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Shiny Happy People

snafupants

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loner, more interested in intellectual pursuits than relationships or family, wrestles with the meaninglessness of existence, likes esoteric things, disorganized, messy, likes science fiction, can be lonely, observer, private, can't describe feelings easily, detached, likes solitude, not revealing, unemotional, rule breaker, avoidant, familiar with the darkside, skeptical, acts without consulting others, does not think they are weird but others do, socially uncomfortable, abrupt, fantasy prone, does not like happy people, appreciates strangeness, frequently loses things, acts without planning, guarded, not punctual, more likely to support marijuana legalization, not prone to compromise, hard to persuade, relies on mind more than on others, calm


Do INTPs dislike "happy people"? If so, why? :confused:
 

Ink

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I don't dislike happy people... I don't think what is described is happy people though (contentness is true happiness imo), but more hubris. I don't like people exhibiting hubris happiness, no. Thought noone did? :confused:
 

snafupants

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I don't dislike happy people... I don't think what is described is happy people though (contentness is true happiness imo), but more hubris. I don't like people exhibiting hubris happiness, no. Thought noone did? :confused:

That might actually be an INTP misconception. Some "superficial" people really are happy. :)

I conjecture that cynicism towards human happiness, on the INTP's part, is partly projection. As if to say, if I'm not happy, then nobody is happy!

In reality, the other person might just be happy. It's like a disgruntled lover's insistence that the other person must be unhappy because s/he's unhappy. :=/
 
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I don't like bubbly, overly enthusiastic happy people. But though I am not very emotional, I think I'm a reasonably happy person myself. Am I allowed to be an INTP and happy?

Well, off I go to find the forum for introverts who aren't misanthropes.
 

Ink

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That might actually be an INTP misconception. Some "superficial" people really are happy. :)

I conjecture that cynicism towards human happiness, on the INTP's part, is partly projection. As if to say, if I'm not happy, then nobody is happy!

In reality, the other person might just be happy. :=/

Okay, all shiny happy people are not "Hubrised", there's a fine line somewhere there though... I don't encounter people/situations like these very often though so I'd definitely say I don't dislike happy people in general... :) (I usually am pretty happy ...sometimes hubrised?)
 

snafupants

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I don't like bubbly, overly enthusiastic happy people. But though I am not very emotional, I think I'm a reasonably happy person myself. Am I allowed to be an INTP and happy?

Well, off I go to find the forum for introverts who aren't misanthropes.

That makes sense, especially considering Fe's inferior position.

Maybe the INTP sees his or her happiness as less materialistic and more hard-won?
 
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That makes sense, especially considering Fe's inferior position.

Maybe the INTP sees his or her happiness as less materialistic and more hard-won?
I'm not sure it's as complex as all that. I think overly happy (Fe) people just overload the INTP's capacity to deal with other people. It's just the nature of the introvert to lose energy through social interaction or just being around extroverted people. That's what it seems like in my case, anyway.

As for just "happy" people, as in not necessarily bubbly or overtly extroverted, I'm not sure what makes the INTP dislike them, if they do at all. I don't think I have a problem with people just for being happy.
 

Etheri

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Happy people are generally less annoying than sad or angry people... But any type of emotional person can be pretty bothersome :beatyou:

I think the confusion comes from us not being overly cheerful when others are. INTPs have trouble understanding / feeling euphoria, and the reluctance to be equally cheerful can easily be taken as dislike?

Also, euphoric people typically demand a lot of attention. Attention I'm not always ready to give?
 

Reluctantly

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I dislike people who seem to have fleeting and transient emotions that are aimed toward manipulating and feeding off another's emotions. The reason being, their happiness is fine as long as it doesn't depend on me having to help maintain it for them. For example, some happy people will regard someone else who is emotionally guarded as offensive and unnatural; after being offended, they will decide this person then doesn't want them to be happy (because if unnatural, why else would they do it?) and doesn't like happy people. But it's a misconception and they are simply transgressing to begin with.
 

snafupants

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For example, some happy people will regard someone else who is emotionally guarded as offensive and unnatural

That's also true. There's even a distrust of introverts in society. What are you thinking?! Or, yep, the killer was *bated breath* highly withdrawn *hysterical cries*. At any rate, I feel like it's a bit of the don't crimp my high (because I'm manic) sort of thing in most cases.
 

redbaron

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I don't mind happy people, I like happy people. What I dislike is intrusive people. People can overtly happy all they like, but if they ask me why I'm unhappy or interrupt my thoughts to blather on about things that I find inane and inconsequential, I just want to strangle them.

Same goes for if someone gets all angry and worked up around me, looking for some sort of support that I either don't possess or am not willing to give. It's really not emotion I have a problem with, it's being forced to interact with people in a condition that if I express what I'm honestly thinking at that point in time, will probably upset them.

So I'm now faced with three options:

1. Remain silent, wrongly reinforcing the idea in their mind that I am indeed surly or discontent, prompting them to try to get me to open up, fuelling even greater annoyance for myself
2. Respond honestly, which depending on just how honest I am and whether or not they're thick-skinned enough to deal with whatever I say, is probably going to upset them and lead them to believe I really was angry or upset and completely miss the point that I wasn't (angry), until they asked me that dumb question
3. Respond dishonestly and fake support for their position, encouraging them to come to me in the future, potentially wasting more of my time and energy

Both 1 and 3 involve being dishonest, which is frustrating for me to be, so generally I take option 2. Explaining that no, I actually wasn't angry until you came over here expressing a concern and/or seeking empty validation. For me, this is unwelcome and intrusive.

Then they do the same thing the next day.

One day I'm going to take pepper spray to work and anyone who asks me or makes a statement in the ilk of, 'why so glum?' or, 'cheer up' is going to get the entire fucking can.
 

Cognisant

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That song "Shiny happy people" reminds me of NGE and creeps me the fuck out.
 

Cavallier

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I don't mind happy people, I like happy people. What I dislike is intrusive people. People can overtly happy all they like, but if they ask me why I'm unhappy or interrupt my thoughts to blather on about things that I find inane and inconsequential, I just want to strangle them.

...

One day I'm going to take pepper spray to work and anyone who asks me or makes a statement in the ilk of, 'why so glum?' or, 'cheer up' is going to get the entire fucking can.


This. So much this. I have no trouble with happy people but it's the happy people who then decide there is something wrong with me and my life if I'm not like them that bug me. I'm not even a particularly introverted person (not on the surface at work at least) but I have "friends" at work who are always giving me inspirational quotes in an attempted to cheer me up when I'm actually already pretty happy. I'm not effusive and that's why they think I'm not happy.
 

Fukyo

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All those happy people around me spreading their toxic positive energy, trying to bring me down. Man, they're so envious of my misfortune.
 

The Gopher

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I dislike people that fake laugh. You know the type which feel the need to pretend to have more emotion or make up emotion just to fit in. I mean to a certain degree it is fine and something you have to do... but not like they do it it's just like no. Totally no dude, like so not groovy man..(is so not starting this again)
 

Kuu

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In my experience, very "happy" people have a terrible tendency to be utterly naïve, blind to how humans and reality operate, and trying to have a serious conversation with them about any subject that matters is near-impossible. They tend to be self-absorbed and concerned with banalities. There are exceptions.

Die in a fire, happy people!

:evil:


There is an entire world of experience in sadness. A perpetually happy person is vastly ignorant in that regard. They can never fully comprehend you no matter how much they try. Can one even appreciate happiness to its full extent without having experienced the opposite? Is there no value to grief itself?


Also,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCQ0vDAbF7s
 

snafupants

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That song "Shiny happy people" reminds me of NGE and creeps me the fuck out.

Yeah, there's an almost Lynchian funhouse, albeit intended, mania to that R.E.M. song.

It kinda reminds me of this well-intentioned yet creepy painting...
 

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Antediluvian

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I tend to dislike general confidence in people, which usually creates happiness (but not always). So, I suppose, I do tend to dislike happy individuals, but the dislike is incidental to their happiness. Personality kinks, sure, but I'm far from being the only one.

As far as INTPs being unemotional, I have heard from someone who has dated plenty of the type that they can become extremely emotional when their insecurities are poked. I have no idea of the truthfulness of that statement, though.
 

snafupants

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I tend to dislike general confidence in people, which usually creates happiness (but not always). So, I suppose, I do tend to dislike happy individuals, but the dislike is incidental to their happiness.

Personality kinks, sure, but I'm far from being the only one.

Do you associate confidence with glibness or an unanalyzed life? @Antediluvian

Is it possible to be confident and all-together? Does confidence, for you, betray a deficiency?
 

Antediluvian

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@snafupants

In some ways I do associate confidence with poorly thought-out viewpoints. Though, of course not always. I would say that I reflexively see confidence as a betrayal of a deficiency of self-reflection (potentially).
 

A22

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I do because they make me sad because by seing them I remember I'm not happy.
 

snafupants

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I do because they make me sad because by seing them I remember I'm not happy.

Perhaps jealousy? These are certainly some quaint views - Antediluvian appears to have just correlated confidence with mindless frivolity (potentially).

I would say that I reflexively see confidence as a betrayal of a deficiency of self-reflection (potentially).

And how does Jung not encapsulate the spirit of INTP forum vis-a-vis Ti in Psychological Types?

His style is usually loaded and complicated by all sorts of accessories, qualifications, saving clauses, doubts,[potentially :D] etc., which spring from his exacting scrupulousness. His work goes slowly and with difficulty.

Edit: Oh no! Another edit. Quick! Work in some more clauses and parenthetical provisos!
 

Hadoblado

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I don't like happy people. That is, if you are happy, I am less likely to like you.

My logic is a little twisted and bitter, and I take no pride in this position. My reasoning is, that if most people are idiots (they are), then wouldn't being an idiot give someone reason to be sad? The fact that so many people are idiots that are also happy flies in the face of rationality. It's like they make one transgression (being an idiot), which is compounded by non-acknowledgement of this fact. These people then go around voting and creating social norms with their stupid brains and stupid ways, with little regard as to whether they're right or not.

A mentally healthy human mind rarely questions he veracity of it's firmly held self-esteem. This makes the vast majority of people who should not have a say, believe the inverse of this and actively pursue their goals, as misled as these goals may be. On a large scale, this shapes world events and leads to all sorts of stupid shit that could easily be avoided if people would take the hit to their happiness and self-confidence, and admit that they are not qualified to make decisions for other people.

Happy people are fine. It is happy people that are also stupid and self-empowered that drive me nuts.

Note: this sort of touches on the Dunning-Kruger effect that seems to be doing the rounds in the forum of late. It wasn't my intention to talk about this but that's pretty much exactly what I did :confused: My bad...
 

Antediluvian

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Perhaps jealousy? These are certainly some quaint views - Antediluvian appears to have just correlated confidence with mindless frivolity (potentially).


I looked up all the possible definitions of quaint to make sure I wasn't being insulted, looks like I am safe. :p


snafupants said:
And how does Jung not encapsulate the spirit of INTP forum vis-a-vis Ti in Psychological Types?

Looks like Jung was a bit of a prognosticator!

snafupants said:
Edit: Oh no! Another edit. Quick! Work in some more clauses and parenthetical provisos!

Not enough hours in the day unfortunately.

Anyway, I was typing a reply to another thread of mine (which was another edit, amusingly), and I think it fits better here. It's funny how I can work the subject of intelligence into almost any subject.

I suppose that I've been ruminative over the fact that even geniuses have been proven to have mental flaws (seemingly). For instance, there was a study I read recently that declared that those with a higher level of cognitive sophistication (based on SAT scores) were more prone to a basic arithmetic error while calculating the "bat and ball question." The gist was that they employ mental shortcuts to avoid doing the math altogether, and that this can cause errors.

So, it would seem that no matter how intelligent/smart a person is, they are still subject to cognitive flaws or biases. A little idiocy can reside in everyone, which makes the Ego do acrobatics backwards through hoops of fire to justify itself.
 

BigApplePi

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How happy do you want them to be? Would they be so happy if you tell them they make YOU unhappy?

Theoretically happy people if they are really happy, have a secret. People want to be happy don't they? So some should rub off. It's contagious. People want to know the secret.

One has to be open, not envious. A happy person won't stay happy long if they are a pain in the butt. They possibly enjoy getting other people happy. They should instantly lay back if you find them intrusive.
 

snafupants

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I suppose that I've been ruminative over the fact that even geniuses have been proven to have mental flaws (seemingly). For instance, there was a study I read recently that declared that those with a higher level of cognitive sophistication (based on SAT scores) were more prone to a basic arithmetic error while calculating the "bat and ball question." The gist was that they employ mental shortcuts to avoid doing the math altogether, and that this can cause errors.

So, it would seem that no matter how intelligent/smart a person is, they are still subject to cognitive flaws or biases. A little idiocy can reside in everyone, which makes the Ego do acrobatics backwards through hoops of fire to justify itself.

I agree. Nobody is above scrutiny on the basis of a test score; anyway, "smart" folk often make the dumbest mistakes. I have noted this phenomenon elsewhere, but there are many similarities between idiocy and genius. It can be challenging to out-stupid a genius. :storks:
 
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