things. I don't think anything you have said really stops you being either. We need to go deeper o-o.

This ^

 

[OrLevitate]

INTP and INFP identify with very similar things. I don't think anything you have said really stops you being either. We need to go deeper o-o.

There's new 'lost cat' posters up around my apt. complex, mentioning how she's a beloved family pet, and with a totally innocuous endearing picture of the cat just relaxing all unassuming like. I saw that cat slinking about 2 days ago, had the pink collar and the shy attitude and everything, I didn't know it was lost. Sucks so much. ITNPs don't feel that right?

 

[Grayman]

There's new 'lost cat' posters up around my apt. complex, mentioning how she's a beloved family pet, and with a totally innocuous endearing picture of the cat just relaxing all unassuming like. I saw that cat slinking about 2 days ago, had the pink collar and the shy attitude and everything, I didn't know it was lost. Sucks so much. ITNPs don't feel that right?

INTP's still have empathy even though they are not considered Feel(dom)

 

[Base groove]

There's new 'lost cat' posters up around my apt. complex, mentioning how she's a beloved family pet, and with a totally innocuous endearing picture of the cat just relaxing all unassuming like. I saw that cat slinking about 2 days ago, had the pink collar and the shy attitude and everything, I didn't know it was lost. Sucks so much. ITNPs don't feel that right?

Fi.

It's been clear all along it's clear now and it'll all be cleared up later when you clear the table.

0.02

 

[OrLevitate]

I went out to where I last saw it and was talking to the guy on the phone telling him where I'd seen the cat only a few nights ago and figured where she might've been hanging out tired having not been fed in days and peered through a large fenced area for a ways and found her almost too easily. The guy zoomed over from work and picked her up. I'm jesus.

Concatenation is something I'm constantly interested in, yes because it's something mysterious and sort of divine, but also because after stuff like that happens it just seemed like it was totally supposed to happen that way, and/or it wouldn't have happened without me, even though the cat probably would've been located eventually I like to think that if this hadn't happened, if I wasn't in my destined place at the right time by way of intuiting and being strong in the force, that the cat would've been run over or something or gotten a disease had it been located later. I know this is irrational and I don't worship coincidence but I let it fuel me positively and like to just think about it. Concatenation in negative circumstances is just coincidence.

anyways I was ehhh about getting the reward money, but he wanted to make sure he followed through on his promise of a reward on the poster and I'm not naive enough to say no to cash and it wasn't a lot anyways. I did tell him while he was handing it again that I'm ambivalent abut getting the reward money. I was like aaaight just go with the flow u kno.

 

[OrLevitate]

Fi.

It's been clear all along it's clear now and it'll all be cleared up later when you clear the table.

0.02

I'm inclined to agree.

 

[Cherry Cola]

The way you describe the Cat business.. meh INFP 98% sure.

 

[Base groove]

INFP

98%

+

0.02

= 1

 

[Cherry Cola]

lol nice

 

[OrLevitate]

My way of buying everyone a round through the internet. Here you go.

 

[Cherry Cola]

There is a real medieval theme park coming though, look at number 9:

http://www.buzzfeed.com/maxseddon/eye-popping-excerpts-from-a-report-alleging-corruption-at

 

[redbaron]

The way you describe the Cat business.. meh INFP 98% sure.

Am I 98% INFP too?

 

[Base groove]

Am I 98% INFP too?

Would you prefer if somebody just got to the point and called you an idiot?

Now, before this goes anywhere, I'll remind you I've made a half dozen good arguments for you being a Te user so it's perfectly feasible (to me) that you would also identify with the cat story, without necessarily being an INFP.

 

[redbaron]

It always makes me laugh when people can be certain of someone's type based on descriptions of singular events. One single event could indicate any number of things. I think pretty much anyone who holds concern for animals in general could relate to the story, regardless of their type.

Also, is Polaris 98% INFP? She relates to the story.

I'd wager that a great multitude of people could relate to the story, whether they're Fi or not. It's borderline meaningless typologically as a standalone indicator of type.

 

[OrLevitate]

It's borderline meaningless typologically as a standalone indicator of type.

What do you think would be a good standalone indicator of typearino?

 

[Latte]

@RB
The way the story was described was what was touted as what indicated the type. Relating to the story would not be sufficiently analogous to that indicator.

@BG & CC
It could be elucidating for many to hear more about which aspects of how he talks about it and what he says that you find indicative of the type you landed on. A conclusion doesn't do much largely by itself compared to that.

 

[Base groove]

It always makes me laugh when people can be certain of someone's type based on descriptions of singular events. One single event could indicate any number of things. I think pretty much anyone who holds concern for animals in general could relate to the story, regardless of their type.

Also, is Polaris 98% INFP? She relates to the story.

I'd wager that a great multitude of people could relate to the story, whether they're Fi or not. It's borderline meaningless typologically as a standalone indicator of type.

Well you could be reminded that the majority of this thread so far has been spent deciding whether the individual exhibits Ti or Fi as a dominant function as most tend to agree that the INxP part is nailed down.

So respondents have begun requesting more information to help differentiate between Ti and Fi. The subject has complied with the requests by providing examples of his inner experience as manifest through deeds and the subsequent response.

Before I continue, let me ask you this: which part of the animal story do you and Polaris relate to? I'll wager it's got more to do with the deed of returning the cat and less to do with the feeling you are given afterward that you personally equate to no less than heroic, if you are a Fe user.

In fact, as I was reading the story, even before he got to the part where he talked about how good he felt about himself ... I imagined that if he proceeds to explain how good this incident made him feel, I'm going with Fi once more.

~

To address your opinion now:

I'd wager that a great multitude of people could relate to the story, whether they're Fi or not. It's borderline meaningless typologically as a standalone indicator of type.

Standalone? Really? No. You have failed there.

"relate to the story" -- well I realize this was precisely the terminology I used (in a casual fashion) but it should be clear now exactly what I meant by that, and that it's got very little to do with anything.

So do you really mean to suggest that I think somebody can be typed by whether or not they 'relate' to a nice story about a lost cat, returned?

 

[Base groove]

@BG & CC
It could be elucidating for many to hear more about which aspects of how he talks about it and what he says that you find indicative of the type you landed on. A conclusion doesn't do much largely by itself compared to that.

Personally for me it had everything to do with how the individual was happy enough to reward himself for the deed,

there is the money that he didn't want,

not because he didn't want it or because "it was nothing", but because he found adequate reward in rewarding himself.

Hopefully this is sufficient for those less penetrating minds out there.

Edit:

Actually ... come to think of it.

I posted Fi before I even knew the cat had been returned. Well now that the water is muddy I can't speculate as to my original reasons however I imagine it had something to do with noticing how he said it "sucks so much" that he could have helped but didn't, because he didn't know.

I guess I expect that Fi is a function more likely to be personally affected by a situation once they've played a part in it; anybody can keep their eyes open for the cat, but I believe that one who has encountered it and done nothing, and then feels deeply troubled as a result, is a carrier of Fi.

 

[redbaron]

For specific behaviours, there isn't really any single behaviour that I think could be used to discern type in and of itself. Lots of people do things because of outside pressures, and a lot of the time this pressure is something people are not even aware of. Cultural, parental and peer influences seep through the cracks in ways we don't even realise, and need to be taken into account.

In essence, using behaviour as the basis for typology is unreliable as a standalone indicator. To do it, one has to think in terms of large timescales, not small ones. One day, one week, one month and even one year is not enough if we're speaking strictly in behavioural terms.

One has to analyze the context of behaviours, not just the what but the why, how and when. What else is going on in someone's life? What are their parental and peer influences? Culture?

Essentially, you need to find out in a holistic sense who the entire person is. Not simply what the person does.

Again, I'm not saying you're not an INFP. From what you've given, there's not anything that's really convincing of any one type specifically.

 

[BigApplePi]

@Base groove.

In fact, as I was reading the story, even before he got to the part where he talked about how good he felt about himself ... I imagined that if he proceeds to explain how good this incident made him feel, I'm going with Fi once more.

Just so I understand you BG, you believe OrLevitate leads with Fi as his primary function? INFP's must do so.

You are a self-professed INTJ and I'm interested in that.

 

[OrLevitate]

Personally for me it had everything to do with how the individual was happy enough to reward himself for the deed,

there is the money that he didn't want,

not because he didn't want it or because "it was nothing", but because he found adequate reward in rewarding himself.

I didn't actually go get doritos, nor reward myself at all and the 'hero' label I applied to myself can't be taken that seriously.

 

[Latte]

@RB (About behavior based analysis criticism)
BGs reasoning seems based on internal motivations and mechanisms he finds derivable from the text rather than behavior.

@RB (Rest)
Multiple angles of attack which contextualize each other is significantly more rigorous and thus more reliable, yeah. There is merit in a multipronged approach due to the conclusion having to make sense with several different layers/kinds of information or analysis.