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Personas

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#52
Social Interaction-Lyra Explained

Part III. Lyra Explained-Social Interaction. I've spoken of Lyra and personas and patterns. Then there is Lyra the man. We know he is a poet and a symbolist and he is versed in mythology. Let's take one excerpt from his Dark Materials. What does this say to you?* You need not articulate words out loud for it. Yet it leaves a feeling. You don't get a feeling? You are not impressed? Then it can be left alone. If it doesn't register, you may go on to something else. Either Lyra is not for you or you can wait and try again.

Lyra can cast a spell. That is the poet, the actor, the dramatist. You guys can fall under it. That is Lyra the artist. But there is Lyra the man. He may fail to hold the very spell he casts ... or he may hold the spell and because we are under it, we do not know. He may or may not be a good artist. Answering that is for art critics. I am not a Lyra scholar. If I were I might guess his personas can act as gods or at least as pure archetypes. That could be why he appears to talk down to you. But Lyra the man is not a god. One has to be careful which one is talking to.

I see Lyra the man faulty. He is not a god. He is like us. He may want to present his art, but does he know how to deal with his audience? He knows there is an audience. He may may claim only a special few can be receptive. But what of others? He is posting on a forum with many. In his overlooking a real audience frustration overtakes him. Are you and I no different when we overlook something because of assumptions we've made?

Let me tell you of a piece of my experience with him back when things went wrong. The event was still in Dark Materials . I made a mistake from which it was hard to recover. After a few spell breaking comments from posters, I posted this: Dark Copy for which Lyra gave me a favorable response: Re: Dark Copy. So you can see there was no clash, harmony in fact. Would you agree? Then later I posted: Dark Talk. Having received a favorable response earlier I thought I would bring what I saw occurring on the thread among all posters into balance. I knew mine wasn't the best choice of poem, but I brought in what I thought was good enough. I had no way of knowing he desired no criticism. He hadn't proclaimed that at the start. After that the sludge hit the fan. He forgot some of his audience need not have been under his spell. He did not like it. What happened after that? At some point moderators stepped in and his thread was treated like a blog: semi-private. I stayed out of it after that.

Later, outside of this thread I must have done a poor job in commenting on this experience. Today I would describe it as Lyra the artist was confronted by Lyra the man and they were in conflict. We are all like this: good intentions and bad results. It happens. I see no reason why a thread explaining something like this can't contribute to avoiding it happening in the future.

I hope this explains Lyra a little better to you as well as forum member reactions. You may note at the beginning of this thread the thread itself got some bashing. I call this pre judging. We, on this forum, can't always forecast how things will turn out. Shall I say more? I haven't decided.


__________________________________________________________
More Lyra references but I'm not about to chase them all down. Who is/was XIII? courtesy C. Hecker88
Note the quote below points to why he might not care to have his art interfered with added to. To repeat, a reader not knowing this will damage the work as he claims to present it. Yet he doesn't always give warning.
I have grown tired of the XIII who has been presented to the forum thus far. He was one of my better works, but to include more strokes would be to ruin the painting.
*Notice what is likely a raven in the visual. The raven is a symbol.
 

TheScornedReflex

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#53
Are you using Lyra to feed your ego?
 

Absurdity

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#54
Re: Social Interaction-Lyra Explained

I see Lyra the man faulty. He is not a god. He is like us. He may want to present his art, but does he know how to deal with his audience? He knows there is an audience. He may may claim only a special few can be receptive. But what of others? He is posting on a forum with many. In his overlooking a real audience frustration overtakes him. Are you and I no different when we overlook something because of assumptions we've made?
This is exactly the type of thing I was hoping this thread would not become.

I hope this explains Lyra a little better to you as well as forum member reactions.
Actually, I think you're just trying to paint yourself as a victim in the most rambling way possible.
 
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#55
Re: Social Interaction-Lyra Explained

This is exactly the type of thing I was hoping this thread would not become.
Okay Absurdity. How would YOU explain the topic of this thread? Maybe you have a different and worthwhile perspective. This figure is an important figure with I think a legacy. Do you want it swept under the rug?


Actually, I think you're just trying to paint yourself as a victim in the most rambling way possible.
I am not a victim unless you want to make me so. Since you are so outspoken, where do you stand in your view of the man?

I don't believe this forum is about one man. It is about differing posters and other posters relating to them. Most posters stick to ideas. Other posters talk about people. Didn't you refer to that event sometime ago ... you know: ideas, people, things? The relationship of poster to posters is an idea.
 
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#56
Are you using Lyra to feed your ego?
My ego (self) would like to explain a piece of Lyra to those who might have some doubts as to what went on. If I've missed something big, I'd like to know that. Do you think I'm being egocentric*? Do you have your doubts? People have said negative things about this thread and in the past about me. Do you see me protesting their right to speak? That doesn't mean they are right. Just as Lyra protested his lack of privacy in his "Dark Materials" thread which I believe in now honored and settled, doesn't mean an artist and a man can't be reviewed if they still have influence, especially if the review treats them fairly.

*e·go·cen·tric (ē′gō-sĕn′trĭk, ĕg′ō-)adj.1. Holding the view that the ego is the center, object, and norm of all experience.
2. a. Confined in attitude or interest to one's own needs or affairs.
b. Caring only about oneself; selfish.
 

redbaron

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#57
And then once this is all finished and enough headaches have been caused, BAP will come full circle and make another apology thread to the moderators.
 
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#58
And then once this is all finished and enough headaches have been caused, BAP will come full circle and make another apology thread to the moderators.
@redbaron.

Usually I have nothing to say to you redbaron. What is it you want? Have you anything positive to say about my Parts I,II,III? Remember what Absurdity once said about ideas over people. I'm not against talking about people and their relations. Don't we all have a lot to learn?
 
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#59
Re: Personas - Lyra Explained

Lyra hasn't posted for nigh on 10 months, this thread just serves the purpose of bashing him behind his back essentially. If you really have a desire to make amends or whatever then send him a PM and he'll hopefully get an e-mail notification.

As it is this is just contemptibly obsessive and serves no positive purpose.

Edit: also the fact that he has explicitly stated he wants you to stop harassing him just makes this all the more fucked up.
I failed to reply to this message. Why did you pre-judge what I would say? Why didn't you say, "I wish you well in your attempt. I don't think it will be easy." or something like that? Why did you suggest a PM? Are you kidding? He would close it without reading it. The thread is an attempt to show how we should view this man. Do you think I failed? Succeeded? Don't forget I had dropped the topic when OTHERS brought it up and wanted to know.
 

redbaron

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#60
Yes, I've noticed. You have the habit of psychoanalysing people, and asking personal questions without ever putting yourself in a similar situation of vulnerability. It's quite manipulative actually, the way in which you are so neutral and deadpan, yet continuously probing others for personal information.

Generally interactions of this nature are more give and take, people expose a little bit of themselves under the premise that maybe someone will identify with what they've exposed and in turn, will expose a little bit about themselves. Interactions with you don't have this mutually beneficial nature really.

With your interactions, you ask all the questions and prompt other people to give you all the information about themselves, while diverting any inquiries into your own underlying motivations or desires with, 'humour' or by answering the question in such a convoluted and/or abstractly verbose manner that it doesn't really reveal anything.

Can't say it's the kind of interaction I enjoy being part of.

And no, I don't really have much positive to say about this obsessive and creepy thread.
 
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#61
Re: Personas - Lyra Explained

I failed to reply to this message. Why did you pre-judge what I would say? Why didn't you say, "I wish you well in your attempt. I don't think it will be easy." or something like that? Why did you suggest a PM? Are you kidding? He would close it without reading it. The thread is an attempt to show how we should view this man. Do you think I failed? Succeeded? Don't forget I had dropped the topic when OTHERS brought it up and wanted to know.
Who are you to say how we should view him. Let the guy rest in peace. Please don't continue your discussion of Lyra here BAP.
 
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